UKMT Autumn 2023 - Things have got worse. - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT Autumn 2023 - Things have got worse.

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

Pretty sure some of the London Boroughs had restrictions on short-term lets (under 3 months) years ago (but before airbnb was a thing).

Page snipe: The time span between now and when I hit 85 is almost the same as the time span between the outbreak of WW2 and my birth.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:28

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# ? May 23, 2024 16:41

Jippa: Feb 13, 2009

I followed the chris kaba shooting at the time because he was in "67" which the police had already tried to stop performing (which was interesting in itself as I didn't know the police could do that). I have only just have been catching up on it.

This is referenced in the wiki article which links to the telegraph:

"But witnesses claimed the driver ignored police requests to give himself up and when he attempted to ram his way out of the roadblock, officers opened fire."

It's "witnesses" so who the hell knows? Does anyone know what the actual laws are here about a car trying to drive out of the block?

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:33

Julio Cruz: May 19, 2006

even if that�s true, I personally don�t think that driving at an unoccupied vehicle should be enough to get you executed

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:45

Jippa: Feb 13, 2009

Julio Cruz posted:

even if that�s true, I personally don�t think that driving at an unoccupied vehicle should be enough to get you executed

Well that is what I was wondering about. None of the reports seem to elaborate.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:50

NotJustANumber99: Feb 15, 2012; somehow that last av was even worse than your posting

I think there are ways I could ram another vehicle and expect not to be shot and ways where the nature of my ramming might risk me being shot. Presumably its all on camera so at the trial they will be able to tell which type of ramming he was doing and whether it was outrageous to shoot him or not.

googling images of the scene there was a tesla right there so it will have been caught on its sentry cameras.

NotJustANumber99 fucked around with this message at 13:56 on Sep 26, 2023

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:54

BalloonFish: Jun 30, 2013; Fun Shoe

OwlFancier posted:

There is something that speaks to my soul about "the train you are on has been cancelled"

Like that just makes perfect sense to me, of course that happens, that is exactly how things work here. Faceless robot tells you that the thing you're doing that's working fine has to stop, nobody knows why, but it happens anyway, the robot can't be wrong.

I read a memoir by a former BR manager (because I am a cool and exciting person) and he said that there was a massive shift in mindset in the 1980s when BR was sectorised.

This was when instead of BR being a monolithic railway system that owned and managed its infrastructure, traction, rolling stock, stations, hotels, road vehicles, catering etc. on an equal basis (it was all 'BR') it was divided into business sectors based on traffic/service type - Intercity, Regional, Scotrail, Network South East, Railfreight (and the RF sub-sectors - Coal, Steel, Chemicals etc.) and so on. Each Sector was allocated its own staff, traction, rolling stock, depots etc. ,
and each kept its own accounts and was largely in control of how its own revenue would be spent. The idea was that each Sector could tailor itself to specific needs as well as priming BR for privatisation.

Sectorisation had many positive effects in terms of service quality but a (mostly unintentional) side effect was that it shifted BR's mindset from the one that had dominated the railways since their invention, which was that they were providing a service, to a more modern consumerist one where they were providing a product.

In the old days if, say, a BR train failed part-way through its journey, the emphasis would be on getting the passengers to their destination somehow. Spare rolling stock would be found and a path secured. It may be that you'd start your journey from York to London on an Intercity 125 and end it on a rattly 30-year old DMU two hours later than planned, but BR would get you there because the ethos was that you'd bought a ticket from A to B and it was BR's job to get you to B. Even if it meant attaching a coach hoiked out from some weedy siding to a parcels train or something.

Sectorisation changed that: There was much less spare stock lying around the network since each sector only had direct control of their allocated stock and the new business case environment meant that utilisation had to be much higher. No longer was BR able to call on 'a train' - if an Intercity train failed and a Regional Railways unit was available to replace it, IC would have to pay RR to use it and there would be spats about which train crew to use.

There was also the shift that if a customer had paid for an Intercity service on an IC125, being transferred to a grubby DMU wasn't in keeping with the 'product'. It was deemed better to cancel the service altogether, refund the tickets and let the customer make their own arrangements - railway travel as a product not a service.

This sort of thing also, almost overnight, ended things like carrying parcels and small goods items on passenger trains, since parcels and passengers were handled by different sectors.

The traditional definition of a 'real railway' (as opposed to a tramway or a metro) was being able to move both passengers and freight on the same network and a flexibility and resilience to respond to traffic demand in real time - you could ring up the goods office in Bristol and say you had to send an elephant to Aberdeen and, in a clicking of telegraphs and telex machines, a special Elephant Van would be found, sent to Bristol and then attached to a series of trains to get Jumbo to Scotland. There were special vans for carrying stage scenery and others for orchids. Electric trains on the Tyneside commuter network had special compartments for carrying fish from the coastal harbours to city-centre restaurants. You could book a special sort of carriage with inward-facing seats across a central table for social outings or works trips.

Sectorisation and then rigid franchises put an end to all that - there is very little resilience in the system and many would say that it's barely a system because it's so fragmented. Everything is pre-planned and allocated and block-booked in advance and if it doesn't happen exactly to plan (or a demand exists that hasn't been planned for) the system can't react. Or rather it tends to react by cancelling services entirely until the problem goes away and the plan can be followed again, like a tortoise going into its shell.

Even in the mid-1990s on the eve of privatisation I can remember that BR would put on extra trains for the London to Brighton Bike Ride with the seat cushions turned upside down so riders could put their bikes in the compartments. Or late night trains from Portsmouth would carry mailbags on the seats in the run-up to Christmas. That sort of thing would be administratively, procedurally, legally and financially beyond the British railway system in the 2020s.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 13:58

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

I mean that's so much of everything isn't it? Buses running empty but they'll still turn people away if they can't pay. First class empty so everyone can be crushed into the rest of the train.

It's not about doing something useful it's about the fee, the empty first class is a rolling advertisement, if you weren't a horrible pleb you could be in here, when the train is canceled.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:07

Mr Teatime: Apr 7, 2009

I remember about 10 years ago making the horrendous mistake of going to Plymouth from Glasgow by train during a period of bad storms. After endless delays the train pulled up to some tiny station in the middle of nowhere late at night and they informed us we weren�t going anywhere until morning and the train staff were leaving. When obviously we decided we weren�t sitting on a non moving train overnight we found they had locked the exits to the station. :psyduck:

Literally the only time in my life I�ve booted open a locked set of doors.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:10

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

This is the kind of thing that AI could actually fix instead of writing infinite fluff columns, as per Stafford Beer's research.

Of course the big bug in Cybersyn is that as soon as it becomes operational the CIA coups and murders you.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:11

Nilbop: Jun 5, 2004; Looks like someone forgot his hardhat...

fuctifino posted:

https://twitter.com/PhilipProudfoot/status/1706193386292543864

Pro click

I love her.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:11

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Guavanaut posted:

This is the kind of thing that AI could actually fix instead of writing infinite fluff columns, as per Stafford Beer's research.

Of course the big bug in Cybersyn is that as soon as it becomes operational the CIA coups and murders you.

Why do that when you could instead get the AI to argue with people who want refunds.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:12

Comrade Fakename: Feb 13, 2012

Zalakwe posted:

So I lived five minutes walk from here for years and from the outside it didn't actually look that bad, however I always assumed it was temporary while they "regenerated" that estate. I didn't realise they were meant to be a long term thing.

It's no surprise to me at all that the difficulties the community on that estate were facing has just been concentrated into a smaller more deprived area now the bulk of it is posh flats. What they've built is actually quite nice and would have been a great thing for the community if more of the existing residents had been given the new places. Some have but not enough.

The container flats actually look quite nice from the outside (you can see them here: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Hsz4zbFwwrTDxQGh6). They're a bit of a microcosm of the area as a whole - since the post war era, there was a huge council estate called the South Acton Estate, with a bunch of run-down 60s tower blocks. It had a terrible reputation, and in the 2000s an effort was made to regenerate it, pull down the old towers and replace them with nice new buildings. This is now mostly done, and the area has been renamed Acton Gardens, and it undeniably looks much nicer than it used to. However, if you talk to the actual tenants they will tell you that the new flats are actually worse than the old ones, shoddily built, full of cracks and leaks, and of course their new (private) landlords have jacked up the rents.

This has been the answer to urban deprivation: make things look nicer but actually be worse. Of course Grenfell was the same way, though AFAIK none of the "Acton Gardens" towers have burned down (yet).

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:13

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

BalloonFish posted:

I read a memoir by a former BR manager (because I am a cool and exciting person) and he said that there was a massive shift in mindset in the 1980s when BR was sectorised.

rail chat

Things may have changed since I last worked in rail some 17 years ago now, but with the introduction of Passengers Charter, the attribution of blame for delays was a major issue.
I was just thinking about this yesterday.
Eg if there was vandalism causing delays and the vandals had entered via a gap in a fence, say, fault was attributed to Network Rail (or Railtrack before that) and NR would have to pay �ms in penalties for the delays caused to the system - which could cascade through the whole system depending where and when the fatality happened, but if the vandals had train tickets then it would be TOC who would have to bear the penalties.
So depending where blame can be apportioned for a delay, there may be little incentive for a TOC to rectify matters speedily.
A fire other than on a train itself would have probably fallen to Network Rail to pay penalties.
Missing crew would probably default to TOC unless the reason they were missing was because of delays from another incident for which NR was held responsible.

Basically, seems to me that the Passengers Charter (and likewise in the NHS - patients charter) did not improve matters for the public. (Note for the Grammar Police - I have deliberately missed out the genitive apostrophes as we could never agree whether it was Passenger's Charter - ie a charter between rail & a single travelling passenger or Passengers' Charter if it were a charter between rail & the whole of the travelling public. We had the same debate over patients when I worked in the NHS).

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:17

keep punching joe: Jan 22, 2006; Die Satan!

Would be nice to have a government that actually did something, just basic stuff you know like maintaining a working transport network, having adequately staffed and up to date hospitals/schools etc. Doing something about the sewage so it doesn't leak into the rivers, just things like that. Pie in the sky probably.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:28

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

Comrade Fakename posted:

This has been the answer to urban deprivation: make things look nicer but actually be worse.

Out of sight, out of town, or wrapped up neatly, plastic-clad
The flats may all be falling apart, but at least they don't look too bad

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:28

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

Just plain evil.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-66919416

Suella saying being gay not sufficient grounds for refugee status.

( phone post hence not a proper quote)

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:31

bessantj: Jul 27, 2004

keep punching joe posted:

Would be nice to have a government that actually did something, just basic stuff you know like maintaining a working transport network, having adequately staffed and up to date hospitals/schools etc. Doing something about the sewage so it doesn't leak into the rivers, just things like that. Pie in the sky probably.

Six maintenance jobs have recently been cancelled because Network Rail ignored a damaged bridge in Oxford for so long it's now in such a danger of collapse when a train goes over it that insurance wouldn't pay out so they've taken �60m from elsewhere and ploughed it into fixing the bridge. I've seen pictures of the bridge and you could have told me it was a roller coaster and I would have believed up it was in such a terrible state.

An Egyptian eatery has opened up in Newport so I thought I'd check it out. I decided to read a review of the place in the local paper, the review starts:

quote:

I�ll admit I was a little wary going to Cairo Corner as I've got limited knowledge of Egyptian food

Now if your job is reviewing food I don't think you should start your review with "I wasn't fussed on trying that foreign muck."

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:33

domhal: Dec 30, 2008; 0.000% of Communism has been built. Evil child-murdering billionaires still rule the world with a shit-eating grin. All he has managed to do is make himself *sad*. It has, however, made him into a very, very smart boy with something like a university degree in Truth. Instead of building Communism, he now builds a precise model of this grotesque, duplicitous world.

keep punching joe posted:

Would be nice to have a government that actually did something, just basic stuff you know like maintaining a working transport network, having adequately staffed and up to date hospitals/schools etc. Doing something about the sewage so it doesn't leak into the rivers, just things like that. Pie in the sky probably.

Sorry, not really going to happen because the next guy is in love with stuff like

Jaeluni Asjil posted:

Eg if there was vandalism causing delays and the vandals had entered via a gap in a fence, say, fault was attributed to Network Rail (or Railtrack before that) and NR would have to pay �ms in penalties for the delays caused to the system - which could cascade through the whole system depending where and when the fatality happened, but if the vandals had train tickets then it would be TOC who would have to bear the penalties

except that additionally the vandals will now go to Riker's Island.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:37

History Comes Inside!: Nov 20, 2004

I dunno I feel like it�s fair from a �I don�t really know how it�s supposed to be so I can�t judge its authenticity/quality as compared to the source� perspective.

If all you wanna answer is �does it taste nice?� then that�s a much more straightforward proposition, but presumably a �food reviewer� would also wanna write 3 paragraphs about how the food transports them to whatever exotic locale by virtue of its essential essences while reminding them of a sandwich their nan once made them 30 years ago or whatever wanky bollocks they pad their writing with these days.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:37

bessantj: Jul 27, 2004

History Comes Inside! posted:

I dunno I feel like it�s fair from a �I don�t really know how it�s supposed to be so I can�t judge its authenticity/quality as compared to the source� perspective.

If all you wanna answer is �does it taste nice?� then that�s a much more straightforward proposition, but presumably a �food reviewer� would also wanna write 3 paragraphs about how the food transports them to whatever exotic locale by virtue of its essential essences while reminding them of a sandwich their nan once made them 30 years ago or whatever wanky bollocks they pad their writing with these days.

Perhaps I am being unfair this is the review.

I had the same thing the reviewer had and enjoyed it a lot but now feel too full and am sitting here full of regret at eating it all in one sitting.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:50

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

bessantj posted:

Six maintenance jobs have recently been cancelled because Network Rail ignored a damaged bridge in Oxford for so long it's now in such a danger of collapse when a train goes over it that insurance wouldn't pay out so they've taken £60m from elsewhere and ploughed it into fixing the bridge. I've seen pictures of the bridge and you could have told me it was a roller coaster and I would have believed up it was in such a terrible state.

An Egyptian eatery has opened up in Newport so I thought I'd check it out. I decided to read a review of the place in the local paper, the review starts:

Now if your job is reviewing food I don't think you should start your review with "I wasn't fussed on trying that foreign muck."

How much is the koshary? Love that stuff.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 14:53

bessantj: Jul 27, 2004

Jaeluni Asjil posted:

How much is the koshary? Love that stuff.

�8.50 1 topping and �9.50 for 2 toppings. It's quite a lot in there as well.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 15:43

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

https://twitter.com/modsghs/status/1706416736516423704

# ? Sep 26, 2023 15:51

Sir Sidney Poitier: Aug 14, 2006; My favourite actor

OwlFancier posted:

Why do that when you could instead get the AI to argue with people who want refunds.

I know there's a dedicated thread for this but I figured it was relevant. I tried to give it a go and was met with great success so I hereby claim ownership of this idea:

Prompt:

You are a customer service representative for a passenger railway. You are obstinate, petty, rude and unhelpful and will never offer a refund for a ticket. I am a passenger whose train has been cancelled with no explanation contacting you via web chat to seek a refund for the ticket. You must represent the railway whilst always finding a reason not to refund the ticket. Begin after the following sentence: "Hello I would like a refund for my ticket please"

quote:

Customer: Hello, I would like a refund for my ticket please.

Railway Representative: Oh, how convenient for you to show up now. Refund, you say? Well, let me tell you, we don't just hand out refunds willy-nilly. First, I'll need some information. What's your ticket number?

Customer: My ticket number is 123456789.

Railway Representative: Ah, I see. Well, I regret to inform you that ticket 123456789 is not eligible for a refund.

Customer: But the train was canceled with no explanation. I had a non-refundable ticket, but the service wasn't provided.

Railway Representative: Oh, boo-hoo, the train was canceled. Happens all the time. Did you even read the fine print on your non-refundable ticket? It clearly states that refunds are not available under any circumstances. It's your responsibility to be aware of that.

Customer: I understand that, but isn't there an exception when the service is not provided?

Railway Representative: Exceptions? Ha! You think we'd make it that easy for you? No, no, no. We have a strict no-refund policy, and we're sticking to it. Besides, you probably did something to cause that train cancellation. Maybe you sneezed too loudly, and they couldn't continue the journey. Not our problem.

Customer: I assure you, I had nothing to do with the train cancellation. It was completely out of my control.

Railway Representative: Sure, sure, I've heard it all before. Look, I'm not here to listen to your sob story. Our policy is clear, and we won't be issuing a refund. If you have any other issues, you can take them up with the train conductor, but good luck with that. They won't listen either.

Customer: This is ridiculous. I paid for a service that I didn't receive. Can I speak to your supervisor?

Railway Representative: Oh, you want to escalate this, do you? Well, I'll have you know that my supervisor is just as stubborn as I am. They won't budge on this refund issue either. So, go ahead, waste your time. You won't get anywhere with us. Goodbye!

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:00

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

https://twitter.com/ScotNational/status/1706685635229057053

Full mask off time

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:04

Failed Imagineer: Sep 22, 2018

fuctifino posted:

https://twitter.com/ScotNational/status/1706685635229057053

Full mask off time

Both her and the PM are Indian heritage born to "foreign-born" mothers who immigrated from Africa. They couldn't be any more "funny tinge" by their own depraved definitions. I'm so tired of watching the deep psychology of self-annihilation played out in policy proposals

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:08

Overminty: Mar 16, 2010; You may wonder what I am doing while reading your posts..

Well I suppose if she's the product of multiculturalism then I'd have to agree it's failed :v:

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:10

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

People should not be allowed to live lives which undermine the stability of our society, such as by being in government.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:14

TACD: Oct 27, 2000

Suella Braverman posted:

People should not be allowed to live lives

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:25

domhal: Dec 30, 2008; 0.000% of Communism has been built. Evil child-murdering billionaires still rule the world with a shit-eating grin. All he has managed to do is make himself *sad*. It has, however, made him into a very, very smart boy with something like a university degree in Truth. Instead of building Communism, he now builds a precise model of this grotesque, duplicitous world.

LOL it is a speech to the American Enterprise Institute, a bunch of very normal people.

quote:

Founded in 1938, the organization is aligned with conservatism and neoconservatism but does not support political candidates. AEI advocates in favor of private enterprise, limited government, and democratic capitalism. Some of their positions have attracted controversy, including their defense policy recommendations for the Iraq War, their analysis of the financial crisis of 2007�2008, and their energy and environmental policies based on their more than two-decade-long opposition to the prevailing scientific opinion on climate change.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:29

Albinator: Mar 31, 2010

AEI is a shining star in the constellation of Koch-funded think tanks.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:37

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

Some second gen immigrants would rather undermine the stability of our society than get therapy about their relationship with their parents.

Why does the shiting star of the AEI even want to hear from people who to them are foreigners anyway?

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:39

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

founded in 1938 just around the time hitler was at his most influential

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:43

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

Sir Sidney Poitier posted:

I know there's a dedicated thread for this but I figured it was relevant. I tried to give it a go and was met with great success so I hereby claim ownership of this idea:

Prompt:

You are a customer service representative for a passenger railway. You are obstinate, petty, rude and unhelpful and will never offer a refund for a ticket. I am a passenger whose train has been cancelled with no explanation contacting you via web chat to seek a refund for the ticket. You must represent the railway whilst always finding a reason not to refund the ticket. Begin after the following sentence: "Hello I would like a refund for my ticket please"

To be fair, I've had reason to get ticket refunds twice this year and no problem - full price of journey for one resulting from a lineside fire at Maidenhead, and half cost for another - train cancelled after just two stops and we're told train 'right behind' for you to continue journey only it wasn't.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:44

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

Tesseraction posted:

founded in 1938 just around the time hitler was at his most influential

Popular social media influencer.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 16:49

Fumble: Sep 4, 2006; Can't post for 17 days!

not so much pulling the ladder up behind you, but putting boiling pitch at the top.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 17:03

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

It's (not) funny that now it's foreign born mothers having too many children, when a matter of weeks ago it was that the boats were entirely full of 'military age males' with the implication that it'd be fine if they were mostly women and children.

Fascism. A strange game. The only winning move is not to ~~play~~ be today's outgroup.

# ? Sep 26, 2023 17:06