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zoux posted:Dispatches from Greater Evilland.
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Sep 26, 2023 19:40
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I have no idea how Bob Menendez kept getting elected after he skated on his first batch of corruption charges years ago not to sound insulting, but really? you have no idea how corrupt pols thrive in modern America? Getting literal gold bars might be a bit on the nose, but that's the point. That's why they're there.
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Sep 26, 2023 19:41
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Alex Press is the best labor reporter in the country and it's not even close. https://twitter.com/alexnpress/status/1706733047331033398 But I think she's attributing incompetence where malice is more appropriate in the case of coverage. https://twitter.com/alexnpress/status/1706735183234580909 Looking at the coverage, it's all "Trump, Biden head to Michigan to woo union voters" like they aren't basically doing opposite things. This is because the media prefers a very close election and ultimately, a Trump victory. To wit: https://twitter.com/Convolutedname/status/1706714317662404742 zoux fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Sep 26, 2023 |
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Sep 26, 2023 20:03
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:I have no idea how Bob Menendez kept getting elected after he skated on his first batch of corruption charges years ago My take is that whenever the country peers into NJ politics and says “surely they wouldn’t …” we respond by saying “he may be a corrupt politician but he’s our corrupt politician”. This is how we do things in NJ.
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Sep 26, 2023 20:28
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CPColin posted:The alternative is using a voting system that isn't vulnerable to the spoiler effect and it's sad that it's 2023 and people are still blaming the third parties and/or their voters and not the system. This, a thousand times. In a winner takes all, first past the post system, the spoiler effect is something to worry about. I wish ranked choice or other options were more politically viable, but it's the one thing both political parties seem to agree on. Neurolimal posted:If the greens were a viable and distinct alternative they wouldn't be allowed to exist, we didn't get where we are via the two parties being vulnerable to challenges. Electoralism is a dead end, vote for whatever you can live with. Or don't vote, who cares. If the greens were a viable and distinct alternative their policies would be absorbed by one of the larger parties, similar to how the Progressive Party faded out 100 years or so ago as their policies got picked up. If your goal is to actually get those policies onto the national stage and implemented, that's a good thing. If your goal is to remain an outsider and throw darts and be Technically Correct (which is the best kind of correct) then it is not.
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Sep 26, 2023 20:37
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DeadlyMuffin posted:
I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? Personally, I think the platform of the Green Party isn’t absorbed by the Dems because their policies run counter to the goals of the donors to the Democrats—but I’m open to having my mind changed
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Sep 26, 2023 20:45
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Jaxyon posted:The biggest theft in retail stores continues to be and always was wage theft. I'm not disputing your point about wage theft. I expect you're right about that. Your second statement is true in that media sensationalizes mass smash-and-grab theft to sell headlines and ads, making the problem appear to be far larger and more widespread than it currently is. I say "currently" because if mass smash-and-grab theft remains easy and successful enough, then it will spread like thefts of Hyundai and Kia cars have spread. I am disputing the implication that only "pearl-clutching olds" are worried about *the risk of violence* from mass smash-and-grab theft. It's not just jewelry and luxury stores being hit, even though they're the most lucrative targets. And ordinary people who can't afford luxury goods might still be nearby (just not in the store), especially if the store is in a mall. It's not about the goods being stolen. It's about "will I get hurt because I'm in or near the wrong store at the wrong time". You can argue that the risk of being physically robbed or hurt amid smash-and-grab violence is low. You can argue that the risk of being mistaken for one of the smash-and-grab perpetrators and wrongfully arrested or worse is low. But why take that risk if it can be avoided completely? Fear of violence drives customers away from stores targeted for mass smash-and-grab theft - even if a large portion of the customers driven away are "pearl clutching olds", or perhaps parents with young children who don't want to take extra risks on a family outing. That potentially hurts businesses a lot more than the losses from smash-and-grab theft alone.
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Sep 26, 2023 20:59
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No, look at the comments on any insta reel or tiktok or whatever for these videos, it's always people talking about how "society is falling apart" or "someone should do something about these animals" and similar. Nobody is talking about "what if I was there when they ransacked the CVS makeup aisle, I could have been hurt!"
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Sep 26, 2023 21:06
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Yeah, the idea that people are worried about their own safety instead of being worried about minorities getting things they didn't pay for is pretty laughable. This is just more dog whistle racism. It's the only play they have left and they will keep at it until they're all dead.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:13
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James Garfield posted:It's 14 months until the election and there isn't a serious Democratic primary, lots of people who don't really follow politics don't know that it'll be a rematch of 2020. I live in California and I'm actually completely tuned out of national politics this time compared to 2020. I was canvassing and going to rallies (and many of us here were too) in 2020 for Bernie. But now with no serious democratic challenger, I would say nobody is even paying attention in blue states.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:19
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Riptor posted:in Massachusetts the Green Party affiliated is the Green-Rainbow party which is the absolute dumbest loving name of a party imaginable The Massachusetts Green-Rainbow Party is the result of merging the Massachusetts Green Party with the Rainbow Coalition Party. The name absolutely makes sense.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:20
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Insanite posted:The Massachusetts Green-Rainbow Party is the result of merging the Massachusetts Green Party with the Rainbow Coalition Party. The name absolutely makes sense. I understand that, but the imagery is stupid and thus it's a dumb name that they could replace with literally anything they want
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Sep 26, 2023 21:24
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The Top G posted:I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? From what I can tell of the 2000 Nader/Green platform on a cursory search, the parts that were material domestic policy (rather than aspirational statements about national transformation) would mostly be pretty unremarkable for a Democrat campaigning for federal office today, and many would have fit a progressive Democrat even at the time. Despite the people I know who have told me every year since Nader ran how fast Democrats are moving right, it hasn't really panned out that way.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:27
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Killer robot posted:They halfheartedly run cranks and perennial losers everywhere, but that's not the same as many any real effort to secure lower offices or build the party, as shown by holding fewer than 150 of the approximately 500,000 local elected offices in the United States. I was curious so I ran the numbers. Between the federal level, all state-wide officials, and all state legislatures there are 8,798 elected officials in the US on the state level or above. Of those, 148 are not affiliated with the Democrats or Republicans (3 federal, 2 state-wide, 143 state legislature). 49 are because Nebraska's legislature is non-partisan; another 34 are in US territories like the Northern Mariana Islands. Best I can find, none of them are affiliated with the Green Party or any formal third party, they're just all Independent.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:29
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Tempest_56 posted:I was curious so I ran the numbers. As of this year there's a single Libertarian serving in state-level office, but he was elected as a Republican and switched this spring. https://vermontdailychronicle.com/vermont-house-rep-goes-libertarian/ Like the Greens, their electoral success is limited to less than 0.1% of local offices in the country, but unlike the Greens they've broken that 0.05% barrier. Edit: He looks exactly like you'd think: 
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Sep 26, 2023 21:41
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Buff Hardback posted:What was missed after the whole “end the rail strike” thing is that the noise (and probably leaning by potus) got them their vacation days after the strike was averted I don't think so. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/may/01/railroad-workers-union-win-sick-leave This article states that at BEST, 61% of a rail company's (CSX) employees now have sick days. Union Pacific has granted sick days to 47% of its workers, Norfolk Southern to 46%, and BNSF, the largest freight railroad, to 31%. That isn't what I would call 'getting them their vacation days' if you ask me. I wouldn't even call it getting HALF of them their vacation days. It is a 4 month old article, so I could be wrong and since then the railroads have given 100% of their workers vacation days, but until its the engineers and everyone else subject to 'precision-scheduling' getting em, its just meaningless words trying to get you to get off the railroad's case.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:47
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Yeah so my issue with 3rd party voting is that the system is set up structurally to be heavily in favor of 2 main parties and without some serious reforms that's not going to change. Also, peoples interest in voting 3rd party occurs once every 4 years, in an election that they have zero chance of winning, instead of building a party. Further, nobody seems to have the Step 2 of building a third party. It tends to go 1. Vote for the green/socialist/libertarian candidate 2. ??? 3. We've broken out of the red/blue binary!
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Sep 26, 2023 21:53
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Killer robot posted:From what I can tell of the 2000 Nader/Green platform on a cursory search, the parts that were material domestic policy (rather than aspirational statements about national transformation) would mostly be pretty unremarkable for a Democrat campaigning for federal office today, and many would have fit a progressive Democrat even at the time. Despite the people I know who have told me every year since Nader ran how fast Democrats are moving right, it hasn't really panned out that way. The part I cared about was "legalized weed" I live in Texas so my vote in the 2000 election was purely an academic exercise, even more so that cycle. I do remember getting in an argument with a girl who was voting Bush because her mom had met him and "he was a nice person".
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Sep 26, 2023 21:54
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zoux posted:The part I cared about was "legalized weed" This is why I voted for Goku.
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Sep 26, 2023 21:57
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The Top G posted:I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? The parts of the platform of the Green Party that haven't already been absorbed by the Dems have been left out because they're unpopular or unserious policies from a party with barely any national support. That's why the person you're referring to was specifically talking about viable alternatives. As much as people talk about Nader, he got just 2.74% of the national popular vote in 2000, and didn't win a single electoral vote. He only got a double-digit share of the vote percentage in one state (Alaska, where he got 10%). People don't talk about him because he had any real chance of winning, they talk about him because he got 1-2% in extremely close purple states where Bush and Gore were separated by less than that amount. That's not a serious threat to the two-party system, that's just annoying whichever party he likes less (and in 2000, he didn't do a particularly great job of hiding that he hated Gore more).
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Sep 26, 2023 22:18
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salt lake city will be having its first ever ranked choice vote for mayor this year and, as hard as every "we're not rightwing!!" rightwing source is going against rcv it might not be as politicly dead as we think
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Sep 26, 2023 22:51
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Scott Forstall posted:not to sound insulting, but really? you have no idea how corrupt pols thrive in modern America? Also, crossposting from the Trump Legal Thread OgNar posted:APNews on it The judge rather forcefully rebuked ths bolded point during the hearing (reportedly, tables were pounded), but it's another chance to highlight one of the lesser known changes since Trump left office: The FTC had, for decades, pegged consumer welfare as the standard by which the harm of anticompetitive behavior was measured. In 2015, they'd even essentially abdicated their ability to enforce anticompetitive behavior to the courts. The judge's ruling (and James' argument) meshes with the FTC's new stance under Khan: Harm to the competitive conditions of any relevant market is sufficient to use its enforcement powers. It's the same principle the FTC used to bar most noncompetes, over remarkably similar objections from the Republican member.
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Sep 26, 2023 22:58
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Being a member of the Green Party in office is easy. Just win as a Dem and leave the party. Not really sure what you'd do at that point you couldn't do as a Dem but it's a path
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Sep 26, 2023 23:02
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Jaxyon posted:The biggest theft in retail stores continues to be and always was wage theft. I’ve worked some of these claims during the riots during the pandemic. They can be quite large. Hundreds of thousands of dollars in merchandise for each store.
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Sep 26, 2023 23:05
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The Top G posted:I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? What Green Party policies specifically do you think are popular enough to be major vote getters but aren't being adopted by the Democrats? Regarding my logic: I believe that in the aggregate, the goals of a political party are to achieve and maintain power, and to use that power to accomplish the goals of their party, whatever they are. In our first past the post winner takes all system, if a third party has a policy that is wildly popular and getting a lot of votes, it is in the party's best interest to pick those things up and run with it. You see this in the early 20th century Progressive Party that was pushing things like trust busting or better food and drug purity laws getting picked up by the major parties, and the Progressive Party petered out. What you will also see is ideas that are popular enough to get picked up by some members of a major party but not all. I *think* but am not 100% that "Medicare for all" is an example of this. I don't think it originated within the Democratic party, but more progressive members picked it up. It wasn't popular enough to become picked up by the most conservative Dems. There are definitely party machinations and donor issues that put their thumbs on the scale, but if something is popular enough to draw votes I think major party politicians will go after them.
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Sep 26, 2023 23:07
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Bar Ran Dun posted:I’ve worked some of these claims during the riots during the pandemic. They can be quite large. Hundreds of thousands of dollars in merchandise for each store. Completely talking out of my rear end here, but I remember watching a video specifically on jewelry robbery, and the guy(who had already done his time, so less incentive to lie about it) said jewelry stores in particular are notorious for lying about how much got stolen to insurance.
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Sep 26, 2023 23:10
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Jaxyon posted:Completely talking out of my rear end here, but I remember watching a video specifically on jewelry robbery, and the guy(who had already done his time, so less incentive to lie about it) said jewelry stores in particular are notorious for lying about how much got stolen to insurance. I physically attended these stores in person, documented marked retail values by SKU to check again their advised prices, estimated stolen amounts , then had or reviewed third party inventory counts taken, then had forensic accounts review and adjust based on historical shrink rates. Yes you are taking out of your rear end. These losses can be significant enough to close stores. The problem is the conflation of these losses that are occurring in specific locations by companies to justify stores closures where they are experiencing what is just regular shrink. So yes organized mass theft is real and can be severe enough to close a store. But that’s not happening everywhere and some companies are closing stores with that as a given reason in places where it is not happening.
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Sep 26, 2023 23:21
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DSA has more members elected than the green party, in higher offices, and isn't a possible spoiler in close elections. The only thing the green party does better than DSA is grifting.The Top G posted:Personally, I think the platform of the Green Party isn’t absorbed by the Dems because their policies run counter to the goals of the donors to the Democrats—but I’m open to having my mind changed I don't think your intuitions about Democratic donors are entirely correct. Bernie Sanders raised the most from donors in both the 2016 and 2020 presidential primaries. (two billionaires spent more of their own money, but raised less from donors)
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Sep 26, 2023 23:21
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The Top G posted:I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? Could we get some specifics you are not the first person to say something about how those evil Dems keeps the Green party down without mentioning a single thing the Green party is about or has done.
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Sep 26, 2023 23:33
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The FCC, a day after getting a Democratic majority, announces plans for a return of Title II Net Neutrality 
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Sep 26, 2023 23:37
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Edward Mass posted:The FCC, a day after getting a Democratic majority, announces plans for a return of Title II Net Neutrality
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Sep 26, 2023 23:41
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How will they be doing it in a way that won’t easily be reversed in the near future?
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Sep 27, 2023 00:11
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Tiny Timbs posted:How will they be doing it in a way that won’t easily be reversed in the near future? I don’t think the FCC can really do anything like that. We would need legislation. So vote blue I guess.
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Sep 27, 2023 00:19
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The Top G posted:I don’t follow your logic. Can you elaborate? https://www.gp.org/platform I'd estimate a third of the platform is already Democratic party policy, and about a third is so broad and nonspecific that I can't tell how it would be done. But where specific policy positions are taken, they're not much better. I just doublechecked and the platform still calls for the US to sign the International Treaty for the Demilitarization of Space. I believe this treaty does not, and has not, ever existed. Other green party platform positions include Puerto Rican independence (a frustrating position to take on many levels at once), "support the right to initiative, referendum and recall at all levels of government", revoking the Boy Scouts charter, ending all funding of animal model research, closing all landfills, shutting down all nuclear power plants (and vitrifying all waste in the US, including all waste generated by shutting down all nuclear power plants, wherever it currently is), phasing out all man-made pesticides, ending all use of irradiation and the use of genetic engineering in food production, unwinding the entire federal reserve system to create a new treasury entity that will issue "public money" only to and through government entities, and "guarantee that public buildings that serve food such as schools, jails and hospitals participate in the practice of "Green Monday" – where all foods served on one day of the week does not contain animal products and byproducts – to provide ethical, healthier, and climate friendly meals one day out of each week". I don't think the issue is running counter to the Democratic donors so much as that it's a clusterfuck of things that sound broadly appealing only if you know nothing about them. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 00:39 on Sep 27, 2023 |
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Sep 27, 2023 00:37
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There's a rule that the FCC can have no more than 3 people from the same party at the same time on the commission, and the panel is only five commissioners, so Biden or whoever would need to appoint more pro-net neutrality Republicans to keep the policy in place.
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Sep 27, 2023 00:38
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I am intensely curious how old this part of the green party platform is:quote:Promote policies to encourage the people of the United States to watch less television, and instead to spend time with their families, friends and neighbors, and to engage in myriad other constructive, artistic or healthful pursuits. edit: lol this is an entire bullet point with zero further explanation, separate from all of more specific international positions: quote:The U.S. must recognize the sovereignty of nation-states and their right of self-determination. I can't imagine why this detailed, actionable, politically appealing platform isn't under careful consideration by the Dems. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Sep 27, 2023 |
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Sep 27, 2023 00:41
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Discendo Vox posted:I am intensely curious how old this part of the green party platform is: "promote policies to encourage... constructive, artistic or healthful pursuits" i guess posting on these forums would be discouraged under the green party
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Sep 27, 2023 00:44
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Discendo Vox posted:I am intensely curious how old this part of the green party platform is: This could be achieved with the passage of a basic income. Time and money are the major factors for most of these pursuits. hint hint, green party.
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Sep 27, 2023 00:49
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Freakazoid_ posted:This could be achieved with the passage of a basic income. Time and money are the major factors for most of these pursuits. hint hint, green party. They propose a negative income tax regime "that would maintain all individual adult incomes above the poverty level, regardless of employment or marital status" which, again, has no other details. It confusingly is redundant with other welfare/support concepts in the same section. I get the sense that every individual sentence in the platform was added completely independently of every other sentence, except for the major developed sections, like getting third parties more federal funding and ballot access. Meanwhile the first, topline item on their homepage is calling for a ceasefire in Ukraine. edit: yeah, there are places where someone added a broad sentence, then later in the same paragraph or section, almost the exact same sentence has been added again by someone who apparently missed it the first time. edit 2: Green's in the pocket of Big Tae Kwon Do: "Include self-defense skills in the physical education curriculum at elementary school level" Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Sep 27, 2023 |
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Sep 27, 2023 00:54
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...I'm kinda confused on where they think the trash will *go* after the landfills close. Even if you somehow massively reduce the amount of waste produced overnight and there is still going to be some that cannot be reduced or replaced with recycled goods - and I can't imagine that "incineration" would be very popular either.
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Sep 27, 2023 01:02
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