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Absurd Alhazred posted:Maybe it was different in the US, but I don't remember when politics wasn't treated like a team sport? It has been since I became politically aware in the 90s. Newt Gingrich was the primary catalyst for this unpleasant change. I hope he dies soon.
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Sep 29, 2023 22:26
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predicto posted:Newt Gingrich was the primary catalyst for this unpleasant change. I hope he dies soon. I still call it a handheld computer
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Sep 29, 2023 22:35
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Star Man posted:A US history teacher I had in undergrad lectured my class that anyone identifying as conservative or liberal in a way we would recognize didn't begin until the Great Depression. Yeah that's why Benny Shapiro calls himself a "classical liberal"
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Sep 29, 2023 22:45
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FlamingLiberal posted:Kind of, but I would say the modern version of conservative/liberal is more post-Civil Rights Act since until that happened you had lots of racist Dixiecrats who agreed with the economic positions of the Democrats but not the social ones. Also, we added a third (and fourth?) type of community with suburbs which mixed things up too.
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Sep 29, 2023 22:55
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I'm pretty sure it'd be something like: "We have here a life-sized anatomically correct statue of Trump. Whilst fellating the statue, please tells us to why our Orange Savior is the one and only true Dictator for Life that we should all be working to Putin to power."
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Sep 30, 2023 00:38
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I mean, the very idea that a political party had a cohesive, singular opinion on things is absolutely a modern thing, starting really in the 1990s (though not actually Newt Ginrich or Fox's fault). Prior to that, there might be one major issue that a party agreed upon and beyond that it was a mish-mash, but even then those issues came and went with large periods where the only reason you were a member of a party was because their local machine was too powerful to oppose so you were a Democrat or a Republican just by coin flip. In general, from 1900 through 1980, you could general expect that each party had a "progressive" wing and a "conservative" wing and any position you had 60% of one party would support and 40% of the other party would support. It's why the bi-partisan ideal is so strong for a lot of people who haven't paid much attention to politics since they were young, because back then nearly every major piece of legislation had major cross-over support. Bob Dole helped create welfare, and the Civil Rights Act of 1964 wouldn't have passed without an overwhelming majority of Republican Senators backing it. Where we are now is because the Civil Rights Act of 1964 broke the biggest rationale for Democrats and Republicans having liberal and conservative wings, but it wouldn't have happened without two major trends: the increasing power of the Presidency making presidential politics drive state and local politics; and the rise of national media through television and the internet. National messages are stronger and more common than they were in any previous time, and it's a proven trend (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/11/181102105956.htm) that people change their points of view to adjust to the party rather than staying in opposition on something.
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Sep 30, 2023 01:08
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^^^That's pretty on point I think^^^ I'm 56 so I'm old enough to remember Reagan's rise, my parents listening to the radio to see if Jimmy Carter won and the first election where I was eligible, when I voted for Dukakis (I'd do it again). Could be I just wasn't paying attention back then (and I didn't all that much until 9/11, at least in any meaningful way) but I don't remember a whole lot of "you're nazis/you're commies" stuff going on much as a kid. I know there were the McCarthy hearings and The Civil Rights Act and things so maybe it was always really this bad. But, for ME, anyway, it seemed to cement itself when Rush Limbaugh carved out a mouthpiece for an untapped voice using the largely obsolete and very cheap vehicle of AM talk radio. Rush, of course, was full of poo poo but so are a lot of Americans and he gave them - if not a voice - at least a script. Maybe "voice" is the wrong word. And he did so using comedy and a whole lot of undeniable talent, regardless of what you think of him. AM radio was clinically dead by then, subsisting on church broadcast, showtunes, Larry King Live, country formats and (maybe) NPR. Since then, once dollar signs got shot into the airwaves, it's been a race to the bottom to mimic his success and now we're dealing with actual members of congress who grew up listening to this poo poo and became true believers. They don't know it was an ad and a con all along. Limbaugh would have easily done some wild, left wing talk radio thing if it made him rich. Your Marjorie Taylor Greene's, your Matt Gaetz and your Jim Jordans don't exist without what Rush tapped into. BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Sep 30, 2023 |
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Sep 30, 2023 01:34
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I mean, Mike Pence was a right-wing radio guy like 20 years ago. Those people just have actual power now.
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Sep 30, 2023 01:46
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skeleton warrior posted:I mean, the very idea that a political party had a cohesive, singular opinion on things is absolutely a modern thing, starting really in the 1990s (though not actually Newt Ginrich or Fox's fault). Prior to that, there might be one major issue that a party agreed upon and beyond that it was a mish-mash, but even then those issues came and went with large periods where the only reason you were a member of a party was because their local machine was too powerful to oppose so you were a Democrat or a Republican just by coin flip. In general, from 1900 through 1980, you could general expect that each party had a "progressive" wing and a "conservative" wing and any position you had 60% of one party would support and 40% of the other party would support. It's why the bi-partisan ideal is so strong for a lot of people who haven't paid much attention to politics since they were young, because back then nearly every major piece of legislation had major cross-over support. Bob Dole helped create welfare, and the Civil Rights Act of 1964 wouldn't have passed without an overwhelming majority of Republican Senators backing it.
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Sep 30, 2023 04:43
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skeleton warrior posted:the Civil Rights Act of 1964 wouldn't have passed without an overwhelming majority of Republican Senators backing it. This is also amply demonstrated if you look at the map showing where the Yea and Nay votes came from - as Wikipedia nicely summarizes: "The House of Representatives:[3] Northern: 281–32 (90–10%) Southern: 8–94 (8–92%) The Senate:[2] Northern: 72–6 (92–8%) Southern: 1–21 (5–95%) – Ralph Yarborough of Texas was the only Southerner to vote in favor in the Senate" It's the same Union vs. Confederacy breakdown that you see on so many other maps throughout our country's entire history.
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Sep 30, 2023 15:17
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This has been dominating the discourse lately and my first question is just how honest they are about these numbers. My second question is that if it is so easy to find a job these days then why worry about all these folks looking for work? https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1708170681123561626?t=__6VMQ2CasaiN9npVZeAiA&s=19
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Sep 30, 2023 19:50
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If the number is that large, almost nothing short of a fully militarized border (with our number one trading partner) would stop it. Only crazies want that. Also, Wyoming shouldn't get to ve a state with that few people
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Sep 30, 2023 20:11
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Jesus III posted:If the number is that large, almost nothing short of a fully militarized border (with our number one trading partner) would stop it. Only crazies want that. Make the migrants citizens and move them to Wyoming. Problem solved.
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Sep 30, 2023 20:18
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:Make the migrants citizens and move them to Wyoming. Problem solved. Yeah seriously Wyoming doesn't need all that empty land for annoying libertarians and the idle rich (but I repeat myself)
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Sep 30, 2023 20:20
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That's probably the number of "encounters". An encounter is when the border patrol turns someone away, or takes them into custody. Assuming that's the measurement being referenced, it a) doesn't count individuals, so if someone were to try to enter the country five times in a month, they'd count as five encounters, and b) doesn't count the people who successfully entered the country, only the ones that failed. (Last year's number of encounters for September was 227k, so 260k wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.)
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Sep 30, 2023 20:28
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Modern GOP discourse around Mexico is that we literally need to invade them
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Sep 30, 2023 20:28
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FlamingLiberal posted:Modern GOP discourse around Mexico is that we literally need to invade them Given all their talk about an impending Second Civil War, I guess speedrunning the Mexican-American War first is in keeping.
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Sep 30, 2023 20:32
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How many of the illegal immigrants are canadian though? Having done it the other way round, and watched people do it the Canada-USA way What you do is show up, show the border guard your passport, and when they ask "but you definitely aren't going to get an illegal job this is a vacation right??" you say "yes definitely" then you get an illegal job illegal immigration rocks
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Sep 30, 2023 20:34
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Bel Shazar posted:A mixture of organized religion and leaded gas. If this isn't the most apt description of what makes up Boomer psyche, I don't know what is.
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Sep 30, 2023 21:05
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Christopher Rufo is still up to his poo poo: https://twitter.com/Charliemagne/status/1708187501922247120
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Sep 30, 2023 21:36
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McGlockenshire posted:Christopher Rufo is still up to his poo poo: The nice, polite fiction that DeSantis and Trump are not that dictator-in-waiting already. I think both have proven they will be petty fascist tyrants given the opportunity.
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Sep 30, 2023 21:46
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McGlockenshire posted:Christopher Rufo is still up to his poo poo: Paul von Hindenberg called, he says your moustache looks like poo poo.
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Sep 30, 2023 21:47
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Jesus III posted:If the number is that large, almost nothing short of a fully militarized border (with our number one trading partner) would stop it. Only crazies want that. Dakotas and Carolinas should be forcibly merged too, redistribute all of it based on national population and watch how fast conservative senate control disappears forever.
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Sep 30, 2023 22:40
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Christopher Rufo is a weird figure because he's on-record several times saying "yes we are using underhanded tricks to attack this minority group mainly as a trick to rile up low-information conservative voters and get our actual agenda passed" very plainly and everyone just kinda doesn't give a poo poo He's like a villain who introduces himself with "hello, I am evil and I know it". Like what do you even say to that
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Sep 30, 2023 23:22
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The making GBS threads on non conservatives was definitely a facet of Reagans rise. (BTW, I voted for Carter in 80) Even in his first campaign, he threw around the word "LIBeral" with such a tone of disgust all the time. It only got worse through his two terms. After Clinton won in 92, they realized that they'd worn out "LIBeral" as an insult and switched to socialist. And then radical socialist and communist. Not that most of their voters can actually define either.
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Sep 30, 2023 23:39
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MrUnderbridge posted:The making GBS threads on non conservatives was definitely a facet of Reagans rise. (BTW, I voted for Carter in 80) Yeah, I was a child during the Reagan years, but I distinctly remember him (and his people) sneering "liberal" like it only had four letters.
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Sep 30, 2023 23:47
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Sarcastro posted:Yeah, I was a child during the Reagan years, but I distinctly remember him (and his people) sneering "liberal" like it only had four letters. Same, though I remember Reagan himself had the actor's control to come off as gently pitying, rather than sneeringly contemptuous.
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Oct 1, 2023 00:45
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Was there ever a time in our modern political alignment when the right wouldn’t have had widespread participation in a Pinochet-like purge of political enemies? I sometimes wonder if Reagan was the start of that or if it was inside of them all along.
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Oct 1, 2023 00:48
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I AM GRANDO posted:Was there ever a time in our modern political alignment when the right wouldn’t have had widespread participation in a Pinochet-like purge of political enemies? I sometimes wonder if Reagan was the start of that or if it was inside of them all along. Gingrich was more openly vicious about it than Reagan, so I put 1994 as the bend in the hockey stick graph of conservative hatred.
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Oct 1, 2023 01:08
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I would say Nixon was definitely into those ideas
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Oct 1, 2023 01:10
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https://twitter.com/BestDamnRoofer/status/1707788790712938985?t=1A7DovP-envpGDO5pzWY9A&s=19 1. How does he know they are a liberal? Because they are rich? 2. How big of a tantrum would chuds have if they found out they got fleeced for being Trumpers? 3. Whatever liberal policies prevented any other roofers from competing with him, isn't that good policies for him? He implies he gouged the homeowners just because he could.
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Oct 1, 2023 03:12
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Crunch Buttsteak posted:Christopher Rufo is a weird figure because he's on-record several times saying "yes we are using underhanded tricks to attack this minority group mainly as a trick to rile up low-information conservative voters and get our actual agenda passed" very plainly and everyone just kinda doesn't give a poo poo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFh08JEKDYk
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Oct 1, 2023 04:21
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I AM GRANDO posted:Was there ever a time in our modern political alignment when the right wouldn’t have had widespread participation in a Pinochet-like purge of political enemies? I sometimes wonder if Reagan was the start of that or if it was inside of them all along. A group of ultra-wealthy people tried to coup FDR so uh, not since then. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot Murgos fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Oct 1, 2023 |
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Oct 1, 2023 04:25
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Panfilo posted:https://twitter.com/BestDamnRoofer/status/1707788790712938985?t=1A7DovP-envpGDO5pzWY9A&s=19 The butt hurt jealousy tone of his voice and copium laugh says it all.
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Oct 1, 2023 10:27
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Maybe Canadian goons can fill me in as it turns out this guy is from Ontario (but went to the Jan 6 protests?) and spends his time screaming at LGBT protestors. There's this bearded leftist guy who talked a little bit about chuds like this particular dude and they mentioned how simply being somewhat successful in their particular business can build up a bit of inertia and keep them relavent far longer than they deserve to be.
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Oct 1, 2023 15:34
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EDIT: eh nevermind
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Oct 1, 2023 16:02
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So how is the RWM spinning the Freedom Caucus getting owned this week and basically forced into having to resort to petty revenge stuff against their own party to eek out any sort of win in the latest big bill tussle?McGlockenshire posted:Christopher Rufo is still up to his poo poo: I have to admit, this guy definitely loving gets far right Chud mentalities more than most political strategists and how best to work messaging around firing them up what remains of the GOP base. Big part of the reason we have non-stop cycling culture war bullshit about oppressing the LGBT+ community in North American politics these days and it's such a relentless talking point with conservatives now. Seemingly to where it's the number one policy issue and more important to them than things like tight budgets, small government, low taxes, big business policy focus, national security and all that poo poo they've been on about since at least the Reagan years. It seems about the only feasible winning strategy for elections that the GOP and CCP here in Canada have left is to stoke culture war bullshit relentless and keep their voters angry about it and it's unfortunately probably the most effective strategy and reason why these far right parties keep getting better and better results around the world every election cycle and some of them are even strong enough to form governments now. Kale fucked around with this message at 16:40 on Oct 1, 2023 |
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Oct 1, 2023 16:29
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Kale posted:So how is the RWM spinning the Freedom Caucus getting owned this week and basically forced into having to resort to petty revenge stuff against their own party to eek out any sort of win in the latest big bill tussle? Not going to watch it to find out, but I expect it involves Hunter Biden
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Oct 1, 2023 16:31
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Panfilo posted:This has been dominating the discourse lately and my first question is just how honest they are about these numbers. My second question is that if it is so easy to find a job these days then why worry about all these folks looking for work? God, Elon Musk is such a loser. He could be the richest man a million times over and still would be a cringeworthy loser. I hope some part of him knows it and that keeps him awake at night. I love how he just makes up numbers too. "Oh these are unrecorded but they could be anything! A billion people!"
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Oct 1, 2023 16:43
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Levantine posted:God, Elon Musk is such a loser. He could be the richest man a million times over and still would be a cringeworthy loser. I hope some part of him knows it and that keeps him awake at night. Elon Musk chose being a painfully stereotypical far right hack bitching about the same old culture war issues 24/7 over being loved and adored by ignorant billions and a fawning main stream media apparatus essentially ready to hand him all the positive free publicity, clout and slack on being taken seriously that he could have ever wanted and that most billionaires are afforded by default in our society. He chose to decline that willingly and settle for just the love of Chuds because I guess his social media addicted brain and feed that is no doubt full to the brim of endless scrolls of Ian Miles Cheong, Babylon Bee, Joe Rogan, Jordan Peterson, Ben Shapiro, Tucker Carlson and Ramaswamy Thought decided this was a more important calling.
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Oct 1, 2023 17:08
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