[Ukraine] U.S. gives up on sending $100,000 guided artillery shells due to 6% hitrate

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Ukraine] U.S. gives up on sending $100,000 guided artillery shells due to 6% hitrate

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fizzy: Dec 2, 2022; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Good news for Ukraine - Ukrainian forces have succeeded in defeating Russia�s fleet in the Black Sea

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/10/3/7422426/

Russian Navy defeated in Black Sea � UK Defence Ministry
EUROPEAN PRAVDA, UKRAINSKA PRAVDA � TUESDAY, 3 OCTOBER 2023, 11:53

The UK Ministry of Defence believes that Ukrainian forces have succeeded in defeating Russia�s fleet in the Black Sea.

Source: UK junior defence minister James Heappey in a speech at the Warsaw Security Forum, as reported by European Pravda�s correspondent at the forum

In his speech, Heappey hailed Ukraine�s military achievements.

"Yes, Ukraine's progress is slow, but no one can say that it does not exist. You can point to the Kharkiv breakthrough as an example of success. But look at what Ukraine has now done in the Black Sea! Ukraine has achieved the functional defeat of the Russian Black Sea Fleet," Heappey said.

Commenting on Ukraine's ground counteroffensive, Heappey pointed out that "every inch is important".

# ? Oct 4, 2023 02:38

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# ? May 28, 2024 06:56

Frosted Flake: Sep 13, 2011; Semper Shitpost Ubique

Some Guy TT posted:

what do you think this is a chat room the whole point of a message board is that you can respond to things hours or even days later and pretend like youre in outer space on a signal delay

I didn't want to leave an unclear argument out there in the ether like a half-finished graffito in Herculaneum.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 02:45

gradenko_2000: Oct 5, 2010; HELL SERPENT; Lipstick Apathy

DiscountDildos posted:

pusillanimous

Maybe I harshly judged him based off something I can't remember, but I had Bessner pegged as a "mad about tankies" guy.

Bessner has definitely had some mockable takes in the past (which can't be dug up now because it seems he purges his tweets) but he's landed in a fairly good place with regards to Ukraine

it's just that the bar is currently set at "we shouldn't propagate a 'clean SS' myth" and people still can't hurdle it

# ? Oct 4, 2023 02:46

sum: Nov 15, 2010

fizzy posted:

Bad news for Ukraine - The U.S. funding system for Ukrainian salaries and Kyiv government expenditures is expected to run out in the next month absent a fresh infusion of money from Congress, and Ukraine would face a severe economic and political shock in the middle of the counteroffensive this fall if Congress cut off assistance to Kyiv.

https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/u-s-funding-cutoff-threatens-ukraines-economic-stability-82716679

U.S. Funding Cutoff Threatens Ukraine�s Economic Stability

This is a big deal. The House is shut down in large part because the Freedom Caucus has a veto over more funds to Ukraine.The Ukrainian economy imploding might be the sort of shock that changes the complexion of the war.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 02:52

VoicesCanBe: Jul 1, 2023; "Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

fizzy posted:

Bad news for Ukraine - Western establishment media (New York Times) is continuing to push the narrative that Ukraine's counteroffensive is continuing to be facing setbacks.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/03/world/europe/russia-ukraine-elastic-defense-counteroffensive.html

Russian Troops Cede Ground and Strike Back, Frustrating Ukraine�s Counteroffensive
By Matthew Mpoke Bigg
Oct. 3, 2023
Updated 5:39 p.m. ET

But one unusually daunting obstacle to Ukrainian troops is a tactic adopted by Russian forces: ceding ground and then striking back.

Rather than holding a line of trenches at all costs in the face of Ukraine�s assault, security experts say, Russian commanders have employed a longstanding military tactic known as �elastic defense.�

To execute the tactic, Russian forces pull back to a second line of positions, encouraging Ukrainian troops to advance, and then strike back when the opposing forces are vulnerable � either while moving across open ground or as they arrive at the recently abandoned Russian positions.

The goal is to prevent Ukrainian troops from actually securing a position and using it as a base for further advances. That is what Ukraine was able to do successfully in the village of Robotyne in the south, its biggest breakthrough in recent weeks.

�The defender gives ground while inflicting as heavy casualties as they can on the attackers with a view to being able to set the attackers up for a decisive counterattack,� said Ben Barry, a senior fellow for land war studies at the International Institute for Strategic Studies, a British research group.

Russia has been doing that since almost the beginning of the war. It's probably their most common tactic. They're just now admitting it, finally.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 02:58

VoicesCanBe: Jul 1, 2023; "Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

fizzy posted:

The U.S. funding system for Ukrainian salaries and Kyiv government expenditures is expected to run out in the next month absent a fresh infusion of money from Congress, Ukrainian and American government officials said.

As a government shutdown loomed, Secretary of State Antony Blinken warned Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell on Sept. 24 that Ukraine would face a severe economic and political shock in the middle of the counteroffensive this fall if Congress cut off assistance to Kyiv.

The U.S. and other donor nations effectively pay the salaries of 150,000 civil servants in Ukraine and more than half a million teachers, professors and school workers, not to mention government expenses ranging from health care to housing subsidies.

.......................................

Since the war began, most lawmakers and members of the public have focused on the hardware, including tanks, helicopters, advanced missile systems and millions of rounds of ammunition, all of which the U.S. is uniquely positioned to provide. Yet when Blinken visited Kyiv in September, Ukrainian Prime Minister Denys Shmyhal began a meeting by thanking him for a little-known stream of civilian-budget aid paid via the World Bank.

�All wages that are now paid in Ukraine in the public sector over the past year, including social and other programs, are funded through this,� Shmyhal said.

Another interesting admission. This is the first time I can recall an explicit confirmation from a major western news source that the US is footing the bill for the Ukrainian government and that it would effectively collapse without it.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:02

my bony fealty: Oct 1, 2008

VoicesCanBe posted:

Another interesting admission. This is the first time I can recall an explicit confirmation from a major western news source that the US is footing the bill for the Ukrainian government and that it would effectively collapse without it.

Insane campaign ad for anti-war funding people (which seems to be exclusively Republicans). The US government is literally paying the salaries of Ukranian bureaucrats while your grocery bill keeps climbing and climbing.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:12

Slavvy: Dec 11, 2012

How can they still be banging on about a counter offensive, how can that be possible

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:26

Lostconfused: Oct 1, 2008

They're lying :ssh:

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:27

VoicesCanBe: Jul 1, 2023; "Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

Slavvy posted:

How can they still be banging on about a counter offensive, how can that be possible

It's going to be the counter offensive that never ends. By Spring 2024 Ukraine will still speak of it as an ongoing situation.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:34

speng31b: May 8, 2010

VoicesCanBe posted:

It's going to be the counter offensive that never ends. By Spring 2024 Ukraine will still speak of it as an ongoing situation.

yeah if they don't ever click end turn they can't lose

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:36

MonsieurChoc: Oct 12, 2013; Every species can smell its own extinction.

Is there any kind of left wing movementleft in Ukraine at this point?

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:37

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

MonsieurChoc posted:

Is there any kind of left wing movementleft in Ukraine at this point?

if you were a leftist in ukraine you'd be in occupied areas, russia or possibly serbia by now

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:38

Frosted Flake: Sep 13, 2011; Semper Shitpost Ubique

There were still KPD members in Germany when the Red Army rolled in.

Of course their response was "what the gently caress have you been doing around here for the past few years?"

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:40

sum: Nov 15, 2010

Speaking of cutting financial aid, it looks like the White House is already putting up trial balloons about shutting it off. I would not want to be a Ukrainian schoolteacher right now. Separately, the energy sector "anti-corruption" reforms seem to be a euphemism for ending the large subsidies Ukraine provides for electricity and heat and liberalizing the market. Needless to say this would be extremely unpopular.
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/10/03/politics/us-ukraine-pressure-counter-corruption/index.html

quote:

US increases pressure on Ukraine to do more to counter corruption

The US is increasingly urging Ukraine to do more to combat governmental corruption, issuing several notices to Kyiv in the last few weeks indicating that certain kinds of US economic aid will be linked to Ukraine�s progress in reforming its institutions, multiple US officials told CNN.

The Biden administration�s commitment to supporting Ukraine�s military remains undiminished. But officials have made clear recently that other forms of US aid are potentially in jeopardy if Ukraine does not do more to address corruption.

Congress has not yet approved the administration�s request for $24 billion in additional funding for Ukraine, with some Republicans wary of providing so much money without robust oversight and conditions attached.

�The message to the Ukrainians has always been that if any of these funds are misappropriated, then it jeopardizes all US aid to the country,� one US official familiar with the efforts told CNN.

The State Department issued a formal diplomatic note, also known as a demarche, to Ukraine in late summer that said the US expects Ukraine to continue pursuing various anti-corruption and financial transparency efforts in order to keep receiving direct budget support, three officials familiar with the matter told CNN. The demarche has not been previously reported.

The US has provided Ukraine with over $23 billion in direct budget support since the war began, according to the Congressional Research Service. This money is separate from military aid and allows Ukraine to continue providing essential services to its citizens like emergency first responders, health care, and education. It is disbursed by the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) through the World Bank to the Ukrainian Ministry of Finance.

The demarche also emphasized the need for Ukraine to implement critical reforms under Ukraine�s International Monetary Fund program, including those related to anti-money laundering/countering the financing of terrorism (AML/CFT), a source familiar with the matter said.

In a statement to CNN, the Ukrainian embassy in Washington said that Ukraine has moved �ambitiously� to pass reforms, including on its IMF program.

�We have conducted these reforms initiated by Ukraine with the help and support from the US, EU and other friends,� the statement says. �And their practical support to our Cabinet of ministers as well as our (National Bank of Ukraine), General Prosecutors office and anticorruption agencies is appreciated and valued�In all our obligations with IMF, EU and other international donors as well as USA, Ukraine delivers on this front.�

The administration has been public about its desire to help Ukraine fight corruption throughout its war with Russia. But private diplomatic discussions about the issue have ramped up in recent weeks, as questions have swirled about whether Congress will approve the administration�s funding request for Ukraine.

National Security adviser Jake Sullivan met with a delegation of Ukrainian anti-corruption officials to discuss their efforts just last month, and Secretary of State Antony Blinken discussed the issue with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky while in Kyiv in early September, State Department spokesperson Matthew Miller said on Monday.

Asked by CNN about the US push to get Ukraine to tackle corruption, Miller said that he would not detail �specific conversations, other than to say that it continues to be a high priority for us that we raise with our Ukrainian counterparts, and it continues to be a priority for Ukraine. And we have seen them take action in response to specific requests that we have made as recently as the past few weeks.�

Separately, the White House has drafted a list of reforms Ukraine should implement in order to continue receiving US financial assistance and move toward integrating into Europe.

The draft, first reported by Ukrainska Pravda, was shared with the US embassy in Kyiv and members of the Donor Coordination Platform, a mechanism launched in January to better coordinate international financial support flowing into Ukraine. The reforms are not a condition for receiving military aid, a US official said.

�This list was provided as a basis for consultation with the Government of Ukraine and key partners as part of our enduring support to Ukraine and its efforts to integrate into Europe, a goal the United States strongly supports,� the US embassy in Kyiv said in a statement.

The White House document outlines changes Ukraine could make within three months, six months, one year and 18 months.

Many of the proposals � including strengthening the Specialized Anti-Corruption Prosecutor�s Office, enhancing the independence of the supervisory boards of Ukrainian state-owned companies, and constitutional court reform � are also requirements for EU membership and benchmarks for the IMF.

�Reforms in the energy sector, a bastion of corruption and oligarchic control, are essential to cementing Ukraine�s European integration,� the State Department said in a strategy memo for Ukraine posted on its website in August.

The memo added that �Ukraine must maintain stable financial management of its economy in order to continue to fight the war, rebuilt the economy, and achieve its goal to become a prosperous, democratic, western country. Ukraine must slay the corruption dragon once and for all.�

The Ukrainian embassy said in its statement to CNN that Ukrainian officials signed an �energy memorandum� during their visit to Washington last month, and that Ukraine has passed a European-style law aimed at preventing abuses in wholesale energy markets. The White House document says implementation of that law should occur by April 2024.

Zelensky, for his part, has been eager to show the US, EU and NATO that he is cracking down on corruption, particularly after Russia�s invasion of Ukraine. He recently cleaned house at the Ukrainian Ministry of Defense, firing his defense minister and several senior defense officials, and launched a number of high-profile raids earlier this year against officials suspected of graft.

Ukraine considers the direct budget support it gets from the US and other foreign allies to be vital to keeping its economy afloat.

�We are grateful that this money arrives as grants, because this does not affect the state debt of Ukraine, and this is a very important factor in these difficult times,� Ukrainian Prime Minister Denys Shmyhal told Blinken last month, referring to the US� direct budget support for Ukraine.

That money is also the �most closely scrutinized� form of aid to Ukraine, a senior Democratic Senate aide told CNN. �The Ukrainians know they have to account for every single penny. The Ukrainians making the decisions know that accountability is a key to their continuing to get funds. It�s been a consistent point of messaging from the administration. Which is fair considering all the support we�re giving them.�

USAID�s inspector general and Ukraine�s Specialized Anti-Corruption Prosecutor signed a memorandum of understanding in July aimed at strengthening USAID�s ability to probe any misuse or abuse of funds by Ukraine, including the direct budget support.

The US intends to provide up to $3.3 billion in direct economic aid to Ukraine if Congress authorizes its $24 billion supplemental request for Ukraine.

That supplemental request is now in limbo, however.

Congress passed a short-term bill on Saturday to continue funding the government through mid-November, but the legislation does not include additional money for Ukraine. Republicans have increasingly questioned the wisdom of the funding and called for greater oversight of it, though some remain opposed to supporting Ukraine as a matter of principle, regardless of Kyiv�s anti-corruption efforts.

The Pentagon, meanwhile, is also taking new steps to better monitor US military aid flowing to Ukraine. The Defense Department inspector general announced last month that it will be establishing a new team in Ukraine to monitor ongoing US security assistance to Kyiv, which has totaled more than $43.7 billion since the start of the Biden administration.

It will mark the first time the DoD IG will have personnel based in Ukraine since Russia�s invasion in February 2022, said spokeswoman Megan Reed.

The White House noted in its draft list of priorities for Ukraine that the Ukrainian MoD should �redesign� its armament and procurement processes to better reflect NATO standards of �transparency, accountability, efficiency and competition in defense procurement.�

Another issue that has come up in recent weeks is the question of whether Zelensky will move to hold a presidential election in March 2024. Sen. Lindsey Graham has pushed for an election, saying it will demonstrate Ukraine�s commitment to freedom and democracy in the face of Russia�s invasion.

Zelensky has said that holding an election in wartime would be complicated and expensive, noting that international observers must be allowed in to ensure the results are internationally recognized. But he said last month that he is ready to do so �if it is necessary.�

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:41

Frosted Flake: Sep 13, 2011; Semper Shitpost Ubique

sum posted:

�Reforms in the energy sector, a bastion of corruption and oligarchic control, are essential to cementing Ukraine�s European integration,� the State Department said in a strategy memo for Ukraine posted on its website in August.

Why the gently caress would the Biden Whitehouse be stupid enough to kick that particular hornets' nest?

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:42

i say swears online: Mar 4, 2005

Frosted Flake posted:

There were still KPD members in Germany when the Red Army rolled in.

Of course their response was "what the gently caress have you been doing around here for the past few years?"

someone brought it up yesterday i think. if you were KPD and drafted, what did you do? were you able to be reintegrated into the GDR by quoting some marx? did you go underground when drafted and hope you didn't get caught? if were you in employment exempt from the draft, did that mean you were still working toward the war effort? i assume there were like a million of these people who had to do something in the war years and not many hid in a barn the whole time

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:43

Endman: May 18, 2010; That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even anime may die

Frosted Flake posted:

There were still KPD members in Germany when the Red Army rolled in.

Of course their response was "what the gently caress have you been doing around here for the past few years?"

Probably lying low so they didn't get shot, I would guess

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:45

KomradeX: Oct 29, 2011

Frosted Flake posted:

Why the gently caress would the Biden Whitehouse be stupid enough to kick that particular hornets' nest?

*Gestures at Biden White House* you want to ask that question again, outloud and slowly?

KomradeX has issued a correction as of 03:49 on Oct 4, 2023

# ? Oct 4, 2023 03:46

Slavvy: Dec 11, 2012

Frosted Flake posted:

Why the gently caress would the Biden Whitehouse be stupid enough to kick that particular hornets' nest?

Dude you have an encyclopedic knowledge of a hundred dead empires and you're asking this question, seriously

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:00

Frosted Flake: Sep 13, 2011; Semper Shitpost Ubique

i say swears online posted:

someone brought it up yesterday i think. if you were KPD and drafted, what did you do? were you able to be reintegrated into the GDR by quoting some marx? did you go underground when drafted and hope you didn't get caught? if were you in employment exempt from the draft, did that mean you were still working toward the war effort? i assume there were like a million of these people who had to do something in the war years and not many hid in a barn the whole time

There are some books on postwar Germany and Austria. The Soviets obviously favoured people who had gone into exile before the war, followed by POWs that defected. After that, people who were imprisoned or sent to concentration camps were judged to have bona fides, though the Soviets were very curious why there had not been a partisan movement in Germany. One KPD member remembered being greeted with "Why are you not with the partisans?!" when he produced his party card.

This has kind of disappeared from western historiography, but as the Reich collapsed, a lot of these guys particularly in the labour movement, did emerge to start organizing communities to either surrender to the Red Army or to pick up the pieces after the Burgermeister and local party Gauleiter ran off or killed themselves. They were the go-between as the Soviets started administering territory, feeding the civilian population etc. This kind of cuts against the West German narrative of rapine and pillage, but it seems that outside of the Fortress Cities, things generally went okay and order was established quickly.

I'd point out that the fate of any fortress that fell after the ram touched the wall has been pretty consistent throughout history, but whatever, uniquely Russian savagery, Asiatic horde, Victims of Communism etc. etc.

There was tension in Germany, Austria, and the rest of the countries that went on to become Warsaw Pact, from about 1945-50 between the local communists who had been in exile with the Soviets and those who had been in hiding at home. It's hard for me to parse what happened and what's Cold War propaganda, but the stereotype is that the Soviets brutally installed Stalinists who weren't even from round here, over the noble social democratic hometown boys, but I would guess there's more to it. It seems like a lot of what happened is that the Soviets started actively organizing the future governments in early 1944 in anticipation of entering the Reich and minor Axis in the campaigns of that summer and 1945, and so there were insiders who the Soviets were used to working with, were much better organized than people who had been hiding from the Nazis for up to 12 years, and so on.

A lot of the writing seems to just barely conceal considering the socialists who went into exile in the Soviet Union before the war traitors, and their return as carpetbaggers, but since Hungary is nearly always used as the example I am guessing our friends the Anti-Communist Diaspora are at work in this historical interpretation.

e: and then in Poland too, why would the Soviets rather work with the socialist parts of the Polish Home Army that rose to spite them and prevent a Soviet-friendly state being established, rather than those who had fought with Bering and the LWP for years? Idk, maybe the Soviets did install Stalinist governments rather than social democracy the recently fascist-or-occupied countries of Central and Eastern Europe clamoured for, but the writing about it, especially in Austria where it seems all flavours of socialism were popular, rubs me the wrong way.

Add to that the US and UK were literally, actually, parachuting people into these countries before the war even ended to prevent them from become too socialist or too aligned with the Soviets. I can see why they would place more trust in people who had spent those long years either in exile or in the Red Army.

Frosted Flake has issued a correction as of 04:07 on Oct 4, 2023

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:02

DancingShade: Jul 26, 2007; by Fluffdaddy

Lostconfused posted:

They're lying

Like those truth revealing sunglasses from They Live, except for Western propaganda.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:12

DancingShade: Jul 26, 2007; by Fluffdaddy

Frosted Flake posted:

Why the gently caress would the Biden Whitehouse be stupid enough to kick that particular hornets' nest?

A certain quote comes to mind about never underestimating how much a certain individual can ahem mess up a situation.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:15

Officer Sandvich: Feb 14, 2010

https://www.ukrinform.ua/rubric-world/3769263-nato-rozrobilo-regionalni-plani-proti-rosii-ta-teroristiv-golova-vijskovogo-komitetu.html

quote:

Bauer also indicated that the Alliance understood the need to have more forces ready to perform tasks. That is why it was decided to increase the number of rapid response forces to 300,000 servicemen capable of deployment within the first 30 days. According to the head of the NATO Military Committee, 300,000 military personnel is the number that should be sufficient for the Alliance in the event of a "major conflict with Russia."

Along with this, he pointed out that the armed forces in many member countries have been "neglected for decades", and therefore huge investments are needed to train people and increase the production capacity of the industry.

According to Bauer, Russia's war against Ukraine also demonstrated the need for NATO to build up integrated air and missile defense. In his opinion, in the next 10 years, most member states will direct "huge investments" in strengthening their air defense capabilities.

At the same time, the admiral pointed out that the development of air defense involves the possibility of destroying missile systems on the territory of the Russian Federation.

"There are two things you can do in air defense. You can wait for the missiles to come to you and then shoot them down. That will require a lot of missiles, as we see in Ukraine. And we are not only talking about missiles, but also drones, which are all are used more often. Or you use missiles and other systems on your end to take out the systems that the Russians are launching those missiles at you from, which is pretty effective because then they have nothing to fire from. So it's a combination of those two things that we let's see from the point of view of investments," he said.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:16

Frosted Flake: Sep 13, 2011; Semper Shitpost Ubique

Okay, well, how do they plan on recruiting 300k people?

Nobody wants to pay for it.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:17

Pomeroy: Apr 20, 2020

MonsieurChoc posted:

Is there any kind of left wing movementleft in Ukraine at this point?

I imagine the primary focus of the activity of any genuine Ukrainian left is, at this point, avoiding the attention of the local state-sanctioned gangs of methed up neo-Nazis with American guns.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:22

Lostconfused: Oct 1, 2008

ЗеРада posted:

In two weeks, Zely managed to behead the chambers of parliaments of the largest countries of North America, almost the entire continent was parliamentary beheaded.

Well, at least he didn't go to Mexico�

_{(from t.me/ZeRada1/16095, via tgsa)}

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:22

Homeless Friend: Jul 16, 2007

orban being like "how can you complain about our corruption, we're giving billions of dollars to these guys" is pretty funny

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:33

DancingShade: Jul 26, 2007; by Fluffdaddy

Frosted Flake posted:

Okay, well, how do they plan on recruiting 300k people?

Nobody wants to pay for it.

They get paid after first deployment. Cuts costs by 90%.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 04:36

Isizzlehorn: Feb 25, 2010

Lostconfused posted:

_{(from t.me/ZeRada1/16095, via tgsa)}

Haha drat

Good poo poo Z man

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:01

CODChimera: Jan 29, 2009

hows the war going?

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:32

crepeface: Nov 5, 2004; r*p*f*c*

gradenko_2000 posted:

Bessner has definitely had some mockable takes in the past (which can't be dug up now because it seems he purges his tweets) but he's landed in a fairly good place with regards to Ukraine

it's just that the bar is currently set at "we shouldn't propagate a 'clean SS' myth" and people still can't hurdle it

he's the co-host of hingepoints, right? i think he's said some dumb stuff on there.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:34

crepeface: Nov 5, 2004; r*p*f*c*

MonsieurChoc posted:

Is there any kind of left wing movementleft in Ukraine at this point?

yea it's called the advance of the russian army!!!

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:35

crepeface: Nov 5, 2004; r*p*f*c*

VoicesCanBe posted:

Another interesting admission. This is the first time I can recall an explicit confirmation from a major western news source that the US is footing the bill for the Ukrainian government and that it would effectively collapse without it.

i remember this post from the old thread making me laugh that biden was now paying healthcare workers in ukraine but not the US

WaryWarren posted:

lol

https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1546846071078486016

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:42

MonsieurChoc: Oct 12, 2013; Every species can smell its own extinction.

Pomeroy posted:

I imagine the primary focus of the activity of any genuine Ukrainian left is, at this point, avoiding the attention of the local state-sanctioned gangs of methed up neo-Nazis with American guns.

Right.

I hope that trans catgirl who claimed to have discovered a super conductor will be okay. She is a powerful poster.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:45

BearsBearsBears: Aug 4, 2022

CODChimera posted:

hows the war going?

All Quiet on the Southern Front

# ? Oct 4, 2023 05:47

fizzy: Dec 2, 2022; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

CODChimera posted:

hows the war going?

Good news for posters like CODChimera who are eager for news about the war - There is news about the war.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-vows-no-new-mobilisation-335000-sign-up-fight-2023-10-03/

Russia says 335,000 sign up to fight, no plans for new mobilisation
By Guy Faulconbridge
October 3, 2023 10:51 AM UTC � Updated an hour ago

MOSCOW, Oct 3 (Reuters) - Russia has no plans for an additional mobilisation of men to fight in Ukraine as more than 335,000 have signed up so far this year to fight in the armed forces or voluntary units, Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu said on Tuesday.

Russia has been bolstering its armed forces and ramping up weapons production in the expectation of a long war in Ukraine, where front lines have barely shifted for a year.

"There are no plans for an additional mobilisation," Shoigu was shown telling top generals on state television. "The armed forces have the necessary number of military personnel to conduct the special military operation."

Shoigu, an ally of President Vladimir Putin, hailed the patriotism of those who had signed up.

"Since the start of the year, more than 335,000 people have entered military service under contract and in volunteer formations," Shoigu said. "In September alone, more than 50,000 citizens signed contracts."

Those figures indicate that Russia has made significant progress both in signing recruits and in absorbing many fighters from the Wagner mercenary force into "voluntary formations".

Putin ordered a "partial mobilisation" of 300,000 reservists in September last year, prompting hundreds of thousands of young men to flee Russia to avoid being sent to fight.

Putin has repeatedly said there is no need to repeat the mobilisation, which some Russian officials say was a mistake as it prompted so many to leave.

LONG WAR?

Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February 2022 unleashed a war that has devastated swathes of eastern and southern Ukraine, killed or injured hundreds of thousands of men and triggered the biggest rupture in Russia's ties with the West for six decades.

Putin says he is fighting a Western alliance waging a proxy war to diminish Russia politically and militarily, while Western leaders say their economic sanctions and their military backing for Ukraine are a direct response to Moscow's aggression.

But the future course of the war is uncertain, despite predictions by U.S. officials earlier this year that Russia's defeat on the battlefields of Ukraine would pierce Putin's hubris.

While Ukraine was able to win back territory last year from Russia in attacks which humiliated the Russian armed forces, this year has been different.

In the month to Sept. 26, Russia took 31 square miles while Ukraine took 16 square miles, according to the Belfer Center at the Harvard Kennedy School.

The declared war aims of both sides appear ambitious: Ukraine says it will eject every last Russian soldier from Ukraine while Russia says it will demilitarise Ukraine.

Mark Milley, who retired last month as U.S. chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, told CNN last month that the fight would be long, hard and bloody as Russia had well over 200,000 men in Ukraine.

"What I said months ago was it's going to be long, hard, bloody because the nature of this particular fight and the type of defense that the Russians put in," Milley said.

Milley said that the Ukrainian aim to kick all the Russians out of Ukraine would "take a long time. That's going to be very significant effort over a considerable amount of time."

"I can tell you that it will take a considerable length of time to militarily eject all 200,000-plus Russian troops out of Russian-occupied Ukraine. That's a very high bar. It's going to take a long time to do it," Milley said.

While the Kremlin expects the United States to continue to support Ukraine with tens of billions of dollars in security assistance, Putin is betting on Western fatigue over the war.

"We have repeatedly said before that according to our forecasts fatigue from this conflict, fatigue from the completely absurd sponsorship of the Kyiv regime, will grow in various countries, including the United States," Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said on Monday.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 06:27

Starsfan: Sep 29, 2007; This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

when they say that 350,000 people signed contracts what they really mean was that over one million Russians were rounded up and dragged off as slaves to take part in meat attacks against the unbreakable Ukrainian front line.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 06:47

fizzy: Dec 2, 2022; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Bad news for Russia - Russian forces in Ukraine have only three further days of fuel, food and ammunition left to conduct the war after a breakdown in their supply chains

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/22/russian-invaders-have-three-days-of-supplies-left-says-ukraine-military

Russian invaders have three days of supplies left, says Ukraine military

Russian forces have only three further days of fuel, food and ammunition left to conduct the war after a breakdown in their supply chains, Ukrainian military commanders have alleged.

The claims of major shortages were described as �plausible� by western officials although they said they were unable to corroborate the analysis.

The report from the Ukrainian armed forces general command was said to be consistent with evidence that the Russian advance had stalled, and that they had reverted to using �indiscriminate and attritional� artillery attacks on civilians.

�We do think that the Russian forces have used a lot of material including particular categories of weapons and we have seen isolated reports of particular units that have lacked supplies of one sort or another,� the official said.

�It is consistent with an advance which has ground to a halt. Failures in the logistic chain has been one of the reasons they have not been as effective as they hoped.�

A Pentagon official added there were continuing morale issues among Russian troops, with food and fuel shortages, as well as frostbite due to a lack of adequate clothing.

�They�re struggling on many fronts,� the US official said.

# ? Oct 4, 2023 06:48

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# ? May 28, 2024 06:56

FrancisFukyomama: Feb 4, 2019

Pomeroy posted:

I imagine the primary focus of the activity of any genuine Ukrainian left is, at this point, avoiding the attention of the local state-sanctioned gangs of methed up neo-Nazis with American guns.

Did any nominally left parties survive that big purge? It sounds like sticking to the minsk accords was grounds for banning and most socdem groups had that stance

# ? Oct 4, 2023 06:50

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Ukraine] U.S. gives up on sending $100,000 guided artillery shells due to 6% hitrate

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