|
The Oldest Man posted:it's funny that people who are self-described pro palestine literally do not have the ability to conceptualize a world in which the palestinians win their own freedom with their own hands and tut tut that by not accepting their own deaths with dignity, they have doomed themselves my sister is very sympathetic to palestinians, but absolutely hates hamas. 'palestine HAD the moral high ground, but hamas pissed it away.' she loving minimized the US treatment of natives to condemn israel last night, and she STILL thinks hamas is wrong!
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:58 |
|
|
oh no not the moral high ground
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:23
|
|
|
it's over moral anakin,
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:23
|
|
|
Dixon Chisholm posted:my sister is very sympathetic to palestinians, but absolutely hates hamas. the only subject wherein a discussion gets more irrationally angry faster than I/P in the US is prison reform.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:23
|
|
|
The Watchman Fell Asleep: The Surprise of Yom Kippur and Its Sources Based on many formerly undisclosed intelligence and military documents, the secret protocols of discussions on the eve of the war, and interviews with relevant figures, The Watchman Fell Asleep is a compelling account of Israel's intelligence failure before the 1973 Arab attack known as the Yom Kippur War. The Hebrew version of this book was awarded the Tshetshik Prize for Strategic Studies on Israel's Security in 2001, and the Israeli Political Science Association's Best Book Award in 2002. Available here in English for the first time, Uri Bar-Joseph has crafted an authoritative explanation of the most traumatic event in Israel's stormy history and one of the biggest strategic military surprises of the twentieth century. IDF institutional culture posted:The illusion of invulnerability, which creates a sense of over-optimism and leads to a high level of risk-taking: Some members of the group had reservations about the validity of the conception but in many cases these reservations were not expressed in the discussions. Some participants maintained later that they thought that even if they were mistaken, the regular IDF force sufficed to block the offensives in the Suez and the Golan. Implicitly, they could make a mistake since its cost would not be too high. It also seems like Israel has already taken a bigger L here than in the October War, "We cannot know what the course of the war would have been had the surprise been averted. Hence, no definite estimation of the IDF losses as a direct result of the surprise can be ascertained. The best that can be done is to estimate the IDF’s losses in the war’s first three days—until the end of its failed counterat- tack in Sinai, and the more successful counterattack in the Golan. These losses had been the direct outcome of surprise. And yet, it should be remembered that the heavy losses the IDF suffered throughout the rest of the war were also the direct outcome of the way the war started. The IDF has never provided an official figure of the number of soldiers that were killed in the war’s first phase. The best figure we have, from a simple count, is 724 soldiers killed until the end of October 8. This figure does not include soldiers who were wounded and died later, or prisoners of war (most of whom were captured during the war’s first three days), who died in Syrian or Egyptian prisons. The IDF was involved in heavy battles before, but throughout its history it had never paid so dearly for such minor achievements as it did on the war’s first day. In the morning of October 7, less than sixteen hours after fire started, Division 252—the main regular force that was supposed to hold back the Egyptian crossing force—was left with 103 tanks out of the 290 tanks it had when war started. The Egyptians, on the other hand, succeeded during these hours to cross the canal with 90,000 soldiers, 850 tanks, and 11,000 additional vehicles. The price they claim to have paid for this achievement was twenty tanks, five fighters, and 280 soldiers killed. If accepted at face value, this loss ratio means that for each destroyed Egyptian tank the IDF lost nine of its own. Such a loss ratio did not reflect a significant improvement in the performance of the Egyptian army or deterioration in the operational capabilities of the IDF’s tank teams. Eight days later, the Egyptian army launched its second offensive in the war. It lost about 250 tanks without any territorial gains. The Is- raelis lost 10–12 tanks. Only the shock of surprise, the confusion, the improper deployment, and the misunderstanding of the Egyptian war plan at the operational and strategic levels can explain the IDF’s initial failure. This combination of factors led to a situation in which many of the tanks of Division 252 were hit by Egyptian teams of tank hunters when they were on their way to their firing positions—the same positions they were supposed to hold when the war started. Many additional tanks were hit when they tried to assist the strongholds in response to desperate calls for help from the reserve soldiers that were not supposed to man them from the start."
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
HallelujahLee posted:oh no not the moral high ground I have the moral high ground Hamanakin
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
liberalishly whispers to a palestinian about to get bombed "you have lost the moral high ground"
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
Dixon Chisholm posted:my sister is very sympathetic to palestinians, but absolutely hates hamas. my guess is your idiot sister will parrot whatever a puppet will tell her, uncritically
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:24
|
|
|
EU freezes aid payments for Palestinians The European Commission puts its full portfolio of development aid to Palestinians, worth 691 million euros ($728.66 million), under review. “The scale of terror and brutality against Israel and its people is a turning point,” Oliver Varhelyi, the EU Commissioner for Neighbourhood and Enlargement, said in a post on social media platform X. “There can be no business as usual,” Varhelyi said. The decision means that payments are immediately suspended, projects put under review and new budget proposals postponed until further notice, he added. hows this for moral high ground
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:25
|
|
|
Dixon Chisholm posted:my sister is very sympathetic to palestinians, but absolutely hates hamas. I regret to inform you your sister is a dipshit
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:25
|
|
|
Hamas announced that their anti-air missiles have targeted Israeli planes from a distance of 35 KM There are currently gun battles in the Sofa settlement on the southern border of gaza
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:25
|
|
|
yes, good, make it so the only way to survive will be to shoot your way out of gaza, great plans everyone
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:26
|
|
|
NPR having a normal one today "The attacks from Hamas, which have killed hundreds of Israeli civilians, including women and children, have caused Israel to respond with missile strikes into Gaza, also killing hundreds."
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:27
|
|
|
Dixon Chisholm posted:my sister is very sympathetic to palestinians, but absolutely hates hamas. wow your sister is a stupid idiot Ask her why she cares now and not when Israel killed ambulance workers and children for decades.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:27
|
|
|
With such rampant racist bullshit coming out of Europe, I don't see how more combatant parties will not become involved if all aid is being stopped.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:27
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:Here is my unironic level headed analysis of the current situation as of now:- You might appreciate this, "Beyond its human and material losses, the cost the IDF paid for being caught unprepared involved the state of combat readiness of the reserve forces upon their arrival at the front. In light of the chaotic way in which the war started, there were many claims that the reserve store units were poorly organized—allegedly proof of the fundamental neglect that contributed independently to the military failure. But as Adan pointed out, in 1973 the IDF was better prepared for war than in 1967. Still, in 1967 the IDF went to war better prepared since it had three weeks to get organized for the fighting. In Yom Kippur some of the reserve forces started their way to the front within a few hours from the time of mobilization, and in a number of cases they got into battle within twelve hours from call. As a result they fought in an unorganized manner and, in many cases, without being properly equipped. Moreover, out of 1,741 tanks that entered combat service in both fronts during the war’s first three days, only 309 arrived in the combat zone on transporters. The rest made their way on tracks; 168 of them suffered various technical problems. The rest entered combat in a low state of technical fitness due to the long drive on tracks. The hasty manner in which the armor brigades were mobilized caused some of them to equip themselves with tanks and kits from other brigades and to fight in unrecognized sectors. For example, Brigade 7 used the tanks of Reserve Brigade 179, and Brigade 179 was equipped with the tanks of Brigade 164, whose reserve store units were located in lower Galilee. The tank teams of Brigade 164, who were supposed to fight in the north, had been delivered to the south and there they were equipped with the tanks and kits of Brigade 7. These tanks had been in a low state of fitness since they were hurriedly left in the stores of Brigade 7 two weeks earlier." I'm starting to wonder how much of the IDF's reputation is just PR, coasting from their own unprovoked full scale war of aggressive surprise invasion in 1967. Didn't they just have a tank transporter roll over?
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:28
|
|
|
Looking at mainstream coverage of this is making my blood boil. Just wall to wall support of Israel's openly genocidal poo poo. loving hell. Decades and decades of pure evil that violates every human right and the west doesn't just accept it but supports it. I hope Hezbollah, Iran and others do what's right. d2i d2a
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:28
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:Hamas announced that their anti-air missiles have targeted Israeli planes from a distance of 35 KM i'm skeptical that hamas will be able to shoot down jets, but let's see what they got from ukraine
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:28
|
|
|
tell your sister that hamas is based and totally kicked israel's rear end
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:28
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/rzimmt/status/1711335860170342865quote:My two (or more) cents about Iran's involvement in recent developments in Southern Israel. In my opinion, two crucial distinctions are required.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:29
|
|
|
RadiRoot posted:sir this is a wendys okay well let me speak to wendy then. does she know about chinas position on hamas?
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:29
|
|
|
There isn't much peeps here about public support of Israel, but that's probably because the government offered job internships to a bunch of businesses in Palestine Tower, so that would mean actively cheering for the deaths of people on that rubble. They did re-iterate "oh you're stuck in Gaza? Clearly as a hostage to Hamas" to the couple people they identified tho.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:29
|
|
|
Sherbert Hoover posted:i'm skeptical that hamas will be able to shoot down jets, but let's see what they got from ukraine Israel flies f-35s so the problem will take care of itself
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:30
|
|
|
HallelujahLee posted:oh no not the moral high ground Al! posted:it's over moral anakin, lol
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:31
|
|
|
mags posted:Israel flies f-35s so the problem will take care of itself hamas should just claim to have captured four f-35s and show pictures of three of them with 1, 2 and 4 painted on the sides
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:33
|
|
|
antipattern posted:Looking at mainstream coverage of this is making my blood boil. Just wall to wall support of Israel's openly genocidal poo poo. loving hell. Decades and decades of pure evil that violates every human right and the west doesn't just accept it but supports it. I hope Hezbollah, Iran and others do what's right. Israel is openly announcing intent to commit genocide in Gaza and westerners are completely lapping it up. Grotesque.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:33
|
|
|
Israel now announcing that there's ANOTHER infiltration happening on the border with lebanon. UPDATE ALJAZEERA JUST STREAMED A LIVE ISRAELI BOMBING IN LEBANON PROPER Al-Saqr has issued a correction as of 14:35 on Oct 9, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:33
|
|
|
VoicesCanBe posted:Israel is openly announcing intent to commit genocide in Gaza and westerners are completely lapping it up. Grotesque. they're just putting the dog to sleep
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:34
|
|
|
VoicesCanBe posted:Israel is openly announcing intent to commit genocide in Gaza and westerners are completely lapping it up. Grotesque. Westerners will be dealing with situations likely as soon as December.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:34
|
|
|
Nonsense posted:Westerners will be dealing with situations likely as soon as December. lol
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:34
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:Israel now announcing that there's ANOTHER infiltration happening on the border with lebanon. are there that many armed lebanese groups that are unaffiliated with Hezbollah? my limited understanding was they pretty much have a monopoly on that stuff
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:35
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:4- I am not surprised at all that the west bank hasnt exploded, FATAH and the PA are complete zionist puppets and have build a typical arab fascist dictatorship, but hopefully something can topple abbas's fat rear end off his chair. got anything to read about this? idk much about either party or criticisms of them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:35
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:Israel now announcing that there's ANOTHER infiltration happening on the border with lebanon. escalation after escalation, other parties will enter soon.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:36
|
|
|
im glad that today, 10/9/2023, americans will be celebrating a holiday about having the moral high ground
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:37
|
|
|
whoever said israel is acting like an insane nutjob was right bombing lebanon proper is a big nono
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:37
|
|
|
WoodrowSkillson posted:are there that many armed lebanese groups that are unaffiliated with Hezbollah? my limited understanding was they pretty much have a monopoly on that stuff In theory, yes.
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:37
|
|
|
aljazeera just showed israel bombing a town in southern lebanon
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:38
|
|
|
EU suspends all aid to palestine
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:39
|
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:aljazeera just showed israel bombing a town in southern lebanon couldn't get enough civilian death huh
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:40
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:58 |
|
|
Al-Saqr posted:aljazeera just showed israel bombing a town in southern lebanon Why in God's name would they instigate
|
|
#
?
Oct 9, 2023 14:40
|
|
