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I've never really been a fan of brandy, I find it kind of one note and boring, but I also felt that way about rum until I tried Rhum Barbancourt and Appleton Reserve. Is brandy like rum in that there's a bunch of stuff that's just artificially sweetened nothing liquor that makes up most of the market? I'm trying to decide whether I want to buy a bottle for my nog-making this year or mix up the recipe and make it without brandy. Whenever I buy a bottle of brandy it just sits around forever gathering dust.
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Oct 17, 2023 00:57
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 10:50 |
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Well first we’ve gotta narrow it to grape brandies, presumably. Eaux de vie and calvados and stuff are technically brandy as well (any distilled spirit made from fruit is) and there are many good ones, but that’s probably not what you’re talking about. But yes, grape brandy is like rum in that there’s tons of crap and also in that the good stuff is fantastic. If you haven’t tried good cognac or Armagnac, especially bottled over 40% abv, you should do that before writing off the category. (For the big name brands that you recognize, you want VSOP or better, but the smaller producers make good stuff too that isn’t necessarily graded VSOP.) Keeping it to those two regions is a good shortcut for now; there are good brandies that aren’t from those AOCs but that can come later. I find Barbancourt to be a particularly brandy-ish rum, so I bet you’ll like it when you find a good one.
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Oct 17, 2023 01:40
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I think I've had Remy Martin VSOP, the bottle looks familiar but I bought the bottle nearly a decade ago now. I don't really remember much about it. What would you recommend? I did have an apple brandy from Atlanta Distillers that was also kind of just there. Pleasant, but nothing that stood out about it. But yes, I'm talking about grape brandy.
22 Eargesplitten fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Oct 17, 2023 |
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Oct 17, 2023 02:18
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I don't know a ton about cognac but the $40 bottle of ABK6 vsop I've got is delicious. Leagues ahead of the cheap brandies, highly recommend.
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Oct 17, 2023 02:23
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Remy VSOP is good and is I think the last big-producer bottle I had, but that was years and years ago. Martell is also good, I'd probably put those two above Courvoisier and Hennessy, but none of the big producers' VSOPs or above are bad or anything. I also like Hine, and Pierre Ferrand has lots of interesting bottles (I've got one of those in my home bar at the moment). If it's available in your local stores, armagnac is often more distinctive and fun. Marie Duffau is the biggest seller in the US and their Napoléon is maybe the best value in brandy (that I can think off of the top of my head anyway).
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Oct 17, 2023 02:31
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In cognac production the big four make 80%+ of the worlds cognac - Hennessy, Remy Martin, Martell, and Courvoisier. Cognac has age statements, VS is a blend with the youngest cognac being aged at least two years in casks, VSOP being aged at least four years, XO being aged at least ten years. Hennessy is ubiquitous and known for their VS cognac. It’s good, I use it in most brandy drinks I’ve posted in this thread. Martell is the second biggest house, and best known for their Cordon Bleu XO. I haven’t ever tried anything by them. Remy Martin is the third biggest house and most famous for either Louis XIII, aged 40-100 years and comes in a crystal decanter, or 1738 if you’re on a budget and into trap music. 1738 is good. Courvoisier is the fourth house and iconic thanks for Busta Rhymes. I drank a ton of VS in college and I dont remember much about it, fondly. All four big brands offer the same kind of craftsmanship and consistency that you’ll get from big whiskey brands. The only other cognac I’ve had was Maison Rouge VS which got the job done well in holiday cocktails. There’s bargains to be had and I personally love the flavor profile cognac brings to cocktails. Buy something that looks good and post about it!
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Oct 17, 2023 03:38
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Where does Pierre Ferrand fit into that ecosystem?
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Oct 17, 2023 04:21
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They’re the #6 cognac producer. Never had any of their cognac but the dry curaçao is excellent, and they make plantation rum too.
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Oct 17, 2023 06:22
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If we're gonna talk about brandy we should also talk about pisco and singani. They're funky, unaged brandies from South America that can be very reminiscent of rhum agricole, singani especially. Worth looking into if you're a rum appreciator.
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Oct 17, 2023 07:39
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Strange Matter posted:Where does Pierre Ferrand fit into that ecosystem? I love Pierre Ferrand. I don't really think about wine brandy I just buy PF, although I'm happy to try an interesting bottle of armagnac any time.
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Oct 17, 2023 13:01
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TengenNewsEditor posted:I love Pierre Ferrand. I don't really think about wine brandy I just buy PF, although I'm happy to try an interesting bottle of armagnac any time. Yeah, exactly. It was designed specifically for use in cocktails under advisement from David Wondrich. I actually don’t know if I’ve ever even drank it neat, but the extra proof makes it stand up really well to mixing.
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Oct 17, 2023 13:57
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I didn't realize that the VS/VSOP/XO labels actually meant anything. I had a bottle of E&J XO for egg nog and assumed that it was aged less than the Remy Martin VSOP I had bought previously. I'll see what the local stores have, I'm in a small town so there's probably not a ton of options but I'll be in a bigger city this weekend. I have a kneejerk reaction against hennesey and courvosier because those seem to have the most advertisement behind them and I assume that anything with a lot of advertising you're paying more for the advertising than the alcohol. I had a pisco sour from a really good bartender once and didn't much care for it. Just kind of boring. But now that I think about it I love Sidecars and Brandy Crostas, so I can at least do that with a bottle of brandy if I buy one and get the gran marnier or whatever the other component of a sidecar is that I'm forgetting and too lazy to look up.
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Oct 17, 2023 18:10
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Hennessy and Courvoisier are actually perfectly good cocktail cognacs, and if they can be had for a reasonable price where you are then you should reconsider writing them off.
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Oct 17, 2023 19:32
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if you want a nice grape brandy that isn't french or american try Brandy de Jerez. two of the easiest to find that are nice are Gran Duque de Alba which is on the sweeter side, and Cardinal Mendoza which is a bit drier
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Oct 17, 2023 20:17
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Yes, I keep the Spanish brandies on hand for those uses myself. My French brandy budget is all taken up with Calvados.
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Oct 17, 2023 21:03
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The local liquor stores have a terrible brandy selection. I'm going to be down in the Denver area this weekend so I'm going to try to do some shopping while I'm down there. There's apparently three varieties of Pierre Ferrand at one of the liquor stores maybe 3-4 miles from where I'll be. The 1840, the Amber Gran Cru, and the Amber Gran Cru double cask. Any rundown on the qualities of each? Also, for sidecars, any recommendations on cointreau vs gran marnier vs some other kind of curacao? I've only ever had them at bars and I don't remember what they used.
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Oct 17, 2023 21:18
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Help, I Bought Brandy
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Oct 17, 2023 22:07
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I've used a lot of Brandy lately making eggnog (spiced rum + brandy, rum + apple brandy, straight apple brandy), but also these: "Winter Fling" Trader Tom created this drink. The fresh unpasteurized cider and pimento dram feels like Christmas, and baby, it's cold out there. Come in for a Winter Fling! 4 oz Fresh Apple cider 1 oz White Rum 1/2 oz Cognac 1/4 oz Pimento Dram 1/4 oz Aperol 1/4 oz Fresh Lemon Juice
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Oct 17, 2023 22:08
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22 Eargesplitten posted:The local liquor stores have a terrible brandy selection. I'm going to be down in the Denver area this weekend so I'm going to try to do some shopping while I'm down there. There's apparently three varieties of Pierre Ferrand at one of the liquor stores maybe 3-4 miles from where I'll be. The 1840, the Amber Gran Cru, and the Amber Gran Cru double cask. Any rundown on the qualities of each? 1840 is made specifically for mixing so if you want a brandy for mixing probably get that one. Grand Marnier is a curaçao and Cointreau is a triple sec. They’re both orange flavored but aren’t the same category really. I’d say get both but if funds are limited then Cointreau is slightly more popular as a cocktail ingredient.
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Oct 17, 2023 22:20
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my kinda ape posted:Grand Marnier is a curaçao and Cointreau is a triple sec. They’re both orange flavored but aren’t the same category really. I’d say get both but if funds are limited then Cointreau is slightly more popular as a cocktail ingredient. I agree, get both and compare, you’ll quickly learn which one is more your style. And Cointreau/triple sec is more frequently called for but I prefer Grand Marnier in pretty much everything, especially so with brown spirits, so I’d get that if your priority is Sidecars etc. and you just want one bottle.
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Oct 17, 2023 22:31
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I'm super lazy and just use Ferrand Dry Curacao for everything.
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Oct 17, 2023 22:37
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Pierre Ferrand Dry Curacao does work for basically anything that calls for orange liqueur, yes. I'd recommend it over buying Cointreau or Grand Marnier as long as it's available and prices are comparable where you are. Pierre Ferrand 1840 is their cocktailing cognac (though the price kind of precludes it from that position, I feel). Not familiar with the Amber Gran Cru bottlings, but I'd expect them to be good.
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Oct 17, 2023 23:25
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prayer group posted:Pierre Ferrand Dry Curacao does work for basically anything that calls for orange liqueur, yes. I'd recommend it over buying Cointreau or Grand Marnier as long as it's available and prices are comparable where you are.  I like Cointreau but Pierre Ferrand Dry Curaçao is cheaper and better. Best orange liquor under $20 for a fifth is Gran Gala, but only worth it if you like Grand Marnier and want to save a few bucks.
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Oct 18, 2023 02:01
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Im not wild about GM in a marg, Cointreau for me. Or hell, ditch the orange liquor and just use agave syrup.
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Oct 18, 2023 02:04
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I think I prefer PF Curaçao > Cointreau > Agave Syrup >>>> Gran Gala/GM >>>>>>>>> Hiram's/Bols > Marg Mix TengenNewsEditor fucked around with this message at 02:22 on Oct 18, 2023 |
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Oct 18, 2023 02:20
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I don't feel like agave syrup adds anything to a margarita, really. If you're not going to use orange liqueur for whatever reason just use simple syrup (but I don't know why you wouldn't just use orange liqueur in the first place).
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Oct 18, 2023 02:57
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prayer group posted:I don't feel like agave syrup adds anything to a margarita, really. If you're not going to use orange liqueur for whatever reason just use simple syrup (but I don't know why you wouldn't just use orange liqueur in the first place). I like it with a nice reposado. I did an agave/lime/wild commons the other day and it was A+ If im using blanco then I’ll use Cointreau.
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Oct 18, 2023 02:59
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You know what's really awesome in a marg is using calamansi for part of the lime. Like 3-1 lime to calamansi ratio. MMmmm......
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Oct 18, 2023 03:18
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22 Eargesplitten posted:I didn't realize that the VS/VSOP/XO labels actually meant anything. I had a bottle of E&J XO for egg nog and assumed that it was aged less than the Remy Martin VSOP I had bought previously. Keep in mind that labeling standards are not necessarily the same across borders and an XO from France and an XO from America are probably not the same thing. One of the oldest tricks in the trade book is allowing a low quality alternative made in your country to be called the same or similar name of a higher quality product imported from a country that already has a stricter standard in place. Parmesan Cheese, XO American Brandy, ect.
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Oct 18, 2023 03:29
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Agave syrup in a marg is good if you’re using drier triple sec but kinda overkill if you’re using curaçao, which is usually pretty sweet already. Anyway, tonight I made a Toronto and drat it was good. 2 oz rye .25 oz Fernet Branca .25 oz Demerara syrup 2 dashes angostura
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Oct 18, 2023 03:32
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JUST MAKING CHILI posted:Agave syrup in a marg is good if you’re using drier triple sec but kinda overkill if you’re using curaçao, which is usually pretty sweet already. My hot take is that classic Margs made with agave taste worse than regular ol simple and most every person I've done a side by side with agree
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Oct 18, 2023 03:37
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Got a birthday party tomorrow, birthday boy likes mojitos and mint juleps Are there good recipes to use or are they generally the same
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Oct 18, 2023 03:40
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Cointreau, Dry Curacao and Grand Marnier are all different takes on essentially the same thing. I believe Cointreau is the original triple sec. Clement Creole Shrub is very nice, too.
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Oct 18, 2023 03:44
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Something I’ve been wondering actually: what purpose is there in having both GM/orange liqueur AND curaçao/triple sec in a margarita? I know the former are brandy-based and the latter are not, but is it not just two orange-based things at once? Seems like overkill, or crossed wires or something. E: ^^ I may have my classifications all donked up
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Oct 18, 2023 03:46
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Triple sec is usually drier and has brighter orange notes and made with a neutral spirit like sugar beets while curaçao tends to be richer sweeter and sometimes made with a brandy base. Depends if you want more orange flavor or a more rich flavor with subdued orange notes in your drink. I like em all though, so you can’t really go wrong.
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Oct 18, 2023 03:50
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prayer group posted:I don't feel like agave syrup adds anything to a margarita, really. If you're not going to use orange liqueur for whatever reason just use simple syrup (but I don't know why you wouldn't just use orange liqueur in the first place). I find that you need a small amount of sweetener regardless of which/how much orange liqueur you use. Using enough of the Orange liqueur to get the sweetness right results in too much orange, but getting the orange right results in a drink that's a little too dry. There's gotta be a touch of sugar -- we add around 1/4 oz simple to ours I know people who like bone dry Margs with no sugar but the balance always seems off on them
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Oct 18, 2023 05:25
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Fart Car '97 posted:I find that you need a small amount of sweetener regardless of which/how much orange liqueur you use. Using enough of the Orange liqueur to get the sweetness right results in too much orange, but getting the orange right results in a drink that's a little too dry. There's gotta be a touch of sugar -- we add around 1/4 oz simple to ours oh my god i wasn't gonna mention it because i thought i was weird for liking it this way but my marg is 2oz tequila, 0.75oz lime, 0.5oz dry curacao, 0.25oz 2:1 syrup. thank you for validating me
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Oct 18, 2023 07:50
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prayer group posted:Pierre Ferrand Dry Curacao does work for basically anything that calls for orange liqueur, yes. I'd recommend it over buying Cointreau or Grand Marnier as long as it's available and prices are comparable where you are. The place I'm going seems to have the 1840 on sale for $39/bottle when normal prices seem to be around $50. Even $39/bottle is tough to stomach for a mixing liquor but good brandy is expensive so I guess I will try it.
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Oct 18, 2023 16:46
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22 Eargesplitten posted:The place I'm going seems to have the 1840 on sale for $39/bottle when normal prices seem to be around $50. Even $39/bottle is tough to stomach for a mixing liquor but good brandy is expensive so I guess I will try it. Landy VS is also under the Cognac Ferrand label, about $25-$30, and is a pretty great cognac for mixing.
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Oct 18, 2023 17:27
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 10:50 |
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On my personal home menu margarita is the driest thing for sure. Totally agree. Just tastes off otherwise. I use passion fruit syrup though so it's already a variation. Orange is a somewhat boring flavor to me, I often replace it with passion or grapefruit or something else.
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Oct 18, 2023 18:35
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