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Districts visually should expand out into adjacent tiles so if you have a commercial hub and Big Ben it’s not just a giant parliament 100x the size of an entire district but a small one in a district now 2x the size spanning two tiles. But that would require context programming for district visuals which I get is a hassle. Districts would be great if they felt like specializing but cities still “spread out” a bit more allowing blending of resources into the districts. Also from a gameplay perspective I get it but there’s zero reason campuses should have adjacency to mountains hot springs or reefs. Campus output should be contingent on buildings happiness and economic output sorry.
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Oct 18, 2023 06:32
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| # ? May 15, 2024 04:50 |
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I could definitely get behind a thing were wonders were built inside of districts, which would be cool, make sense, and reduce map clutter. The district would still have to met specific criteria ofc like your commercial hub would still need to be adjacent to a river to build big ben or whatever. Maybe some specific wonders would get their own tile. Depends on the thing i guess. Would be cool imo
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Oct 18, 2023 08:26
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Tom Tucker posted:
This is a thing that gets weird over time. For your "just learned to build a hut"-civilization, nearby nature-stuff seems highly relevant to science. For your fifteenth megacity, not so much.
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Oct 18, 2023 08:33
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Tom Tucker posted:Also from a gameplay perspective I get it but there’s zero reason campuses should have adjacency to mountains hot springs or reefs. Campus output should be contingent on buildings happiness and economic output sorry. Dunno about you, but college would have been a lot more bearable if I had access to ski slopes and nice water features 
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Oct 18, 2023 08:46
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Phosphine posted:This is a thing that gets weird over time. For your "just learned to build a hut"-civilization, nearby nature-stuff seems highly relevant to science. For your fifteenth megacity, not so much. I think this is something that's supposed to be addressed by exponential growth. Sure, it's weird that your biotech research division is getting a bonus from looking up at a mountain and being inspired, but it is dwarfed by the base science provided by research labs. Okay maybe not dwarfed, but with all the other science sources across your late-game empire, that mountain isn't doing much really. Like the library still gives a bit of science in the modern era too even though libraries don't actually advance science these days (EDIT: in retrospect, this is a terrible example because uni libraries most certainly do advance science. Can I go with the Monument instead?). But it's okay because they don't contribute a huge amount by late-game anyway. I guess a better solution would be to obsolete those bonuses at the appropriate time. Microplastics fucked around with this message at 09:30 on Oct 18, 2023 |
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Oct 18, 2023 09:28
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oof, vote against that. Obsolecense isn't a fun mechanic imo, what little we have of it already feels bad.
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Oct 18, 2023 09:31
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yeah it would make sense to replace it per Era, and basically give it a growing Japan bonus
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Oct 18, 2023 09:32
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Serephina posted:oof, vote against that. Obsolecense isn't a fun mechanic imo, what little we have of it already feels bad. Yeah, the minmaxing would be maddening if there was any incentive to avoid obsolescence triggers.
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Oct 18, 2023 13:15
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It was probably my least favorite Civ4 mechanic.
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Oct 18, 2023 14:49
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return to original civ where someone installed lights in the great library and all the books stopped working
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Oct 18, 2023 15:03
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COMMUNISM CANCELS EFFECT OF PYRAMIDS
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Oct 18, 2023 15:32
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John F Bennett posted:COMMUNISM CANCELS EFFECT OF PYRAMIDS lol what? Is this for real?
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Oct 18, 2023 15:40
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Madmarker posted:lol what? Is this for real?  
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Oct 18, 2023 16:00
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Woke communism cancels strong manly pyramids
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Oct 18, 2023 16:43
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The Revolution seized the Emperor's store of grain from within the pyramids, distributing it among the people.
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Oct 18, 2023 17:01
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I will be the dissenter in this conversation and state emphatically that Civ is a game using board game design fundamentals and that districts were, for the most part, a very successful mechanic that fulfills its design purpose well enough while also functioning in a simple enough manner to be approachable. Furthermore, attempting to add more granularity without a real functional purpose and only for historical flavor would only lead to a worse product (e.g. the really dumb way Firaxis implemented climate change that most definitely did NOT work) 
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Oct 18, 2023 18:55
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John F Bennett posted:COMMUNISM CANCELS EFFECT OF PYRAMIDS That kind of poo poo was annoying in the original few games, although I kinda get it. Rather avoid it by making newer stuff better, and letting new tech upgrade your old poo poo (what happens often now) is a superior choice to make some stuff even more valuable to invest in upfront.
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Oct 18, 2023 19:35
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Super Jay Mann posted:I will be the dissenter in this conversation and state emphatically that Civ is a game using board game design fundamentals and that districts were, for the most part, a very successful mechanic that fulfills its design purpose well enough while also functioning in a simple enough manner to be approachable. Furthermore, attempting to add more granularity without a real functional purpose and only for historical flavor would only lead to a worse product  I think all the people who really want the districts to sprawl should give Old world a spin, the designers there knocked a lot of the concepts in Civ VI out of the park there
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Oct 18, 2023 20:35
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Super Jay Mann posted:I will be the dissenter in this conversation and state emphatically that Civ is a game using board game design fundamentals and that districts were, for the most part, a very successful mechanic that fulfills its design purpose well enough while also functioning in a simple enough manner to be approachable. Furthermore, attempting to add more granularity without a real functional purpose and only for historical flavor would only lead to a worse product (e.g. the really dumb way Firaxis implemented climate change that most definitely did NOT work) I like districts too, though there are too many of them. Preserves are just bloat, and encampments need a redesign. Entertainment districts are pretty much an afterthought in most games, and water parks really shouldn't be their own district. Commercial districts and harbors are fine I guess, but trade routes are so good having one of them feels almost mandatory. Also the cost scaling is kinda dumb, especially zoning districts that you're going to build some day to lock in the price, and the district discount formula is both a mess and completely undocumented.
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Oct 18, 2023 20:39
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I think the actual fix to obsolence would be some kind of mechanical abstraction, like instead of requiring a roman arena or amphitheater before you can build a modern building, you plop down some kind of basic non-commital entertainment/theater infrastructure that unlocks the more specific buildings. I would also absolutely hate that, though. All I personally want from districts is more diversity of architecture. e: Oh yes, the cost scaling is also dumb as hell, and most of Civ 6's decisions to limit certain projects to using only production or faith are arbitrary and gamey, that's a whole different peeve Zulily Zoetrope fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Oct 18, 2023 |
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Oct 18, 2023 21:55
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Archduke Frantz Fanon posted:
Old World only has certain sites that you can build cities on, right? And then games like Endless Legend and Humankind have regions, where you can only place one city per region. These both help spread the world out and allow for districts by eliminating sprawl, and they do their job well enough, but I like the Civ method of placing a city anywhere I want. I don't know what the happy medium between those are, but I hope some creative developer figures it out.
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Oct 19, 2023 00:59
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Super Jay Mann posted:districts were, for the most part, a very successful mechanic that fulfills its design purpose well enough while also functioning in a simple enough manner to be approachable. I really don't agree. Going back however many years I've played Civ, the game's biggest issue IMO has always been that the endgame devolves into tedious micromanagement too often. I don't find districts approachable, I find them to be tedious micromanagement at the start of the game, which was previously the fun part.
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Oct 19, 2023 01:39
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Mmmm, how was Civ: Call for Power in that regard? I remember watching a friend play it and the idea of a centralized public works currency still seems intriguing decades later.
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Oct 19, 2023 02:05
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It is a crime that public works was never used outside of the Activision civ-likes Also Civ 6 districts own, way better than the city sprawl in Endless Legend TBH
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Oct 19, 2023 03:00
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toasterwarrior posted:It is a crime that public works was never used outside of the Activision civ-likes Yeah, EL's disrict equivalent was kind of awful. I think you had to aim for giant triangular cities to get the best bonuses?
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Oct 20, 2023 04:20
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EL districts are kind of the opposite of Civ 6 districts. They're what allows you to exploit the outlying tiles rather than having citizens work them.
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Oct 20, 2023 06:27
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Humankind city sprawl to me was the worst because I’d wind up just covering a huge swath of beautiful territory in 70 different “science zone” things which made no sense. The tactical combat was cool but war weariness killed it as did the massive amount of cliffs and hills everywhere. Choke points and cliffs should be an exception not the rule there were never any wide open flat plains. Game had some good stuff going for it did updates ever improve it?
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Oct 20, 2023 06:56
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Technically in EL the optimal city was a simple line two tiles wide. Not awful, but a solved minigame. Districts in general are good for civ, for how they make some fun board game decisions, for how they show a large city sprawling, and hell, for realism in urban combat which nobody cares about. Civ7 better fuckin' keep them in, going back to single tile cities would be... stark.
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Oct 20, 2023 07:26
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one thing that is probably locked in for civ7 is the art style: too many "realism" styles in the competition, so my guess is an even more Pixar-like comic style
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Oct 20, 2023 09:31
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God I hope not. I'm used to it now but the stylistic move from civ5 to civ6 was a 🤮 moment for me.
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Oct 20, 2023 10:29
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my sincere, but vain, hope is that they replace every one of those elaborate animated models with whatever picture is on that ruler's wikipedia page, and then they spend all the money they would've spent on 3D animators on hiring someone to actually loving think about game balance.
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Oct 20, 2023 11:34
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DontMockMySmock posted:my sincere, but vain, hope is that they replace every one of those elaborate animated models with whatever picture is on that ruler's wikipedia page, and then they spend all the money they would've spent on 3D animators on hiring someone to actually loving think about game balance. Well, maybe. But how about they use the money saved on 3D animation to track down whoever came up with VI's World Congress and legally block them from engaging in game design ever again
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Oct 20, 2023 11:48
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To be fair, the move to more simple, colourful models is almost necessary when moving to 3d. A realistic brown smudge when zoomed out isn't very compelling! They can kind of stop where they are though, the trees and fog of war are kind of ugly and unreadable.
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Oct 20, 2023 11:48
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DontMockMySmock posted:my sincere, but vain, hope is that they replace every one of those elaborate animated models with whatever picture is on that ruler's wikipedia page, and then they spend all the money they would've spent on 3D animators on hiring someone to actually loving think about game balance. Visuals sell. But they never show UIs on the store page, so that doesn't count.
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Oct 20, 2023 11:55
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whatever they do, the Civ 5 UI mod will be once again one of the most popular
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Oct 20, 2023 12:58
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I don't think it was ever explicitly stated but I've always assumed they did those expensive 3D leader models and screens because they double as a marketing tool (or maybe that was the primary motivation for making them). It's the same reason a lot of games (Civ included) spend money on fancy cinematic intros; those things are definitely marketing tools first and foremost. If you're showing off Civ 6 in a short video advertisement it makes sense to have something that looks more engaging than a montage of game maps with nothing to break it up, and those screens make it look like there's another dimension to the game beyond staring at those maps all the time.
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Oct 20, 2023 13:08
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Microplastics posted:God I hope not. Same, except 4 to 5. The first time I started a Civ5 game I quit the game in disgust (and played Civ4 instead) when I saw the graphics. Fortunately when I tried again I soon discovered strategic mode and never looked back. I use strategic mode almost exclusively in Civ6, too. I expect that will stay the case in 7 as well, as long as they keep the mode.
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Oct 20, 2023 15:18
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Civ 5's art deco aesthetic was awesome... it's just 1 upt and the AI that sucked.
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Oct 20, 2023 15:31
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Tom Tucker posted:Humankind city sprawl to me was the worst because I’d wind up just covering a huge swath of beautiful territory in 70 different “science zone” things which made no sense. Yeah, they made districts cost more to build when you have more of that type, so it's no longer possible to win a science victory in 500 BC by slamming out 100 research districts. They also added a setting to increase the amount of strategic resources on the map, and when you set it to high it's actually possible to fight interesting wars now. I like the way cities look in Humankind, because in the late game you end up with hamlets that can become impressive cities in their own right.
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Oct 20, 2023 15:33
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| # ? May 15, 2024 04:50 |
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Humankind also updated how strategic resources work. They increased the amounts and units, projects, and structures now have a threshold to build. If you have less than the threshold you can still build them but there is a scaling production cost based on how far below the threshold you are. Each strategic resources also has an associates building for you industrial zones that when built increases the amount you extract from deposits worked by that city. They also made it possible for units to plunder trade routes. I haven't used that feature to much but I believe it's possible to send an army or fleet to an enemy trade routes and steal their resources to build your own units while making building more of theirs more expensive.
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Oct 20, 2023 15:56
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