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(Thread IKs: weg, Toxic Mental)
 
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO
Oct 3, 2012

The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

1400 Russians were killed yesterday.

In a single day. That's 3X what was happening before the rasputitsa.

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shadow puppet of a
Jan 10, 2007

NO TENGO SCORPIO


for pete's sake will someone please write out "Russicum ite domum" in the square hundred times by sunrise so they get the message and go to the gently caress home.

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Budzilla posted:

It already is a big deal.
Its a big loss for that area and will matter for that particular region but its probably not enough to change the course of the war yet.

The type of losses I was talking about (where the majority of Russian helo forces are decimated) would be war changing.

Budzilla posted:

In the DnD thread I wondered if Russia will now have to move its helicopters out of Crimea and Ukraine with these long range weapons in play now.
Total WAG on my part but given how the Russians have reacted in the past I'm guessing we'll see at least a couple of repeats of something like this before they pull them that far back.

They have to know that if they do that they'll lose nearly all their combat effectiveness because they'll be almost out of fuel by the time they get near the battlefield. That and they'll no longer be a viable quick reaction force either. Helicopters aren't very fast (even the KA52 isn't all that fast honestly) and they take a long time to go a few hundred km's.

So I think they'll try something to make them work a few times, take some serious losses, and then pull back over the next month or so.

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

marshalljim posted:

Probably old news to this thread but there's also video of an Army test:

https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/status/1714302636642516995

so they even trained on the wtc buildings

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

Basically a male Margaret Thatcher

WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:

1400 Russians were killed yesterday.

In a single day. That's 3X what was happening before the rasputitsa.

That was the day before I think. Yesterday's Ukr claim was 750 Russians status 200

TEMPLE GRANDIN OS
Dec 10, 2003

...blyat
that's a lot of zinc

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

TEMPLE GRANDIN OS posted:

that's a lot of zinc

well, it's a big load

PainterofCrap
Oct 17, 2002

hey bebe



Oscar Wilde Bunch posted:

Might be bullshit, but this is allegedly what the business end of an ATACMS strike looks like.

https://x.com/alfaiomi/status/1715034304336523570

Jesus. Cosmic popcorn.

A thousand bombers in WWII could not do this much damage.

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

PainterofCrap posted:

Jesus. Cosmic popcorn.
That is a old vid of a Russian attack on Kharkiv a year or so ago.

PainterofCrap posted:

A thousand bombers in WWII could not do this much damage.
Nah 1k bombers in WWII would beat this easily many times over. Even factoring the crap accuracy of bomb drops back then.

The advantage with ATACMS and other such systems (ie. Iskander) isn't the damage they can do vs bombers. In fact I'd go so far as to say for straight up destruction, that is ignoring logistics and pilot risk, bombers are way more powerful.

Its that you can do quite a bit of damage quickly (driving a truck 50km or so out of cover to fire a missile that goes Mach 2+ is pretty fast for on target time), safely (no pilots at risk), over all cheaper (have to factor in the costs of bombers getting shot down), and with less resources (just need a truck with a couple of guys + missile vs a runway + bomber crew + huge amounts of fuel + bomber plane etc etc etc) vs a bomber equivalent.

Vietnam was probably the last war where the bomber was sort've viable as the primary long range explosives delivery method. Even then lots of US bombers got shot down by SAM's. I think that is what really convinced the US generals and such that missiles were, over all, the way to go and then they started to do major missile program overhauls that really came into their own in the late 70's/early 80's.

Prior to that period the US short and mid range missile artillery programs for the Army were mostly over complicated and expensive trash IMO.

PC LOAD LETTER fucked around with this message at 06:13 on Oct 22, 2023

MrQwerty
Apr 15, 2003

LOVE IS BEAUTIFUL
(づ ̄ ³ ̄)づ♥(‘∀’●)

marshalljim posted:

Probably old news to this thread but there's also video of an Army test:

https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/status/1714302636642516995

What a workhorse White Sands Missile Range is

If you've never been to White Sands, I highly suggest it, it's stunning

Ronwayne
Nov 20, 2007

That warm and fuzzy feeling.

PC LOAD LETTER posted:



Prior to that period the US short and mid range missile artillery programs for the Army were mostly over complicated and expensive trash IMO.

I especially appreciate the air to air nuclear rocket.

Budzilla
Oct 14, 2007

We can all learn from our past mistakes.

https://twitter.com/Tendar/status/1715789551082344928

Some of these airframes look to be intact but if they have to transport these away from the airfield by land then they will be spending sometime getting repaired.

Oscar Wilde Bunch
Jun 12, 2012

Grimey Drawer

PC LOAD LETTER posted:

That is a old vid of a Russian attack on Kharkiv a year or so ago.

Nah 1k bombers in WWII would beat this easily many times over. Even factoring the crap accuracy of bomb drops back then.

The advantage with ATACMS and other such systems (ie. Iskander) isn't the damage they can do vs bombers. In fact I'd go so far as to say for straight up destruction, that is ignoring logistics and pilot risk, bombers are way more powerful.

Its that you can do quite a bit of damage quickly (driving a truck 50km or so out of cover to fire a missile that goes Mach 2+ is pretty fast for on target time), safely (no pilots at risk), over all cheaper (have to factor in the costs of bombers getting shot down), and with less resources (just need a truck with a couple of guys + missile vs a runway + bomber crew + huge amounts of fuel + bomber plane etc etc etc) vs a bomber equivalent.

Vietnam was probably the last war where the bomber was sort've viable as the primary long range explosives delivery method. Even then lots of US bombers got shot down by SAM's. I think that is what really convinced the US generals and such that missiles were, over all, the way to go and then they started to do major missile program overhauls that really came into their own in the late 70's/early 80's.

Prior to that period the US short and mid range missile artillery programs for the Army were mostly over complicated and expensive trash IMO.

My grandfather was in the 8th Air Force and was part of Black Thursday/the Schweinfurt raids and the strategic bombing campaign in Europe in general and the scale of what he was watching drove him to the booze. Those big bomber groups were dropping like 2,000,000lbs of ordnance at a time. Just obliterating cities into dust. I still have a hard time wrapping my head around the scale of devastation during that period.

Wasn’t there some version of the ATACMS at some point that was like a ton of top attack sub munitions. I swear I saw some demo video where it comes in and just puts a big fuckin hole in the top of every vehicle in a column.

gay picnic defence
Oct 5, 2009


I'M CONCERNED ABOUT A NUMBER OF THINGS

Oscar Wilde Bunch posted:

Wasn’t there some version of the ATACMS at some point that was like a ton of top attack sub munitions. I swear I saw some demo video where it comes in and just puts a big fuckin hole in the top of every vehicle in a column.

Something like this was in development but I believe it was cancelled.

zone
Dec 6, 2016


Latest British Intelligence report:

Toxic Mental
Jun 1, 2019

Jeez someone should tell Putin that war is bad

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

Basically a male Margaret Thatcher

zone posted:


Latest British Intelligence report:

Doesnt include Wagner and the prisioner battalions?!?!?!

Fuuuuuck

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Oscar Wilde Bunch posted:

Wasn’t there some version of the ATACMS at some point that was like a ton of top attack sub munitions. I swear I saw some demo video where it comes in and just puts a big fuckin hole in the top of every vehicle in a column.

gay picnic defence posted:

Something like this was in development but I believe it was cancelled.

Yeah it was cancelled when they realized that current munitions had enough bang and were accurate enough to do the job.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!

CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:

Doesnt include Wagner and the prisioner battalions?!?!?!

Fuuuuuck

literally my immediate response irl

a 150k+ dead alone is ghastly. it's nowhere close to a societal shifting figure but that's still a decent chunk of an entire generation just gone. russia has 13MM men between 20 and 35, per this data. 5% attrition in an age group is considered a society-moving event, because that's basically the slack end of a labor force; you lose something like that and you start having some serious upheavals around everything. 5% of that is 650k men.

you're still a long way off from that number but if you keep loving losing a thousand men a day you're going to get there faster than you'd like. especially when you consider that the people who were temporarily wounded and returned to duty are still likely to be horrifically traumatized or otherwise unfit for return to normal life. so if you want to include those, and then start throwing some numbers at the wall on how many died affiliated with wagner... you might not be that far off of half of that 650k.

beer_war
Mar 10, 2005

Toxic Mental posted:

Jeez someone should tell Putin that war is bad

He's famously old and paranoid and doesn't use the Internet. Who's gonna tell him? Shoigu?

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006
Deputy Commander of Rosgvardiya forces in the so-called Donetsk People's Republic, Alexander Khodakovsky opened his PMs and whined to the mods for probating his doomposting and decried censorship

Dear Richard Jeffrey:

Strategic Tea
Sep 1, 2012

Those men are just marching with Steiner

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006
there are now as many destroyed Russian KA-52's as the entire KA-52 fleet of the Egyptian Air Force.

I guess 1 more if we count the captured one.

Tarquinn
Jul 3, 2007

I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you
my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal.
Hell Gem
:siren: Hi thread!

Some people here have discovered the slur "norks" for themselves when talking about North Korea.

This stops right the eff now. Future probations won't be just six hours.

Thank you! :tipshat:

Tarquinn fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Oct 22, 2023

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006

Tarquinn posted:

:siren: Hi thread!

Some people here have discovered the slur "norks" for themselves when talking about North Korea.

This stops right the eff now. Future probations won't be just six hours.

Thank you! :tipshat:

This is the first I've heard of that being a slur, it must have gotten that designation recently. It's been used by a ton of mainstream news media including Wired, WSJ, The Register, bunch of others too. Won't use it if you don't want us to but it would be strange for that to be considered a slur when it's an abbreviation for north koreans because you'd think you'd see people telling the media to stop using it in headlines and entire sections of their website

HonorableTB fucked around with this message at 08:10 on Oct 22, 2023

Mikojan
May 12, 2010

CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:

Doesnt include Wagner and the prisioner battalions?!?!?!

Fuuuuuck

So the 293k figure from the AFU reports are still optimistic, but not *that* optimistic, thats loving crazy

any idea what the lastest projected figures are for Ukrainian casualties?

Tarquinn
Jul 3, 2007

I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you
my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal.
Hell Gem

HonorableTB posted:

This is the first I've heard of that being a slur, it must have gotten that designation recently. It's been used by a ton of mainstream news media including Wired, WSJ, The Register, bunch of others too. Won't use it if you don't want us to but it would be strange for that to be considered a slur when it's an abbreviation for north koreans because you'd think you'd see people telling the media to stop using it in headlines and entire sections of their website

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Nork

Over the years I have come to realize that almost any nickname for an ethnic group is or was meant to derogatory at some point. What a world.

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006

Mikojan posted:

So the 293k figure from the AFU reports are still optimistic, but not *that* optimistic, thats loving crazy

any idea what the lastest projected figures are for Ukrainian casualties?

I haven't seen anything reputable, those casualties are held tightly under wraps. Western estimates put it at around 50% of what Russia's taken, 70,000 killed and 100,000 to 120,000 wounded.

Tarquinn posted:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Nork

Over the years I have come to realize that almost any nickname for an ethnic group is or was meant to derogatory at some point. What a world.

Huh. Not every day you come across a new slur, I guess

ded
Oct 27, 2005

Kooler than Jesus

Coolguye posted:

literally my immediate response irl

a 150k+ dead alone is ghastly. it's nowhere close to a societal shifting figure but that's still a decent chunk of an entire generation just gone. russia has 13MM men between 20 and 35, per this data. 5% attrition in an age group is considered a society-moving event, because that's basically the slack end of a labor force; you lose something like that and you start having some serious upheavals around everything. 5% of that is 650k men.

you're still a long way off from that number but if you keep loving losing a thousand men a day you're going to get there faster than you'd like. especially when you consider that the people who were temporarily wounded and returned to duty are still likely to be horrifically traumatized or otherwise unfit for return to normal life. so if you want to include those, and then start throwing some numbers at the wall on how many died affiliated with wagner... you might not be that far off of half of that 650k.

do we even know how many were killed by covid as well? number creeps up

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

Basically a male Margaret Thatcher

Coolguye posted:

literally my immediate response irl

a 150k+ dead alone is ghastly. it's nowhere close to a societal shifting figure but that's still a decent chunk of an entire generation just gone. russia has 13MM men between 20 and 35, per this data. 5% attrition in an age group is considered a society-moving event, because that's basically the slack end of a labor force; you lose something like that and you start having some serious upheavals around everything. 5% of that is 650k men.

you're still a long way off from that number but if you keep loving losing a thousand men a day you're going to get there faster than you'd like. especially when you consider that the people who were temporarily wounded and returned to duty are still likely to be horrifically traumatized or otherwise unfit for return to normal life. so if you want to include those, and then start throwing some numbers at the wall on how many died affiliated with wagner... you might not be that far off of half of that 650k.

Also add on that the young people Russia lost due to Covid and then also got the gently caress out while they could, they lost at least the 5%

Ukraine is facing the same problem too

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Coolguye posted:

a 150k+ dead alone is ghastly.
Well that is dead + permanently wounded.

Still that is a huge number. Multiple Vietnams worth of deaths + hard casualties in the space of around 1.5yr.

Coolguye posted:

5% attrition in an age group is considered a society-moving event, because that's basically the slack end of a labor force; you lose something like that and you start having some serious upheavals around everything. 5% of that is 650k men.
Didn't something like almost 1 million Russians leave the country for near by nations before they closed the borders? Up until they closed the borders there was a pretty constant stream of educated specialists leaving the country too though I don't know how many left.

A large portion of them will probably come back after the war ends but short term a labor crunch wouldn't be surprising.

Jippa
Feb 13, 2009

Tarquinn posted:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Nork

Over the years I have come to realize that almost any nickname for an ethnic group is or was meant to derogatory at some point. What a world.

It means boobs in the uk. :britain:

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006
If you want to do comparisons, in WW2 the USSR lost ~27 million during the war. A quarter of the people in the Soviet Union were wounded or killed.

That largely brought us here today in terms of society shaping events and is more responsible than any other event in the last 80 years for why Russia is how it is today

CAT INTERCEPTOR
Nov 9, 2004

Basically a male Margaret Thatcher

Mikojan posted:

So the 293k figure from the AFU reports are still optimistic, but not *that* optimistic, thats loving crazy

any idea what the lastest projected figures are for Ukrainian casualties?

Anywhere between 30-40% of what Russia has lost seems to be about the right estimate. They lost a *lot* holding Bahkmut


PC LOAD LETTER posted:

Didn't something like almost 1 million Russians leave the country for near by nations before they closed the borders?

500K I think, Fatherboxx would be a better person to give that estimate. But with Covid and the exodus there's a lot of young people who just will not be back even before you start counting the deaths and incapacitated

Just Another Lurker
May 1, 2009

Jippa posted:

It means boobs in the uk. :britain:

I can confirm that saying a woman has "a massive pair of norks" is indeed a thing.

Tsyni
Sep 1, 2004
Lipstick Apathy
Nork nork nork. gently caress Putin, kill all Russians involved in the war and post the videos too with some sick rear end music. Ty

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

HonorableTB
Dec 22, 2006
Thanks for calling Chatterbox, next caller

Kchama
Jul 25, 2007

Gargamel Gibson posted:

I don't disagree with you, but you really don't need to keep spamming that.

Yeah, I agree.

Tarquinn posted:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Nork

Over the years I have come to realize that almost any nickname for an ethnic group is or was meant to derogatory at some point. What a world.

It's unfortunately true.

bad_fmr
Nov 28, 2007

Just Another Lurker posted:

I can confirm that saying a woman has "a massive pair of norks" is indeed a thing.

Take those filthy words to the commonwealth thread. Here in this war thread we are very serious about naughty words and :decorum:

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

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TEMPLE GRANDIN OS
Dec 10, 2003

...blyat
covics not counted

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