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Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
To be fair to the machine though, I feel confident in saying that lemon-lime is better than orange flavoured drinks in 9/10 situations. Since most orange drinks are kinda lame compared to lemon and/or lime. Some brands' orange is pretty great, but a lot are kinda 'meh' by comparison

EDIT: oof, terrible way to start the new page, seeing this out of context

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Kazvall
Mar 20, 2009

/salutes Major Isoor

Thief
Jan 28, 2011

:420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420:

Thief fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Oct 6, 2023

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

My folding chair is augmented.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Deus Ex: Invisible War



Previously, I solicited recommendations for stealth games to review - some kind goon suggested reviewing Deus Ex: Invisible War. Here is my review: IT KEEPS CRASHING.

Yes, I installed the Visual Upgrade mod. No, I'm not going to troubleshoot further. The game has had an upswell of defenders in recent years, and maybe there's more to the game than my decades-old memories of clunky mechanics and matchbox-sized levels suggests.

But it's a moot point because IT KEEPS CRASHING.

You only get two screenshots because, well, you know. Buy at your own risk.

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
:hmmyes: Very informative! I uh, think I'll strike it off the gaming bucket list :v:

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

anyone that defends invisible war is insane, its worse than you remember

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Oh, and universal ammo, uggghhhhh

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

invisible war is complete dogshit lol

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Is it IW that technically crashes and reboots every time you move to a different area lol

Pablo Nergigante
Apr 16, 2002

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Is it IW that technically crashes and reboots every time you move to a different area lol

Yeah lol

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Is it IW that technically crashes and reboots every time you move to a different area lol

yup lol

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

It launches two windows/processes when you try to run it and one of them can conflict with any number of running processes in windows :dumbbravo:

Sub-Actuality
Apr 17, 2007

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Is it IW that technically crashes and reboots every time you move to a different area lol

breathtaking design lmao

 




Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011

Sub-Actuality posted:

breathtaking design lmao

Vadun
Mar 9, 2011

I'm hungrier than a green snake in a sugar cane field.

Wormskull
Aug 23, 2009

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011

Punished Chuck
Dec 27, 2010

Pablo Nergigante
Apr 16, 2002

Leadthumb
Mar 24, 2006




PS this post is impervious to Flames because of the flame proofer. :)

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Lol but unfortunately I don't think Morrowind is doing it on purpose it just can't help itself. Playing it in the early 00s is probably why I quicksave every 30 seconds to this day

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Deus Ex: Human Revolution







"I never asked for this game review!" - Ok, I got that out of my system, I swear I'll behave now. I almost don't even need to say "Deus Ex: Human Revolution Director's Cut", because the OG product is no longer available on digital storefronts. The Director's Cut integrates the "Missing Link" DLC, reworks some of the boss fights, got rid of the gold tint, improved some textures and added some dev commentary. All in all an improvement, although I liked the gold filter and restored it via a mod, as the Good Lord intended. The Missing Link DLC may be more of a blessing than a curse, depending on your preferences, which I'll address later.

As many of you know already, DXHR puts you in the mechanized sunglasses of one Adam Jensen, head honcho of security operations at Sarif Industries - a global innovator in the augmentation industry as of 2027. Of course, augmentations and their effect on society are a running theme throughout the Deus Ex series. Throw in some conspiracy theories and your 0451 game is off to a good start. Needless to say, since there's a fair gap between 2027 and 2052, the tone allows for some light and hope while hinting at a foreboding darkness creeping in. Adam gets immersed in one such conspiracy when his girlfriend and her fellow labcoat nerds are abducted by some bad dudes with heavy augmentations. The rest, I'll leave the prospective player to discover. Having said that, before delving into gameplay, I wanted to talk about fanservice in HR. Now, this was the first decent Deus Ex game in a decade, so some was to be expected, even though the game takes place decades before the original. And in the base game, I found it to be just about right. You don't directly interact with anyone from DX1 as far as I know. You don't give Alex Jacobson a turbo wedgie, nor do you stick Walton Simons' face in a toilet. Instead, Bob Page makes an appearance in the introductory cutscene (with the original voice actor). Joseph Manderley's presence is felt via some emails early on, where he works for FEMA and tries to exert his influence on a criminal investigation. There are a few emails at a media corporation from Morgan Everett, Nicolette DuClare, and Lucius DeBeers. That's it. However, in the Missing Link DLC, you rescue a young Tracer Tong from a PMC group and you also encounter Gary Savage and his wife-to-be Tiffany. This starts getting to be too much, in my book. It feels like Star Wars, where there only seems to be five people in the universe. While I'm talking about the DLC, it has a variety of shortcomings. I like the idea of starting off without your augs or weapons, slowing reacquiring them over time but a lot of the content is a slog. There's a lot of backtracking and sidequests, as well as some very same-y environments. Also there's a point where you're supposed to get all of your weapons back, but this can be bugged. In my case, I had a tranq gun and a heavily modded sniper rifle that poofed away into some otherworldly vortex. So I had to go through Missing Link and Singapore with just a stun gun and a 10mm pistol. As such, I think it would be a lot better if Missing Link were optional.

ANYWAYS, the main game itself has some snazzy stealthing going on and is a worthy bearer of the Deus Ex name. It opts for cover-based stealth rather than shadow-based stealth, and I'm assuming that this was done so that they could have levels that aren't dingy unlit dungeons. There are some great stealth sandboxes to be had, and very few levels feel like clunkers. Jensen can do either silent or lethal melee takedowns, initiated by a key prompt when close to enemies. The melee takedown is the "quiet" one, although this seems strange, given that the mini-cutscene for this shows Adam punching the enemy's brain inside out, snapping his elbow, and then slamming him to the ground like a pro wrestler. As mentioned, augmentations are here in full force and I actually kind of prefer that you only have four 'F' keys to keep track of instead of 12. The remaining augs are passive - which runs the risk of being boring, but the Jensen's augs have a decent mix going, but they would be further refined in the sequel. Inventory Tetris is also back and is fairly generous if you get the augs that unlock the entire grid. Of course, whether or not you should spend precious Praxis on inventory space (when DX1 didn't have this requirement) may itself be a contentious issue, but I was ok with just a stun gun, sniper rifle, and a tranq gun. There is something called a "PEPS gun", which is like an energy shotgun that knocks people back in an AOE. It was amusing, but it seems fairly situational. Dead or unconscious guards are dragged behind you instead of carried, which is a bit weird at first. It's very slow, so you have to be super careful about being spotted in such a vulnerable state. You'd think that a guy who can punch through concrete walls would be able to hoist a guy or two over his shoulder, but whatever I guess! You can also toggle the cover mechanic so that you don't have to hold down RMB to stay in stealth, which I thought was a nice touch. You can do corner takedowns, but you won't necessarily get a prompt for it - you just have to mash the button based on intuition. Melee takedowns also take up a bar of energy, which might be a point of consternation, but I think it provides good gameplay balance - whether or not you use takedowns or a weapon will be decided based on preference and ammo ability. If you don't have some protein bars for Jensen to scarf down, then you'll have to switch your tactics to a more weapon-based approach.

I like also that they shakeup the gameplay here and there - there is the occasional ambush, some levels that are more open and have civilians mixed in and the now infamous level where Malik's VTOL is being attacked by mercs and you discover whether or not you're a horrible person (by not saving her), or a good soul (by saving her). There is lots of globetrotting in true Deus Ex fashion: Singapore, Detroit, Montreal, Hengsha, and an evil villain stronghold somewhere in the Arctic Ocean. Adam isn't one for philosophical discussion like JC Denton, but I prefer the contrast. There are nonetheless parallels to DX1 but they're not exhausting: Pritchard is like a smartass Jacobson, Malik is Jock, and Sarif is Manderley. There's a statue of a hand grasping a globe, you get saved from a prison by a mysterious AI, and bad accents abound. Deus Ex: Human Revolution had a lot of skepticism and angst to overcome after the debacle that was Invisible War. But the tremendous amount of work that Eidos-Montreal put in paid off in spades. DXHR has some great gameplay and environments and best of all: IT DOESN'T KEEP CRASHING!

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

dude sex human revolution

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Yeah I actually didn't mind the gold filter either, tbh. Have you played Mankind Divided yet? It's been a while since I played HR but MD (which I played much more recently) basically seemed to be an 'extra missions pack' for HR, which is precisely what I was after. Tough to say which is better... I'd say HR for 99% of it, but the whole ending sequence is very 'meh', which evens it out a little, IMO

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Yeah I played MD when it first came out, but my memories of it are hit and miss. I remember there was a bank mission that provided a good stealth challenge. The Prague location offered a generous amount of side content, though. I also remember that there was one mission where you had to sneak around a crime scene, it was very challenging because there was eyes everywhere. Anyways, it's next in the queue so we'll see how it holds up.

I forgot to mention that in HR you can hide bodies in vents, which is pretty sweet. Probably makes the whole building stink in a few days, though.

Wormskull
Aug 23, 2009

Major Isoor posted:

Yeah I actually didn't mind the gold filter either, tbh. Have you played Mankind Divided yet? It's been a while since I played HR but MD (which I played much more recently) basically seemed to be an 'extra missions pack' for HR, which is precisely what I was after. Tough to say which is better... I'd say HR for 99% of it, but the whole ending sequence is very 'meh', which evens it out a little, IMO

Man’s Hind Divided or whatever the guy said. Get classicked, son.

I got the tude now
Jul 22, 2007

Wormskull posted:

Man’s Hind Divided or whatever the guy said. Get classicked, son.

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

Wormskull posted:

Man’s Hind Divided or whatever the guy said. Get classicked, son.

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

Wormskull posted:

Man’s Hind Divided or whatever the guy said. Get classicked, son.

day of sex: mans hind divided

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Seventh Arrow posted:

Yeah I played MD when it first came out, but my memories of it are hit and miss. I remember there was a bank mission that provided a good stealth challenge. The Prague location offered a generous amount of side content, though. I also remember that there was one mission where you had to sneak around a crime scene, it was very challenging because there was eyes everywhere. Anyways, it's next in the queue so we'll see how it holds up.

I forgot to mention that in HR you can hide bodies in vents, which is pretty sweet. Probably makes the whole building stink in a few days, though.

I think MD has higher highs but lower lows. It has some really excellent mission design like the standout bank, and poking around the hub area breaking and entering is a big step up from HR's slightly anemic hubs. That said, it's sorely unfinished and just kind of stops 2/3 through and doesn't seem like it's getting a sequel at this point.

Both good games, they feel a bit "binary/analogue" compared to the original with some really weird decisions, like only being able to knock people out if you have juice, overreliance on canned animations and non-lethal just being a straight up better option in every way at all times, but they're good fun.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

I'm noticing now that hiding bodies in MD is way, way faster - so that's a plus. The energy system looks like it's been retooled, but I think it's just the same thing with a different visual.

And there may be a DX sequel after all:

https://twitter.com/jasonschreier/status/1587515910046220288

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Oh nice! Hopefully it pans out. The bit about Fable is a bit weird though, but... I'll take it? :D

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

I was looking through some screenshots and Malik's VTOL identifier is BOO-BEE:



the image is reversed in the cutscene, normally the identifier is the other way around

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Deus Ex: Mankind Divided







Dimitrij Hanzer is a young Czech living in the year 2029. After a harrowing accident at the factory where he worked, he was given augmentations so he could continue to live and work as he had before. But something changed. After the Hugh Darrow "Incident" (where augmented people were forced by malicious programming to violently murk anyone around them), people he knew started to avoid his company. He could hear whispers behind his back. The slur of "clank" could be heard openly and the police harassed him for his papers every where he went. Co-workers suggested that he live in the segregated commune of Golem City where he would be "safer." Fed up with living as a second-class citizen, Dimitrij came home with markers and signage in hand. He began scrawling a familiar slogan on white cardboard: "AUG LIVES MATT..." The permanent marker was crushed by his robotic fist and black liquid spilled over his statement of resistance. A single tear rolled down Dimitrij's cheek.

If you care about story, this is the kind of thing that you're going to have to expect from Eidos Montreal's 2016 title, Deus Ex: Mankind Divided. They're very interested in the "augs = marginalized minority people" angle and that's going to dominate the proceedings from the get-go, even moreso than in Deus Ex: Human Revolution. Regardless of where you stand politically, it's pretty hamfisted and also distances itself from the intertwined themes of the first Deus Ex. There, running motifs of transhumanism, terrorism, the loss of independence, the centralization of power, plutocracies, and the shadow government (to name a few) all wove their way throughout the main plot, giving it an intricate philosophical outlook despite its sometimes-cheesy demeanor. In DXMD, it seems like the intertwined subjects are "AUG APARTHEID BAD" and "SUNGLASSES STILL COOL." While I'm still on the story train, I appreciated that the fanservice this time around was more muted than even DXHR. It's not that I'm necessarily against fanservice per se, but the game takes place in 2029, way before you could realistically see the Dentons or any other DX1 characters close to their age in 2052. Here, any previous stalwarts - mainly Illuminati players like Bob Page, Lucius DeBeers, Morgan Everett, Beth DuClare, and Stanton Dowd - only appear in cutscenes, mostly at the beginning. Manderley's presence is once again felt, but only behind the scenes. Arch-villain Victor Marchenko feels like a stand-in for Gunther Hermann: an eastern European meathead with lots of deadly mechanical augmentation who is fanatically devoted to the cause and can be terminated with a killswitch. You even get the achievement "Laputan Machine" if you off him this way. Other than that, your ex-girlfriend is knocking boots with Bob Page, just so you know.

Ok onto gameplay: if you were thinking that MD is essentially HR but more, you're pretty much dead on. If you enjoyed the stealth gameplay in the previous title, then I don't see why you wouldn't like this one. Except for the dreadful hacking minigame. The interface for hacking in HR was a lot cleaner, even if the gameplay became tedious after a while. Here it's still tedious, but the design is messy and dares you to interact with it. Fortunately, multitools have made an appearance; unfortunately, they're pretty rare out in the wild. This is mitigated by the fact that you can craft them. Did I mention there was crafting? Ah, there is - fortunately if you have a distaste for crafting in your games, it's pretty minimal. There's a single "type" of crafting material, that allows you to make multitools, TESLA ammo, nanoblades, etc. So you'll never miss out on crafting a multitool because you didn't have copper wire or something like that. They've done away with the energy "bars" from DXHR, but you can still lose static blocks of your battery when you use your augmentations for takedowns and suchlike. Many of the controls are similar but they've redesigned the aug menu and made it a bit more efficient. You can also assign the F1 - F4 keys to whatever active augs you like. The augmentations themselves are neat - most of the ones from HR have returned, but lo and behold, Jensen has found super secret new augs lurking around in his mainframe! Something new has been added! These let you do fun things like pin dudes to the wall with your killer nanoblades or zap multiple terrorists with your TESLA system. This was a fun way to incapacitate multiple enemies, but it can be a bit clunky if the NPC is blocked by something like the numerous boxes that have somehow returned from DXHR. I like that they managed to evade the "RPG Sequel Syndrome", where a popular RPG gets a sequel, but in order to build the character the developer has to find a way to start them from scratch. And this will often result in trite twists where the main character develops amnesia or something. Here, they start you off with some basic augs and weapons, but after a violent explosion you can reset your augs and gain access to the aforementioned super mega tastes-great-less-filling augmentations.

I quite liked the stealth dioramas that Mankind Divided gave us to play around in. I have a vague feeling that they're not quite as thematically memorable as the ones from Human Revolution, but they also feel more intricate and vast. Of particular note are the GARM facility and the convention center. The sound, as in the previous title, is well done, as one would expect from a stealth title. A marker system makes its return, allowing you to track enemies regardless of where you are - even better, you can set them on unseen enemies if you use your "Jensen vision" to view their outlines. And in an improvement over the previous title, the marker goes away if the NPC is knocked out or killed. A few of the levels seem to suffer from a dampened commitment to nonlinearity but for the most part, you get a lot of different approaches to choose from. And there are still levels where you can hack a turret to surprise your enemies with a hot lead how-do-you-do, which can make up for a lot of shortcomings. The remote hacking augmentation is tremendously useful, letting you temporarily shut down nosy cameras and killer robots temporarily. It's marked with the same icon as the quest objective marker, though, so that might make things a little disorienting sometimes. Finally, the invisibility seems like it might be a little too strong, seeing as nothing can see through it. Not augmented guards, not cameras, not robots, not turrets, nothing. Its big limitation is supposed to be a significant battery draw, but this can be trivialized with augmentations. Anyways, if you don't want to use it as a crutch and cheese your way through maps you can either avoid it altogether or just get the first level with the "battery hog" level of energy consumption. Dragging bodies (instead of carrying them) makes a return and is every bit as clunky as it was before, but at least it's faster now. It will still be frustrating if you need to hide guys up stairs or around corners, though. Having said that, DXMD is still a fantastic title to stealth around in and the "Criminal Past" DLC is also worth a look!

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Yeah, agreed. I quite enjoyed it, but you're right - it doesn't quite have the same level of memorable-ness as the DXHR missions. Great fun either way though, IMO

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Yeah, couple of standout levels like the bank but overall less memorable. Still a good game.

Also runs into the X-Men marginalised people problem where like, yeah if your minority group routinely flips out and uses terrifying powers to threaten the entire world/existence/Brooklyn Bridge I probably do support heavily regulating or neutralising you, sorry.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

The Palisade bank isn't bad, but most of the stealthing challenges are on the second floor, which is teensy-tiny. Levels like the GARM facility and maybe even the Dubai stuff at the beginning are much bigger and more intricate.

There's also New Game+ if you want to run through it again with all your augs and weapons.

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Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

No Sun To Worship







Antonio Freyre, the stealthbro who brought us Undetected, now has a new sneaky offering for you to get your grubby thieving mitts on. If Undetected was a love letter to the Metal Gear Solid series, then No Sun To Worship is like a dirty text to Splinter Cell. True, you're not an espionage agent working for Uncle Sam, but the gameplay is third-person stealth involving the infiltration of prisons, nuclear facilities, underground labs and more! The gameplay is quite minimalistic. You have a silenced pistol, a noisy rifle, a trusty knife for melee kills and that's it. You can't turn invisible, you can't see through walls, you can't toss smoke grenades, and mashing F5 will only have the game chuckle at your precious naiveté. Not only is the gameplay minimalistic, but the game itself is too - there are five levels and they each take about a half hour to quietly creep through. However, due to the lack of savegames, you may be replaying a bunch of them, depending on your skill level.

The story is...I have no idea. There's no dialog and the only spoken lines outside of the intro and epilogue are guard chatter. Apparently you're supposed to be able to suss it out based on the imagery and settings but it seemed pretty opaque to me. There's some Geiger-esque iconography in one of the levels and you're killing prisoners. A UFO lingers mysteriously in the sky above. That's all I got. The steam discussion forums hint that this may be a prototype for a larger project. I guess we'll see! To elaborate a bit more on the gameplay, you're given a light and sound meter to gauge your overall sneakiness. Your only "superpower" is that you can engage a quiet mode that allows you to stay silent even when running. However, doing this depletes your health, but fortunately you can siphon it back from your fallen enemies. You can use the mousewheel to change your acceleration, but it's a binary slow-fast, with no gradations in speed. This was sufficient for the gameplay's demands, however. Many of the guards are squishy and can be dispatched either via pistol shot or melee attack - but there are also armored guards who will require either melee or the noisy rifle. Of course, using the rifle (unless there's no one nearby) will likely result in station-wide alarms and these will usually remain in effect for the duration of the level. Stay quiet or stay home!

No Sun To Worship is basically no-frills, minimalistic stealth done right. There's not a lot of game to be had, but enough to justify the pricetag. Give it a try!

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