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None of the thread title suggestions hit me just right, but then... well this one came out of nowhere. I thought it worked ok.
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Nov 14, 2023 15:07
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| # ? Jun 10, 2024 13:47 |
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I feel like I made a mistake making bird people and going into the new scenarios. I am confused by all the birds. Every faction is birds. As opposed to my pantheon which is almost entirely frogs
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Nov 14, 2023 17:25
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Same here, I should have gone with my murder cannibal halflings instead. All that chicken going to waste 
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Nov 14, 2023 17:32
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Just a heads up but, thanks to the AI improvements, Grexopolis is actually fun now. It’s this massive war and everyone is actually doing stuff on both sides. Now, it might not always be the most USEFUL stuff, but they’re definitely fighting and conquering. Two enemies down, two to go!
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Nov 14, 2023 17:34
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I like that you can give your faction rulers their own AI behavior now. It's a simple change but it adds a lot of flavor when you encounter your customs out in the wild.
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Nov 14, 2023 17:41
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Thyrork posted:None of the thread title suggestions hit me just right, but then... well this one came out of nowhere. All I can think/say is "The first Emu War was fought with guns, and the Emus won!"
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Nov 14, 2023 18:08
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mitochondritom posted:I feel like I made a mistake making bird people and going into the new scenarios. I am confused by all the birds. Every faction is birds. As opposed to my pantheon which is almost entirely frogs Are...are you me? 
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Nov 14, 2023 18:08
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Aww man Astral Reflections was nerfed at some point since launch when I last played. Miss duplicating the crap out of my heroes.
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Nov 14, 2023 19:49
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Kinda got my rear end kicked by the first mission on hard I killed the progenitor on turn 8 - it respawned 5 inches away on turn 9 with a stronger and larger stack. Is this...supposed to happen? it was literally pointless to kill it, didn't even buy any time. Seems like its best to just let it burn down your farms. Plus the high world threat means im getting phoenix stacks and juggernaut stacks thrown at me constantly by some nearby nests.
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Nov 14, 2023 19:57
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:Kinda got my rear end kicked by the first mission on hard Cleared that one last night with a 1 city challenge build. Pretty tough. The progenitor shouldn't respawn immediately but it did feel like it had regular intervals so maybe reload a save and try killing it a turn later. I managed it by rushing the Phoenix guy and wrecking his capital. I was able to clear the gold quest dungeon along the way, and then afterwards I played defensive after that and ran out the clock on the story missions.
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Nov 14, 2023 20:15
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:Kinda got my rear end kicked by the first mission on hard Found on the AoW4 forums from a dev that the progenitor is bugged on hard and spawns way more often.
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Nov 14, 2023 20:21
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I lucked out and went into that mission with an astral build starting with the tome of evocation, while the progenitor and all its golem buddies are weak to shock.
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Nov 14, 2023 20:23
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Bloodly posted:All I can think/say is "The first Emu War was fought with guns, and the Emus won!" See I figure that's true, but the thread title also is true. mitochondritom posted:I feel like I made a mistake making bird people and going into the new scenarios. I am confused by all the birds. Every faction is birds. As opposed to my pantheon which is almost entirely frogs Enfys posted:Are...are you me? Oh wow, goons with frog races, how original, how special how rare. Whooooohoohoo. ... I should recreate my frog wizard.
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Nov 14, 2023 20:30
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lurksion posted:Aww man Astral Reflections was nerfed at some point since launch when I last played. Miss duplicating the crap out of my heroes. On the other hand, I have no idea where to look to change the tooltip. Oh well nbd if this is never published
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Nov 14, 2023 20:46
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Noir89 posted:Same here, I should have gone with my murder cannibal halflings instead. Legit. The first game I played was cannibal swarming barbarian halflings. Took the horde / shrink transformation book first so I could run the world over with the wee bastards. I never felt truly effective but it was at least incredibly funny. I did get my feet under me finally on the everyone at war scenario. I did an underground start, rolled over the city state next to me, had an underground landing to start a third colony underground in a completely sectioned off area and printed myself to overrun. Industrious prospecting absolutely is busted when you've got like 3-4 scouts just circling the map and prospecting everything. I also didn't figure out until this run that once you complete the faction sidequest they fully drop out immediately, it puts a bit more emphasis on getting those things done, rather than dragging my feet and looking for fights. How do people like anti-morale builds? I was kicking around an idea for a merciless slaver, mana channeler dark culture who's main strategy is bringing in the banshees and undead and just morale routing everything it comes into contact with. I figure merciless slaver would be the thing to go for to turn routes into captures.
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Nov 14, 2023 21:46
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lurksion posted:Aww man Astral Reflections was nerfed at some point since launch when I last played. Miss duplicating the crap out of my heroes. Yeah, tome of mirrors went from gamebreakingly strong 1 unit can solo 3 stacks to I'm not sure what reason to take the tome aside from the unit enchantment to reflect none-physical on your frontliners or if you had a busted strong T4 you wanted to duplicate.
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Nov 14, 2023 22:10
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DeathSandwich posted:Legit. The first game I played was cannibal swarming barbarian halflings. Took the horde / shrink transformation book first so I could run the world over with the wee bastards. I never felt truly effective but it was at least incredibly funny. Vicious Killer rings on your heroes with Killing Momentum is the method that is I think is usually banned now in cmp because it ends fights on the second turn. Mixing in a little bit of everything else of course.
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Nov 14, 2023 22:32
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Noir89 posted:Found on the AoW4 forums from a dev that the progenitor is bugged on hard and spawns way more often.
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Nov 14, 2023 22:44
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This unit has been renamed to Reginator. No further notes.
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Nov 14, 2023 22:50
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Morale builds are very powerful up until you meet an enemy that doesn't care about morale. I am curious to hear what the multiplayer scene considers op though or where you even find that out. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Nov 14, 2023 |
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Nov 14, 2023 22:59
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Rascyc posted:Had to test achievements somehow! I think I read on the discord this is exactly the reason. Ra Ra Rasputin posted:I am curious to hear what the multiplayer scene considers op though. I'm not around those spaces anymore but I can tell you Disruption Wave, pre-patch and probably still Awaken Instincts and currently almost certainly Hermit Kingdoms. As well as the aforementioned Vicious Killer perks on Heroes. Most of the time those things are banned. Hero powerleveling is a major component of mp and heroes were generally considered the main defining force, though currently a 3 heroes max per battle is a popular rule (which doesn't change the powerleveling but does add some more value to other units). Also have a tierlist from the mp scene that's been going around about the current form traits: S: Bulwark, cold blooded, Bear mounts, Resistant, Tough. A: Arcane focus, Hardy, Wolf mounts, Spider mounts, Unicorn mounts, Strong, Sneaky. B: Hideous stench, Tenacious, Athletics, Defensive tactics, Overwhelm tactics, Ferocious, Poisonous, Quick reflexes, Keen sighted. C: Sharp eyes, Elusive, Fast recuperation. D: Light footed, Underground adaptation, Resilient, Nightmare mounts. F: Swamp adaptation, Desert adaptation, Ice adaptation, Adaptable. (not mine and I disagree with a few but most I can see) Autsj fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Nov 14, 2023 |
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Nov 14, 2023 23:00
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I can agree with most of that placement, yeah, all the defensive traits are top tier especially early game when units have barely any stats and any % damage boosts or strong scale well and cold blooded is bound to be S tier if morale builds are partially banned for being too good, morale can snowball really hard, even in singleplayer I've had fights swing drastically between two playthroughs of the same fight just because of who lost enough units to trigger low morale and fumble all their attacks that would otherwise kill.
Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Nov 15, 2023 |
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Nov 15, 2023 00:34
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I'm having a hard time picking a culture besides industrious, it's just so good, just plow through your city production with unlimited gold and some of the best early empire skills with materium and the bastion is a brickwall that you can put on great enchantments like aspect of the root.
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Nov 15, 2023 02:25
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Yeah it does feel like industrious is one of the most "complete" playstyles with a lot of stuff that works super well with it. I do also find a nature playthrough quite fun, pick high culture for awakened range boost on your archers, and go with I think it's tome of beasts? The one that gives you the wildlife sanctuary, which scales based on adjacent forest provinces and gives you access to a lot of animals in the city production. You can churn out packs of wargs and things to patrol your forests, and pick the book that gives you the forestation spell and the one that gives you the one that turns the land green, and march your forests full of angry wolves across the world. Big athel loren energy. Try to get the ancient oak wonders because they work well with carpeting everything in forests/foresters. If you have the dragon DLC then tome of evolution will probably work well too because you can just build babby spiders with the wildlife sanctuary, and then level them up into bigger ones. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Nov 15, 2023 |
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Nov 15, 2023 02:45
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Okay the vassal cooperation stuff is pretty fun when it works out. I timed two of them to come through and attack and I joined in and let them take the brunt of the first megastack battle outside of the city. They fled with a few units as I won the battle with them. Now their remnants are just running around the city and tearing everything down while I siege lol 
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Nov 15, 2023 03:22
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Built a second city! I understand now. I feel like 'how to build a city and why you might want to' wasn't tutorialized but maybe I just clicked through it like an idiot. Befriended some cat people, beat up some lost souls. Won a unicorn in a fight.
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Nov 15, 2023 05:15
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:I am curious to hear what the multiplayer scene considers op though or where you even find that out. generally i find out by asking them. usually via DMs but also i kinda know some of them, so YMMV on that but you could always go ask them questions in their discord server. be warned that if they answer you they may be very condescending about it and also take the opportunity to complain about how bad aow4 is. you could always read their public balance discussions and see what thing x player did that beat them and made them really mad about it, or check out what stuff they currently have banned. for example, right now they ban: --bringing more than 3 heroes to a pvp tactical fight --skalds --hermit kingdom speaking to some of them recently myself, my impression is the state of what's OP is, in short, "heroes". there's some specifics like the vicious killer abuse but heroes ultimately are trivial to get to t3 level stats very early and become radically more powerful with levels (and so leveling them faster is a very powerful mode of play). one of their big players (formerly the planetfall """world champion""") actually recently quit the scene because she tried to find a non-hero-powerlevel viable strat, and one too many times got her leader murked 100->0 turn 2 by a hero who started the turn on the other side of the map, who then proceeded to use their additional action off killing momentum to freeze 9 (??? exaggerated maybe? now that i'm looking at this i'm not certain how they'd manage that many) more of her units. i got said player to play with me in a couple of t1/t2 units only no heroes skirmish mod games (2 tomes allowed if you want all the details). she told me even under these restrictions pikes would be useless, even against cavalry. i found that difficult to understand so i asked her to show me, and she stomped me flat with nothing but a ton of white wolf mounted barbarian warriors and a handful of white witches. turns out the damage bonus from pack hunter adjacency does not stop at 1, and if you cluster a bunch of them together they suddenly have +60% or +80% damage on their attacks. i will admit i was pretty upset when i found out about this. for my pride i will mention that i did actually beat* her in one of our two fights *she diceroll picked her traits, culture, and tomes ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 07:59 on Nov 15, 2023 |
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Nov 15, 2023 07:54
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Feel like as good as starting Tome of souls is with the cheap 1 hex nuke and 1 hex +20 hp/strengthen/cleanse and quick access to souls that just waiting for tome of necromancy might be the superior tactic for going undead empire skeleton spam and just taking some of the better T1 starting tomes like cryo/warding/enchantment, since without good enchantments and transformations while the skeletons are dirt cheap and easy to spam they really need the enchantments so you aren't just burning through your early souls replacing them and causing your troops to lose morale that the skeleton fell over. Anyone having good success with relentless crusaders? good imperium flow in the mid game when you are fighting doomstacks constantly? I appreciate those glimpses into the multiplayer scene. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 07:59 on Nov 15, 2023 |
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Nov 15, 2023 07:56
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i should mention that apparently some of them ran some test games after agreeing not to pick killing momentum and modding spur to action to put the hero in defense mode after use instead of being a free action. those particular players were pretty positive about how heroes felt after doing that, but their whole meta is a bit in flux right this second with the release of the dlc and new swatch of balance changes.
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Nov 15, 2023 07:57
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I am hoping by the next expansion there will be massive balance pass on everything and they are keeping track which tomes are full of filler that nobody would use, I have noticed myself rushing down warfare for killing momentum and the big stat buffs followed by support for spur and army stats and I can agree with banning skalds because they put every other support to shame with 2 huge AoE buffs and insanity on attacks. Are dragon lords a popular pick for the 2nd stat boost line filled with AoE nukes or is it wizard kings all the way?
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Nov 15, 2023 08:05
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i think dragon lords are considered an early game move because they get outscaled by hero items later. they used to have an economic advantage from the dragon horde bonus but with the item forge consuming your unused items that's a bit less in consideration, and i think that was a bit of a stretch advantage to begin with. should take the time to give the disclaimer that the "i think"s here are important - i'm generally not the most authoritative source on what's going on with them nowadays truth be told, mostly because i barely play the game myself. i was curious after the dlc released to see what was up with them and got some good chats in, so to my knowledge my previous two posts are all fairly current and accurate info, but anything i didn't happen to speak to them about this go around should probably be taken with a grain of salt.
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Nov 15, 2023 08:15
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I've not actually heard of Skalds being banned, not saying that never happens because houserules change between games and plenty of times groups will agree on a houserule for a game or two just for the sake of variety, but before the patch it was a toss up if the whole Tome of Revelry was banned. Not just because of Skalds but also because the xp spell was bugged and gave +130% xp instead of the intended +30%, and all the other stuff in the book also being pretty great. Less of a, any one particular bit of the book breaking the game (apart from the xp spell), just almost every build incorporating it so it got stale. I don't know how it ended up articulating but with the announced changes there were a couple who were hoping/expecting Nymphs to become a solid competitor to Skalds and that might've taken the pressure off a little. That said, the Tome of Nymphs has issues being mostly only 2 actually good things and a bunch of food so I'm not 100 on that actually working out. Plenty of other things I'm not 100 on either atm: as said Killing Momentum was the primary hero level goal but I don't know how the nerf has affected that; it used to be so strong because a shock hero could run up, kill, then run to another target and kill again; this is no longer possible unless targets are adjacent and the hero will need to be able to take actions on the spot which is a significant reduction from its earlier power and flexibility. And like Ninjewtsu I'm not a final authority here, I got sick of DR's mp server as that place is the circlejerk ground for folk who were so obnoxious they managed to get themselves banned from the official discord (which takes a lot) and is (or was, last time I was there) absolutely horrifically toxic, so most of my info is somewhat second hand now as well.
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Nov 15, 2023 11:31
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Popping out of lurking to say that it is very satisfying to solve your problems with lots and lots of guns. Dreadnaught was my favourite culture/style in AoW3 and its fun to get that feeling back.
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Nov 15, 2023 11:49
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Seals is a much more fun and chaotic victory condition although now I think it kinda makes Expansion somewhat obsolete. The only real drawback in singleplayer is how all the AI players will instantly declare war on you the second you get 1 point ahead, whereas you can be slightly more diplomatic while expanding and still win. But if you have claimed 75% of provinces already then chances are you can already win via tech, magic, seals, etc.
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Nov 15, 2023 12:13
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I kind of wish that you could split Cultures into the Governmental and Military choices. I really like how Reaver units play, for example, but I don't like the aggressive Total War baggage that comes with them.
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Nov 15, 2023 12:25
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I just want the reavers gunpowder units swapped over to the materium culture
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Nov 15, 2023 12:31
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Jack Trades posted:I kind of wish that you could split Cultures into the Governmental and Military choices. They are a Renaissance culture. It's Conquistador time where the gun-emus live.
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Nov 15, 2023 12:44
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Jack Trades posted:I kind of wish that you could split Cultures into the Governmental and Military choices. I agree. For me it's wanting to play "high" and "feudal" but without being tied to Order which is such a boring and unhelpful affinity tree.
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Nov 15, 2023 13:07
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Feel like as good as starting Tome of souls is with the cheap 1 hex nuke and 1 hex +20 hp/strengthen/cleanse and quick access to souls that just waiting for tome of necromancy might be the superior tactic for going undead empire skeleton spam and just taking some of the better T1 starting tomes like cryo/warding/enchantment, since without good enchantments and transformations while the skeletons are dirt cheap and easy to spam they really need the enchantments so you aren't just burning through your early souls replacing them and causing your troops to lose morale that the skeleton fell over. Yeah I had an undead industrious dwarf build I could not get going until I switched to cryo as starting tome, bypassing tome of souls and hopefully gunning for necromancy as the first T2 pick. That said, leaving tome of necromancy for third tome is less an intention and more of a hope because by the third tome I presumably would've scouted all my opponents by then and seen if any of them are running order and/or high culture; if any are, that's necromancy scrapped for something else because undead builds are stupidly easy to hard-counter, mostly just by being high culture :v
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Nov 15, 2023 13:49
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I've always liked the idea of "hybridized society traits", where some culture mechanics also exist as society traits for other cultures to pick up and create sort of a hybrid. Barbarians with war spoils, a Dark/Feudal society, Mystics that prospect, etc.
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Nov 15, 2023 13:53
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