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rotinaj posted:If i remember correctly, you can choose to let micah do all the shooting You are remembering incorrectly
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Nov 27, 2023 00:40
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Danger - Octopus! posted:I love the bit where you find the camp of some random gang where their leader is giving a speech just like Dutch does about how they're noble outlaws and the importance of freedom (or something like that), and it underlines that really Dutch is just one of many charismatic gangleaders with big talk, and he isn't so special - he's just the one you met first. I didn't run into that one until my second playthrough, it was a great little moment. I almost felt bad about setting them all on fire without warning e I wish Dutch got in on whatever recruitment train the O'Driscoll gang had going on, there were like 900 of them and 10 people in Dutch's gang.
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Nov 27, 2023 01:23
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Inspector Hound posted:I didn't run into that one until my second playthrough, it was a great little moment. I almost felt bad about setting them all on fire without warning This is a point specifically addressed at the start of the game, actually. Colm will take anybody into his gang because he doesn't give a poo poo about them. Kieran for instance was only there because his options were to join them or be murdered by them. It's obviously very different for the VDL gang. Speaking of the gang being different, a neat bit of storytelling I found on my second run is how you can stumble upon an O'Driscoll train robbery in Chapter 2. They murdered everyone on-board. In contrast, when the gang robs a train in Chapter 2, John specifically says not to kill anybody. The Van der Linde gang does explicitly have a code, in contrast o basically every other gang in the game.
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Nov 27, 2023 03:47
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They break their code when convenient, like how Dutch loves murdering young and old women
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Nov 27, 2023 05:03
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Buschmaki posted:They break their code when convenient, like how Dutch loves murdering young and old women But if those events were routine, they wouldn't be treated like how they are. Dutch killing that girl disturbs everybody in the gang, and Arthur responds to Dutch killing the old woman (who was robbing him with threat of murder) by saying "You gonna kill me next, Dutch"? He was so disturbed by what he just saw he asked his father if he was gonna kill him. The gang compromising their morals by letting in folks like Micah or doing debt collection is a big theme of the game.But there'd be no theme if they had no morals to compromise in the first place
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Nov 27, 2023 05:57
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Ironically you only really find out Dutch is a piece of poo poo even to his gang when you do the dishonorable thing in the end and go back for the money. Arthur finds and loots $42,000 dollars under the wagon which is like a couple million dollars today. Certainly enough for Dutch to buy the entire gang tickets to whatever Tropical destination and even some property to retire. John's land and farm ends up costing up about $2000 total. Dutch easily had enough money to allow everyone to retire and settle down OR move away. But he doesn't want to retire, he wants to wage his ideological war of resistance against civilization and modernization which is further proven by where we find him in RDR1, leading the Native Americans, one of the last few groups desperate enough and ideologically motivated to resist 'modernity'.
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Nov 27, 2023 05:59
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I was looking forward to playing RDR2 (Steam version) for the first time on my brand new computer with all of the high resolution texture mods and other graphical boosts. I followed youtube instructions, installed Lenny's Mod & Scripthook Version 2.0 (https://www.nexusmods.com/reddeadredemption2/mods/1472), and then installed a whole set of graphics focused mods by unzipping them into the "lml" folder in the RDR2 directory. They appeared to load in the mod manager for Lenny's, as they showed up in the "View and managed your currently installed mods" tab and were all set to "enabled". However, I was wary there was no way to verify if they were actually working and I couldn't tell the difference graphically when I enabled or disabled them (rebooting the game each time between). So I figured I would download a mod that had an objective easily testable effect in the game to see if it was working. I download WickedHorseMan's Colored Loading mod to give color to the load screens. Booted the game up and it did not work. Disabled all other mods except for that one and it still didn't work. Deleted all the folders in the "lml" folder in the RDR2 directory and verified in Lenny's mod manager that nothing showed up as installed. Then reinstalled just the Colored Loading mod, checked it was installed and enabled, and it still does not work. So I figure either A) I've messed something up from the very beginning either with Lenny's or Scripthook and have never been playing with mods. B) The Colored Loading mod simply does not work and isn't a good way to test if mods are working. I've attached screenshots of my current RDR2 game directory with the files from Lenny's mod circled in Red and the file from Scitphook circled in Green so everyone can see if I've made mistakes. I also attached a second picture of Lenny's modmanager open and showing Colored Loading enabled. I'd love to hear some tips on what I did wrong and how to fix it. Also 2 specific questions: 1) The scripthook folder also has a file "ScriptHookRDR2.lib". I did not put this file in my directory as I was not instructed to. Could this be the issue? 2) Anyone know of any other mods that use Lenny's mod loader that I could install and have an immediately verifiable effect that would make it obvious if the mod was working or not? Thanks!   Megasabin fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Nov 27, 2023 |
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Nov 27, 2023 06:44
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Yeah, Micah didn't corrupt Dutch. Dutch was always a poo poo and he always would have acted the way he did with his back up against the wall. The only thing Micah really did was encourage him to be sloppier and draw more heat, which forced him to be more desperate when things didn't go well. Yeah Dutch was encouraged by Micah to treat other gang members as expendable, but obviously he already felt that way or else they would have all actually ended up fabulously wealthy in New Zealand or Vancouver or wherever, potentially even prior to when the actual events of this game take place. It's not really a hundred percent clear where all that money came from. I think a big reason why they made Micah a much less nuanced character than pretty much every other member of the camp is it was very important for you to relate to Arthur in considering Micah the problem rather than the abusive con artist running things.
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Nov 27, 2023 16:37
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All that said, I would still gladly pay 20 bucks for a new game plus mode where you wave at Micah while he gets hanged in Strawberry, tell the German dude to collect his own debtors, and hang out on John's ranch with Sadie and Lenny and Charles starting from like act 3 into old age.
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Nov 27, 2023 16:39
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Away all Goats posted:Ironically you only really find out Dutch is a piece of poo poo even to his gang when you do the dishonorable thing in the end and go back for the money. Arthur finds and loots $42,000 dollars under the wagon which is like a couple million dollars today. Certainly enough for Dutch to buy the entire gang tickets to whatever Tropical destination and even some property to retire. John's land and farm ends up costing up about $2000 total. Dutch easily had enough money to allow everyone to retire and settle down OR move away. But he doesn't want to retire, he wants to wage his ideological war of resistance against civilization and modernization which is further proven by where we find him in RDR1, leading the Native Americans, one of the last few groups desperate enough and ideologically motivated to resist 'modernity'. Arthur logs every cent the gang makes. That $42,000 is from all the robberies in the game and the final train heist at the very end. How Dutch put that train robbery money in the chest when Abigail stole the key is another matter but it's explicitly jus the gang's savings which you can monitor frm start to finish. It's not some secret hoard of cash.
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Nov 27, 2023 16:57
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NikkolasKing posted:Arthur logs every cent the gang makes. That $42,000 is from all the robberies in the game and the final train heist at the very end. Yes. My point is that by the end of the game Dutch had more than enough money to allow the gang to stop being outlaws, but he's not interested in letting his gang retire, he wants to wage his fruitless war against civilization while pretending he's doing the noble thing.
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Nov 27, 2023 22:03
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Dick Trauma posted:I was in a mission and while pushing a heavy crate aside Arthur started coughing. The weather had turned cold and he was still in his summer gear. Whoops. also didn't realize that he had a weight status, and he was underweight. I am a bad Arthur owner. If you let Arthur get too thin or too fat, Dutch pulls you (as in you, the Player) aside and accuses you of being a poor Arthur owner. I felt really bad the first time this happened. I immediately started controlling Arthur's diet, and also made other improvements such as giving Arthur his own place to sleep (I refer to this as "his place" and make sure to always reward him for sleeping there). I also stopped punishing Arthur when he killed people, and instead started rewarding him with treats when he politely greets them instead. Positive reinforcement is key.
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Nov 27, 2023 22:19
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Away all Goats posted:Yes. My point is that by the end of the game Dutch had more than enough money to allow the gang to stop being outlaws, but he's not interested in letting his gang retire, he wants to wage his fruitless war against civilization while pretending he's doing the noble thing. But most of that money came right at the very end. They didn't have time to go anywhere or do anything with it. Regardless, the main point is do we think Dutch intended to travel off to a tropical paradise with the gang. Well, by Chapter 6, I'd say no. But Dutch in Chapter 6 is no more the exact same person he was earlier than Arthur is. If anything, Dutch probably has more of a radical shift than Arthur does. RDR2 is as much Dutch's story as it is Arthur's. They both go through a lot and change a lot. I don't know why some people find this so hard to accept. Dutch is a human being and can be stressed and hosed up by watching all of his friends die just like any human being would. If anything, he comes off as more broken up by Hosea's death than Arthur does. (Cool bit of storytelling is Abigail makes sure to tell Dutch about getting Hosea's body while it falls to Sadie to tell Arthur they also got Lenny's. I think it shows the priorities of the two.)
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Nov 28, 2023 14:03
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Yeah Dutch was definitely a quasi-cult leader already at the start, but we are picking up the story when his descent into madness has already begun. The riverboat debacle was a sign of an already degrading situation. Its tough to know exactly how much of his speeches and whatnot are already rote to the gang, vs a newer development in response to this record amount of stress.
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Nov 28, 2023 16:52
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Just saved my game and I'm still only at 51%.  I had a quest in St. Denis with Mary and she asked Arthur to run away with her. I was waiting for a button to press to accept but it didn't appear. Arthur said he needed more money and I said "Arthur you have $4,000 and your outlaw family will understand! GO!" 
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Nov 29, 2023 12:27
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my second playthrough is showing me things i hadnt seen before, like this! i always wondered what the lions paw trinket was about.. He's fine..  Yeah, this is fine. 
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Nov 30, 2023 02:54
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Jumped back in to another playthrough, this will be my third time and I'm still coming across stuff I haven't seen before. Still can't bring myself to play an evil Arthur though. Is there a good guide to setting up the first person view? I toyed with doing a first person playthrough but the controls and movement just feel so awkward I can't jive with it. I hosed around with the graphics options which helped but there are so many control schemes and it doesn't highlight what the differences are without exiting the menu that I don't know which one works well.
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Nov 30, 2023 03:26
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NikkolasKing posted:But most of that money came right at the very end. They didn't have time to go anywhere or do anything with it. I think differently. Dutch never had intentions of escaping. Dutch values the same thing he does at the start of the game until the very end; fighting against the modern world. Even without the payroll train money (which as you mentioned, Abigail had the key to) it's substantially enough money to allow the gang to retire, not to mention they could have laid low until it was eventually safe enough to retrieve the blackwater money, which they eventually do anyway. Speaking of laying low, they literally enter every new chapter with a plan to rob or steal from the nearest local power pretty much as soon as they find them. Does this sound like the actions of someone trying to keep his community safe, or someone just trying to steal more resources so they can continue waging their holy war? As Arthur says, there's always another goddamn train. The fact is Dutch and his gang were extremely successful outlaws considering they did it for 25 years prior to the game. There's absolutely no way they never had the resources to escape that life, unless Dutch 'Be loyal to me or I don't care what happens to you' Van Der Linde never intended to retire. And indeed we see him 11 years later in RDR1, still fighting. When they finally retrieve the blackwater money and split it, why does Dutch walk off without any of it? Because it was never about the money. edit: I didn't even the mention the part where Arthur and John were groomed to be outlaws. Basically my point is that Dutch is literally the villain of the entire duology and Arthur and John are the heroes. Away all Goats fucked around with this message at 04:25 on Nov 30, 2023 |
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Nov 30, 2023 04:12
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Away all Goats posted:I think differently. Dutch never had intentions of escaping. Dutch values the same thing he does at the start of the game until the very end; fighting against the modern world. Even without the payroll train money (which as you mentioned, Abigail had the key to) it's substantially enough money to allow the gang to retire, not to mention they could have laid low until it was eventually safe enough to retrieve the blackwater money, which they eventually do anyway. Speaking of laying low, they literally enter every new chapter with a plan to rob or steal from the nearest local power pretty much as soon as they find them. Does this sound like the actions of someone trying to keep his community safe, or someone just trying to steal more resources so they can continue waging their holy war? As Arthur says, there's always another goddamn train. I mean, Dutch is not an undisputed dictator. All his decisions are supported by Hosea with a couple of exceptions. Dutch's initial plan in Chapter 3 of cozying up to the local law wasn't a bad one, it's just that he, Hosea, and Micah all got greedy and were like "let's go after this gold they got." The Saint-Denis bank robbery was planned explicitly by Hosea. The gang as a whole makes many mistakes that aren't educable to Dutch's issues, even if I grant he never intended to give up teh fight. quote:The fact is Dutch and his gang were extremely successful outlaws considering they did it for 25 years prior to the game. There's absolutely no way they never had the resources to escape that life, unless Dutch 'Be loyal to me or I don't care what happens to you' Van Der Linde never intended to retire. And indeed we see him 11 years later in RDR1, still fighting. When they finally retrieve the blackwater money and split it, why does Dutch walk off without any of it? Because it was never about the money. Something I've always found intriguing is John's total 360 on Dutch. He doubts him but likes him which is 90 degree turn. Then he ends up entirely detesting him, the full 180 turn from love to hate. Then, by RDR1, he's turned back the other way, doing a 180. John s the one who takes the "Dutch was always evil" side in RDR2's epilogue in that argument with Sadie while she says Dutch changed. And yet, American Venom then happens. Dutch saves John's life and leaves him a ton of money. Cut to RDR1 a few years later and now John is saying "leader of the gang taught me how to read, taught me how to see all that was good in the world. He was a great man in a way." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSiSAi0YcUo&t=166s The villains of RDR are not characters we're supposed to sympathize with or feel anything for. Bronte, Cornwall, Ross - they're cartoon characters and their ends mean nothing to us. Dutch and Micah are conveniently juxtaposed to each other in AV. Dutch utters a broken, hollow "I ain't...got too much to say no more." He looks and sounds like man who is entirely crushed by his own failures and has nothing left to live for in the world. Which, in effect, is why he commits suicide. Everyone's feelings are their own but I do not think for a second the writers intended us to be glorying in what a shell of his former self Dutch has become. Contrast with Micah where you are 100% supposed to take the most wonderful glee in blowing him to smithereens. Like any other villain, Micah's end is whatever on an emotional level. But Dutch? It seems pretty clear the intention was to give him sympathy, as there was once a good man there, just like John said. We can mourn what he has become. There is no mourning for any other villain in these games.
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Nov 30, 2023 10:22
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I started this loving challenge a week ago and I haven't seen a single god drat opossum since. I saw them all the time before.
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Dec 1, 2023 21:29
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Ross is right, you just hate him cause he enforces the rules
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Dec 1, 2023 21:40
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Node posted:I started this loving challenge a week ago and I haven't seen a single god drat opossum since. I saw them all the time before. At night, in the hills south of the trapper near Riggs station. Good spot for badgers and skunks too. Point a gun at an opossum and it will roll over and play dead.
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Dec 1, 2023 22:16
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i've 100% the game like 5 times now (don't ask please) and i have always consistently found one in pretty much this area, directly next to a tree, at aroud dusk. follow the road until you hit the bridge and go back and do the same, eventually one will spawn. at sunrise i just slept until dusk again if none spawned the entire night. it's always the same tree, i could probably pinpoint it if i took a screenshot in-game right now.  keep using eagle eye and look at the bases of the trees, they're small and you can get fairly close without them fleeing. also used this spot to get the 4 pelts needed for the trapper's hat
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Dec 1, 2023 23:13
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NikkolasKing posted:I mean, Dutch is not an undisputed dictator. All his decisions are supported by Hosea with a couple of exceptions. Dutch's initial plan in Chapter 3 of cozying up to the local law wasn't a bad one, it's just that he, Hosea, and Micah all got greedy and were like "let's go after this gold they got." The Saint-Denis bank robbery was planned explicitly by Hosea. The gang as a whole makes many mistakes that aren't educable to Dutch's issues, even if I grant he never intended to give up teh fight. I mean Dutch is not dictator in the traditional sense, he just rules through charm and loyalty rather than through force. We see what happens when people start questioning him- he abandons them. At least once with Arthur and several times with John. quote:Something I've always found intriguing is John's total 360 on Dutch. He doubts him but likes him which is 90 degree turn. Then he ends up entirely detesting him, the full 180 turn from love to hate. Then, by RDR1, he's turned back the other way, doing a 180. John s the one who takes the "Dutch was always evil" side in RDR2's epilogue in that argument with Sadie while she says Dutch changed. And yet, American Venom then happens. Dutch saves John's life and leaves him a ton of money. Cut to RDR1 a few years later and now John is saying I think he dislikes the monster Dutch revealed himself to be, but at the end of the day, Dutch was still a father figure to him. Everything John is and has (like his family) can be owed Dutch. There's always a bit of rose-tinted glasses when a person looks at their childhood. quote:The villains of RDR are not characters we're supposed to sympathize with or feel anything for. Bronte, Cornwall, Ross - they're cartoon characters and their ends mean nothing to us. Dutch and Micah are conveniently juxtaposed to each other in AV. Dutch utters a broken, hollow "I ain't...got too much to say no more." He looks and sounds like man who is entirely crushed by his own failures and has nothing left to live for in the world. Which, in effect, is why he commits suicide. Everyone's feelings are their own but I do not think for a second the writers intended us to be glorying in what a shell of his former self Dutch has become. Contrast with Micah where you are 100% supposed to take the most wonderful glee in blowing him to smithereens. Like any other villain, Micah's end is whatever on an emotional level. But Dutch? It seems pretty clear the intention was to give him sympathy, as there was once a good man there, just like John said. We can mourn what he has become. There is no mourning for any other villain in these games. That and a major part of the reason people sympathize with Dutch and read so much more into him, is because Arthur does. We spend the whole game looking at the gang and Dutch through Arthur's eyes. And Arthur is probably one of the most level-headed, intelligent and competent people in the entire game, so if Arthur likes and respect Dutch, then we probably should too. We want to believe Dutch was a good person, because Arthur believed it.
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Dec 5, 2023 23:59
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Lol RDR2 really does kind of 'break' when you play it like GTA. Not just in the 'sorrowful and intelligent Arthur Morgan would never try to rob a store ten feet from a police station, get caught and kill a dozen men, burning some of them alive all for $8' way, but in that when you return to the same store a day later the most the clerk can say is "I hope you can act like a gentleman this time!"
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Dec 9, 2023 21:01
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Wolfsheim posted:Lol RDR2 really does kind of 'break' when you play it like GTA. Not just in the 'sorrowful and intelligent Arthur Morgan would never try to rob a store ten feet from a police station, get caught and kill a dozen men, burning some of them alive all for $8' way, but in that when you return to the same store a day later the most the clerk can say is "I hope you can act like a gentleman this time!" All just part of running a business in the Old West
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Dec 11, 2023 00:51
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Played the story through when it first came out late 2019 and mostly enjoyed the wonders and constant danger of the world. Replaying it again, and paying more attention to the story and characters...it's even more amazing now. Hanging onto Chapter 2 as long as I can. Key example being I didn't realize Arthur was scorned from the life he wanted and had to fallback to the gang. Completely missed that in first playthrough and explains so so much.
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Dec 14, 2023 22:00
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jbusbysack posted:Played the story through when it first came out late 2019 and mostly enjoyed the wonders and constant danger of the world. On a replay Chapter 3 is the prime "Mountain Man Arthur" time. The gang is at its highest morale, you have unlocked all the various story gated stuff, and can just go do hunting and sidequests and challenges forever and then have a full arsenal of weapons, fancy outfits, and other toys while doing the main story thereafter, along with all of the other stuff that then only shows up in chapters 3-7
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Dec 14, 2023 22:16
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WoodrowSkillson posted:On a replay Chapter 3 is the prime "Mountain Man Arthur" time. The gang is at its highest morale, you have unlocked all the various story gated stuff, and can just go do hunting and sidequests and challenges forever and then have a full arsenal of weapons, fancy outfits, and other toys while doing the main story thereafter, along with all of the other stuff that then only shows up in chapters 3-7 Awesome, thank you!
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Dec 14, 2023 22:28
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Counterpoint: act 2 is better because Micah is in jail
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Dec 14, 2023 22:38
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webmeister posted:Counterpoint: act 2 is better because Micah is in jail 
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Dec 14, 2023 22:46
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webmeister posted:Counterpoint: act 2 is better because Micah is in jail for sure but the extra holster is worth it lol
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Dec 14, 2023 22:57
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WoodrowSkillson posted:for sure but the extra holster is worth it lol I got a second holster from the trapper long before bothering with Micah
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Dec 14, 2023 23:00
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Hobo Clown posted:I got a second holster from the trapper long before bothering with Micah good point, i was remembering it as unlocking the slot
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Dec 14, 2023 23:04
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WoodrowSkillson posted:for sure but the extra holster is worth it lol You can get it immediately for doing the Hunting 1 challenge (I think, the one where you skin 3 deer)
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Dec 15, 2023 00:54
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The challenges are structured so weirdly like that. I can't imagine anyone not messing around with hunting enough to not unlock the trapper holster before Micah's mission even opens up. The idea of someone just beelining story missions in RDR2 without taking the time to ramble along the open plains taking the measure of nature's glory...*shudders*
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Dec 15, 2023 05:24
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I picked this game up on sale for about $20 on Steam last week and have put maybe five or so hours into it. I'm not sure what to make of it. My computer can run it maxed out at 1440P well in the 80-100FPS range and the game is gorgeous. The landscape, characters, the details and such, are all truly "next gen" in a way that I only see comparable to a maxed out Cyberpunk. As for the gameplay, it's very slow and deliberate. I never had a console to play the first Red Dead (thought I may now get it for Switch) so I have nothing to compare it to other than GTA IV and V. It seems like a game where, if I'm just trying to binge it to finish the story, I'm going to be constantly annoyed. But it also feels like a game where if I take my time and relax and just soak in the atmosphere, it's an incredible experience. Is that more or less true? For reference, I've only just gotten to the little Valentine town or whatever it's called. I choked a man to death in his underwear, and then got into a full on bar-brawl and thrown out of a window. This is good poo poo!
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Dec 17, 2023 19:01
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chaosapiant posted:But it also feels like a game where if I take my time and relax and just soak in the atmosphere, it's an incredible experience. Is that more or less true? This is 100% the appeal. I refer to it as “cowboyin’” for a reason. Just ride around. Explore caves and mountaintops. Explore burned out encampments, snowy valleys. Go hunting. Enjoy the random generated poo poo and side quests. That’s what hooked me on RDR to begin with—just galloping around in an open world and exploring everything I could.
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Dec 17, 2023 19:06
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That said, the story is also really good
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Dec 17, 2023 19:10
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Yeah, it's both. It's a slow, deliberate, extremely expansive and beautifully realised open world game that also happens to have one of the greatest stories and best cast of characters in the history of videogames Give it the time it deserves. You will honestly be richly rewarded
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Dec 17, 2023 20:28
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