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What is the most powerful flying bug?
This poll is closed.
🦋 15 3.71%
🦇 115 28.47%
🪰 12 2.97%
🐦 67 16.58%
dragonfly 94 23.27%
🦟 14 3.47%
🐝 87 21.53%
Total: 404 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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Organ Fiend
May 21, 2007

custom title

Never thought a picture could fill me with both laughter and existential dread simultaneously.

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comedyblissoption
Mar 15, 2006

dk2m posted:

I watched 20 Days in Mariupol and just couldn’t stop feeling sad for the regular people, random children and old people, caught up in a completely avoidable war. Ukraine could have just played the west and Russia off each other but decided to double down and force the issue with the most unreliable partners. nobody in the west truly gave a poo poo about Ukrainians and yet the insane fanatics running the show decided that we’re going to be the saviors
i would rephrase what transpired. "Ukraine" is not an accurate actor here as an entity capable of playing the west and Russia off each other.

we should remember more aptly, ukraine was run by literal nazis empowered by the west since the coup and frame the post-coup state's intentions in this light

the former post-coup president, poroshenko, was recently filmed wearing a nazi patch and waving a nazi flag. the poroshenko administration declared january 1st a national holiday for the nazi bandera, leader of the OUN which abetted the holocaust
https://twitter.com/KanekoaTheGreat/status/1702584315400671439

Homeless Friend
Jul 16, 2007

CODChimera posted:



quick how do we spin this into a Ukraine win??

Sorry, I've been told that this was only the expectation of a few news columns and nobody seriously thought there would be fast results :smugdon:

supersnowman
Oct 3, 2012

Ardennes posted:

How many Canadians not from Quebec can speak French well even though supposedly all of them study it for years?

Very few because they have no reason to ever use it. Hell the current president of Air Canada, a corporation where official language law are supposed to be enforced more or less bragged about living his entire life in Montreal without ever learning French.

Hazamuth
May 9, 2007

the original bugsy

Grimnarsson posted:

That Finland industrialised as the result of the reparations has always been something that I've wondered if it's just a nationalist myth and positive spin for a massive national burden? Did the Soviet Union really ask for goods that Finland wasn't already producing? And indeed Finland was making at least ships and locomotives well before the war. It might be accurate to say that after the war Finland transformed into a predominantly industrial society from a predominantly agrarian one but that would have happened without the reparations just the same. Industrialisation afterall is a process that in Finland had started well in the 19th century.

Weka posted:

Supported by the USSR to industrialize?

from https://www.stat.fi/tup/suomi90/toukokuu_en.html (Statistics Finland)

"Although the early war years were characterised by dramatic drops in industrial output, industry recovered quickly from the war. In the first peace year of 1946, industrial output increased by more than 20 per cent and higher output than in any year before the war was recorded still in the same year. In the immediate post-war period of 1946 to1951, industrial output grew very rapidly.

Many factors contributed to the brisk growth. First, rebuilding of the country after the war increased demand for industrial products. Second, Finland devalued its currency several times in 1945 and 1949, which boosted exports to the west. For example, the combined effect from the two devaluations in 1949 was that the value of the dollar rose by 70 per cent against the Finnish markka. Third, the International Court of Justice ordered Finland to large war reparations which were largely paid in manufactured products. From 1946 to 1952 these reparations accounted for a significant share of all industrial output. In terms of magnitude the war reparations could equal to up to four per cent of the country's gross domestic product.

In 1951, the Korean War boosted exports by creating in the world a huge rush to buy munitions and, in its wake, an international economic boom. This shows as a peak in the volume of Finnish industrial output. From 1950 to 1951, industrial output went up by about one-sixth. After the economic boom demand for exports faded quickly in the next year and Finland's economy was weakened by both import regulations and tight monetary policy. After one year's strong growth, industrial output duly declined in 1952. However, from 1953 to 1955 rapid growth resumed in industrial output: thanks to the war reparations the quality of manufactured products had improved, and exports to the western markets also began to grow."


As for the myth part, it has become apparent later on that one of the reasons we managed to pay the reparations was that we already had a good industrial base in metallurgy and it had advanced significantly during the war. The reasons for emphasizing the positive benefits of the reparations were largely political, as by having the support of the people behind making the payments, you could sidestep the fact that those same industrial products would have been helpful in our own reconstruction. Nevertheless, the growth of industrial production after the war was rapid and the overall volume grew more quickly than at any point in time before the war. However, the transformation from agrarianism had started well before, so in that sense it wasn't industrialization. As far as I know, USSR was always more of an export country for us and machinery was of western origin, largely bought with loan money from Sweden or the US.

Thanks for asking about this, as I started to ponder myself after making the last post and had the onus to check on how the issue is considered nowadays.

my bony fealty
Oct 1, 2008

Cao Ni Ma posted:



Inspirational stuff from cnn.

just surrender dumbass

Calde
Jun 20, 2009

Ardennes posted:

How many Canadians not from Quebec can speak French well even though supposedly all of them study it for years?

Delurking to mention L'Acadie exists too. The majority of my extended family in Canada can speak French, but not speak French well according to the standards of Quebecois, lmao.

Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3
Nov 15, 2003

Cao Ni Ma posted:



Inspirational stuff from cnn.

The UAF was low on shells so they only fired enough to blow him up and not any of the Russians surrounding him.

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

supersnowman posted:

Very few because they have no reason to ever use it. Hell the current president of Air Canada, a corporation where official language law are supposed to be enforced more or less bragged about living his entire life in Montreal without ever learning French.

Montreal was an "English" city, and Canada's largest, until the 70's, when the bombings by the restive French population caused the corporations and their white collar workers to flee to Toronto (and the US).

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019


it's nice to have him back

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019

Cao Ni Ma posted:



Inspirational stuff from cnn.

"suicide bombing ftw" - cnn

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Their NATO trainers taught their officers how to get a Silver Star/DSO citation.

Minenfeld!
Aug 21, 2012



I hate myself for saying it, but I can't exactly disagree with FF on British coats.

Tankbuster
Oct 1, 2021

Vomik posted:

every old uncle in India will trap you in a conversation about how kids aren’t learning their home tongue enough or can’t properly speak it and the language is gonna die lol

basically you could have that exact convo about 30 different languages in one evening at a midsized wedding here

Yeah but in india places are federalized enough that you will always get a leg up in local bureaucracies if you speak the language. If anything the standardization post independence is slowly killing off regional dialects - you see it the most in all the different languages being put under the rubric of hindi.

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Minenfeld! posted:

I hate myself for saying it, but I can't exactly disagree with FF on British coats.

🙏

lobster shirt
Jun 14, 2021

mawarannahr posted:

"suicide bombing ftw" - cnn

cnns right

VoicesCanBe
Jul 1, 2023

"Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

"Next year we're gonna do stuff. Things will happen."

Clark Nova
Jul 18, 2004

Danann posted:

https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1730698432770155000

sorry defense industry but real estate generates more gdp and is cleaner

:catstare: I wanna live crammed in next to the munitions plant. I want to build my house on ground that has been a munitions plant for a hundred years

Officer Sandvich
Feb 14, 2010
Estonia considers deporting individuals who seek to obtain Russian passports

quote:

Estonian Prime Minister Kaja Kallas has confirmed that her government is exploring the possibility of deporting individuals in the country who choose to obtain Russian citizenship, Estonian publication Postimees reported on Dec. 1.

The revelation comes amid growing concerns about potential security threats and ties to Russia’s aggressive actions in the region.

Estonian Minister of Internal Affairs Lauri Laanemets had already signaled in early November the government’s intention to expel those expressing interest in acquiring Russian citizenship.

Responding to a letter from Estonian MP Alexander Chaplygin, who questioned the legal basis for such actions, Kallas underscored that Russia, in attacking Ukraine, had breached all principles of international law.

The Parliament of Estonia and the Council of Europe have acknowledged Russia as a state supporting terrorism.

“For example, the Russian Federation conducted attacks on Baltic countries during military exercises, consistently expressed hostile and false narratives about Western countries through official channels, and recently resumed organizing the illegal entry of migrants into the European Union,” said Kallas.

“This is a threat to the security of the Republic of Estonia and a clear signal that the Estonian state cannot ignore,” she said.

Kallas said that each case would be meticulously reviewed by the Police and Border Guard Board to assess the perceived danger posed by the individual.

She also raised the possibility of investigating whether obtaining Russian citizenship could be considered support for terrorism and an activity direceted against Estonia and its allies.

“In a situation where obtaining Russian citizenship is a clear signal of support for terrorism and actions against Estonia and our allies, it is undoubtedly necessary to consider the suitability of such an individual to live in a democratic country that upholds human rights,” Kallas added.

Confirming the government’s official position, Kallas reiterated Laanemets’ stance on seeking deportation methods for those pursuing Russian citizenship.

Nonsense
Jan 26, 2007

Russia is mobilizing vast reserves of manpower. Ukraine will collapse before the end of the summer.

Officer Sandvich
Feb 14, 2010

Nonsense posted:

Russia is mobilizing vast reserves of manpower. Ukraine will collapse before the end of the summer.

See, this has been bothering me for months now. Even in this thread a lot of people are seeing the 1k+ daily Russian losses and thinking that's unsustainable, so Russia must be losing. But unless I'm mistaken, that's just highlighting the key difference between a Russian and western mindset? We see 1k+ losses and think "that's awful! They must be making so many bad decisions out there!" But Russia sees that, knows Ukraine is losing some troops too, and knows they can grind this out for years while Ukraine can't. So in Russia's mind they're winning?

And as far as I can see, unless the west makes significant changes to how much equipment and ammo we send, Russia genuinely looks likely to see this grinding strategy through to some kind of mini-goal. Not capturing Ukraine in totality, but enough of it to call a halt to the grind, dig in defences, sell it back home as a victory, then build up strength for the next campaign. Putin gets his glorious military entry in Russian history books. The west looks like collective dumb-dumbs who dragged their feet on almost every decision and were too afraid of Putin to ever commit any kind of truly decisive aid.

Is that too much of a depressing read of the situation? I'd love to be wrong...

Chamale
Jul 11, 2010

I'm helping!



Almost all Ukrainians speak some blend of Ukrainian and Russian, because the languages have so much vocabulary in common, and someone could easily end up using a Russian loanword in a Ukrainian sentence or vice-versa. Before the war, a poll found that more than 10% of the population speaks Surzhyk at home, a pidgin of Ukrainian and Russian. But during the war it became so heavily politicized that people could get arrested or worse for failing to pass some kind of language shibboleth.

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique


Reminder that this exact scenario is what everyone was worried about the Baltics doing when they were allowed to join NATO.

Officer Sandvich posted:

I'd love to be wrong...

Good news!

tambourine
Oct 11, 2021

Officer Sandvich posted:

See, this has been bothering me for months now. Even in this thread a lot of people are seeing the 1k+ daily Russian losses and thinking that's unsustainable, so Russia must be losing. But unless I'm mistaken, that's just highlighting the key difference between a Russian and western mindset? We see 1k+ losses and think "that's awful! They must be making so many bad decisions out there!" But Russia sees that, knows Ukraine is losing some troops too, and knows they can grind this out for years while Ukraine can't. So in Russia's mind they're winning?

And as far as I can see, unless the west makes significant changes to how much equipment and ammo we send, Russia genuinely looks likely to see this grinding strategy through to some kind of mini-goal. Not capturing Ukraine in totality, but enough of it to call a halt to the grind, dig in defences, sell it back home as a victory, then build up strength for the next campaign. Putin gets his glorious military entry in Russian history books. The west looks like collective dumb-dumbs who dragged their feet on almost every decision and were too afraid of Putin to ever commit any kind of truly decisive aid.

Is that too much of a depressing read of the situation? I'd love to be wrong...

The "mini goal" is to keep this forever war going until Putin croaks and getting out of the war becomes his successor's problem.

Nevil Maskelyne
Nov 11, 2023

by Fluffdaddy
lmfao do the liberals/nazis on whatever reddit hes quoting actually believe russia is losing a thousand people a day

even two years later the grim reaper of material circumstances is still completely invisible to them

Thoguh
Nov 8, 2002

College Slice

‘Terrorism’ has lost all meaning when you apply it to a sovereign nation state for engaging in a war with another sovereign nation state.

Officer Sandvich
Feb 14, 2010

Nevil Maskelyne posted:

lmfao do the liberals/nazis on whatever reddit hes quoting actually believe russia is losing a thousand people a day

even two years later the grim reaper of material circumstances is still completely invisible to them

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1730839123269705884

I believe it because the losses are confirmed.

V. Illych L.
Apr 11, 2008

ASK ME ABOUT LUMBER

Nevil Maskelyne posted:

lmfao do the liberals/nazis on whatever reddit hes quoting actually believe russia is losing a thousand people a day

even two years later the grim reaper of material circumstances is still completely invisible to them

the D&D thread takes such losses more or less as a given, yes. i actually don't think it's a strange thing to do if you're them - respectable institutions which they trust have said as much, and the people claiming otherwise are generally seen as being motivated or contrarian or otherwise unrespectable. under this lens, the war is obviously unsustainable for russia, and ukraine only needs to hold out to secure victory - which will have retroactively made all the suffering worth it. the more pragmatically minded will cite the cost imposed on russia as establishing a credible incentive, which again is only completely mad if you think about it

Starsfan
Sep 29, 2007

This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

the infographic says the losses are *TO* be confirmed Sandvich. Could be anywhere from 0 to 1,070

V. Illych L. posted:

the D&D thread takes such losses more or less as a given, yes. i actually don't think it's a strange thing to do if you're them - respectable institutions which they trust have said as much, and the people claiming otherwise are generally seen as being motivated or contrarian or otherwise unrespectable. under this lens, the war is obviously unsustainable for russia, and ukraine only needs to hold out to secure victory - which will have retroactively made all the suffering worth it. the more pragmatically minded will cite the cost imposed on russia as establishing a credible incentive, which again is only completely mad if you think about it

From what recall they do acknowledge that you can't put complete confidence in the numbers since Ukraine can't be expected to have perfect information, but they believe that they are roughly accurate to a +/- 10% of the reported total.

also the Oryx numbers are conservative and form the the lower boundary of the actual Russian equipment losses, with the upper boundary being the Ukrainian MoD numbers.

Starsfan has issued a correction as of 20:43 on Dec 2, 2023

V. Illych L.
Apr 11, 2008

ASK ME ABOUT LUMBER

this attitude requires one to assume that the british MoD is excessively weighing its observations in a way which tends to downplay russian losses, but you know

Orange Devil
Oct 1, 2010

Wullie's reign cannae smother the flames o' equality!

gradenko_2000 posted:

it's extremely true:



from Robert Citino's "The Wehrmacht's Last Stand"

the citation for footnote 63:

How many shells do you think a front the size of Russia with 150 guns per km fire a day? How many shells do you reckon the society that fielded that produced in a month?

VoicesCanBe
Jul 1, 2023

"Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

V. Illych L. posted:

the D&D thread takes such losses more or less as a given, yes. i actually don't think it's a strange thing to do if you're them - respectable institutions which they trust have said as much, and the people claiming otherwise are generally seen as being motivated or contrarian or otherwise unrespectable. under this lens, the war is obviously unsustainable for russia, and ukraine only needs to hold out to secure victory - which will have retroactively made all the suffering worth it. the more pragmatically minded will cite the cost imposed on russia as establishing a credible incentive, which again is only completely mad if you think about it

Yeah we're talking about a group of people who consider the Kyiv Independent to be a reliable source. From their perspective they have no real reason to doubt the stated numbers, thus they must be true. After all, if they weren't true the Kyiv Independent surely wouldn't report them.

Cerebral Bore
Apr 21, 2010


Fun Shoe

Thoguh posted:

‘Terrorism’ has lost all meaning when you apply it to a sovereign nation state for engaging in a war with another sovereign nation state.

terrorism is when somebody we don't like resorts to violence

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Orange Devil posted:

How many shells do you think a front the size of Russia with 150 guns per km fire a day? How many shells do you reckon the society that fielded that produced in a month?

In the Magnuszew bridgehead, the 1st Belorussian Front stockpiled 2.5 million artillery and mortar rounds, and in the Puławy bridgehead 1.3 million rounds. By comparison, in the whole of the 'Uran' operation to retake Stalingrad, the Don Front had fired fewer than one million artillery and mortar rounds. The 2nd and 3rd Belorussian Fronts, situated away from the main road and railway networks and having less crucial missions, had to limit themselves in terms of fuel and rations, but not on ammunition. Together the two fronts had as initial issues 9 million artillery and mortar rounds, of which 40% were allocated to their opening barrages.

To paraphrase Ridley Scott, it's a matter of geometry, these are problems that are solvable.

Pistol_Pete
Sep 15, 2007

Oven Wrangler

Nevil Maskelyne posted:

lmfao do the liberals/nazis on whatever reddit hes quoting actually believe russia is losing a thousand people a day

even two years later the grim reaper of material circumstances is still completely invisible to them

They'll have a hazy picture in their heads of ragged, demoralised Russian conscripts being driven towards the Ukrainian machine guns by Commissars, like something out of Nazi WWII propaganda, and that's good enough for them.

BULBASAUR
Apr 6, 2009




Soiled Meat

KomradeX posted:

I was talking with my Ukrianian friend tonight and he mentioned that in Belarus, speaking Belarusian is on the decline and likely to just be replaced by Russian and he's afraid that Ukrianian will end up down that path or like galeic in Ireland. And well I was wondering how true that actually is and why, beggars he mentioned Uncle Luka (my term) ended Belorussian education coursee

Russian and cyrillic were the 'lingua franca' of the USSR so it was moving into that direction well before recent times. This took a pause after the collapse, but its hard to put the breaks on assimilating to the dominant economy at your doorstep. This isn't really unique to eastern europe either.

CODChimera posted:



quick how do we spin this into a Ukraine win??

this reads like a memo to company shareholders

Megamissen
Jul 19, 2022

any post can be a kannapost
if you want it to be

RedSky posted:

Irish has some other factors that don't make the comparison 1 to 1, in this case as at least Ukrainian and Belarusian have (afaik) many genuine similarities and roots with Russian in how they are written and spoken.

Irish is entirely distinct from English and nothing like it. Thinking in Irish is the great sin as far as the likes of fine Gael and Fianna Fáil are concerned. They'll always have the leader speak Irish at ceremonies and events but as a lingua franca it is not accepted.

i think a better comparison would be to scots

dk2m
May 6, 2009

VoicesCanBe posted:

Yeah we're talking about a group of people who consider the Kyiv Independent to be a reliable source. From their perspective they have no real reason to doubt the stated numbers, thus they must be true. After all, if they weren't true the Kyiv Independent surely wouldn't report them.

a lot of it is due to the extreme amount of censorship on any sort of Russian source. it was prepped for years in the making, but having 0 visibility into motives and perspectives of Russia will mean that your only source of information will be our propoganda. to be clear though, a lot of poo poo you’ll see from Russian sources is just as bombastic and unreliable, but if you never even encounter it, then you never are able to develop the muscle to parse through the information fog of war.

more broadly though, the problem has been linking analysis with complicity - the liberal idealist cannot think outside of “values”, which is certainly in opposition to a materialist point of view. true analysis, critical theory, takes into account not only cultural theory and deconstruction, but also the political economy. doing this will label you a sympathizer amongst most liberals, in the same way that bush would repeat “you cannot negotiate with terrorists” as the main driver of us policy in the Middle East

the Israel war was much more transparent and obvious in how it looks like to cover only for a particular side, and the censorship/narrative spin didn’t work. it also resulted in a more materialist narrative, in which the historical context of the war was an agreed upon starting point amongst both sides. that’s unlike what happened with this war - there’s almost no understanding of the historical context for this war, leading to phrases like “unprovoked full scale invasion” to become the standard view

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Canadian English dramatically changed since the 1960's. There were places, like Perth, where Scots was being spoken until the 1950's at least, and that's all gone now too.

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Zodium
Jun 19, 2004

mawarannahr posted:

it's nice to have him back

frosted flake ftw

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