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freebooter
Jul 7, 2009

The Lord Bude posted:

I have a several of friends who quite like/liked living in Melbourne and Sydney and the defining characteristic of all of them was a lifestyle whereby they lived in the inner parts of the city and didn’t drive. In the case of Sydney on a train line, in the case of Melbourne within the area covered by trams.

This is me but I think PT has also degraded. Melbourne's trains network is comprehensive but shockingly unreliable - there was a map going around a while ago showing how often the lines were replaced by buses up to the mid-point of 2023, and for some lines it was more than 50% of the time. Some of that is the necessary level crossing removal project but a lot of that is just decayed signals, jumpers on the tracks, etc. Road traffic has also gotten horribly congested and that affects trams.

I moved here about 10 years ago and in that time the population has gone from 4 million to 5 million with no corresponding infrastructure boost. The new metro tunnel and West Gate expansion will have to be some level of improvement, but I feel like if you're going to increase a city's population by a full 20% you need a bit more than a new underground line and another Yarra road crossing.

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Anidav
Feb 25, 2010

ahhh fuck its the rats again
Steven Miles to be Queensland's next premier

Queensland’s next premier will be Steven Miles after his opponent for the leadership Shannon Fentiman conceded she doesn’t have the numbers.

SecretOfSteel
Apr 29, 2007

The secret of steel has always
carried with it a mystery.

Anidav posted:

Steven Miles to be Queensland's next premier

Queensland’s next premier will be Steven Miles after his opponent for the leadership Shannon Fentiman conceded she doesn’t have the numbers.

Don't forget the ABC photo!

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Eediot Jedi
Dec 25, 2007

This is where I begin to speculate what being a
man of my word costs me

Dutton rear end looking man

Cartoon
Jun 20, 2008

poop

SecretOfSteel posted:

Don't forget the ABC photo!

Typical ABC fake news! They airbrushed out the knife.

Jezza of OZPOS
Mar 21, 2018

GET LOSE❌🗺️, YOUS CAN'T COMPARE😤 WITH ME 💪POWERS🇦🇺

Eediot Jedi posted:

Dutton rear end looking man

ugh, i can see it and now i dont know if i can unsee it

Solemn Sloth
Jul 11, 2015

Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.
Having small councils works for the state government because it means none of them gather much political power comparable to the premier, and works for councillors because there’s a bunch more robes and chains to go round. Both state and federal government are as corrupt as each other imo.

City of Melbourne is a liberal org because companies get a vote, otherwise it would be a den of commies like the state and federal electorates that make up the CBD.

Brisbane seems a nice enough City but lol at living anywhere with such a high density of Queenslanders.

Jezza of OZPOS
Mar 21, 2018

GET LOSE❌🗺️, YOUS CAN'T COMPARE😤 WITH ME 💪POWERS🇦🇺
tbh the density of qlders in the inner north of melbourne is probably about as high as brisbane, and i assume this is why nobody likes collingwood

Solemn Sloth
Jul 11, 2015

Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Jezza of OZPOS posted:

tbh the density of qlders in the inner north of melbourne is probably about as high as brisbane, and i assume this is why nobody likes collingwood

There’s a reason the Yarra exists and it’s largely to keep those people out

Laserface
Dec 24, 2004

CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:

Sydney is just an unaffordable mess for living in it.

On the other hand a lot of the infra issues have been fixed in the last decade and there's a bunch of others nearing completion or inbuild that will fix quite a few glaring problems of public transport. You might even dare say a lot of Sydney's PT and planning is actually pretty drat good now and even matches / surpasses Europe especially when it comes to the Metro and the associated urban planning. Thank christ Minns hasn't made the bonehead mistakes of Carr and Wran so far and decided to keep the ball rolling - Much of what he's announced was already in process but he's managed to repackage it so it sounds like Labor came up with it (They didnt, it was all in design up to a decade ago, but frankly I'm willing to let that pass as Labor hasn't cancelled anything)

Cycling has improved greatly in the last decade apart from some notable bonehead stupidity (big gently caress you to Bicycle NSW for having a hand in those ones) and Sydney itself is perfectly fine to get around on a bike, more so after the pandemic introduced "temp" bike lanes that.... just have not gone away. Also the main west route for cycling via Lilyfield Rd is about to repoen which will make a noticable difference.

The proposed third CBD of Bradfield is looking like it will have a lot of infra from day one which is going to be a surprising change.

The downside of all this new infra is that they can still gently caress it up and there's no excusing the shitfest that is Rozelle Interchange and they really should have pushed expanding/building the Metro and light rail. And there cant be enough cycling infra. And there should be rebates for e-bikes because Sydney being hilly means it can be daunting for new cyclists BUT also the perfect place for an e-Bike.

our entire PT network grinds to a halt if there is a dog on the train tracks or someone jumps in front of a train dude. it is not approaching Europe.

and then when there is any hint of bad weather or maybe a train delay, everyone is on the roads, and they get choked.


and yes, Inner City Sydney resident here, I e-bike or train/bus everywhere that isnt rideable and only drive should i be going somewhere outside of the PT network. Sydney absolutely sucks if you have to drive anywhere within it.

Eediot Jedi
Dec 25, 2007

This is where I begin to speculate what being a
man of my word costs me

Jezza of OZPOS posted:

ugh, i can see it and now i dont know if i can unsee it

Hehehehe... turgid

Recoome
Nov 9, 2013

Matter of fact, I'm salty now.

Solemn Sloth posted:

Having small councils works for the state government because it means none of them gather much political power comparable to the premier, and works for councillors because there’s a bunch more robes and chains to go round. Both state and federal government are as corrupt as each other imo.

City of Melbourne is a liberal org because companies get a vote, otherwise it would be a den of commies like the state and federal electorates that make up the CBD.

Brisbane seems a nice enough City but lol at living anywhere with such a high density of Queenslanders.

Queenslanders are bad but my god no one ever mention COVID around a Melbumian because they’ll turn into a frothing anti-vaxxer who spouts off every LNP talking point from the last 3 years. Absolutely mental stuff and once again supports the Fortress Queensland and Premier Palaszczuk.

Anidav
Feb 25, 2010

ahhh fuck its the rats again
Miles is my leader.

If he says jump I will ask how far.

JBP
Feb 16, 2017

You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

Recoome posted:

Queenslanders are bad but my god no one ever mention COVID around a Melbumian because they’ll turn into a frothing anti-vaxxer who spouts off every LNP talking point from the last 3 years. Absolutely mental stuff and once again supports the Fortress Queensland and Premier Palaszczuk.

This is the opposite of what most people from Danistan do. Maybe you socialise in Queenslander friendly circles idk.

GoldStandardConure
Jun 11, 2010

I have to kill fast
and mayflies too slow

Pillbug

JBP posted:

This is the opposite of what most people from Danistan do. Maybe you socialise in Queenslander friendly circles idk.

I saw two anti-vax/neo nazi marches, plus a bunch of swastikas painted on the pavement in tomato sauce when I was in Melbourne in June.

is Victoria ok?

JBP
Feb 16, 2017

You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

GoldStandardConure posted:

I saw two anti-vax/neo nazi marches, plus a bunch of swastikas painted on the pavement in tomato sauce when I was in Melbourne in June.

is Victoria ok?

Some people went around the twist because they got sacked. Two of my cousins from Geelong are still carrying the herald sun hatred but idk anyone else. One of them is a cop and the other is a libertarian musician. It touches particular people's brains.

I think locking them up at home for too long was a problem. They went online and now we're stuck with them.

E: well when I say "we're" I guess I mean tourists going to Swanston St because all this stuff may as well not exist in my life. I don't know anyone that thinks about covid at all outside of the current wave being a pain.

EE: also we get all the international antivax superstars because our city is famous for being gulag

JBP fucked around with this message at 03:43 on Dec 12, 2023

Recoome
Nov 9, 2013

Matter of fact, I'm salty now.

JBP posted:

This is the opposite of what most people from Danistan do. Maybe you socialise in Queenslander friendly circles idk.

I heard that Dan can’t get out or get memberships because of the COVID thing.

Thus is the burden of having a titanium spine

JBP
Feb 16, 2017

You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

Recoome posted:

I heard that Dan can’t get out or get memberships because of the COVID thing.

Thus is the burden of having a titanium spine

Isn't this a shock jock thing? I don't listen to talkback.

I'm probably blissfully out of touch.

E: he definitely got triple suplexed into the concrete by Lindsay Fox outside his place in Portsea for having sex with his granddaughter that's a fact

Autisanal Cheese
Nov 29, 2010

JBP posted:

E: he definitely got triple suplexed into the concrete by Lindsay Fox outside his place in Portsea for having sex with his granddaughter that's a fact

holy poo poo is that what happened

SecretOfSteel
Apr 29, 2007

The secret of steel has always
carried with it a mystery.

Eediot Jedi posted:

Dutton rear end looking man

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Solemn Sloth
Jul 11, 2015

Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Recoome posted:

Queenslanders are bad but my god no one ever mention COVID around a Melbumian because they’ll turn into a frothing anti-vaxxer who spouts off every LNP talking point from the last 3 years. Absolutely mental stuff and once again supports the Fortress Queensland and Premier Palaszczuk.

I guess this is why Dan Andrews lost the 2022 election in a campbellesque rout

Solemn Sloth
Jul 11, 2015

Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.
Honestly I think part of the reason we have a population of dedicated lunatics is that they’re so marginalised from mainstream politics that they decide getting mad and nude on the steps of parliament is their best shot.

As mentioned above we also attract some international grifters because MoSt LoCkDoWnEd CiTy :kingsley:

JBP
Feb 16, 2017

You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

Solemn Sloth posted:

Honestly I think part of the reason we have a population of dedicated lunatics is that they’re so marginalised from mainstream politics that they decide getting mad and nude on the steps of parliament is their best shot.

As mentioned above we also attract some international grifters because MoSt LoCkDoWnEd CiTy :kingsley:

It's derro no-job lefty arts degree latte land

Breetai
Nov 6, 2005

🥄Mah spoon is too big!🍌
Let's see what the head of the RBA has to say today.


quote:

Ms Bullock had some interesting things to say about central bank digital currencies (CBDCs) in the Q&A portion of her speech.
"A lot of the very useful things that came out of the CBDC trial that we did, and it was quite unusual, it was a pilot, it was a real claim on the Reserve Bank, it wasn't just play money, but one of the things that came out of it was really that some of these wholesale cases and particular cases where central bank digital currency could be used to settle assets - and this is why we're embarking upon this next step of looking at tokenised assets - [is] if you tokenise assets, put them on the ledger, can you use a CBDC to make that a much more efficient process, a much more efficient settlement process, and much safer settlement process?

So, for me, the thing that came out of that particular experiment of all the case studies was that that's a sensible next direction in which to take this."
Smells like blockchain.



She also brought up the concept of getting the consumer to bear additional handling costs with regards to making cash transactions, carefully coaching it in terms of 'we think this would be a difficult sell' but also mentionoing such costs in the same breath as loving 'shrinkage'.

quote:

"Look, it is a good question. And the issue with cash has always been that businesses don't really understand, I think, the costs of cash in their business. They are at the moment, I think, understanding it a bit more, but in the past they haven't really. They have called "shrinkage" as their main cost, which basically means theft, but really, they haven't really internalised, if you like, the costs of processing.

"I think the challenge with cash is that it really does have a big community, public service sort of aura attached to it. If you try to charge people to use cash, they are prepared to pay to get it out of an ATM but if businesses started charging people to use cash, I suspect there would be a very big backlash.

"Having said that, it is also true that as economists, you want people to face the prices of using particular services that reflect the cost of those services.

"So, at the moment I think we're probably in a position where it's very difficult to actually enforce payment for cash, but it is going to end up ‑ what's going to happen and what does happen at the moment is that the costs end up embedded in the costs of the financial institutions that are providing the services, and people don't face them. I think it would be a very big challenge, though, to get people to face the costs of cash."


That'll be a great tax on the poor and unbanked!

Solemn Sloth
Jul 11, 2015

Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Breetai posted:

Let's see what the head of the RBA has to say today.

Smells like blockchain.



She also brought up the concept of getting the consumer to bear additional handling costs with regards to making cash transactions, carefully coaching it in terms of 'we think this would be a difficult sell' but also mentionoing such costs in the same breath as loving 'shrinkage'.

That'll be a great tax on the poor and unbanked!

Hell yeah the cookers will start focusing on something other than “walkable neighbourhoods are totalitarian” for a while

Snowglobe of Doom
Mar 30, 2012

sucks to be right

Eediot Jedi posted:

Dutton rear end looking man

All the ladies shady
'Bout a Dutton rear end Man

WhiskeyWhiskers
Oct 14, 2013


"هذا ليس عادلاً."
"هذا ليس عادلاً على الإطلاق."
"كان هناك وقت الآن."
(السياق الخفي: للقراءة)

freebooter posted:

This is me but I think PT has also degraded. Melbourne's trains network is comprehensive but shockingly unreliable - there was a map going around a while ago showing how often the lines were replaced by buses up to the mid-point of 2023, and for some lines it was more than 50% of the time. Some of that is the necessary level crossing removal project but a lot of that is just decayed signals, jumpers on the tracks, etc. Road traffic has also gotten horribly congested and that affects trams.

I moved here about 10 years ago and in that time the population has gone from 4 million to 5 million with no corresponding infrastructure boost. The new metro tunnel and West Gate expansion will have to be some level of improvement, but I feel like if you're going to increase a city's population by a full 20% you need a bit more than a new underground line and another Yarra road crossing.

Ehhh, I wouldn't take any map like that as necessarily reliable. The PTV app has said my train is replaced by a bus for the last 5 months, but I've never had to take a bus. Which is a problem in itself, but definitely a different problem

freebooter
Jul 7, 2009

JBP posted:

E: well when I say "we're" I guess I mean tourists going to Swanston St because all this stuff may as well not exist in my life. I don't know anyone that thinks about covid at all outside of the current wave being a pain.

Yeah Victorians are identical to everyone else in Australia: they mostly think lockdowns/restrictions sucked but were necessary, are satisfied with their state government's response, and are more than happy to memory hole the whole period.

WhiskeyWhiskers posted:

Ehhh, I wouldn't take any map like that as necessarily reliable. The PTV app has said my train is replaced by a bus for the last 5 months, but I've never had to take a bus. Which is a problem in itself, but definitely a different problem

I think it originated from a train subreddit so I took it to have been calculated with obsessive precision. For me personally it's gotten better in the back half of the year, but I live in the west and from January-June the constant closures and delays were driving me up the loving wall.

freebooter
Jul 7, 2009

On another note: what is everybody's opinion on immigration levels, particularly as it pertains to the housing crisis? I noticed Albanese's "crackdown" announcement came and went without comment.

My personal take is that I am still an inner-city latte-sipping lefty who is instinctively suspicious of political talk around immigration, but am also beginning to think that a discussion around levels shouldn't be off the table during a rental crisis? Particularly since - and I'm not an economist - I've often wondered why Howard took such a hard line on refugees while also presiding over a massive, colourblind intake of legal migrants who met certain skills categories; and the answer as far as I can tell is that "immigration keeps the price of labour cheap and the Liberals hate the unions more than they hate foreigners."

I personally don't give a gently caress whether migrants come from England or India, and prefer living in a multicultural society to what I imagine Australia was like in the '70s, but this goes back to what I said before about Melbourne going from 4 million to 5 million in a decade, and the infrastructure (let alone the availability of housing) not keeping up. I don't know. I am drifting from being instinctively pro-immigration to being agnostic, and wondering if my cosmopolitan sympathies have been exploited by neoliberals.

(I am also vaguely aware that some kind of Protectionist/Free Trade argument played out along similar lines 100 years ago.)

Captain Theron
Mar 22, 2010

freebooter posted:

On another note: what is everybody's opinion on immigration levels, particularly as it pertains to the housing crisis? I noticed Albanese's "crackdown" announcement came and went without comment.

My personal take is that I am still an inner-city latte-sipping lefty who is instinctively suspicious of political talk around immigration, but am also beginning to think that a discussion around levels shouldn't be off the table during a rental crisis? Particularly since - and I'm not an economist - I've often wondered why Howard took such a hard line on refugees while also presiding over a massive, colourblind intake of legal migrants who met certain skills categories; and the answer as far as I can tell is that "immigration keeps the price of labour cheap and the Liberals hate the unions more than they hate foreigners."

I personally don't give a gently caress whether migrants come from England or India, and prefer living in a multicultural society to what I imagine Australia was like in the '70s, but this goes back to what I said before about Melbourne going from 4 million to 5 million in a decade, and the infrastructure (let alone the availability of housing) not keeping up. I don't know. I am drifting from being instinctively pro-immigration to being agnostic, and wondering if my cosmopolitan sympathies have been exploited by neoliberals.

(I am also vaguely aware that some kind of Protectionist/Free Trade argument played out along similar lines 100 years ago.)
Immigration is good and a boon to our economy that helps everyone. It's only impacting housing and infrastructure due to decades of mismanagement. We have plenty of space in Australia, and we produce far more food than we need domestically. We need to be far more proactive about increasing density in our existing cities and we should be encouraging growth in regional centres, including ensuring well paying work and social services.

Regular Wario
Mar 27, 2010

Slippery Tilde
i dont think we should let the poms in

Captain Theron
Mar 22, 2010

Non Compos Mentis posted:

i dont think we should let the poms in

Yeah, we don't need any TERFs.

Edit: bring back the entrance exam, but the only question is if trans rights are human rights.

Jezza of OZPOS
Mar 21, 2018

GET LOSE❌🗺️, YOUS CAN'T COMPARE😤 WITH ME 💪POWERS🇦🇺
also the building industry has been reliant for immigrant workers for as long as ive been an adult so if immigration was causing a demand surplus then lol we are hosed

Regular Wario
Mar 27, 2010

Slippery Tilde

Captain Theron posted:

Yeah, we don't need any TERFs.

Edit: bring back the entrance exam, but the only question is if trans rights are human rights.

i will accept this amendment

also dont let anyone in that voted for brexit

Animal Friend
Sep 7, 2011

I was born in brisbane and ive drank yarra water before ama

Regular Wario
Mar 27, 2010

Slippery Tilde
how do you feel about the yarra worms currently living in your meat?

lih
May 15, 2013

Just a friendly reminder of what it looks like.

We'll do punctuation later.

freebooter posted:

On another note: what is everybody's opinion on immigration levels, particularly as it pertains to the housing crisis? I noticed Albanese's "crackdown" announcement came and went without comment.

My personal take is that I am still an inner-city latte-sipping lefty who is instinctively suspicious of political talk around immigration, but am also beginning to think that a discussion around levels shouldn't be off the table during a rental crisis? Particularly since - and I'm not an economist - I've often wondered why Howard took such a hard line on refugees while also presiding over a massive, colourblind intake of legal migrants who met certain skills categories; and the answer as far as I can tell is that "immigration keeps the price of labour cheap and the Liberals hate the unions more than they hate foreigners."

I personally don't give a gently caress whether migrants come from England or India, and prefer living in a multicultural society to what I imagine Australia was like in the '70s, but this goes back to what I said before about Melbourne going from 4 million to 5 million in a decade, and the infrastructure (let alone the availability of housing) not keeping up. I don't know. I am drifting from being instinctively pro-immigration to being agnostic, and wondering if my cosmopolitan sympathies have been exploited by neoliberals.

(I am also vaguely aware that some kind of Protectionist/Free Trade argument played out along similar lines 100 years ago.)

the net immigration levels are mostly so high right now because we have a lot of international students, temporary workers etc. entering the country post-pandemic, but not the usual amount leaving (because there were far fewer in the country from 2020-2022). this should mostly return to normal before too long, but it has been a bit of a shock to the rental market because during the pandemic the number of people-per-dwelling decreased a fair bit because of the shift to working from home so there's less rentals available than there were pre-pandemic. we are actually still a little bit below the pre-pandemic trend in terms of population, so it's not as much about the infrastructure not being there, just the market changed due to the pandemic (more people living alone) meaning that immigration trying to return to normal has been disruptive.

Yeast
Dec 25, 2006

$1900 Grande Latte
We probably shouldn’t import an entire population of the Gold Coast in 1 year if we aren’t building the houses to put them in.

I am not a crank.

Recoome
Nov 9, 2013

Matter of fact, I'm salty now.

Solemn Sloth posted:

I guess this is why Dan Andrews lost the 2022 election in a campbellesque rout

There’s an opposition party in Vic?

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NTRabbit
Aug 15, 2012

i wear this armour to protect myself from the histrionics of hysterical women

bitches




Recoome posted:

There’s an opposition party in Vic?

Not since Dictator Dan made it illegal

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