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FirstnameLastname posted:i wasn't ever talking about what he posted! but the concern you're showing is about him exposing himself to the allegedly gory videos, and I've been trying to explain that people's imaginings about the videos are worse than anything actually in them. the videos he mentions (and I've watched the ones I could find) are heartening, not triggers for PTSD.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:03
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Leandros posted:I imagine that the main shockwave does not in fact contribute that much as it is going much faster than the copper, so its gone by the time the armour is penetrated. Could be wrong. No, that's correct. Since the 1930's people had hoped that the shockwave would kill the crew of a vehicle just by penetrating the armour, but that's not the case for a bunch of physics reasons about the compressibility of air or whatever. Deafen, concuss, otherwise have a bad time, but just penetrating the armour alone does not do anything, there needs to be a behind armour effect, caused by something important/flammable getting hit.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:04
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Btw, Achzarit has a completely different back end, while that very much looks like a Namer's door and ramp (different lights though). Also...I wonder how anyone survived that unless it was pretty much empty at the time.
Ardennes has issued a correction as of 03:29 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:08
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I had a friend who swore he saw a documentary while not entirely sober that claimed the crew got turned into soup and blasted through the exit hole. He never could find it back and it seemed so unreasonable a death. Like, you're dead, but you're also a Jackson Pollock painting. I'll pass on the good news. e: should probably spoiler the textual gore Leandros has issued a correction as of 03:15 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:09
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Leandros posted:I imagine that the main shockwave does not in fact contribute that much as it is going much faster than the copper, so its gone by the time the armour is penetrated. Could be wrong. FF already detailed it a lot but you are right, its not really the pressure wave that does damage. its the remainder of the projectile itself depending on the type, the superheated metal if its that kind of round, and then the spalling from the tank itself flying around the inside that causes crew members injuries/death. so for modern tanks like the merkava its designed to minimize that so that's why many of these tank kills might not be actually killing everyone inside it depending on exactly where and how it gets hit. the tank itself might burn but the crew may escape with their lives or even unharmed depending on the exact nature of the hit taken. or they get unlucky and everyone has a very bad day cause it just nails the crew area. spalling has always been one of the primary dangers for tank crew members goigng all the way to the start, hence WWI tankers wearing these because even bullets hitting the tank might cause bits to fly around 
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Dec 12, 2023 03:16
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Willa Rogers posted:the videos he mentions (and I've watched the ones I could find) are heartening, not triggers for PTSD. I remember seeing youtube video recommendations popping up from the Ukraine war with titles that evoked a certain disgust from me. It might just be my bias regarding this conflict, but like Willa, i feel a sense of hope when i read Al-saqr's descriptions of whats being posted out there. There seems to be something different about the way that Hamas and Hezbollah have being engaging with the media vs what Ukraine has been doing.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:18
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Willa Rogers posted:I'm such a wuss I can't even watch the videos of injured children. I can't even read the replies to the Al Qassam videos lest I'm not prepared to see what's in them. same with the kids thing. sometimes i see an image in the replies of something on twitter and i quickly scroll past. gimmie the pew-pew tho
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Dec 12, 2023 03:18
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Al-Saqr posted:--- 🔻🔻 tone neutral announcement 🔻🔻🔻 lol this is what we're having a struggle session about?
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Dec 12, 2023 03:20
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i am fine with cfombat footage not being posted here, you can go find it all over the internet. thank you.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:21
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The hope with sabot rounds that the spalling would create enough of an effect to take out at least one crew member, forcing a bail. That said, a large part of that is the "lightning" war thinking behind NATO, you only have to worry about a 2-3 week war. If a tank gets hit with a sabot and at least seriously wounds a crew member, it is as good as a kill because the war will be over by the time it could be fixed. The problem is naturally a more protracted conflict when the other side takes that vehicle back, repairs it, and puts it back into action. As far HEAT warheads are concerned, arguably two things are happening: the shock of the hit and the spalling from it in a localized area, but also the plasma and heated debris from the kinetic hit (i.e the now superheated liner) potentially entering the crew compartment. Ardennes has issued a correction as of 03:30 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:25
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It did create a bit of historical trivia that is the difference between a World War 2 "fan" and someone who does a bit of reading. The armour of the Tiger II and Panther was really impressive at the end of the war, right? So the pathetic Soviets and Western Allies showed their backwardness in the face of mighty Germany technology etc etc. Only, being built by slave labour, their welds were not very good at all, and had a tendency to break, and more importantly the metal quality of German armour plate itself declined dramatically towards the end of 1944. As a result, while the German armour was thick, and this is why people are always yelling at people who make WW2 video games to make it better, because theoretically no Allied tank guns in service could defeat it at certain ranges, in reality just being hit sufficiently hard would cause the welds to break and pieces of armour to fly around the inside of the tank. So, you know, Nazis are bad at war. The M113s Israel previously used (and are starting to appear again) had aluminum alloy armour, which is great at saving weight and has pretty good protective qualities, but also has a tendency to melt. e: Seeing melted down US vehicles in the Gulf War may have had a psychological effect on Timmothy McVeigh, if I'm remembering correctly? Frosted Flake has issued a correction as of 03:28 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:26
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https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1734385498611663152?t=BtHeMA40M1GowZ3sunqYLQ&s=19 Apparently it's in flames. Based in where it loaded, it's probably a palm oil tanker
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Dec 12, 2023 03:27
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lobster shirt posted:i am fine with cfombat footage not being posted here, you can go find it all over the internet. thank you. It's not being posted, linked to or embedded, except in that one poster's imagination.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:29
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A weird psychological thing how we're ok with bombing footage which probably has massively more death into it but if you push the camera a bit closer suddenly we're not OK with it. CNN exploited this for years.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:30
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ughhhh posted:I remember seeing youtube video recommendations popping up from the Ukraine war with titles that evoked a certain disgust from me. It might just be my bias regarding this conflict, but like Willa, i feel a sense of hope when i read Al-saqr's descriptions of whats being posted out there. There seems to be something different about the way that Hamas and Hezbollah have being engaging with the media vs what Ukraine has been doing. cause its 2 countries shoveling men into a meatgrinder over geopolitcal poo poo. And in Mariupol for instance it was just horrible people on both sides. Azov nazis fighting Wagner nazis who were backed up by Kadyrovs butchers. And now its just conscripts from both countries that would rather be living their lives getting blown the gently caress up in the snow. There's no hope found in watching young and old men die over where the border of Ukraine is. Hamas is fighting for their freedom against an oppressing power. I don't rejoice in any of the deaths, but Israelis know what they are signing up for and if the Taylor Swift Facts lady can have the chutzpah to refuse to do her service, so can the rest of them. So if they get loving RPG'd by being morons out in the open im not shedding any tears and im glad that its a few less soldiers that are committing war crimes daily.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:31
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apatheticman posted:A weird psychological thing how we're ok with bombing footage which probably has massively more death into it but if you push the camera a bit closer suddenly we're not OK with it. I think the problem is creating a definite rule. The GBS thread was criticized (for good reason) for having people become addicted to videos of Russian troops being blown up and on fire, and the no-gore rule came from it. The issue is how far you can push it to the line. Can you show drone footage about a second away from impact? etc
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Dec 12, 2023 03:35
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Ardennes posted:I think the problem is creating a definite rule. The GBS thread was criticized (for good reason) for having people become addicted to videos of Russian troops being blown up and on fire, and the no-gore rule came from it. lmao at the nazi fund drive for gang tags
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Dec 12, 2023 03:37
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apatheticman posted:A weird psychological thing how we're ok with bombing footage which probably has massively more death into it but if you push the camera a bit closer suddenly we're not OK with it. I agree. I was just about to post this. I seriously get concerned and have flashbacks from watching people post and analyze and discuss in great detail the missile that hit al-Ahli Hospital. People were instantly killed when that hit. Westerners (me included) are taught to be fine with mass death through TV, movies, loving statistics themselves, and the news. But it is worth exploring if showing any actual combat footage at all is a form of gore porn.
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Dec 12, 2023 03:41
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Regarding WW2 shock and spalling, weren't the heaviest assault guns/SPGs like the SU-152 capable of knocking out tanks without any direct penetration?
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Dec 12, 2023 03:42
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WoodrowSkillson posted:cause its 2 countries shoveling men into a meatgrinder over geopolitcal poo poo. And in Mariupol for instance it was just horrible people on both sides. Azov nazis fighting Wagner nazis who were backed up by Kadyrovs butchers. lol Wagner Nazis and Kadyrov butchers were they even in Mariupol
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Dec 12, 2023 03:46
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edit: vid is from 2016, disregard https://twitter.com/shippingscope/status/1734352127240130724 Burn Zone has issued a correction as of 07:29 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:51
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wtf why didn't they steal it
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Dec 12, 2023 03:53
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What is meant by Israeli ship? What kind?
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Dec 12, 2023 03:54
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crepeface posted:lol Wagner Nazis and Kadyrov butchers Wasn't kadyrov driving the Azovstal pow bus
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Dec 12, 2023 03:56
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crepeface posted:lol Wagner Nazis and Kadyrov butchers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sdKN0Iofk8 there is a reason so many more civilians died in mariupol compared to the rest of the war. Azov prevented them from leaving and used them as human shields, and then Kadyrov's men pulled an Israel and would just blow up the whole building and kill everyone, Culminating in the Avozstal steel plant siege. WoodrowSkillson has issued a correction as of 03:59 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 03:56
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https://twitter.com/AlHaqiqaNews1/status/1734360064419357180 this footage seems to be longer
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Dec 12, 2023 03:57
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lol at the song kicking in at the end
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Dec 12, 2023 03:58
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Urgent Reuters from the British Maritime Trade Office: A fire was recorded on board a ship in the vicinity of Bab al-Mandab, west of the Yemeni port of Mokha
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Dec 12, 2023 03:59
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i say swears online posted:wtf why didn't they steal it escallation
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Dec 12, 2023 03:59
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I said come in! posted:Urgent Reuters from the British Maritime Trade Office: A fire was recorded on board a ship in the vicinity of Bab al-Mandab, west of the Yemeni port of Mokha sounds like some bab news
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Dec 12, 2023 03:59
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apatheticman posted:A weird psychological thing how we're ok with bombing footage which probably has massively more death into it but if you push the camera a bit closer suddenly we're not OK with it. Shock and awe.
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Dec 12, 2023 04:00
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What were the results of using IEDs against Abrams tanks in Iraq/Afghanistan? Was there any real success rate?
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Dec 12, 2023 04:00
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Leandros posted:Wasn't kadyrov driving the Azovstal pow bus WoodrowSkillson posted:
he evacuated them quote:there is a reason so many more civilians died in mariupol compared to the rest of the war. Azov prevented them from leaving and used them as human shields, and then Kadyrov's men pulled an Israel and would just blow up the whole building and kill everyone, Culminating in the Avozstal steel plant siege. which was it, a siege or did they blow it up and kill everyone? crepeface has issued a correction as of 04:05 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 04:03
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Willa Rogers posted:I'm such a wuss I can't even watch the videos of injured children. I can't even read the replies to the Al Qassam videos lest I'm not prepared to see what's in them. Wish more people were as sensitive and avoidant as you, no sarcasm.
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Dec 12, 2023 04:03
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briny deep to israel long walk off a short pier to israel davy jones locker to israel
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Dec 12, 2023 04:04
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here is an article on the likely ship attack: https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/commercial-ship-in-flames-after-red-sea-missile-attack norway-flagged chemical tanker
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Dec 12, 2023 04:04
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crepeface posted:he evacuated them yes, from Azovstal since Azov's braggadocio ended there. Mariupol saw some of the most intense city fighting of the war and is very reminiscent of Gaza in how building after building is just flattened or destroyed. Im not sure why you seem to want to defend loving Kadyrov lmao https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/28/mariupol-before-and-after-updated-google-maps-reveal-destruction-in-ukraine-city
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Dec 12, 2023 04:05
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i say swears online posted:wtf why didn't they steal it from photos of it, there doesn't seem to be enough space to land a helicopter anywhere on the deck and the only way to board it would be to repel up one of the sides e: https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels/details/9330771 also this page on it features the phrase "ARMS GUARDS ONBD"
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Dec 12, 2023 04:05
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WoodrowSkillson posted:yes, from Azovstal since Azov's braggadocio ended there. Mariupol saw some of the most intense city fighting of the war and is very reminiscent of Gaza in how building after building is just flattened or destroyed. Im not sure why you seem to want to defend loving Kadyrov lmao he's a good bus driver. very nice to evac them. edit: azov is the occupying force oppressing the people of Mariupol, even by your own admission of human shields. comparing a military conflict between state level actors to bombing a people who have lived under oppression for 70 years is asinine. edit 2: ill take it to the ukraine thread to stop making GBS threads up this one crepeface has issued a correction as of 04:13 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 04:06
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lobster shirt posted:here is an article on the likely ship attack: https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/commercial-ship-in-flames-after-red-sea-missile-attack Update: 8:33 PM Eastern - We received additional information about what struck the ship as well as the location of the attack. The Strinda was hit by a land-based cruise missile about 60 nautical miles north of the Bab el-Mandab. No one was injured in the attack and no U.S. vessels were near it when the attack occurred, a U.S. official tells us. nobody was hurt!
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Dec 12, 2023 04:08
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