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Anyway there's a QB from the University of Washington the Seahawks should snag as their starter next season and that's Jake Browning 
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Dec 12, 2023 04:08
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Lifespan posted:Wilson wasn't exactly incredible in the two SB years, but good enough with a great team around him. Yes, Russell was incredible immediately. His rookie season he had a passer rating over 100 with 26 pass tds and 10 interceptions. The only part of his stats that wasn’t incredible were total pass yards per game and that’s partially due to the low-scoring, grind the clock, run the ball game plan. Carroll was 15-19 before Russell Wilson, 113-60-1 with Wilson and 15-16 since trading him. So basically, 30-35 when Carroll doesn’t have the peak LOB defense and Marshawn Lynch or Wilson’s best years. I don’t know why Seahawks fans have such a hard time admitting that Wilson was a fantastic franchise quarterback.
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Dec 12, 2023 05:54
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Geno is probably, overall, an above average qb and technically what Seattle is paying is a roughly fair market deal for Geno. But ultimately that’s a trap. A team isn’t going to reliably make repeated deep playoff runs with less than elite quarterbacks unless you have a coach like McVay or Shanahan or Bill Belichick.
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Dec 12, 2023 05:59
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Nervous posted:The Geno contract was fine. Our boy earned it last year even if it was a flash in the pan. The NFL is suddenly shockingly light on "quarterbacks who aren't an unspeakable embarrassment to everyone around them" and in that light paying Geno is fine He's a very middle of the pack QB, and the right team can do really well with that I think he's at least better than Jimmy fwiw
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Dec 12, 2023 06:01
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We cannot allow the Green Bay Packers to make the playoffs this is a travesty. It is the solemn duty of either the Seahawks or the Rams to displace them. (it's going to have to be the Rams)
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Dec 12, 2023 06:17
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DancingMachine posted:We cannot allow the Green Bay Packers to make the playoffs this is a travesty. It is the solemn duty of either the Seahawks or the Rams to displace them. (it's going to have to be the Rams) Of course we can; if the Packers don't make the playoffs, how can we laugh at them for being knocked out of the first round in hilarious fashion?
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Dec 12, 2023 06:23
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Coldforge posted:Of course we can; if the Packers don't make the playoffs, how can we laugh at them for being knocked out of the first round in hilarious fashion? Don't tempt Xort...
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Dec 12, 2023 06:46
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Ornery and Hornery posted:Carroll was 15-19 before Russell Wilson, 113-60-1 with Wilson and 15-16 since trading him. So basically, 30-35 when Carroll doesn’t have the peak LOB defense and Marshawn Lynch or Wilson’s best years. I don’t know why Seahawks fans have such a hard time admitting that Wilson was a fantastic franchise quarterback. Russ holds all the franchise records at QB (at least for 16 game seasons). He was the best QB in franchise history, Hasselbeck doesn't even scratch him. He also is on the wrong side of 30, was showing some signs of decline in his last 2 seasons. To say that the Seahawks would be good with him now isn't really saying anything considering Russ would have a giant question mark at left tackle. Geno has a better QBR than him this season. It was absolutely the right move to trade him, and as mentioned the only move because he wanted out and didn't want to play for us.
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Dec 12, 2023 06:47
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Ornery and Hornery posted:Yes, Russell was incredible immediately. His rookie season he had a passer rating over 100 with 26 pass tds and 10 interceptions. The only part of his stats that wasn’t incredible were total pass yards per game and that’s partially due to the low-scoring, grind the clock, run the ball game plan. Are you serious? As a Seahawks fan I am willing to say that he was probably the best QB in Seahawks history, but 26/10 is definitely not "incredible" and you can't claim he carried the LOB to multiple SB appearances. He actually got better as the LOB started to disband, but it wasn't enough. Wilson was great for the team but he wasn't the lone catalyst for their success.
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Dec 12, 2023 07:19
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seiferguy posted:Cross, Mafe and Witherspoon will all contribute long term to this team. Witherspoon in particular will be pissing off rival NFC West fans for years to come.
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Dec 12, 2023 07:30
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wilson was very good in his prime but there is simply no reality where the smarter move was to keep him. he’s 35 and he’s not showing signs of having some baffling brady-like longevity. if you keep him, most of the coaching staff has to go and you’re probably in full blown rebuild mode and looking at a few years of having a pretty lovely record while everyone settles in while he’s getting even worse and then probably demands a trade a year or two in anyways because he thinks he’s still the greatest and can put up all the numbers if someone would just listen to him
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Dec 12, 2023 07:31
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Lifespan posted:Are you serious? As a Seahawks fan I am willing to say that he was probably the best QB in Seahawks history, but 26/10 is definitely not "incredible" and you can't claim he carried the LOB to multiple SB appearances. He actually got better as the LOB started to disband, but it wasn't enough. Wilson was great for the team but he wasn't the lone catalyst for their success. 26 passing TDs was tied for 9th best in the 2012 season. He had the second highest TD%, behind Aaron Rodgers. Getting those stats with such a Pete Carroll style offense is indeed incredible for a rookie. And of course that’s saying nothing of the 500 rushing yards and 4 rushing TDs. I’m not claiming he carried the LOB. I’m saying that he clearly was a major contributor and a major catalyst to the win rate of Seattle over a stretch of time. Even after the LOB was gone Seattle kept winning at a decent rate. Because having an elite quarterback is just that important. Ornery and Hornery fucked around with this message at 07:48 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 07:40
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seiferguy posted:To say that the Seahawks would be good with him now isn't really saying anything considering Russ would have a giant question mark at left tackle. Geno has a better QBR than him this season. It was absolutely the right move to trade him, and as mentioned the only move because he wanted out and didn't want to play for us. I never claimed that Seattle would be better now if they had Russ rather than Geno + Charles Cross (and other trade components). While we must acknowledge that Geno has played 1 game less than Russ…2023 Russ is better than 2023 Geno in:
Two areas where Geno has better production than Russ: 1) more yards and 2) much better sack rate.
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Dec 12, 2023 07:47
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holefoods posted:wilson was very good in his prime but there is simply no reality where the smarter move was to keep him. he’s 35 and he’s not showing signs of having some baffling brady-like longevity. if you keep him, most of the coaching staff has to go and you’re probably in full blown rebuild mode and looking at a few years of having a pretty lovely record while everyone settles in while he’s getting even worse and then probably demands a trade a year or two in anyways because he thinks he’s still the greatest and can put up all the numbers if someone would just listen to him The smart move would, in fact, have been firing Pete and John. Doing a full rebuild is better than whatever this season is. Trading a future second for a partial season rental of a good but not great DL in their 30s? Ignoring IOL again? The same drat scheme issues that have been here since Pete took the job? The hawks have the same chance of a deep playoff run now that they would have had with a rebuild: zero. In addition, Russ has had a better 2023 than Geno, with worse supporting talent. Which is nuts because Russ does look at least partially cooked. And despite the huge compensation to get a clearly declining Wilson, in cap space and picks, the Broncos have more wins than Seattle. The reason is that Sean Payton is a really good coach. Pete is not. Also, Geno is just 2 years younger than Russ.
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Dec 12, 2023 07:54
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I am here 2 post
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Dec 12, 2023 07:57
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tired: trading russ wired: firing pete & john inspired: both
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Dec 12, 2023 10:00
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mllaneza posted:Witherspoon in particular will be pissing off rival NFC West fans for years to come. Love a CB willing to suplex a dude.
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Dec 12, 2023 10:55
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RW was a great qb and the best in franchise history. He also wanted out. The team itself was also losing their trust in him. They were addressing reports of division in the locker room since 2014. Anyone can easily say that the correct move was to fire PC/JS because we don't know what the outcome would've been from that move. Regardless of what direction they went, the Seahawks were going to tank and were in need of rebuilding. I don't remember if someone posted it here, but they were right when they said the Patriots dynasty broke peoples' brains WRT what to expect from teams and longevity.
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Dec 12, 2023 14:13
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Ornery and Hornery posted:The smart move would, in fact, have been firing Pete and John. Doing a full rebuild is better than whatever this season is. Trading a future second for a partial season rental of a good but not great DL in their 30s? Ignoring IOL again? The same drat scheme issues that have been here since Pete took the job? The hawks have the same chance of a deep playoff run now that they would have had with a rebuild: zero. What supporting cast does Russ have if he's still here? His receiving corps would still be Metcalf and Lockette, but then his TEs are Will Dissly and Colby Parkinson, who are not anything special. The team probably doesn't get JSN without two 1st round picks. Our not great defense loses at least 2 key players. You're saying we need to rebuild, which is fine, but Russ is not even close to the player he was to make up the difference between that lack of talent that he was doing post LOB dissolution. Sean Payton has as many SB wins as Pete. Pete took a battered team to the playoffs last year and so far has only missed the playoffs twice in his tenure (looking to be a third time probably). Payton also had an arguably better QB who carried him in NO with Drew Brees. He's better than Hackett but literally anyone coach would be lol. This season already felt like a soft rebuild similar to the 2011 season where the team has competitive games but still is missing some key talent. While the Williams trade isn't working out, I don't hate a team trying to augment especially considering they were 6-3 at the time because I'd rather have a coach go for it instead of just hoping next year might be the year.
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Dec 12, 2023 14:54
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Yeah, things would be dire if the Russ trade didn't happen. Even if he just stayed at his performance level and salary from his last season here, the team would not have had good draft picks and little cap space. Awful OL, likely pretty weak at RB, etc. The trade was good, but it was also needed because Pete and John like to give away draft picks freely.
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Dec 12, 2023 17:25
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Lifespan posted:Yeah, things would be dire if the Russ trade didn't happen. Even if he just stayed at his performance level and salary from his last season here, the team would not have had good draft picks and little cap space. Awful OL, likely pretty weak at RB, etc. The trade was good, but it was also needed because Pete and John like to give away draft picks freely. Always draft RBs with your best picks.
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Dec 12, 2023 17:44
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its all nice on rice posted:RW was a great qb and the best in franchise history. He also wanted out. The team itself was also losing their trust in him. They were addressing reports of division in the locker room since 2014. Imo It’s not 20/20 to say that Pete and John sucked. By the time they traded Russ we had a decade of data on them and the majority of it was bad. And my issue is that with PCJS they explicitly are not tanking or rebuilding. They just keep patching holes inefficiently. I do agree that the Pats broke public perception of what success in the nfl is, realistically.
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Dec 12, 2023 17:56
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Trading RW was absolutely the correct move because he is an annoying little hobbit and he and kermit belong together.
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Dec 12, 2023 18:11
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The pace at which Russ went from "HoF first ballot no doubt!" to "Probably eventually the HoF" to "He was an okay QB" is impressive.
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Dec 12, 2023 18:47
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seiferguy posted:Sean Payton has as many SB wins as Pete. Pete took a battered team to the playoffs last year and so far has only missed the playoffs twice in his tenure (looking to be a third time probably). Payton also had an arguably better QB who carried him in NO with Drew Brees. He's better than Hackett but literally anyone coach would be lol. Pete didn’t “take” a battered team to the playoffs. A statistically unsustainable performance from the QB combined with hilarious faltering of the NFC competition meant that Seattle sneaked into expanded playoffs. Almost half of the NFC makes the playoffs every year. It’s not like Pete is out scheming other teams or crafting some brilliant game plan. This also feels like it dramatically undervalues Sean by reducing it to rings. Sean with the Saints had solid playoff runs, with good teams, and great strategies. Two of the games that ended saint playoff runs had spectacular and controversial final plays. If Sean had literally one of the best defenses ever for 3.5 seasons like Pete I bet he’d have some good success too. It’s also really undervaluing the adjustments Sean did to help an aging Brees produce for the last few years of Brees’s career. Drew’s arm was goooone and yet the offense still clicked. Then, immediately after, Sean turned the next man up into a decent starting quarterback. And to your point, it is true that Pete has only missed the playoffs twice in his tenure. As I noted earlier, Pete also only has career winning records with Russel Wilson. Pre Wilson he had a below 500 W/L and post Wilson he has a below 500 W/L. Much of his making the playoff is due to having an elite QB and relatively weak competition. And Pete’s only won 2 playoff games since the end of the LOB era. That’s since 2015! seiferguy posted:This season already felt like a soft rebuild similar to the 2011 season where the team has competitive games but still is missing some key talent. While the Williams trade isn't working out, I don't hate a team trying to augment especially considering they were 6-3 at the time because I'd rather have a coach go for it instead of just hoping next year might be the year. And the off-season narrative that the 2022 team was positioned like the 2011 team and thus ready to take the next step towards building a champion was always incorrect and unrealistic.
There has been a constant narrative that because Pete teams generally are on the right side of .500, that they are so close to becoming contenders again!!! And that’s not true. The roster is flawed and the game strategies are flawed.
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Dec 12, 2023 19:34
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Mustached Demon posted:Always draft RBs with your best picks. Finally, somebody talking sense in here! Edit: upon review of 2024 draft boards, this looks like a really weak RB class. That will not dissuade those with hearts of courage from drafting RBs early and often. Ornery and Hornery fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Dec 12, 2023 |
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Dec 12, 2023 19:35
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This guy really hates the winningest coach in seahawks history. Show us where Pete beat your college team.
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Dec 12, 2023 19:47
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Ornery and Hornery posted:Finally, somebody talking sense in here! Either RBs or OL!
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Dec 12, 2023 19:47
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Ornery and Hornery posted:There has been a constant narrative that because Pete teams generally are on the right side of .500, that they are so close to becoming contenders again!!! And that’s not true. The roster is flawed and the game strategies are flawed. I more or less get where you're coming from, but a flawed team on the right side of .500 *is* close to being a contender - you really only need one good offseason to get over that hump. I think it's totally fair to criticize Carroll for not getting them out of that zone despite always being so close, but he's still managed to keep them there with a declining Wilson and Geno Smith at QB.
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Dec 12, 2023 19:54
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its all nice on rice posted:This guy really hates the winningest coach in seahawks history. My college team is UW so Pete beat them a lot
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Dec 12, 2023 20:03
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Ornery and Hornery posted:My college team is UW so Pete beat them a lot USC has kind of been a perennial disappointment ever since he left.
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Dec 12, 2023 20:18
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Ornery and Hornery posted:And to your point, it is true that Pete has only missed the playoffs twice in his tenure. As I noted earlier, Pete also only has career winning records with Russel Wilson. Pre Wilson he had a below 500 W/L and post Wilson he has a below 500 W/L. Much of his making the playoff is due to having an elite QB and relatively weak competition. And Pete’s only won 2 playoff games since the end of the LOB era. That’s since 2015! hey how many playoff games has sean payton won since 2015 out of curiosity
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Dec 12, 2023 20:33
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Ornery and Hornery posted:Pete didn’t “take” a battered team to the playoffs. A statistically unsustainable performance from the QB combined with hilarious faltering of the NFC competition meant that Seattle sneaked into expanded playoffs. Almost half of the NFC makes the playoffs every year. It’s not like Pete is out scheming other teams or crafting some brilliant game plan. Pete's a secondary and special teams guy. He's never been about brilliant game plans, his thing has always been physical and violent technique. It's what makes playing the Seahawks twice a year so frustrating; the players are out there every game trying to hurt their opponent, and it's very effective when combined with good technique (which it usually is). You're going to miss that when it's gone.
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Dec 12, 2023 20:44
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All those words I am absolutely not going to read are going to look real silly when the Hawks run the table and go on a playoff run watching football is fun and I want to watch more football, let's fuckin go
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Dec 12, 2023 21:50
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shirts and skins posted:All those words I am absolutely not going to read are going to look real silly when the Hawks run the table and go on a playoff run I'd enjoy the gently caress out of a Seahawk-Cowboy matchup where the Seahawks win.
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Dec 12, 2023 22:09
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Mustached Demon posted:I'd enjoy the gently caress out of a Seahawk-Cowboy matchup where the Seahawks win. Same, my friend
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Dec 12, 2023 22:10
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I lament a lot about the Hawks being bad but I've made peace with them never getting to a Super Bowl again and I'm happy I got to see them win one in my lifetime.
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Dec 12, 2023 22:11
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Manoueverable posted:I lament a lot about the Hawks being bad but I've made peace with them never getting to a Super Bowl again and I'm happy I got to see them win one in my lifetime. Brother they've been 3 times in your lifetime. While I've made peace they won't go again with this front office or coaching staff things will change and they'll get another shot, otherwise what's the loving point of watching any of this
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Dec 13, 2023 00:16
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I enjoy football games. I don't need there to be a future superbowl in order to enjoy a good game.
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Dec 13, 2023 00:32
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It would be nice if Pete announced his retirement and designated a successor. Seems like good head coaches are hard to find though. John Schneider though -I wish I could find the article again, but it was a writeup about how he drafts for "Swag" It was his primary consideration. With him in charge, the Seahawks will never win a playoff game again. Leperflesh posted:I enjoy football games. I don't need there to be a future superbowl in order to enjoy a good game. Merry football everyone!
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Dec 13, 2023 01:16
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