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Of loving course this dude is the one who claims Russia is protecting Russian-speakers and the Jewish from Nazi Ukraine. Of loving course. And his fans will no doubt relish the hypocrisy. My best friend can't wrap his head around why anybody looks up to Russia. His family is from China and he half understands that for them 'They're the same people and need to be one country even if it's by force' makes sense back home. But why would Americans or Germans do it? He points out all these statistics that he looks up comparing Russia with the US. Russia has a weaker army. Weaker economy and no massive private enterprises on the same scale. Lower life expectancy. State-controlled religion (not even a a religion-controlled state). And far fewer freedoms by any metric. Yet you have people saying it's this unstoppable juggernaut we must submit to, soon to surpass us due to the New Silk Road (this is an actual claim I've heard many times), that it's the delinquents dying and that's actually a good thing, that they're the religious land the founding fathers actually envisioned (another claim I've heard), and that it's more free actually (because you can throw paint at gay people I guess?) I keep trying to tell him it's emotions, man. Same emotions they claim we're blinded by.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:05
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A part of it is the legacy of Soviet Union and the fact that Russia(n speaking empire) was at one point in time a legitimate rival and alternative to United States, even if that point was more than 30 years in the past. You would think it is an ancient history, but folks in their 50s and older still remember and often genuinely can't comprehend that current Russia isn't even a shadow of it's former self and the idea of it rivaling United States (heck, or even European Union) is laughable. And a part of it is that the one thing modern Russia is legitimately good at is the spreading of propaganda and disinfo campaigns that paint Russia not only as a country that (still) matters, but as one of the good ones fighting against evil West and it's woke fascism. You can directly trace a truly staggering amount of brainrot, especially in Eastern Europe, to various "alternative" channels and news sources that are pretty transparently funded by Russia. And finally, a part of it is people being legitimately dumb and wishfully thinking that the wild leopard that is currently mauling their neighbor won't come and maul them once he finishes, but will instead go and maul whoever they point at.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:56
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Bright Bart posted:I was going to say it seems wild, but not unexpected, that doing this doesn't automatically exclude you from the Sejm. And was wondering whether the difficulty in punishing a sitting member is a holdover from Communism or a reaction to it. As far as I understand, the key here is wether the transgression was an actual crime - in this case, assault - or a civil issue between two people. Here there was a physical assault on another person that Braun committed by spraying another person directly in their face. This is automatically prosecuted, without the need to be reported by any of the peole involved. I’m not sure extinguishing the menorah is a crime under Polish law - protecting religion is commonly understood here as protecting the Catholic church exclusively.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:14
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Yeah. That's something not just television but even journalists get wrong with phrases like 'The woman who was assaulted decided not to press charges.' You don't make that decision. You can talk to the cops and see if they can leave things alone. You can claim you don't remember anything. But you don't decide to bring charges. That's a prosecutor or other appointed/elected functionary. You can't even veto it if they decide to do so. That's partly why you can get the situation where the victim gives testimony defending the person on trial. You actually gave me some things to think about! -- The leopard situation might apply to e.g. Slovakia. Or even to radical pockets of Germany. With the USA it's, to me, more like Russia is an overlarge wolf going absolutely nuts on other forest animals from tiny bunnies to adult moose. The US is a full-grown grizzly. But parts of it think it's a tiny black bear cub (because woke and women in the military and Obama and the wealth tax etc. etc.) So parts of it think we need a deal with Russia to team up against the hunter China, even if that means letting animals the bears have promised to stand with be wolf food. Then, other times, those same parts of the bear sees itself as a mighty polar bear. And then it only makes sense to ally with the wolf, who it sees as a GoT direwolf thing. Bright Bart fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Dec 13, 2023 |
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Dec 13, 2023 15:34
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Bright Bart posted:I was going to say it seems wild, but not unexpected, that doing this doesn't automatically exclude you from the Sejm. And was wondering whether the difficulty in punishing a sitting member is a holdover from Communism or a reaction to it. It's one of those protections like you see in judiciary that might seem really generous, but kind of have to be to prevent abuse. Like, imagine you could just banish an MP for that, with some seemingly reasonable precautions like getting a parliamentary majority on the motion. It's great in reasonable circumstances, but then imagine Ziobro just being able to do that on a whim for the past 8 years, given both voting power and general legal bullshit of PiS. It would be a complete disaster and, for better or worse, it just has be gated by a bunch of hoops to jump to ensure it's some real, no bullshit, near-unanimous decision. Thankfully, Braun is no stranger to losing immunity and nobody likes him or his antics. Even PiS doesn't seem particularly eager to cover for him. And that's important, because they do still have sway in the prosecution and could possibly try obstructing the process of actually stripping him of the mandate, should things go that far (and since it requires a court, it's sort of independent from whatever the Sejm itself is able to dish out immediately). The only people with some stake in covering for Braun is his Konfederacja pals, but even they are stuck in a Korwin situation where they really have to run some calculations which way out of this scandal would prove costlier.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:01
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Bright Bart posted:Of loving course this dude is the one who claims Russia is protecting Russian-speakers and the Jewish from Nazi Ukraine. i think they vastly overestimate the amount of actual reality-grounded knowledge americans have about russia's internal affairs. prior to the current war it was mostly a big scary beast that hacked our elections through its insidious network of cyberninjas and buff bernie influence operations elsewhere that has more knowledge of russia likes it because russian governance is actually perceived as better than a country of residence. this is arguably actually true for kyrgyzstan, but you can maybe find some people in countries where it isn't who perceive it as such for lack of knowledge combined with their perception of their own country. americans who think the american government is an abject failure can happily paint an imaginary russia where those perceived failures are not a problem
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Dec 13, 2023 19:15
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There's actually this 'switch' hypothesis, it's hopefully not taken seriously by anyone who counts, but it's there and there are at least a couple of books written on the topic. The claim is that since the Cold War the US and Russia have switched in similar ways to the old Republican and Democratic parties did on many issues. Russia has become Reagan's America. The army takes priority. People are encouraged to become rich rather than shamed for trying. The economy takes precedence over hippie environmental nonsense. People respect authority. Children are taught to be patriotic. The flag is respected. As are elders. Women and men keep traditional roles. The church is still part of daily life. The world respects the country and its leader. The USA on the other hand has become Andropov's USSR. The army is weak. Job-creators are taxed so much they don't even bother. Economic growth is hindered by the global warming conspiracy. People spit on authority and called Trump an idiot with no shame. Children are taught critical race theory. Youth burn the US flag and fondle the Rainbow one. They also make TikTok videos being rude to retired folks. 'Women' and 'men' as concepts are both on the way out when someone born with a uterus can call themselves 'Mr. Paul Smith'. Religious persons such as Hobby Lobby and other corporations are forced to provide birth control. The world laughs at the country and its leader. Of course you're starting with the wrong pieces on the board and moving them around improperly but that's the switch. Bright Bart fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Dec 14, 2023 |
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Dec 14, 2023 20:06
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LOL at idea that anyone cared about environment in the USSR or that it wasn't socially conservative with strict gender roles. Or that modern Russians go to the church in any noticeable amount.
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Dec 14, 2023 21:56
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Bright Bart posted:'Women' and 'men' as concepts are both on the way out when someone born with a uterus can call themselves 'Mr. Paul Smith'. If you're not trying to post this as an endorsement of these views rather just explain them, you can do that without dropping some transphobia.
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Dec 14, 2023 22:16
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burnishedfume posted:If you're not trying to post this as an endorsement of these views rather just explain them, you can do that without dropping some transphobia. It is a transphobic view. I'm not sure it's transphobic to replicate here. Now I'm questioning myself. But while posting what a KKK member might call a black person is itself a form of racism, saying that the far-right tells immigrants from MENA countries 'Arabs go home!' isn't itself xenophobia (the posting that is). I thought what I wrote was more similar to the later. Leaving it up for now if mods want to see it. Might delete later. Bright Bart fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Dec 14, 2023 |
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Dec 14, 2023 22:42
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OddObserver posted:LOL at idea that anyone cared about environment in the USSR or that it wasn't socially conservative with strict gender roles. Or that modern Russians go to the church in any noticeable amount. Like I said, wrong pieces and moving them around at your convenience. My favourite part of this has to do with miniskirts. Many in the US were against them because they represented atheist communism. Many in the USSR were against them because they represented decadent capitalism. Well, politicians in these countries. Not sure how the average American or Soviet comrade felt.
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Dec 14, 2023 22:47
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Bright Bart posted:Not sure how the average American or Soviet comrade felt. Horny.
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Dec 14, 2023 23:03
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Things are moving fast today in Poland! - The Smolensk commission is no more. Despite being in power for 8 years, PiS has not managed to deliver any proof that the crash was intentional. The few interim reports it published were commonly mocked, as they included things like experiments with a can of wieners under pressure that was supposed to represent the fuselage. The commission would also languish in lavish offices around various MoD properties, hire very questionable "experts" and exist as Antoni Macierewicz's fiefdom. The wording on the closing communique makes it clear that its inner workings will be closely investigated, including money it paid to its members. - Public television is imploding - top propaganda "Wiadomosci" news anchors elected to jump ship, hoping for a quick pay out. Clauses in their contracts stipulate they can be paid over 100k EUR for their non-compete clauses, although it has already been announced that no one gives a poo poo about their competing and they'll just be released to do as they want. Meanwhile, no one wants to anchor the daily evening news and there is internal strife between the three government media camps - the TVP Info news channel, the independent daily news program "Wiadomosci" and the government news wire service TAI. Knifes out! There are still attempts to block the new government from effectively managing the media companies by board room shenanigans and even the constitutional tribunal. - Billions of EUR have been freed from the EU on Tusk's first foreign visit to Brussels, throwing the right wing into a fit. The COVID relief money was blocked due to constant breaking of the rule of law regulations and being dicks to Czechia over power plant pollution. - Weird lady responsible for the education programming in Malopolska has lost her job. Recently she claimed elementary schools in Sweden have masturbation rooms where teachers help students get off. - The police is suddenly more than happy to investigate how a parliamentarian was rough handled by cops during an antigovernmental demonstration earlier in the year - a case consequently ignored until now. Just the top of the iceberg, there's a lot going on.
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Dec 15, 2023 14:34
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Do we have any other example of a Western (you know what I mean, the term here including Australia and Japan) government admitting the state media is purposely biased in their favour but it's fine because most independent journalists criticize them so there needs to be balance? Or is Poland the first, one for the shameful records book? e: They don't even defend the state media being pro-government, they're admitting it's pro-their party. And re: state media? I'm reading on Notes From Poland that the tribunal overseeing this matter has ruled for an injunction preventing the new government from making changes to the editorial boards or overall direction of several. But that legal scholars are calling bs. Lets hope the EU can tell the difference between an illegitamate ruling by a puppet court and actually ignoring rule of law. Otherwise we might not see any more of that money. Bright Bart fucked around with this message at 07:48 on Dec 16, 2023 |
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Dec 15, 2023 14:46
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Bright Bart posted:
I think this is a pretty clear cut case - in short, it's out of the jurisdiction of the constitutional tribunal as it's not a constitutional issue, but a corporate law dispute, and the subjects of the temporary hold - that is, the state treasury that de facto owns the media and the minister of culture who manages it - cannot be censured in any way by the court as they are not sides in any current TC proceedings. And that's ignoring the whole CT legitimacy issue(s). AFAIK the boardroom fuckery they are actually going for can cause an insignificant delay at most. It's a done deal - if it wasn't, the rats wouldn't have ran away.
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Dec 15, 2023 15:29
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The party funding one gazillion lovely right-wing newspapers ran by their cronies: there are no other media ready to represent us.
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Dec 15, 2023 17:45
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Mokotow posted:Things are moving fast today in Poland! Macierewicz disregarded this and apparently the commission is meeting today as if nothing happened.
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Dec 18, 2023 12:47
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Anne Frank Funk posted:Macierewicz disregarded this and apparently the commission is meeting today as if nothing happened. Hoping for more stellar experiments like exploding hot dogs
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Dec 18, 2023 13:52
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Dec 18, 2023 14:06
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Sejm giving out 'Christmas dinner' to the needy is okay but what would actually be super cool would be doing it on actual Christmas Eve. Forgoing your own family dinner and postponing your own present opening session to volunteer would be commendable even if it's for publicity. I mean, if one came out and explicitly said 'I'm actually doing this mostly for PR', I'd likely say right on, still doing good, might even actually be a shortfall of volunteers on the day of so it still helps. But it's on Dec 22.
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Dec 18, 2023 21:50
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Hey man, this is a catholic country - we do charity for show, not like we actually mean it whole year round. Do your szlachetna paczka or wośp and be done with it.
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Dec 18, 2023 23:30
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Oh no, Poland, your new PM is a cringe boomer tiktoker! https://www.tiktok.com/embed/7219223843351596314
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Dec 19, 2023 14:02
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Tusk is the kind of guy who is less cool the more he tries to show of himself, just like Trudeau. People really want to like them, and they're determined to stop that from happening. Bright Bart fucked around with this message at 15:05 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 15:03
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TVP Info just went off the air. PiS parliament members stormed out of the Sejm yesterday evening and spent the night in the TVP headquarters, protecting "media plurality and independence" by *checks notes* having PiS politicians take selfies in the TVP broadcast control room? In the morning PiS announced their politicians will continue to occupy state media buildings to ensure no take over by the legally elected government, but this hasn't stopped the actual broadcast signal getting turned off. TVP 1 is still on-air and has been re-transmitting TVP Info all morning, but apparently it now switched to broadcasting a historical TV series (strong Swan Lake vibes here), while TVP Info is off altogether. Meanwhile, TVP has a new board and it's members are at the TVP HQ having heated discussions with PiS politicians.
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Dec 20, 2023 12:20
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Did Orlen say they won't display any government messages at all or just those of the coalition partners as political parties? They could have said they were trying to be apolitical but they said it was because the new government is liberal; and unpatriotic iirc. Lol. Neoliberal sure. Not sure about removing that Neo though.
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Dec 20, 2023 12:35
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We have entered the clown zone. TVP has been doing partisan stream on YouTube and building is now surrounded by police
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Dec 20, 2023 16:07
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Is like to be able to explain this image to my less online Polish wife, can I have some cliff notes? Dzięki
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Dec 20, 2023 17:05
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Osmosisch posted:Is like to be able to explain this image to my less online Polish wife, can I have some cliff notes? Dzięki 1. That's the former Defense Minister - Antoni Macierewicz 2. There are many hosed up things about him, but the core one here is that he was promoting the 'Russians shot down Kaczynski in Smolensk' 3. Using sausages in simulations 4. He's requesting the plane hull (a bun) for the passengers (I think that's what the sausages were supposed to be) 5. The phrase 'Jaka parówa wariacie'/'Which sausage, dude/psycho/insert non-obvious translation here' was a meme (or maybe even a real ad campaign) for the convenience store Żabka, which also has a side-shop selling hot-dogs/coffee/etc.
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Dec 20, 2023 17:37
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I guess it’s like your mate working at the Żabka and he’s like “open wide boi” when you come to visit, only he looks like like Antoni Macierewicz just because. Also, Antoni Macierewicz likes to surround himself with pretty young boys (see Edmund Janiger, Bartlomiej Misiewicz) but I don’t think that’s related…? Or the earlier post
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Dec 20, 2023 17:39
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Mixed feelings after today. It seems that KO used pretty much the same tools to take control of TVP as PiS did a few years earlier - basically bordering on legality, or rather relying on cementing a de facto situation as the status quo. PiS created additional structures, also semi-legally, to cement its control. They usurped the Constitutional Tribunal by not recognising the right of the opposition to have its seats, and they overrode one national media council by creating another higher national media council, and because they controlled the Constitutional Tribunal they could make it say that everything was lega artis, even though it wasn't. KO is now using company law and lower level legislation that theoretically doesn't apply, but since they don't recognise the Constitutional Tribunal or the 'illegal' national media boards, they end up using exactly the same dubious regulations that PiS used to gain control a decade ago. In the end, KO gained control of TVP because the IT people were apparently in on it and took over all the feeds, plus they controlled the building access cards so that the new board members could roll in in the morning. So even though the legal basis for this is unclear, KO has de facto control over most of TVP. There is a perfectly legal way to do this, but as far as I can tell it would take at least a few months, if not years, and would be open to challenge by the illegal but de facto controlling Media Board and the Tribunal. Also, the coalition has a majority but the president has full veto power over new legislation. Again, mixed feelings. PiS is making a big song and dance about media freedom and was desperate to start a fight - they got what they wanted, as the new board member's security guard allegedly roughed up a PiS MP during the early morning tug-of-war over opening the doors to the TVP boardroom. This, combined with the gathering crowd and constant shouting, led to the TVP building being surrounded by riot police and the image being broadcast to the world.
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Dec 20, 2023 22:52
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"How many Poles does it take to change a TV station?"
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Dec 21, 2023 00:15
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I love revanchism.
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Dec 21, 2023 12:13
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There was no good answer here, but I think launching the open conflict here was more or less necessary. PiS created a bunch of these unconstitutional bodies intended to, essentially, act as a right-wing deep state that can hamstring and sabotage any non-PiS government and continue exerting power even after they lose elections. Recognizing them and engaging with their procedures would mean an impotent government perpetually bogged down in bureaucratic bickering with various PiS functionaries whom they claim to be illegitimate but still respect their decisions for some reason. It also means the beginnings of a full-on constitutional crisis, but that was always going to happen. PiS specifically made it so their stranglehold on the state apparatus couldn't be broken without a crisis. The moment the new government engages with the Constitutional Tribunal, National Media Council and so on treating them as legitimate, it's accepting that it operates in a legal order based on "the state belongs to PiS and you're just borrowing it".
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Dec 21, 2023 13:19
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It's ugly, but I think necessary in the end. The 'proper' way to handle this would take until Duda is ousted in two years to even begin thinking about all the other legal obstacles PiS had prepared and the government cannot really just sit on their asses for half of their term. I can definitely see fighting fire with fire being a somewhat uncomfortable here, because where's the point of having cleaned up for realsies this time and going back to respect the rule of law, but this was probably one of the better fights to pick - the sorry state of TVP has been universally despised by all but most devoted brainwashees and it doesn't have quite the gravitas of, say, mucking with the Supreme Court. I'd say unfucking the judiciary will be the really uncomfortable fight, but then again when PiS was pulling its bullshit it ultimately blew over in the end so what do I know. It sure helps that all the PiS squealing about it is pretty funny and the new stoic karateka director has some gigachad energy to him. It's a real meme timeline we're living in.
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Dec 21, 2023 14:16
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Meanwhile Piechocinski, a retired ex minister from the rural PSL party, spends his days slaying online with epic one liners “Poles, politicians, TVP” Janusz Piechocinski: “please note that filing your pork headcount protocol is due December 31st” (He just drops these factual tweets or one liners unrelated to nothing in particular whenever the next shitstorm hits the social media)
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Dec 21, 2023 14:43
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Xerxes17 posted:"How many Poles does it take to change a TV station?" My FiL (formerly of TVP, but not the PiS version) replied "12 million"
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Dec 21, 2023 14:55
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Mokotow posted:(He just drops these factual tweets or one liners unrelated to nothing in particular whenever the next shitstorm hits the social media) My fav was the time when Notre Dame was burning and he posted about prices of pork
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Dec 21, 2023 15:46
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Cool, a gunman just killed ten people in downtown Prague. Thank you for exporting your awesome culture, America.
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Dec 21, 2023 17:57
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steinrokkan posted:Cool, a gunman just killed ten people in downtown Prague. Thank you for exporting your awesome culture, America. They are saying 15 already plus a couple yesterday that apparently was the same dude who did it. I'm out of the country for the week and going back soon, love having to message everyone to figure out if they are safe 
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Dec 21, 2023 18:21
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theghostpt posted:They are saying 15 already plus a couple yesterday that apparently was the same dude who did it. I'm out of the country for the week and going back soon, love having to message everyone to figure out if they are safe It's terrible, I hope everybody is fine. I took some lectures at the Faculty in my day, but seems nobody I know was nearby at the time.
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Dec 21, 2023 18:54
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