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lines posted:I assume Ncuti also had some level of influence over how he was dressed possibly lol  
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Dec 13, 2023 10:51
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TIP posted:possibly lol Man knows what he has, I can't fault it!
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Dec 13, 2023 11:03
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MikeJF posted:See, like I said, from my point of view it makes more sense for Ncuti to be underdressed: Tennant's doctor is both literally and metaphorically tightly buttoned up, which is the whole problem that they're emphasising at that moment. Ncuti is free and easy. He's comfortable. This was my read as well
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Dec 13, 2023 11:04
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Huh, I just realized this will be the first time the current Doctor will be younger than I am. Not sure how to feel about this information. The 14 specials and the upcoming start of Gatwa’s era have kind of reinvigorated my love of the show, so this past weekend I finally decided to dive back into the classic run for the first time in years. For a long time there’ve been two McCoy stories I deliberately avoided watching; Time and the Rani & Paradise Towers. Partly because their general reputation is either pretty mixed or poor, but also because I feel bittersweet about actually completing the McCoy era since he’s arguably my favorite Doctor. In any case, I watched Paradise Towers and… it was decent! Fine even! Half the characters were terrible, the main antagonist went completely off the rails once he was possessed, and the plot is wafer-thin, but McCoy was great as always and even Mel wasn’t too bad. I’ll probably jump to Pertwee next since his era is my biggest blind spot for the classic show, but I just know some of those 6/7/8-parters are going to be tough to get through unless I space them out over a whole week or something.
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Dec 13, 2023 11:08
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I've not seen much Pertwee - the main one I remember seeing is The Mutants, which is interesting but a couple of episodes too long. Too much capture and escape!
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Dec 13, 2023 11:16
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The Pertwee era was great, perhaps because it was the first Doctor Who I remember regularly watching and I was enthralled, but on my last full show rewatch it still held up well. But yes, the stories run very long and there is a LOT of repetition that didn't really stand out as much when you could only watch them the week they aired unless you were lucky enough to have a video recorder and your dad didn't want to watch the golf. I still really love the UNIT "family" as a concept, and though he was overused, you never get to see Delgado in the role again due to his untimely death so enjoy it while you can. Paradise Towers was good! It has a lot of problems that the show had around that time, but it is one of the McCoy stories I always enjoyed in spite of any flaws. Time and the Rani however.... oof.
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Dec 13, 2023 11:29
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Huh, I just realized this will be the first time the current Doctor will be younger than I am. Not sure how to feel about this information. Gatwa is the third one younger than me (Smith, Whittaker and him) and it made me VERY cynical about Smith right up until the second he first appeared on screen, and now I kind of welcome it. That the next Doctor could be anyone is part of the appeal for me now rather than just another reminder I'm getting old I reckon that McCoy is probably the Doctor that does best after their on screen tenure with what, sixty New Adventure novels, a bunch of past doctor adventures, and McCoy does a really good job with the Big Finish audios. I think he's probably the Doctor that sounds most like he did on TV, even now.
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Dec 13, 2023 11:36
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I'd say McCoy's definitely the one whose actual voice has held up the best, although I think that C.Bakes and McGann are better than him at the actual medium, so to speak. And yeah, Gatwa is the first doctor younger than me as well, but that's absolutely fine by me. Welcome, even. Bring on Woke Zoomer Doctor Who - lord knows we need it
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Dec 13, 2023 12:55
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Jerusalem posted:Paradise Towers was good! It has a lot of problems that the show had around that time, but it is one of the McCoy stories I always enjoyed in spite of any flaws. Time and the Rani however.... oof. My first Seven story was Ghost Light and to this day I STILL have no idea what the hell was going on!
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Dec 13, 2023 12:58
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PriorMarcus posted:I think Ncutti running around in his underwear was particularly glaring because Davies had gone out of his way (too far out of his way, I think) to have Tennant not wearing Jodie's outfit. Which is really silly, but shows that he's sensitives as a writer were aligned with one group but maybe not another. RTD generally means well, but as you say his particular sensitivities as a writer likely aren't very well attuned to how certain things might be perceived outside of his own particular peer group.
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Dec 13, 2023 13:09
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Barry Foster posted:And yeah, Gatwa is the first doctor younger than me as well, but that's absolutely fine by me. Welcome, even. There was a 1 sec clip in one of the recent promos showing off Gatwa all teary eyed, and I honestly can't wait to see him in action giving some big emotional speech during a pivotal scene https://i.imgur.com/SzAsuKr.mp4 I honestly can't even remember a 13 speech that was any decent 
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Dec 13, 2023 13:14
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CobiWann posted:My first Seven story was Ghost Light and to this day I STILL have no idea what the hell was going on! Ghost Light is absolutely my favorite TV story. It's so wild.
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Dec 13, 2023 13:57
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It’s peak McCoy and I might actually enjoy it more than Curse of Fenric.
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Dec 13, 2023 13:59
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Khanstant posted:The reddit OP that started this wasn't talking about the sexualization. Some commenters dismissing the OPs concerns were going on to objectify him as part of their dismissal. Being half undressed was just one of several things working together that disappointed the OP. Yeah, that was my own particular observation from reading that thread: that numerous people were saying it was perfectly ok for the first black man to play the Doctor to be running around in his underwear during his first appearance, because he was hot and fit, had a nice rear end/nice legs, etc. The op felt it was kind of undignified and clownish, and I just thought it was odd that so many replies basically thought it was ok to dismiss that concern by thirsting over Gatwa. And to address another post: no, this isn't some "prudish Yanks vs. open-minded Brits" thing here, this is about how even well-meaning writers like RTD often fall into the trap of thinking that the representation of people of different ethnic backgrounds in and of itself is enough, without necessarily considering the presentation of those characters and how it might be perceived by people of the same ethnicity.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:01
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The_Doctor posted:It’s peak McCoy and I might actually enjoy it more than Curse of Fenric. Remembrance is more fun, Fenric is more dramatic but Ghost Light is ambitious
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Dec 13, 2023 14:08
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I think they probably should have given him pants, personally. Just give him David Tennant's outfit so that when he starts properly, we can see him all starry-eyed in the closet choosing his outfit.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:11
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As a kid I was confused by Ghost Light. Now even knowing what's supposed to be happening I'm confused and delighted. Every time I forget about the two insect monsters in the basement and why they're there EVEN THOUGH I KNOW.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:11
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Fil5000 posted:As a kid I was confused by Ghost Light. Now even knowing what's supposed to be happening I'm confused and delighted. Every time I forget about the two insect monsters in the basement and why they're there EVEN THOUGH I KNOW. This is the werewolf episode for me. I've seen it a whole bunch of times watching through the early seasons but I can never remember why he's a werewolf or what he's trying to do, why the cult is helping him. I always zone out when he makes his little speech in the cave.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:25
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Bicyclops posted:This is the werewolf episode for me. I've seen it a whole bunch of times watching through the early seasons but I can never remember why he's a werewolf or what he's trying to do, why the cult is helping him. I always zone out when he makes his little speech in the cave. I assume Ghost Light's messiness comes from it originally being something else and getting rewritten at short notice. Tooth and Claw's flaws come, I assume, from RTD not having slept in a month.
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Dec 13, 2023 14:41
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Bicyclops posted:This is the werewolf episode for me. I've seen it a whole bunch of times watching through the early seasons but I can never remember why he's a werewolf or what he's trying to do, why the cult is helping him. I always zone out when he makes his little speech in the cave. He's an alien who possesses people's blood and he wants to be Queen Victoria
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Dec 13, 2023 14:51
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Jerusalem posted:Paradise Towers was good! It has a lot of problems that the show had around that time, but it is one of the McCoy stories I always enjoyed in spite of any flaws. Time and the Rani however.... oof. We need that Gillian Anderson as the Rani story that Gatwa suggested, just so that the Rani gets a story that we can unreservedly call 'good'. It'd also give me an excuse to try building a Magic the Gathering deck around her, she might genuinely be the best looking card in that whole set. 
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Dec 13, 2023 15:03
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I suspect we're not gonna get any White women cast as the Rani under RTD, unfortunately for that idea.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:06
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I wonder who's got the rights to The Rani, is it Pip and Jane's estate?
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Dec 13, 2023 15:12
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Open Source Idiom posted:I suspect we're not gonna get any White women cast as the Rani under RTD, unfortunately for that idea. Ncutti has said he wants Gillian Anderson for the role. EDIT: Oops. I've accidently looped the conversation.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:14
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Open Source Idiom posted:I suspect we're not gonna get any White women cast as the Rani under RTD, unfortunately for that idea. Let's not kid ourselves here; if Gillian Anderson said she was interested in playing The Rani for an episode or two, RTD would cast her so fast they'd start filming before the ink on the contracts was dry.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:23
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Big Mean Jerk posted:In any case, I watched Paradise Towers and… it was decent! Fine even! Half the characters were terrible, the main antagonist went completely off the rails once he was possessed, and the plot is wafer-thin, but McCoy was great as always and even Mel wasn’t too bad. It's unironically one of my favorites of the whole era, camp and all. It was blatantly an adaptation of Ballard's High-Rise with extra heavy-handed late-80s social commentary (cannibal grannies feeding off the youth!), fun robots, and a computer villain with neon bits at the top that look like something you might see on the wall of any given chichi boutique in Chelsea. And, this: quote:the main antagonist went completely off the rails once he was possessed He's doing "John Cleese as Basil Fawlty, Gumby, and Hitler all at once" and it always slays me.  He seems like he was having the time of his life doing it, and I certainly hope that was the case.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:51
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Yeah you can do a hell of a lot worse from that era than Paradise Towers.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:56
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usenet celeb 1992 posted:It's unironically one of my favorites of the whole era, camp and all. It was blatantly an adaptation of Ballard's High-Rise with extra heavy-handed late-80s social commentary (cannibal grannies feeding off the youth!), fun robots, and a computer villain with neon bits at the top that look like something you might see on the wall of any given chichi boutique in Chelsea. The main thing I remember about Paradise Towers was that the writer, Stephen Wyatt, was disappointed in the actor they chose to play Pex. The idea was that Pex was supposed to be a guy built like Schwarzenegger, a complete 1980s action movie hero type...who was also a complete coward that was ultimately redeemed by sacrificing himself at the end. Casting a guy who was decidedly not built like Arnie kind of defeated the purpose of the character, in Wyatt's view.
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Dec 13, 2023 15:58
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I think it’s funnier that that’s who Pex thinks he is, but the wrapping doesn’t match the contents.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:01
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What did people think about the brief color inserts of the Toymaker and the First Doctor when Fourteen realized who was behind the counter? I liked how it was something for the fans AND something for people who never knew about the Toymaker before - a brief flash of "oh, this guy's from the Doctor's past." Wonder if it was just to showed off the found footage or something that they might use going forward for "old" villains.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:03
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I noticed that they cut around the costume.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:05
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The_Doctor posted:I think it’s funnier that that’s who Pex thinks he is, but the wrapping doesn’t match the contents. Agree with this. In physicality and outlook he was as much a "child" as the Kangs*, it really worked overall, thematically. Plus he always looked to me a bit like Bernard Sumner out of New Order, which was perfect for the 80s vibe. * By which I don't necessarily mean any of them were 100% childish, but they were effectively all left to their own devices to raise themselves without guidance, to varying ends.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:06
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CobiWann posted:What did people think about the brief color inserts of the Toymaker and the First Doctor when Fourteen realized who was behind the counter? I thought it was fine if a little clunky. Apparently at one point they considered having David Bradley back to recreate a scene with NPH but decided against it.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:18
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The_Doctor posted:I think it’s funnier that that’s who Pex thinks he is, but the wrapping doesn’t match the contents. Yeah, but the writer of the story, who came up with the character, wasn't going for "funny", is the problem. Or at least, not the JNT version of "funny". IIRC, he intended any humor in the story to be very dark (which is why the idea of a super buff guy being a coward who runs away and leaves people in the lurch appealed to him); but the unfortunate thing is that story was made during JNT's "DW as Light Entertainment" period, before the Cartmel Masterplan had begun to take shape.
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Dec 13, 2023 16:22
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Huh, I just realized this will be the first time the current Doctor will be younger than I am. Not sure how to feel about this information. Same! Smith and Whitaker were close but now with Gatwa he's straight up just a wee boy
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Dec 13, 2023 16:33
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https://twitter.com/RadioTimes/status/1734952071827182028?s=20 This made me breathe a sigh of relief.
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Dec 13, 2023 17:00
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Cleretic posted:We need that Gillian Anderson as the Rani story that Gatwa suggested, just so that the Rani gets a story that we can unreservedly call 'good'. Haha, until now Everytime people mentioned the Rani I thought they meant the badass spider demon lady species. Who are the Racnoss, not Rani. Oops. To be honest going from thinking there was an ancient loose thread about a cool StarCraft alien species to just humans I am oblivious to, is a bit of a let down. Kept imagining how the classic production team pulled off the costumes. Oh well. Bring back the Racnoss with Gillian Anderson.
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Dec 13, 2023 17:12
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Doctor Spaceman posted:Yeah you can do a hell of a lot worse from that era than Paradise Towers. I make fun of the pool all day long, but there's a core of something in Paradise Towers that makes it one of the stronger McCoy stories.
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Dec 13, 2023 17:26
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Confusedslight posted:https://twitter.com/RadioTimes/status/1734952071827182028?s=20
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Dec 13, 2023 17:47
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Sydney Bottocks posted:Yeah, but the writer of the story, who came up with the character, wasn't going for "funny", is the problem. Or at least, not the JNT version of "funny". The "big buff muscley guy turns out to be a coward" had already been a cliche (especially in superhero comic parodies) for decades; simply through exposure to that sort of idea in, like Viz or The Beano, I think that would have just tipped it even more toward cartoonishness than "dark humor". I mean, as a wee'un I bought into the idea of Pex being a strong person the same way I bought into the flimsy sets, props, and cheap robots: "for the sake of the story". And in the end he works as a character because of the writing. And like I've said, by having him not being much different, physically, than the Kangs, it more identifies him as part of that generation and is a better complement to his vulnerability. So in this regard, at least, I think it's a case of the writer's intention coming across, even if it's not in the exact way he envisioned.
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Dec 13, 2023 17:53
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