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Sanguinia posted:What confuses me a lot more is Jimmy telling Kerrigan that she should be running away with him instead of going after Mengsk. I mean, the later part is fine, his whole arc was about giving up his need to get revenge on Mengsk, he SHOULD be encouraging Kerrigan to do the same for consistency's sake. But he also knows that she's needed to save the universe from the Hybrids. He can't run away from that, and he shouldn't be trying, especially when his big final speech in WoL was about reaffirming his commitment to fighting for higher ideals and the preservation of the galaxy. Jimmy doesn't really know what's happening, but choosing to focus on and fight Mengsk specifically is basically picking the most dangerous fight in the sector at this very moment from his perspective. Going through all the trouble to save kerrigan only for her to catch a bullet trying for revenge is basically the worst outcome. Any way she survives means that whatever she's supposed to do/know survives too. BisbyWorl posted:This is super convenient. Both because it means Kerrigan has no knowledge, and thus no narrative culpability, for her myriad of crimes, and because it lets the writers not have to explain literally anything about what she was up to in Wings. Why was she so focused on getting the artifact? Why was she suddenly okay with the end of the universe in the Prophecy missions? The world will never know. If they told you it would spoil the twist. Torchlighter fucked around with this message at 12:02 on Dec 17, 2023 |
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Dec 17, 2023 11:55
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One thing I will specify just in case some people are misunderstanding: The Umojan Protectorate is not part of the Dominion. It is its own separate sovereign "Space Nation" separate from Mengsk's Dominion. Though they did have ties to Arcturus in his early days and his time as a Rebel, relations soured after he became Emperor. Valerian has more direct ties to them however, as his mother was from Umoja, and his relations with them never soured.
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Dec 17, 2023 14:26
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The Umojan marine armor looks really cool tbh
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Dec 17, 2023 14:28
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BlazetheInferno posted:Valerian has more direct ties to them however, as his mother was from Umoja, and his relations with them never soured. umomma
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Dec 17, 2023 14:44
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I actually quite enjoy HotS from a gameplay perspective. I don't think it's as good as WoL there, but it's still a fun romp. It might help that I'm Crazy for Casters and boy does this campaign have some doozies when it comes to spellcasters. I think this campaign's version of the Infester might be the single most broken spellcaster Blizzard's ever made. It's hilariously powerful and a lot of fun. Storywise, I don't know if there's anything to be said that hasn't already been said. Except maybe that it was a weird as hell choice to say "What if Kerrigan's identity was utterly consumed by the two men in her life?" Her characterization, as we've seen even here, revolves a whole lot around "Awww, Jimmy <3" and "Grrrrr, Mengsk." I also regret that what we get here in this campaign, again, as we've seen, is somewhere between anti-hero and anti-villain. The whole "Here's a campaign where you play a full-on mustache-twirling cartoonish villain who's doing horrible things for no reason" is one of my favourite parts of Blizzard RTS games (as well as Westwood RTS games, of course). It's goofy and fun and I dunno I guess when a non-trivial part of the gameplay revolves around things like massacring workers and burning down every last stinking Supply Depot it's refreshing to be able to play as someone who doesn't do those things then pretend they're the good guys. All I'm saying is this could have been a moment where Jim says "I moved heaven and earth to bring you back, Sarah" and she says "Okay but have you considered that being evil is loving badass?"
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Dec 17, 2023 15:07
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is there ever any lore explanation, hand-wavey or otherwise, for why de-zerging kerrigan in WoL doesn't seem to have done anything in terms of removing her ability to control the zerg? was it purely an aesthetic change?
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Dec 17, 2023 15:08
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HannibalBarca posted:is there ever any lore explanation, hand-wavey or otherwise, for why de-zerging kerrigan in WoL doesn't seem to have done anything in terms of removing her ability to control the zerg? was it purely an aesthetic change? I would imagine it hasn't fully worked, she's still got the bone-growth hair replacement after all.
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Dec 17, 2023 15:13
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HannibalBarca posted:is there ever any lore explanation, hand-wavey or otherwise, for why de-zerging kerrigan in WoL doesn't seem to have done anything in terms of removing her ability to control the zerg? was it purely an aesthetic change? She can control them because she's a bonkers powerful Psychic, not because she was infested. The Confederacy was running tests on the things even before Kerrigan joined Mengsk - Mengsk isn't kidding in the first game when he says "It's clear the Confederates have known of these creatures for some time." However, I will say her history as the Queen of Blades, even if she doesn't remember it, probably helps matters. But it's not the sole factor. Small detail to remember: Every time the Adjutant describes Kerrigan as a "Class 12 Psionic"... that Psi Scale as an in-universe measurement of Psionic ability is designed to go from 1-10. She is a 12. BlazetheInferno fucked around with this message at 15:21 on Dec 17, 2023 |
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Dec 17, 2023 15:17
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Re: the bug hair, if you really wanted you could say that hair isn't really a "living part of the body" like the cells that make up your organs, so it wouldn't be changed. However... Barring some extreme closeup on the microscopic structure of her eyebrows and lashes, that looks like normal human hair so 
GunnerJ fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Dec 17, 2023 |
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Dec 17, 2023 15:23
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Just on the more mundane side of things, imagine if Kerrigan had confided in him something along the lines of “actually, Jim, I had a lot of time for self-reflection these past few years, and… I think I’m actually gay/asexual/aromantic/otherwise just fundamentally not interested in you like I was before all of this.”
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Dec 17, 2023 16:12
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I'm just going to assume Kerrigan is lying about not being able to remember her Queen of Blades days.
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Dec 17, 2023 16:28
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Remember the start of the Terran campaign, where Raynor was like "let's kick this revolution into overdrive" all movie-trailer style?
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Dec 17, 2023 16:31
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You’re going to have to be more specific, that’s like all of WoL’s cutscenes.
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Dec 17, 2023 17:10
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BisbyWorl posted:There's a bit of a gap between the end of Wings and the start of Heart, which Blizard was ever so kind enough to cover in Flashpoint, a side novel designed to wring a few more bucks from your pocket. GunnerJ posted:Barring some extreme closeup on the microscopic structure of her eyebrows and lashes, that looks like normal human hair so 
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Dec 17, 2023 17:42
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Back in SC1 she had hella braids (blazing red ones too), so this hair is actually closer to what she had as a human than the more "normal" hairstyles things like Raynor's nightmare depict. Like I can't help but see it as just being braids in plastic tubes, like the ones on the end of shoelaces but longer. E: oh god I just saw SC1 remaster Kerrigan and they made her fuckin' redhead Nova with slightly less resting bitch face. Ponytails are my favorite hairstyle, but c'mon let the girl have her own flair. Felinoid fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Dec 17, 2023 |
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Dec 17, 2023 18:05
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Regalingualius posted:You’re going to have to be more specific, that’s like all of WoL’s cutscenes. Part of my point - but in this case, it's like the first one with him. The one where he shoots a television screen.
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Dec 17, 2023 18:35
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habeasdorkus posted:I'm just going to assume Kerrigan is lying about not being able to remember her Queen of Blades days. No, no there are totally reasons why she doesn't remember, and when you find out why you will be ashamed of your words and deeds.
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Dec 17, 2023 19:45
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It's nothing compared to the butchering of Kerrigan's character, but I find it hilarious that despite having a free ride on a gleaming space station, Raynor still hasn't bothered to shower or change out of his sweat-stained shirt.
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Dec 17, 2023 20:14
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quote:Here, the opening mission consists of Kerrigan throwing all the good will the Umojans are showing her back in their faces by trashing their place just to prove a point. I mean, she was literally their lab rat.
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Dec 17, 2023 20:17
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It's been a while, but I recall my friend watching me play say she didn't like Jim because he's 'patronizing' to Kerrigan. She didn't know how blizzard treated both characters so far, so I didn't have the heart to tell her just how deep the bad writing rabbit hole went. Though she does think the zerg are 'adorable' and got a zergling plushie for Christmas, so...
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Dec 17, 2023 20:18
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Zerglings are adorable and make cute noises, I will die on this hill 
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Dec 17, 2023 20:25
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if you try to pet a zergling you will in fact die, yes
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Dec 17, 2023 20:29
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It's gonna eat me alive anyway, so if that's happening I'm getting some pets in.
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Dec 17, 2023 20:30
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TheOneAndOnlyT posted:It's nothing compared to the butchering of Kerrigan's character, but I find it hilarious that despite having a free ride on a gleaming space station, Raynor still hasn't bothered to shower or change out of his sweat-stained shirt. Experimenting on Kerrigan is only a side hustle, they're actually doing all the possible work in human science trying to get Raynor into clean clothes.
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Dec 17, 2023 20:34
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Kith posted:if you try to pet a zergling you will in fact die, yes That’s why you spritz it with lemon juice when it tries biting you
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Dec 17, 2023 20:34
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Kith posted:if you try to pet a zergling you will in fact die, yes worth
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Dec 17, 2023 20:37
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Drakenel posted:Though she does think the zerg are 'adorable' and got a zergling plushie for Christmas, so... One of the Carbot zerglings, or the official Blizzard ones that can flip inside out to morph into a baneling?
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Dec 17, 2023 20:42
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Carbot version of HotS intro which explains what happened to that Battlecruiser falling off the sky.
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Dec 17, 2023 20:45
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The infestor getting dropped with his tounge hanging and a plushie for support :3
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Dec 17, 2023 20:58
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Felinoid posted:Back in SC1 she had hella braids (blazing red ones too), so this hair is actually closer to what she had as a human than the more "normal" hairstyles things like Raynor's nightmare depict. that was something I always liked about Kerrigan's Ghost image in OG SC1. You could tell that she was just done with everyone's poo poo, her eyes were kinda sunken and her hair was all in dreads. Sure, she's still all business when she has to go ghosting, but otherwise she just looks like she doesn't care about anything. The replacement in SC:R does away with that and it's very lame Lots of things about Kerrigan from 2010 and on are very lame
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Dec 17, 2023 20:59
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Karia posted:One of the Carbot zerglings, or the official Blizzard ones that can flip inside out to morph into a baneling? carbot one. I hadn't seen the official ones, but I'm hesitant to actually give blizzard money.
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Dec 17, 2023 21:34
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And here we go. Oh dear. There is quite a lot to say but many have already brought up the points relevant, so I'll just say that imo HotS would have been much better were Kerrigan just pretending, and this chance at a break was her genuinely going "Psych!" and massacring everyone there. Burnt off the Zerg, didn't burn off the Queen Bitch of the Universe. This isn't even close to fixing all the problems in the story, but it would help a fair bit already. Story-wise, it's all downhill for here now, even if gameplay-wise it remained serviceable. I wouldn't call the gameplay bad, but it was for me the least interesting of the bunch. Could just be I don't care for playing Zerg in general however.
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Dec 17, 2023 21:36
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There are honestly so many ways to rewrite this scene to improve it. Kerrigan is hostile and trying to escape. Kerrigan is hostile but pretending to cooperate while out of her element. Kerrigan is playing along but toying with the Terrans. Kerrigan is trying to cooperate but the zerg queen in her head is pushing her to attack. Kerrigan is cooperating but pretends to lose control of the zerg to prove a point about controlling the zerg. Even just skipping the whole bit and having the base tutorial (if you really need it) lead directly into the events of the second level. If anything it's hard to imagine an alternative approach that would be worse, at least while sincerely trying to write a story.
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Dec 17, 2023 22:08
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Of those options, I think her feigning losing control would be my preferred choice. Having her turn around at the end and go 'I loving lied, this was meant to teach you that you can't control the Zerg, so stop trying'.
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Dec 17, 2023 22:13
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Felinoid posted:Like I can't help but see it as just being braids in plastic tubes, like the ones on the end of shoelaces but longer.
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Dec 17, 2023 22:20
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Drakenel posted:It's been a while, but I recall my friend watching me play say she didn't like Jim because he's 'patronizing' to Kerrigan. She didn't know how blizzard treated both characters so far, so I didn't have the heart to tell her just how deep the bad writing rabbit hole went. both of those points are true, though I mean I'm pretty sure Blizzard wants us to sympathize with Jimmy, but his unearthly crusade to get back together with the girl he dated for a month, and his audacity to get loving pouty when she says she won't put her life on hold to, what, retire to a space homestead off the grid as two of the sector's most wanted criminals? It's not clear what he even thinks was going to happen, just that he feels it is incredibly unfair for Kerrigan to get a say in her own future. I really don't like SC2 Raynor, is what I'm saying. Kerrigan is at least the victim of the plot being bugfuck stupid, rather than personally making all the worst choices possible.
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Dec 18, 2023 00:01
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I mean I'm pretty sure Blizzard wants us to sympathize with Jimmy, but his unearthly crusade to get back together with the girl he dated for a month, and his audacity to get loving pouty when she says she won't put her life on hold to, what, retire to a space homestead off the grid as two of the sector's most wanted criminals? It's not clear what he even thinks was going to happen, just that he feels it is incredibly unfair for Kerrigan to get a say in her own future. It's just more of Blizzard's characteristic double standard regarding female agency. "You need to choose renewal, not vengeance" and all that, as it was put in WoW. Blizzard is chronically, desperately afraid of women choosing anger and vengeance over forgiveness and stepping aside. I wonder why...
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Dec 18, 2023 00:08
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I don't know if this specific case is an example of Blizzard doing a cautionary tale about women getting too uppity. Jim Raynor wants her to give up on revenge, but it remains to be seen whether the game's overall theme and plot agree. (Can't say more because spoilers (also bc it's been a while since I played HoTS so maybe I'm not remembering something key and am therefore very wrong ).)
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Dec 18, 2023 00:17
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:both of those points are true, though I think there could be something sympathetic in Jim being the lovelorn fool, if they executed it better. It's an interesting potential idea to me that Raynor has spent the last four years thinking about Kerrigan, feeling shame and guilt that he wasn't able to protect her from turning into a monster (as if it was solely his fault, since he is the main character of the story he's told himself about this), and having alcohol-fueled daydreams about someday saving her. Then after much effort, he finally "saves" her, but the fantasy he's spent years pursuing doesn't come true. He's nostalgic for and trying to recreate a romantic relationship that barely existed in the first place, the feelings he's built up in the intervening years are completely unrequited, and Kerrigan didn't spend the last four years thinking about him as he did thinking about her. I think Raynor having to reconcile his fantasy of what he dreamed their post-WoL relationship could be with the reality of Kerrigan's lack of romantic interest in him would be worthwhile for his character to have to process! Obviously they don't even come close to doing any of this though. gohuskies fucked around with this message at 00:26 on Dec 18, 2023 |
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Dec 18, 2023 00:23
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GunnerJ posted:I don't know if this specific case is an example of Blizzard doing a cautionary tale about women getting too uppity. Jim Raynor wants her to give up on revenge, but it remains to be seen whether the game's overall theme and plot agree. (Can't say more because spoilers (also bc it's been a while since I played HoTS so maybe I'm not remembering something key and am therefore very wrong Oh, I mean, it is absolutely not intended to be read that way; there's more than enough unsubtle hints in the opening cutscene alone to tell us that Kerrigan absolutely reciprocates his feelings and does want them to be together, only she wants Mengsk to be dead first. I just don't think that makes the framing any better. It could have been interesting if Jim's conflict between his fantasy girl and the actual woman was a deliberate plot thread they intended to explore, instead of presenting it as a tragedy that befalls our hero through no fault of his own, without even realizing that that is what they wrote.
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Dec 18, 2023 01:01
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