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So my android phone got an update and hoo boy. The touchscreen vacillates between working well enough, not responding to any inputs at all, and responding to the lightest touch by whipping the screen violently either up or down at top speed. I hate it. E: Oh, weird. I'm coming up on the end of my contract. WHAT A COINCIDENCE
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Dec 19, 2023 02:14
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Woolie Wool posted:If you can feed a horse, milk a cow, and drive a plow with a team of oxen you're better prepared for the economy of the future than most people. The society of post-industrial smallholding farmers isn't going to happen until after the omega-war over all the arable land on earth that can support maybe a few hundred million of those. For that phase the more marketable skill is going to be fashioning sick hood ornaments out of human jawbones.
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Dec 19, 2023 02:47
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Duck and Cover posted:I watched the new Super Mario Brother movie which made me finally watch the old Super Mario Brothers. The old one is better. It isn't even close. One is a cheesy movie the other a collection or references with famous people voices and music you will recognize. It's like prequel Star Wars vs. sequel Star Wars. They both suck but at least the prequels had a vision.
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Dec 19, 2023 02:48
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The Moon Monster posted:It's like prequel Star Wars vs. sequel Star Wars. They both suck but at least the prequels had a vision. This is a perfect analogy.
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Dec 19, 2023 02:55
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I tried to watch the new Mario movie but I gave up like 10 minutes in when they introduced Mario & Luigi's parents and extended family. I could tell it was going to be 50% "hey remember this thing from the games?" and 50% made-up bullshit that has no precedent
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Dec 19, 2023 02:57
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Time_pants posted:This is a perfect analogy. Nah. The prequels aren't amazing and are racist/antisemetic but podracing is infinitely cooler than anything in the new Mario movie. edit: Oops got confused by my Starwars anyway yeah that makes more sense. Duck and Cover fucked around with this message at 03:20 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 03:16
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The worst Star war is still better than that Zach Snyder trash coming out
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Dec 19, 2023 03:31
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The old Mario movie was great for what it was and I’ve always said so and any time I have a bunch of people always agreed with me. A bunch of old people way outside the target demographic decided that it was bad way back in 1993. We have since discovered that whole generation is bad and has awful taste but unfortunately we will never get the promised SMB 2. Internet Old One fucked around with this message at 04:25 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 04:22
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Armacham posted:The worst Star war is still better than that Zach Snyder trash coming out I liked the one with the whales and Sarah Silverman
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Dec 19, 2023 04:24
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Internet Old One posted:The old Mario movie was great for what it was and I’ve always said so and any time I have a bunch of people always agreed with me. A bunch of old people way outside the target demographic decided that it was bad way back in 1993. Sorta like how a bunch of old idiots way outside the target demographic decided the new Mario movie was bad.
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Dec 19, 2023 05:15
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Biplane posted:Sorta like how a bunch of old idiots way outside the target demographic decided the new Mario movie was bad. Yeah I mean it's not like they filled the movie with references that a 5 year old wouldn't get. The movie is just bad. It's okay to admit that you don't have to make the stupid argument of "BUT BUT BUT IT'S NOT FOR YOU" that's crap it's clearly designed to appeal to me it's just garbage. Sonic movies? Alright. Lego Batman? Sure. Detective Pikachu? Better than Mario. Movies for kids do not have to be garbage.
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Dec 19, 2023 05:46
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erosion posted:The funny thing about advertising is that so much goes into this messaging that doesn't really do anything but everyone has to pretend it's really important or everything collapses. This led me into a jstor rabbithole about if digital advertising works *at all* and I thought I would share my dummy layman thoughts. There's a good freakonomics episode from 2020 called "Does Advertising Actually Work?". There's some compelling anecdotes that it doesn't - consultants being paid to create jargon, and not knowing how to measure the thing that needs to be measured, which is the causal impact of ads on sales. We don't know this because there's no control group for not doing it. Consumer psychology research is very secretive, proprietary and insular, which runs against the whole scientific method thing, and most psychology is *already* bullshit that can't be replicated; so beyond the common sense idea that seeing something more often creates familiarity, what's up with the $600 billion that goes into the ad industry and why is it getting worse? At some point in 2011, eBay was fighting with Bing and decided to turn off all their keyword-search ads. They expected sales to drop by 5% - it dropped by 0.5%, in the margin of error of 0. eBay slashed their marketing budget by $100 million a year. But nobody followed them. This happened again, by accident, when a company forgot to run newspaper ads and saw no impact. Steve Levitt told them to maybe stop the newspaper ads, and they refused. "It was almost if they found out they didn’t work, it was far worse for these people than it was not finding out it didn’t work. Because then they had to explain why for the last 15 years they had been wasting $200 million a year. So, they were happy to just live in a world in which as long as there were ads in every market, every Sunday, life was good." Here it is happening again to Steve Sailer: "... my contacts at G&Z explained that no brand manager had ever gotten promoted by cutting his ad budget. G&Z believed in advertising. To consider reducing commercials was heresy. In short, Americans like to advertise. Our assumption that somebody must have proved that advertising works is reassuring even if nobody can remember the exact details." There's collections of stories like this in the book Subprime Attention Crisis - Tim Hwang talks about how Facebook fraudulently created advertising numbers to kill other websites, he talks about how 60% of ads on the internet are never even *seen* (hidden out of screen or something), and how people pay far less attention to ads than they used to (click rate is like 0.01%.) So why are ads getting more invasive and prevalent (anecdotally, the brand new video billboards in my neighborhood)? It could be the silent depression we're in - as business slows, the industry would advertise more to try to drive more sales. It could be people desperate to insist that their job has an impact on the world, as above, pumping any amount of money and research to justify it. The latter, I think, led to increasingly arcane poo poo like neuromarketing - strapping EEGs on people and making them watch commercials, which horrified me at first, until I realized the EEGs can't even be read. It has nothing to do with targeting consumers and everything to do with showing your patron a graph that says "engagement" and the line is going up. They love it! (Ex. chocolate is better than kissing in collaboration with Cadbury, car design proven to be on a par with the most basic of human emotions by Volvo, etc.) The big claim of neuromarketing is that we can finally figure out things like consumer preferences and shopping habits by recording brain activity. What it ended up in was bad ad copy. All of this is a pretty strong implication that most of advertising, beyond the simple stuff like awareness and attribution, is a rain dance. Those fake studies also obscured most of the research I was trying to do into a connection between advertising and psychology, of which there's surprisingly little outside of poo poo articles like those. No one has taken a serious, non-corporate-funded look at the purpose & impact of modern advertising. (The closest thing is Manufacturing Consent and Chomsky's propaganda model.) It's not super cut and dry though, because the whole industry is secretive. Ads do have function beyond sales, they do help small businesses, and the "ads aren't real" theory is popular among techy people, who have ad blockers and have been trained by the internet to ignore ads. What we do know is that almost all the entertainment we consume - sports, journalism, apps, podcasts, even transport & medical research - is being subsidized by ads. It's deeply intertwined with whatever remains of American infrastructure and the service economy. If it turns out that it's a bubble, like the 2008 mortgage crisis, well that would suck
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Dec 19, 2023 06:28
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I think advertising definitely works, but I would speculate that the useful cases for this are narrow. I would also say that it clearly works sometimes. My go-to example of this is Shark Vacuums. They are terrible devices, and there are a lot of superior options, frequently for less money. Shark sells a ton of product though and I think it's because they have successfully ingrained themselves as A Brand(tm). People do not make rational choices around products, and I would suggest that it is driven a lot by marketing.
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Dec 19, 2023 06:36
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Paid media digital marketing is effective in two main areas. The first is awareness - on the low end of the scale are new or small businesses or products whose biggest barrier to success is that no one knows they exist. You have to do some marketing at the onset just so that people become aware of your presence. This generally isn't a problem that a smart business will solve with ad spots, but more with things like generating content that people want to watch or read - social media posts, search engine placement, guerilla/viral astroturfing, etc. If you have money to throw at it you can do video ads or whatever and sometimes they're wildly successful for at least a short period of time. Think of something like Head-on ("apply directly to the forehead!") - not like it's a wildly successful business (are they even still around?) but for a short period of time everyone was discussing their ads which lead to them getting placed in major pharmacy chains on name recognition alone. The second is usually bullshit-rear end branding stuff like luxury brands who need to establish a brand identity so that the masses are aware that this product is expensive, exclusive, and out of reach. In these cases you're not even directly advertising to the people you're selling your product to, you're trying to convince everyone else that this is an expensive luxury brand so that when rich failsons buy your products people think "that guy must be rich!" And this is ostensibly effective for certain brands but again it's not direct advertising, it's more PR and publicity stunts, celebrity endorsements, etc. Think Balenciaga - their clothes are garbage and no one can afford them. They're so bad and listed for such absurd prices that if someone is wearing Balenciaga you know they're rich and dumb. At the prices they sell their clothes at (generally $1,000+ for shoes, $5-10k for a jacket, etc) the actual volume that they need to sell in order to be profitable is very very low. This is like mobile games chasing whales, all they need is one bored, rich Saudi teenager or whatever to have a crisis of identity and buy a whole new wardrobe through them and they're rolling in cash, all because normal people who would never be caught dead wearing those clothes know that they're so absurdly expensive that they are a meme. Beyond those two things paid advertising almost never does anything at all (and generally isn't even the best way to do those two things). Good short-tail search engine placement is still a huge huge deal, as is grassroots/astroturfed community content (like if you can get a reddit comment recommending your shoes to come up first in a Google search for "best tennis shoes reddit" you're golden) or even just consistent content creation of middling or better quality to keep you popping up on social media feeds. Buying social media ads is pretty much a joke though, as is YouTube ads outside of the two cases mentioned above etc. Effective ads are ads that the audience doesn't realize are ads. Articles in what few big online publications are still around (reviews, feature spots, previews, etc), or sprinkles of reddit posts recommending the product (especially by accounts who are active in the communities they post those things in), or generally anything astroturfed (caveat: influencers can't astroturf for poo poo everyone knows that everything they say is a paid ad and you will never see real returns on influencer marketing) The thing about all of this is that generally with modern advertising algorithms through e.g. Google you are only paying per conversion, it's generally not smart to pay per impression anymore. So like Balenciaga's conversion rate may be incredibly low and maybe that leads to them paying $2,500 for every successful conversion but they still make money hand over fist because of their margins on those conversions. There's such an absolute deluge of advertising these days that ads don't need to be effective to be profitable. You can shoot them out there like a garden hose and only pay when they make you money. And truly effective advertising these days is anything deemed 'engagement'. If you get people actively and willingly talking about your product, it sells. You just have to kick that off with awareness or branding or whatever in the first place, but it becomes self-sustaining as soon as people care enough to discuss your product on Reddit or whatever. So the TL;DR of this post is that marketing is still extremely powerful but 'advertising' is largely obsolete unless you're doing the kind of 'advertising' where you shoot a minigun full of darts at a dartboard and only pay for the ones that hit a bullseye, which is only really effective if your margins are larger than the cost of conversion. And it's really just a starting point, most of your marketing is the stuff you do after your advertising makes people aware of your product and it's not worth the cost or effort of continuing to advertise beyond that point. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 07:23 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 06:59
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The new Mario Brothers movie butchered the DK rap by just having it repeat DK, DONKEY KONG. How the gently caress do you manage to gently caress up nostalgia so bad you worthless jackasses. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sMd1rsJJ0M They didn't even credit the DK rap creator, Grant Kirkhope. (who I didn't know created, nor do I really care that they did but just credit them for fucks sake) Duck and Cover fucked around with this message at 07:28 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 07:26
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deep dish peat moss posted:The second is usually bullshit-rear end branding stuff like luxury brands who need to establish a brand identity so that the masses are aware that this product is expensive, exclusive, and out of reach. In these cases you're not even directly advertising to the people you're selling your product to, you're trying to convince everyone else that this is an expensive luxury brand so that when rich failsons buy your products people think "that guy must be rich!" This makes a lot of sense now that I think about it here. And I made myself sad that this is kinda the state of the world  .
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Dec 19, 2023 07:50
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I can now exhaust the YouTube home page list of videos. It just stops after about 5 pages. I guess I'm blocking enough channels I've never heard of that Google just gives up trying. Still shows dozens of video's I've already watched though.
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Dec 19, 2023 09:29
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Canine Blues Arooo posted:I think advertising definitely works, but I would speculate that the useful cases for this are narrow. I would also say that it clearly works sometimes. My go-to example of this is Shark Vacuums. They are terrible devices, and there are a lot of superior options, frequently for less money. Shark sells a ton of product though and I think it's because they have successfully ingrained themselves as A Brand(tm). How do you vacuum a shark? Just use a rag and water, idiots.
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Dec 19, 2023 11:21
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Outrail posted:How do you vacuum a shark? Just use a rag and water, idiots. They got them little fishes that nibble off dead skin n' poo poo and the shark is like, cool, thanks bros.
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Dec 19, 2023 11:23
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Outrail posted:How do you vacuum a shark? Ask your mom
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Dec 19, 2023 11:34
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Professor Shark posted:Ask your mom Shouldn't you know this?
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Dec 19, 2023 11:36
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Sometimes I think that advertising doesn't work but then I remember that half the men in America commute to the office in an $80000 pickup truck so who's to say 
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Dec 19, 2023 12:10
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The Moon Monster posted:Sometimes I think that advertising doesn't work but then I remember that half the men in America commute to the office in an $80000 pickup truck so who's to say Honey, I surprised bought you an 80K truck!
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Dec 19, 2023 12:11
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Advertising mostly doesn't work beyond a vague awareness of a product/service/company but some people are real real easy to influence
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Dec 19, 2023 12:33
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Word of mouth and keeping up with the joneses works but is slightly askance to advertising as described probably.
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Dec 19, 2023 14:11
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Canine Blues Arooo posted:I think advertising definitely works, but I would speculate that the useful cases for this are narrow. I would also say that it clearly works sometimes. My go-to example of this is Shark Vacuums. They are terrible devices, and there are a lot of superior options, frequently for less money. Shark sells a ton of product though and I think it's because they have successfully ingrained themselves as A Brand(tm). My Shark Vacuum was highly rated by Consumer Reports and that was the first time I’d ever even heard of the brand.
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Dec 19, 2023 15:16
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The Moon Monster posted:Sometimes I think that advertising doesn't work but then I remember that half the men in America commute to the office in an $80000 pickup truck so who's to say I have the same kind of thoughts “Who pays attention to this poo poo?” And yet the fabric of our country and society was written in ads and almost every factoid spit out by a clever boomer was the result of stealth advertising. It’s super depressing I’m going to take some pills about it.
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Dec 19, 2023 15:29
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Most people are complete dipshits and are persuaded to buy products if their favorite celebrity endorses it. Lmao if you think advertising doesn't work and double lmao if you think it doesn't work on you.
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Dec 19, 2023 15:33
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advertising works because its an unspoken class signal in the unspoken class war inherent to late stage capitalism dudes arent buying 80ks trucks to commute to work because they saw a commercial. They're buying an 80k truck to commute to work because other dudes saw a commercial. EDIT bradzilla posted:Most people are complete dipshits and are persuaded to buy products if their favorite celebrity endorses it. Lmao if you think advertising doesn't work and double lmao if you think it doesn't work on you. Ryan Reynolds is an AI amalgamation of headshots and one-liners, and its been harnessed to sell people cell phone service Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Dec 19, 2023 |
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Dec 19, 2023 15:34
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Yeah exactly “keeping up with the Joneses”
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Dec 19, 2023 15:34
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Vampire Panties posted:They're buying an 80k truck to commute to work because other dudes saw a commercial. This. Advertising isn't just the overt commercials you see/hear, it's loving EVERYWHERE. Logos are plastered on literally everything for a reason.
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Dec 19, 2023 15:38
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Internet Old One posted:My Shark Vacuum was highly rated by Consumer Reports and that was the first time I’d ever even heard of the brand. I mostly know of them from their cordless floor sweepers, which were great for the money and really handy for quick "oh poo poo I spilled oregano all over the kitchen floor" type messes. Now those are all discontinued because they mostly got 1-star reviews from idiots complaining about poor suction, even though they aren't meant to have suction because they aren't vacuums.
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Dec 19, 2023 15:42
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bradzilla posted:Most people are complete dipshits and are persuaded to buy products if their favorite celebrity endorses it. Lmao if you think advertising doesn't work and double lmao if you think it doesn't work on you. actually advertising only works on idiots and normies and not me, the superior and intellectual goon
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Dec 19, 2023 15:45
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I was at the convenience store the other day and was in the drinks aisle when the music playing was suddenly interrupted by The Rock touting his new energy drink. I was creeped out by the ad seemingly knowing I was a few feet from said drink but I ended up buying one anyway instead of the Red Bull because my brain is conditioned to buy poo poo when told.
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Dec 19, 2023 16:05
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People are jumping to criticize the statement “advertising doesn’t work” when the effort posts above were limited to internet advertising
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Dec 19, 2023 16:11
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motion sensors switching the radio to ads if you stand somewhere particular is completely believable but god I hope it's not real yet
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Dec 19, 2023 16:14
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https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/06/14/opinion/bluetooth-wireless-tracking-privacy.html
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Dec 19, 2023 16:19
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advertising definitely works on me when I’m watching something on Hulu and it shows me the same ad 14 times during the same movie. Around the 10th time I’m just annoyed but you better believe that 11th time really seals the deal. Hulu is just an example. It’s everywhere. The ads are so (targeted? Shame on me?) that it’s the same goddamn ads over and over again. And rather than just not repeat ads they’d rather just beat you in the face with them
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Dec 19, 2023 16:27
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I bought a jacket and since then I've seen an ad for that same jacket on every website I open without an AdBlock, and after seeing these ads I still own the jacket, so clearly ads work
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Dec 19, 2023 16:29
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Every ad I get is for deodorant but I don't even wear it, so I feel like internet ad targeting has completely failed.
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Dec 19, 2023 16:34
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