PC Building Megathread: As long as she doesn't demand ray tracing

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > PC Building Megathread: As long as she doesn't demand ray tracing

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Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

Twerk from Home posted:

11 year old 550W power supply could potentially be an issue with a modern GPU of that size, isn't the 6700XT moderately higher watt than the 3060?

6600, 6600XT or 7600 might be safer and also cheaper.

While the age of the PSU does raise some concerns, the 6700 XT's recommended PSU size is 550W and the advertised TDP is 230W. Though, as Doombat stated, it apparently draws less.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 18:09

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# ? May 31, 2024 19:22

Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

I assume no cpu that fits my current motherboard would be an adequate upgrade so I'll need to upgrade both right?

That is correct. As Butterfly Valley said,

Butterfly Valley posted:

Motherboard, CPU, ram, PSU, storage, you're overdue a whole upgrade

If you want to upgrade your CPU you're looking at doing a full new build. This can be fairly affordable or really expensive depending on what avenue you would want to go. As mentioned up thread, the current floor is about $650 with a weaker GPU than you're looking at, though Micro Center can help reduce some of that cost if you have one nearby. Again, I recommend just doing a GPU right now and seeing where it lands you. If you're happy then you don't need to upgrade anything else. Would maybe look at replacing the PSU just due to age though.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 18:11

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

Also, speaking of last-generation silicon and saving some bucks, while stock got depleted over Black Friday it looks like vendors have checked under the couch and found more supply, so cheap previous-gen Intel silicon is back on the menu! It's still not quite as low as it was during BFriday (and the iGPU versions are once again charging a full premium for the privilege), but $155 for a 12600KF is still an amazing price and Amazon says they can ship that poo poo before Christmas. It's once again a go-to recommendation for budget builds (though some AM4 Ryzens remain extremely attractive).

So in that spirit, here's a nice general budget build:

PCPartPicker Part List

Good motherboard using very high-end DDR4, an excellent SSD, the previously-mentioned RX 6700XT, a nice case, plenty of power and an SA Mart Windows install factored in. All for less than $1000. Can be adjusted up or down in various places to taste.

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

So my real question is, is my gpu going to be hampered or bottlenecked a considerable amount by my cpu/motherboard or am I safe to just get the gpu for now? Is this a good choice of upgrade for my gpu if what I am wanting to do is say play current games at decent fidelity on a 1080p monitor? Like right now steam says a game like Talos Principle 2's minimum gpu is an Nvidia GTX 970, my exact current card.

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

I assume no cpu that fits my current motherboard would be an adequate upgrade so I'll need to upgrade both right?

Yeah, as a Sandy/Ivy Bridge part, its CPU socket is exclusive to just those chips. You'd need a new motherboard to get a better CPU. As a more-than-decade-old part, it's definitely going to start bottlenecking game apps and other things fairly hard (we've come a long way from the days of four-core non-hyperthreaded CPUs), especially as we go forward, so I would definitely begin budgeting for a full system replacement (which'll probably run $1000-1500, depending) and retiring the current machine to secondary duty (old machines like that are very popular as network-attached storage!) or just storing it.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 18:18

Nettle Soup: Jan 30, 2010; Oh, and Jones was there too.

Eventually I'll upgrade from my i5 760 and my p7h55-m pro motherboard. For a computer I built in 2010ish it's held up surprisingly well, with only a new graphics card, cooler, ~~drives, fans, fan controller, case, monitors, extra usb slots it can't fully use~~ and psu at some point. Runs most things we throw at it, and even when I upgrade it, it'll keep on trucking as a perfectly good Plex server.

I wish I could control the cpu fan though, the regular program doesn't work and it's like a jet engine taking off.

(Cooler is an Arctic Freezer 12) Anyone got any ideas on this? It runs at a nice 35*c ish so it's not overheating.

Also, it's me, I'm the one person who still uses the ps/2 port.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 18:37

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

Admiral Snackbar posted:

I hope this is the right thread for this. I'm thinking about dipping my toes into VR but I'm not sure it's worth it with my current video card. I have an RTX 3060 - would I get any satisfaction out of pairing that with a Quest 3?

So this got lost a little bit in the shuffle. The big Thing with VR is that you're basically driving a dual-monitor setup, one for each eye; this means that your effective (max) resolution is basically 4128x2208 on the Quest 3. That's a pretty hefty image, especially depending on what each app wants to do effects-wise; if your 3060 is one of the 12GB models, I wouldn't be worried about framebuffer as much, but it still might struggle a little to keep up with max-resolution output depending on what an app wants to do. If you want to be utterly certain your card can keep up, I would recommend an RTX 4070 on the Nvidia side or an RX 7800XT on the AMD side, with a 4070Ti or a 7900XT being an even better idea for utterly guaranteed rock-solid performance (with the continued caveat about Nvidia's upcoming refresh). That said, I also don't have a lot of experience with VR apps in 2023 (I'm mostly going off of "what'd be needed for great performance at that resolution for a desktop app") so I don't know how demanding any given app would be. And of course, lowering the program resolution would help, but then you aren't getting the most out of your headset. Sorry if this isn't terribly helpful :shobon:

Nettle Soup posted:

Eventually I'll upgrade from my i5 760 and my p7h55-m pro motherboard. For a computer I built in 2010ish it's held up surprisingly well, with only a new graphics card, cooler, ~~drives, fans, fan controller, case, monitors, extra usb slots it can't fully use~~ and psu at some point. Runs most things we throw at it, and even when I upgrade it, it'll keep on trucking as a perfectly good Plex server.

The old Nehalem & Sandy Bridge parts have held up well for a long time - an almost absurdly long time, compared to the rest of the history of computing. For my own part, it was Starfield, even with its kinda shoddy coding, choking out my i5-6600 and my GTX 970 that convinced me to upgrade - even if I know Starfield has Bethesda Quality programming (and I have other reasons for wanting to play it less each day), I also know that Cyberpunk Phantom Liberty and Baldur's Gate 3 are going to be no less gentle, and upcoming software I'm interested in is going to be just as rough if not moreso. (There's also the fact that it relies on DDR3, which I think could be a genuine problem with very modern games and their more complex gamestates.) Still, if it's giving you the performance you need now, that's great! I do suspect you'll start to feel the true age of the CPU sooner than later at this point, though. :smith:

quote:

I wish I could control the cpu fan though, the regular program doesn't work and it's like a jet engine taking off. (Cooler is an Arctic Freezer 12) Anyone got any ideas on this? It runs at a nice 35*c ish so it's not overheating.

Is the "regular program" Fan Control? It should be able to detect all fans attached to the motherboard and allow for full control of them. Granted, the p7h55 is an oooold motherboard at this point and I have no idea if things with fan readouts have changed since the industry switchover to UEFI BIOS, but it might still be worth a shot if you aren't using it already.

quote:

Also, it's me, I'm the one person who still uses the ps/2 port.

If PS/2 illuminated mechanical keyboards still existed, you can bet I'd be all over that poo poo.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 19:07

BAILOUT MCQUACK!: Nov 14, 2005; Marco! Yeaaah...

SpaceDrake posted:

Also, speaking of last-generation silicon and saving some bucks, while stock got depleted over Black Friday it looks like vendors have checked under the couch and found more supply, so cheap previous-gen Intel silicon is back on the menu! It's still not quite as low as it was during BFriday (and the iGPU versions are once again charging a full premium for the privilege), but $155 for a 12600KF is still an amazing price and Amazon says they can ship that poo poo before Christmas. It's once again a go-to recommendation for budget builds (though some AM4 Ryzens remain extremely attractive).

So in that spirit, here's a nice general budget build:

PCPartPicker Part List

Good motherboard using very high-end DDR4, an excellent SSD, the previously-mentioned RX 6700XT, a nice case, plenty of power and an SA Mart Windows install factored in. All for less than $1000. Can be adjusted up or down in various places to taste.

Yeah, as a Sandy/Ivy Bridge part, its CPU socket is exclusive to just those chips. You'd need a new motherboard to get a better CPU. As a more-than-decade-old part, it's definitely going to start bottlenecking game apps and other things fairly hard (we've come a long way from the days of four-core non-hyperthreaded CPUs), especially as we go forward, so I would definitely begin budgeting for a full system replacement (which'll probably run $1000-1500, depending) and retiring the current machine to secondary duty (old machines like that are very popular as network-attached storage!) or just storing it.

Definitely considering the build you posted. Wavering on whether to cannibalize certain parts from my current to go with it, since I have no real need for the pc as a NAS.

Is using the thermal paste that comes with a heat sink still frowned upon these days?

# ? Dec 19, 2023 19:40

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

Is using the thermal paste that comes with a heat sink still frowned upon these days?

Nah, these days heat solution manufacturers are pretty good about providing non-crap thermal compound.

quote:

Definitely considering the build you posted. Wavering on whether to cannibalize certain parts from my current to go with it, since I have no real need for the pc as a NAS.

Well, it depends on what you want to cannibalize; platter-based HDDs, in particular, have become a part that's going the way of the dinosaur (you'll see discussion of this if you browse back in the thread a bit). With m.2-slot, NVMe-based solid state drives having become standard in the PS5 and Xbox Series X/S, games developed to target those platforms now assume they're installed on such, and will try to stream new assets into memory in real-time (often as you turn your camera) as part of their memory management. Platter-based drives, of course, can't keep up with this at all and so are functionally useless for those titles, even if they would seem like better matches for how big some titles can get nowadays. That is going to become de rigeur going forward, given how modern videogaming works, so bringing over an old but still functional HDD is of limited value at this point, especially factoring in age and probable remaining drive life. (I had actually planned on bringing over such a drive into my new PC as an "archive drive", but I realized the data I actually wanted to preserve boiled down to, like, 70-80GB total. It was much easier to just plop it onto the interim smaller NVMe drive I'd picked up and keep it on there, relegating spinning rust to the dustbin of history.)

Otherwise, cases remain cases, and if you like yours, there's little reason to get a new one, especially for a build like this where the thermal situation won't be completely absurd. I only got a new case because I'd previously insisted on A BIG FULL CASE WITH TONS OF SPACE, which I basically didn't end up using at all and I got tired of bench pressing it every time I wanted to adjust some tiny thing. :v:

If yours still works for you, though, no reason to change it out. SATA SSDs also remain fine, depending on age, though they are slower than NVMe drives by a fair bit (a PCIe 4-based NVMe drive is about twelve times as fast as a SATA SSD, for example). I'd also recommend using the indicated cooler - the i5 12600KF is on the tamer side of thermals for a modern Intel CPU, but at absolute maximum load it can still draw twice the maximum wattage your 3570K does, and an old Hyper 212 or somesuch would really struggle to keep up with that. And OFC, the DDR3 in your current motherboard can't be used in modern mobos at all.

If you go the upgrade route, I hope it goes well! The thread will be here if you have any specific questions. :yayclod:

# ? Dec 19, 2023 20:09

Butterfly Valley: Apr 19, 2007; I am a spectacularly bad poster and everyone in the Schadenfreude thread hates my guts.

SpaceDrake posted:

If you want to be utterly certain your card can keep up, I would recommend an RTX 4070 on the Nvidia side or an RX 7800XT on the AMD side, with a 4070Ti or a 7900XT being an even better idea for utterly guaranteed rock-solid performance (with the continued caveat about Nvidia's upcoming refresh). That said, I also don't have a lot of experience with VR apps in 2023 (I'm mostly going off of "what'd be needed for great performance at that resolution for a desktop app") so I don't know how demanding any given app would be. And of course, lowering the program resolution would help, but then you aren't getting the most out of your headset. Sorry if this isn't terribly helpful

If OP is intending to use airlink and PCVR with their Quest 3 then Nvidia cards have much better encoding for that - or at least that's the case with my Quest 2.

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

Definitely considering the build you posted. Wavering on whether to cannibalize certain parts from my current to go with it, since I have no real need for the pc as a NAS.

Is using the thermal paste that comes with a heat sink still frowned upon these days?

Regarding thermal paste, no, it'll be totally fine. About cannibalising any parts from your current build, the only thing you should really be considering keeping is the storage, and even then I'd be dubious given how old most of it will be (if it hails from the same era as your current CPU). Modern fast and compact storage (NVMe drives) are dirt cheap right now. You need a new CPU, motherboard and RAM anyway. Your PSU is over a decade old and should absolutely be replaced. A new incredibly good CPU cooler will only set you back ~$35, and cases have come a long way in a decade so buying yourself a new one would make for a much better building experience along with giving you better thermals and noise at the end of it.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 20:15

BAILOUT MCQUACK!: Nov 14, 2005; Marco! Yeaaah...

SpaceDrake posted:

Well, it depends on what you want to cannibalize; platter-based HDDs, in particular, have become a part that's going the way of the dinosaur (you'll see discussion of this if you browse back in the thread a bit). With m.2-slot, NVMe-based solid state drives having become standard in the PS5 and Xbox Series X/S, games developed to target those platforms now assume they're installed on such, and will try to stream new assets into memory in real-time (often as you turn your camera) as part of their memory management. Platter-based drives, of course, can't keep up with this at all and so are functionally useless for those titles, even if they would seem like better matches for how big some titles can get nowadays. That is going to become de rigeur going forward, given how modern videogaming works, so bringing over an old but still functional HDD is of limited value at this point, especially factoring in age and probable remaining drive life. (I had actually planned on bringing over such a drive into my new PC as an "archive drive", but I realized the data I actually wanted to preserve boiled down to, like, 70-80GB total. It was much easier to just plop it onto the interim smaller NVMe drive I'd picked up and keep it on there, relegating spinning rust to the dustbin of history.)

Otherwise, cases remain cases, and if you like yours, there's little reason to get a new one, especially for a build like this where the thermal situation won't be completely absurd. I only got a new case because I'd previously insisted on A BIG FULL CASE WITH TONS OF SPACE, which I basically didn't end up using at all and I got tired of bench pressing it every time I wanted to adjust some tiny thing. If yours still works for you, though, no reason to change it out. SATA SSDs also remain fine, depending on age, though they are slower than NVMe drives by a fair bit (a PCIe 4-based NVMe drive is about twelve times as fast as a SATA SSD, for example). I'd also recommend using the indicated cooler - the i5 12600KF is on the tamer side of thermals for a modern Intel CPU, but at absolute maximum load it can still draw twice the maximum wattage your 3570K does, and an old Hyper 212 or somesuch would really struggle to keep up with that. And OFC, the DDR3 in your current motherboard can't be used in modern mobos at all.

If you go the upgrade route, I hope it goes well! The thread will be here if you have any specific questions.

Butterfly Valley posted:

Regarding thermal paste, no, it'll be totally fine. About cannibalising any parts from your current build, the only thing you should really be considering keeping is the storage, and even then I'd be dubious given how old most of it will be (if it hails from the same era as your current CPU). Modern fast and compact storage (NVMe drives) are dirt cheap right now. You need a new CPU, motherboard and RAM anyway. Your PSU is over a decade old and should absolutely be replaced. A new incredibly good CPU cooler will only set you back ~$35, and cases have come a long way in a decade so buying yourself a new one would make for a much better building experience along with giving you better thermals and noise at the end of it.

It was mostly the case and hard drives since I have 2 1TB HDD and 1 1TB SSD. The drives is an easy choice as I can ride out the HDD's until they die since they are just storage. The case on the other hand is kind of iffy because I would have to gut it and repack all those parts when getting a new case means that pc can basically stay as is with 1 drive in it and I could keep it as backup.

Thanks for all the advice

# ? Dec 19, 2023 20:25

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

It was mostly the case and hard drives since I have 2 1TB HDD and 1 1TB SSD. The drives is an easy choice as I can ride out the HDD's until they die since they are just storage. The case on the other hand is kind of iffy because I would have to gut it and repack all those parts when getting a new case means that pc can basically stay as is with 1 drive in it and I could keep it as backup.

So among other things, I would definitely recommend CrystalDiskInfo to check the health status of those drives. (It's Good, Ignore The Anime.�) See which of those drives are still in good(ish) health, and determine which of them you might want to save for the new build. I would absolutely recommend the included NVMe SSD, or something similar, in the posted build as your OS drive, however - it's just so much faster and will make booting up and essential system functions much, much snappier than even the (I assume) current SATA SSD you're using. My notes about HDDs remain, though keeping one around for media storage and use with (much) older games isn't a totally ridiculous idea, especially if they remain in decent health.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 20:42

Nettle Soup: Jan 30, 2010; Oh, and Jones was there too.

SpaceDrake posted:

Is the "regular program" Fan Control? It should be able to detect all fans attached to the motherboard and allow for full control of them. Granted, the p7h55 is an oooold motherboard at this point and I have no idea if things with fan readouts have changed since the industry switchover to UEFI BIOS, but it might still be worth a shot if you aren't using it already.

Yeah, it is. It detects but can't get a response. The only thing it can get anything out of is the fan on the 1070, and that so rarely spins up anyway.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:05

BAILOUT MCQUACK!: Nov 14, 2005; Marco! Yeaaah...

I assume its still true that any windows 7 key can activate windows 10 currently?

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:07

MarcusSA: Sep 23, 2007

Admiral Snackbar posted:

I hope this is the right thread for this. I'm thinking about dipping my toes into VR but I'm not sure it's worth it with my current video card. I have an RTX 3060 - would I get any satisfaction out of pairing that with a Quest 3?

Fwiw I run VR games off my laptop 3060 and it�s been fine :shrug:

A lot of the current VR games are built with pretty low specs in mind because that�s the hardware the standalone headsets have.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:08

ethanol: Jul 13, 2007

You really only need powerful hardware for vr sim like flight sim in my experience, some older pc games which were never intended for vr. Like the poster said a lot of the stuff is primarily designed to run on the mobile processor that is in the quest. That said I�m running on a 4090 so I�ve lost touch with where the ground floor is on almost everything gaming

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:11

spunkshui: Oct 5, 2011

Nettle Soup posted:

Eventually I'll upgrade from my i5 760 and my p7h55-m pro motherboard. For a computer I built in 2010ish it's held up surprisingly well, with only a new graphics card, cooler, ~~drives, fans, fan controller, case, monitors, extra usb slots it can't fully use~~ and psu at some point. Runs most things we throw at it, and even when I upgrade it, it'll keep on trucking as a perfectly good Plex server.

I wish I could control the cpu fan though, the regular program doesn't work and it's like a jet engine taking off. (Cooler is an Arctic Freezer 12) Anyone got any ideas on this? It runs at a nice 35*c ish so it's not overheating.

Also, it's me, I'm the one person who still uses the ps/2 port.

I control mine directly in the bios.

As long as you�re using a four pin CPU fan and putting it into the four pin plug on the motherboard, even the oldest motherboards should be able to directly control that fan if they don�t bother with the system fans.

You might not be able to fully customize the fan curve, but you should still be able to find something like extreme, standard ,silent.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:17

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

BAILOUT MCQUACK! posted:

I assume its still true that any windows 7 key can activate windows 10 currently?

So actually, no, that program ended just a few months ago and Microsoft did follow through with it.

They meant to close it off a while ago, but they finally pulled the trigger. More info here and here.

(Yes, it's frustrating as gently caress, but you can get a cheap and valid Win11 key from SA Mart in the shops run by LODGE NORTH and BrownThunder.)

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:20

ethanol: Jul 13, 2007

SpaceDrake posted:

So actually, no, that program ended just a few months ago and Microsoft did follow through with it. They meant to close it off a while ago, but they finally pulled the trigger. More info here and here.

(Yes, it's frustrating as gently caress, but you can get a cheap and valid Win11 key from SA Mart in the shops run by LODGE NORTH and BrownThunder.)

Wow looks like I just squeezed by updating to 11 a few months ago. I�m still running on a upgraded windows 7 key from 2012

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:21

DoombatINC: Apr 20, 2003; Here's the thing, I'm a feminist.

Nettle Soup posted:

I wish I could control the cpu fan though, the regular program doesn't work and it's like a jet engine taking off. (Cooler is an Arctic Freezer 12) Anyone got any ideas on this? It runs at a nice 35*c ish so it's not overheating.

It looks like it uses a proprietary fan that turns itself off under low PWM signal (the cooler is advertised as "semi-passive" for this reason) so it might just be a quirk of that specific design. Normally I'd recommend just replacing the fan with something a little innately quieter if the cooler is still doing its job, but it also looks like the proprietary fan has its attaching clips built straight into the frame which kinda complicates that suggestion :goleft:

if the noise is enough of a problem then it might be time to replace the entire cooler with, like, an SE-214-XT or something else with a quieter fan and more standardized replacement parts.

# ? Dec 19, 2023 21:31

Nettle Soup: Jan 30, 2010; Oh, and Jones was there too.

Yeah the clip is part of the frame. I think I bought it in a hurry at some point when the previous one died, so I'm not all that attached to it.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/ID-COOLING-Cooler-120mm-Cooling-Intel/dp/B09Q7XVZ2V Looks like it's in stock on amazon UK and not too expensive, I might do that at some point! I'll have a look in the bios too and see what's up.

It's been a while since I've looked at the weird motherboard OS that came with it too, I wonder if it still works...

# ? Dec 19, 2023 22:45

Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

SpaceDrake posted:

I would definitely recommend CrystalDiskInfo to check the health status of those drives. (It's Good, Ignore The Anime.�)

Excuse me, goon sir. The anime is the best part. :colbert:

# ? Dec 20, 2023 12:42

Admiral Snackbar: Mar 13, 2006; OUR SNEEZE SHIELDS CANNOT REPEL A HUNGER OF THAT MAGNITUDE

SpaceDrake posted:

So this got lost a little bit in the shuffle. The big Thing with VR is that you're basically driving a dual-monitor setup, one for each eye; this means that your effective (max) resolution is basically 4128x2208 on the Quest 3. That's a pretty hefty image, especially depending on what each app wants to do effects-wise; if your 3060 is one of the 12GB models, I wouldn't be worried about framebuffer as much, but it still might struggle a little to keep up with max-resolution output depending on what an app wants to do. If you want to be utterly certain your card can keep up, I would recommend an RTX 4070 on the Nvidia side or an RX 7800XT on the AMD side, with a 4070Ti or a 7900XT being an even better idea for utterly guaranteed rock-solid performance (with the continued caveat about Nvidia's upcoming refresh). That said, I also don't have a lot of experience with VR apps in 2023 (I'm mostly going off of "what'd be needed for great performance at that resolution for a desktop app") so I don't know how demanding any given app would be. And of course, lowering the program resolution would help, but then you aren't getting the most out of your headset. Sorry if this isn't terribly helpful

MarcusSA posted:

Fwiw I run VR games off my laptop 3060 and it�s been fine

A lot of the current VR games are built with pretty low specs in mind because that�s the hardware the standalone headsets have.

Thanks for the feedback! I think I'll give it a go - I don't mind turning some settings down to get a good framerate, and I guess worst case scenario is I'll end up upgrading my video card sooner than I expected.

# ? Dec 20, 2023 15:11

Teriyaki Koinku: Nov 25, 2008; Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!

BrainDance posted:

Oh drat, that's actually good to know. I had only sort of heard a little bit about the ban, didnt know the details or if it was even for sure happening. More worried about what it means for me two generations from now, because I'm not gonna pass on a 6090.

But I was pretty confused when he showed me that the GPU I bought for under 15,000 was now over 20,000. And then we went looking for another seller for that exact GPU and they were all out of stock except for one "wait 5 weeks, import from America one" I just assumed it was taxes or something? Because mine, when I got it on launch, the guy was getting them from Taiwan I think.

I did see some normal price ones on Jingdong when we went to check other brands, but maybe they were out of stock. This is gonna be an 11.11 thing anyway so hopefully it'll all be ok.

Also how is that supposed to stop Chinese businesses from getting them at all? Won't they just buy them on Jingdong like the rest of us?

Update on China WRT 4090: apparently they're going to release a special China-only card called the 4090D in January to get around export restrictions, but apparently that has led to further antagonism between the US Secretary of Commerce and Nvidia.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 09:15

Twerk from Home: Jan 17, 2009; This avatar brought to you by the 'save our dead gay forums' foundation.

BrainDance posted:

Also how is that supposed to stop Chinese businesses from getting them at all? Won't they just buy them on Jingdong like the rest of us?

The US rule change bans not just sales to China, but sales to about 60 countries that are likely to export to China. Any distributor in the remaining, mostly strongly US aligned countries who ends up allowing GPUs to go to China is going to be punished pretty heavily.

I'm sure that a trickle of GPUs will keep going to China, but it's going to be slow, expensive, and make it hard to build an effective supercomputer with them because you won't be able to get many GPUs of the same model and config.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 15:12

Rinkles: Oct 24, 2010; What I'm getting at is...
Do you feel the same way?

Lancool II Mesh case for $77. It's the previous model, but it's still a very good case, based on my own experience with it.

https://www.newegg.com/black-lian-li-lancool-ii-performance-atx-mid-tower/p/2AM-000Z-00086

https://www.walmart.com/ip/LIAN-LI-...NCE-X/920665717

# ? Dec 21, 2023 16:24

Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

A friend of mine got a G.Skill LT1 mATX PC Case sent to them via Amazon that they didn't order and have no use for. I wasn't aware that G.Skill even made cases, but apparently they do. No idea how good or bad this case is, but it's new in box (they did open the box to make sure the case was in good condition). Said since they didn't pay for it they'd sell it for the cost of shipping in case someone here is interested.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 16:52

Bloopsy: Jun 1, 2006; you have been visited by the Tasty Garlic Bread. you will be blessed by having good Garlic Bread in your life time, but only if you comment "ty garlic bread" in the thread below

Speaking of cases I�m looking to upgrade from a Define 7 Compact to a 011D Evo for thermals/noise. Currently have a 7800x3d with a Fractal Celsius 240mm aio. What is the consensus for a 280mm vs 360mm aio? I�ve seen and been told elsewhere that there is not much of a difference at all between a 240mm and 280mm but a big difference from 280mm to 360mm. I�ve also seen mentioned on SA that there isn�t much of a difference from 280mm to 360mm. So which is it? I�m not concerned about cost.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 17:07

Wibla: Feb 16, 2011

The 7800X3D doesn't need an AIO at all :colbert:

Have you done any fan curve tuning?

What GPU are you running? stock case fans?

# ? Dec 21, 2023 17:09

Kibner: Oct 21, 2008; Acguy Supremacy

Bloopsy posted:

Speaking of cases I�m looking to upgrade from a Define 7 Compact to a 011D Evo for thermals/noise. Currently have a 7800x3d with a Fractal Celsius 240mm aio. What is the consensus for a 280mm vs 360mm aio? I�ve seen and been told elsewhere that there is not much of a difference at all between a 240mm and 280mm but a big difference from 280mm to 360mm. I�ve also seen mentioned on SA that there isn�t much of a difference from 280mm to 360mm. So which is it? I�m not concerned about cost.

For the good aio�s, there is a sizable difference between 240 and 280 but a negligible difference between 280 and 360. 280 uses 140mm fans while 240 and 360 use 120mm fans. So, the 280 has an effective radiator size that is closer to the 360 than the 240. And since the fans are larger, they should be capable of higher static pressure at lower noise levels which help it keep up with the 360s in noise normalized thermals.

I think the people that may have told you different could have been talking about the cooling potential if the fans and pump were screaming away at 100% instead of at a volume that is tolerable.

With that said, the 7800x3d uses comparably little power and does not need an aio of any sort. Any reputable dual tower air cooler would be overkill.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 18:04

Kibner: Oct 21, 2008; Acguy Supremacy

Ahh, you are putting it in an O11 case. For that situation, an AIO might make sense because that line of cases is not good at air cooling. Get an Arctic II Freezer 280 and run it at low speeds and it will be silent and be wonderful. They come in all-black and rgb versions.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 18:10

Dr. Video Games 0031: Jul 17, 2004

240 * 120 = 28,880mm2
360 * 120 = 43,200mm2
280 * 140 = 39,200mm2

So yeah, 280mm and 360mm AIOs are very close in terms of radiator area. If you get something like a Liquid Freezer II, those are extra thick (35mm instead of 25mm I think?), which is a big part of the reason why they perform so much better relative to their peers, though they may have some case compatibility issues as a result. The downside is that 140mm fans are worse at pushing air through a radiator than 120mm fans (due to worse static pressure at equal RPMs), but the increased water volume and surface area more than makes up for that.

The O11 cases are designed the way they are largely for aesthetic reasons. If you are just interested in a high-end case that's quieter than your current one but you don't care about the aesthetics of the O11, I'd get something more like the Lancool III or Fractal Design Torrent. The Lancool III is a highly versatile case that can accommodate a wide variety of cooling setups while still being easy to work in, while the Torrent is mostly focused delivering the best air cooling possible (you can throw some radiators in there, but doing so disrupt's the case's biggest advantage--the massive front fans)

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Dec 21, 2023

# ? Dec 21, 2023 20:03

Wibla: Feb 16, 2011

Or OP could tune the fan curves appropriately and open the door while running heavy workloads :shrug:

OP hasn't replied with any more info about the current build beyond CPU and AIO, so it's hard to give further advice. If OP likes the aesthetic of the O11, go for it, but if it's solely for noise and cooling, there are other, cheaper/better options.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 20:32

CapnAndy: Feb 27, 2004; Some teeth long for ripping, gleaming wet from black dog gums. So you keep your eyes closed at the end. You don't want to see such a mouth up close. before the bite, before its oblivion in the goring of your soft parts, the speckled lips will curl back in a whinny of excitement. You just know it.

I did read everyone who replied to me, and thank you.

Branch Nvidian posted:

The first getting this combo from Micro Center: https://www.microcenter.com/product...er-build-bundle
It has a 7800X3D which is the best CPU for gaming on the market currently. The 3D v-cache does hurt some production workloads, but it simply cannot be beaten for gaming.

SpaceDrake posted:

And yeah, once you get up to the $300 range on a CPU, the 7800X3D absolutely has to enter the conversation for gaming-focused setups. It is simply the best value for the money. You currently spend around $50-60 more than a 13600-13700 Intel part for a CPU that atomizes $600 competitors, even in its own product range.

Are you guys sure about that? The reviews here are frankly scathing, and on this site that lets me compare different games, the 13600k beats the 7800x3d every time. But it wins every time here, so I don't know what to think.

SpaceDrake posted:

Aside from what Nvidian mentioned, my usual motherboard question applies: are you going to use all the features of your chosen mobo? Are you going to use some or all of its features? Do you plan on plugging in a lot of internal devices to the PCIe slots? Do you want/need S/PDIF or surround sound support on the board? Is a USB party in the back relevant to your use-case? Maybe you want a ton of m.2s for All The Storage? This is a place where you can save a fair bit of money or set it on fire, so it's worth considering. Granted, with the Micro Center deals, you'll likely end up with a bit more motherboard than you can really use, but it's at a lower price than you'd often pay for separate components, of any sort, anyway.

I mean... I want expandability to future-proof, and more USB slots in the back = more better, always, but I'm assuming whatever motherboard I get will be good enough. When I was part picking, it was one of the last things I picked, and the criteria was basically "what slots everything that I picked out and is popular".

Otherwise I will go to DDR5 RAM and it makes sense to hold off on a video card and just take the 3060 Ti I have in my current computer and put it in the new one until CES. Has the crypto nonsense died down, though? When the new models get announced, will I actually be able to get the new ones at MSRP, or the old ones at a discount, or will they all sell out instantly and get relisted at hundreds of dollars more?

CapnAndy fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Dec 21, 2023

# ? Dec 21, 2023 21:55

Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

CapnAndy posted:

Are you guys sure about that? The reviews here are frankly scathing, and on this site that lets me compare different games, the 13600k beats the 7800x3d every time.

I can't speak to the accuracy of the Technical City page, but I can tell you that the guy who runs Userbenchmark is an unhinged lunatic with an extreme grudge against AMD for some unknown reason. He'd never posted a single positive review of an AMD part.

Edit: Additionally, Gamers Nexus, who are considered the gold standard for PC component reviews in this thread had high praises to sing of the 7800X3D, and show it consistently beating the 13600K, and even the 12900K, in gaming performance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B31PwSpClk8

Branch Nvidian fucked around with this message at 22:06 on Dec 21, 2023

# ? Dec 21, 2023 22:03

change my name: Aug 27, 2007; Legends die but anime is forever.

RIP The Lost Otakus.

Userbenchmark has a noticeable (read insane) bias against AMD processors and GPUs, any other review site or video will tell you it's the best CPU for gaming hands-down

# ? Dec 21, 2023 22:04

DoombatINC: Apr 20, 2003; Here's the thing, I'm a feminist.

CapnAndy posted:

Are you guys sure about that? The reviews here are frankly scathing, and on this site that lets me compare different games, the 13600k beats the 7800x3d every time.

The userbenchmark guy is a well-known raving lunatic and that website is not worth using for any reason, and websites that compare benchmark details that like are almost always using synthetic estimate results that aren't especially accurate

If you want to see some hard data about the chip that was collected by professionals, check the GN video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B31PwSpClk8

# ? Dec 21, 2023 22:04

Branch Nvidian: Nov 29, 2012

CapnAndy posted:

When the new models get announced, will I actually be able to get the new ones at MSRP, or the old ones at a discount, or will they all sell out instantly and get relisted at hundreds of dollars more?

Crypto bullshit is largely over. I wouldn't be surprised if some assholes buy up the entire launch stock of the new models just because that happens with everything in consumer electronics these days, but they shouldn't remain like that for terribly long. Especially once the scalpers find they're unable to make a 300% profit.

# ? Dec 21, 2023 22:10

CapnAndy: Feb 27, 2004; Some teeth long for ripping, gleaming wet from black dog gums. So you keep your eyes closed at the end. You don't want to see such a mouth up close. before the bite, before its oblivion in the goring of your soft parts, the speckled lips will curl back in a whinny of excitement. You just know it.

Thank you everyone for assuaging my worries on the 7800x3d.

Branch Nvidian posted:

Crypto bullshit is largely over. I wouldn't be surprised if some assholes buy up the entire launch stock of the new models just because that happens with everything in consumer electronics these days, but they shouldn't remain like that for terribly long. Especially once the scalpers find they're unable to make a 300% profit.