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Alchenar posted:A huge chunk of the game is designing and building your own personal spaceship, without anything to actually do in that spaceship the whole process is just putting lego together. No wonder I liked that part best!
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Dec 29, 2023 21:13
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I've played with it a bit more, partially specifically out of spite about how seemingly useless it is and no matter what the game is I will play with extraction automation tooling no matter how much of the poo poo I can Just Buy Anyways (especially since I'd rather spend an hour loving with outposts than spend 15 minutes spamming 24 hour wait cycles outside a vendor waiting for them to stock enough Adhesive for me to glue a suppressor whatever pistol I'm using in this universe) From what I've played with it's a very, very odd mix of "intuitive" and "wait, it can't do that?" Like, power will work for everything in your outpost, but it also lets you wire things directly to each other, but there's no way to visually tell the difference between a power linkage, an output linkage, and an input linkage Also I'm pretty sure the outpost talent for "you can create more outpost linkages" is just plain broken because I took it and I'm still told I'm capped at 3 per outpost so lol
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Dec 29, 2023 21:13
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Alchenar posted:A huge chunk of the game is designing and building your own personal spaceship, without anything to actually do in that spaceship the whole process is just putting lego together. Arguably it's worse than that-- I stole a giant multi-hab-module ship and was like "oh this is actually kind of cool to walk around in, I play around more with this" and then had to scrap it back down to "just functional" levels of hab modules again because changing anything made it link together in stupid ways, like instead of "a connector that had 3 doors into different rooms", I ended up with a connector that was a dead end and an engineering bay that you could only get to by walking through a bedroom and an infirmary
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Dec 29, 2023 21:16
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Some of y'all should probably be playing Dyson Sphere Program instead or something.
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Dec 29, 2023 21:29
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I think there's an unserved gulf between Dyson sphere type factory management games, and the kinds of crafting and resources automation management you get in farm sims, Minecraft types, exploration crafting games, etc. The former have a problem of not having a game you want to do things in to want to get all automated about while also getting technical and granular in an intense way right off the bat or have you immediately start to invent all of technology's history from sharpened rocks to speculative nuclear engineering. I don't want to build a Dyson Swarm. I want to be the number one workshop builder in Sandrock and have building the Dyson Swarm simply be the most expedient way to ensure I have infinity Bronze Tubes in case anyone commissions that many one day.
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Dec 29, 2023 21:50
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just play factorio
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Dec 29, 2023 21:57
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Alchenar posted:A huge chunk of the game is designing and building your own personal spaceship, without anything to actually do in that spaceship the whole process is just putting lego together. And then, when you NG+, all that design poofs. I can see having the ship itself vanish. I can see the credits vanishing. But expecting that level of player involvement and expecting them to delete it on the slim chance they can run through with every NPC dead is the dumbest move in game design since the WiiU.
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Dec 29, 2023 22:03
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"If you don't like how this game is does X just go play a different game" is such a weirdly conversation-terminating non sequitur that I'm not even sure how to respond to it
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Dec 29, 2023 22:10
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game would've been better if it was literally just Nords in Space
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Dec 29, 2023 22:17
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The more I think about Starfield, the more I think it would have been a way better game if it was all just set in a single giant solar system (think Firefly) with no FTL jumps and no procgen anything, just the entire set of non-procgen content in the game crammed in there.
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Dec 29, 2023 23:26
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Roadie posted:The more I think about Starfield, the more I think it would have been a way better game if it was all just set in a single giant solar system (think Firefly) with no FTL jumps and no procgen anything, just the entire set of non-procgen content in the game crammed in there. It would have indeed been a better game if it was literally anything else besides the release version.
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Dec 29, 2023 23:44
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no, it would've been a better game if they had written a good story and made it fun to play
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Dec 29, 2023 23:45
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Everybody has ideas of how to better Starfield but nobody willing to make themselves a better player for what Starfield is.
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Dec 29, 2023 23:46
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And why the hell don't we have a new incredible machine game yet
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Dec 29, 2023 23:49
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Khanstant posted:Everybody has ideas of how to better Starfield but nobody willing to make themselves a better player for what Starfield is. Thing is most ideas are basically "Starfield would've been a better game if it was a completely different game"
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Dec 29, 2023 23:51
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Chillmatic posted:I confess that i can’t wait for the inevitable internet hype-meltdown after this comes out
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Dec 29, 2023 23:57
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Bholder posted:Thing is most ideas are basically "Starfield would've been a better game if it was a completely different game" Funny how bad games are
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Dec 30, 2023 00:03
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Bholder posted:Thing is most ideas are basically "Starfield would've been a better game if it was a completely different game" This is the kind of problem you run into when every element of your game is half-assed or incomplete.
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Dec 30, 2023 01:02
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if i was todd howard i would have made the game more better
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Dec 30, 2023 01:06
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Todd seems like he has a higher level executive job than he probably should have but hey maybe he always wanted to be a business boy instead of game boss
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Dec 30, 2023 01:24
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moist turtleneck posted:if i was todd howard i would have made the game more better
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Dec 30, 2023 01:25
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Khanstant posted:Everybody has ideas of how to better Starfield but nobody willing to make themselves a better player for what Starfield is. it's amazing how much better starfield's combat feels over fallout 4 (and to a lesser extent fallout 76) but i'll take victories where i can find them
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Dec 30, 2023 01:29
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Ironslave posted:This is the kind of problem you run into when every element of your game is half-assed or incomplete. Yeah this is the thing; it's not that there's one or two things holding Starfield back. Everything is at-best 10 year old game design with no glue holding it together. I would challenge anyone to name something new Starfield brings to video games that they'd like to see reproduced or iterated on in another game.
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Dec 30, 2023 01:48
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Even the jetpack fun was done better by Tribes
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Dec 30, 2023 01:54
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Gating the base jetpack skill behind a skill point was such a bad idea
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Dec 30, 2023 01:55
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that's why bounty hunter is the best background. all three skills are ones you need to get anyway
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Dec 30, 2023 02:11
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Ironslave posted:This is the kind of problem you run into when every element of your game is half-assed or incomplete. Not to sound like a broken record but that is exactly how Cyberpunk discourse went when it was released.
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Dec 30, 2023 02:18
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Giving any one of the systems or subsystems that compose Starfield the attention and care it needed to be engaging or even worthwhile would mean changing the play and focuses of the game itself. Starfield was trying to be many things at once, and ended up being none of them. I would assume there are ways you could improve it or even make it a better game, but the final product is only going to bear a superficial resemblance to itself, like NMS and 2077 ended up. At the very least they could remove gating everything behind doing Challenges to be allowed to spend your Perks, and maybe make more things (like jetpacks and crafting) baseline, and do some patching and adding of items/weapons to make the more-useless ones worth taking. And let you keep your drat ship between universes. As it is the game feels like an early-access alpha they polished rather than improved or iterated upon. I've been criticizing BGS games (and practices) for almost two decades now, but there's always been something positive I felt I could say about the things they produce, even if it's just that they made what they were trying to make. I can't say that about Starfield. It's hard for me to imagine a deeper nadir of concept and quality. Edit: oh hey, 2077 got mentioned while I was writing this. 2077 then and now are entirely different games, I played the thing at both ends.
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Dec 30, 2023 02:18
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Bholder posted:Not to sound like a broken record but that is exactly how Cyberpunk discourse went when it was released. I'm struggling to think of when Bethesda ever really reversed course on anything, other than a little with 76. Like I don't think we'll ever see an official atmospheric flight mode
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Dec 30, 2023 02:28
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Bholder posted:Not to sound like a broken record but that is exactly how Cyberpunk discourse went when it was released. Cyberpunk was broken as gently caress (and holy poo poo there is a LOT to be said about how lovely that launch was and how stupid it is for everyone to be singing their praises today like they didn't charge us all full MSRP for broken crap at launch) but at least there was something to fix there. You could make an immaculate, perfect version of Starfield and it would still suck. The problems aren't technical, they're core game design issues.
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Dec 30, 2023 02:35
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Alchenar posted:
The ship builder is a pretty solid swipe at the concept, and it lands nicely between giving the player freedom to make cool poo poo while also being simple enough that you don't need to go full Kerbal calculating thrust to weight or center of gravity etc. It has its issues, but there is a good core there and it's something that could be iterated on.
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Dec 30, 2023 02:37
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The game is just empty. It takes 40+ hours to get to a point where you can actually do all the stuff and go through several NG+ and then you find that it is just empty. There is nothing of substance to see or do. I was hoping that it was like Skyrim, where you head out and inevitably always run into "something" of interest. Some kind of lore, some quest some random information or dungeon, some of the times it might even relate to a major quest you encounter later, something. Just anything! But there really isn't anything at all anywhere. It's desolate, depressing and sad. I can confidently say that I've played 95%+ of all the quest that aren't broken and I kept playing and hoping for something, but it's just not there. I have a little more to say after 300+ hours in this game, but I'll hold on for now. I only did this because, again I thought, maybe I'll go there, maybe there'll be something, maybe this will lead to another thing, but it just didn't. In summary, this game is really really really boring. It's all just empty and sad and I regret the hours I put into it. I just started playing Cyberpunk again, after buying the DLC and holy gently caress! By Satan, how is that even possible for a 3 year old game to be this good!? The contrast is shocking. I feel cheated for having paid any amount of money for Starfield. I played Cyberpunk when it came out and didn't encounter any significant bugs (i got lucky I guess), but goddman is it a fuckton better now. Playing it is like getting gamer-whiplash. I really hope that the people at Bethesda see this as a wake up call, but I'm doubtful.
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Dec 30, 2023 02:39
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Alchenar posted:I would challenge anyone to name something new Starfield brings to video games that they'd like to see reproduced or iterated on in another game. Chunks!
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Dec 30, 2023 03:31
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Ugly In The Morning posted:I’m not even sure why Freestar split off so fast, became hostile so fast, and was able to be a credible threat so fast. Nothing about the timescale of this game makes sense. It’s like the opposite of the Bethesda fallout games, where they insist on moving the game year forward but everything feels like it’s fifty years after the bombs fell. They had to cram in a Firefly TV show faction. That's it.
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Dec 30, 2023 03:37
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DancingShade posted:They had to cram in a Firefly TV show faction. That's it. Does anyone under the age of 40 give a poo poo about Firefly anymore? I can’t imagine some 25 year old gamer giving a gently caress about a show that was popular with college nerds when they were four years old. It would be like dropping a Dallas or Threes Company reference in Morrowind and expecting college kids in 2002 to get all hyped for it.
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Dec 30, 2023 05:08
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i am 29 and i have seen firefly. make of that what you will
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Dec 30, 2023 05:11
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Cyrano4747 posted:Does anyone under the age of 40 give a poo poo about Firefly anymore? I can’t imagine some 25 year old gamer giving a gently caress about a show that was popular with college nerds when they were four years old. Todd Howard is 53. I couldn't easily find out how old Emil Pagliarulo was but he looks around that age too.
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Dec 30, 2023 05:13
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he was born 11/21/69, doesn't quite have todd's flair for dates, but it's close
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Dec 30, 2023 05:19
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VostokProgram posted:i am 29 and i have seen firefly. make of that what you will
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Dec 30, 2023 05:21
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DancingShade posted:They had to cram in a Firefly TV show faction. That's it. Based on the timeline I feel like it's a tossup between "needed a Firefly faction" and "RDR2 was a smash hit" possibly both
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Dec 30, 2023 05:30
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