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Kafouille posted:Yes but what is the purpose of making it underground, digging out large quantities of ice is not trivial when you have to carry every bit of equipment to a foreign planet. Rad shielding would be way easier to do by simply digging a lot less ice and putting it up the walls of your construction on the surface, be it inside the insulation layer as double duty water/electrolysis feedstock or just bulk ice on the outside For a 20 story building?
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Jan 5, 2024 08:54
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The larger the building the more you save on digging by going that way by virtue of the square/cube law.
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Jan 5, 2024 08:56
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We'll be mining the ice for water regardless.
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Jan 5, 2024 08:58
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"mining" implies some ongoing operation, rather than just what you excavated during initial construction and you probably want to build far enough away from the mine that you don't need to worry about your digging works causing ground instability
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Jan 5, 2024 09:04
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I feel like rather than digging you should just use a nuclear powered melter machine. Like a TBM but with radiators on the front instead of drills. Suck up the water and pump it through an insulated pipe up to the surface and dispense it as snow.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:04
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Kafouille posted:The larger the building the more you save on digging by going that way by virtue of the square/cube law. Yeah but my nuclear excavations also become more expeditious.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:10
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The basic water needs of a human is something like the volume of a small car per YEAR, completely open loop, and that includes oxygen. You're not drinking your living space unless you take a decade to excavate it.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:11
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just get those mig engine snow melters the russians have
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Jan 5, 2024 09:12
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redshirt posted:Not remotely similar. First, they are not on ice, they are on snow on land. Considering you're here asking very silly questions (-300 C is not "a bit cold", the scale stops at -273.15) you're being an rear end in a top hat about it. The south pole is 2700 m of ice, it's not "on land".
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Jan 5, 2024 09:26
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Well there is land at the south pole, but there is ice on that land and the base is built on the ice.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:32
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What I was going for was, why are you asking the question? Are you just curious if it's possible? Is this for a story? Or is this a serious engineering challenge that you actually want to do? I was gonna say that it'd affect the level of effort we put in, but apparently you got the thread interested so  On the off-chance this is a serious engineering problem that you actually have been told to solve, then please tell Musk he needs to start paying Jeffery for engineering services. Sagebrush posted:I feel like rather than digging you should just use a nuclear powered melter machine. Like a TBM but with radiators on the front instead of drills. Suck up the water and pump it through an insulated pipe up to the surface and dispense it as snow. Melting it is a bad idea unless you really need liquid water, since most of the energy goes into the phase change. According to this paper, it takes roughly 13 kJ to cut out a kilogram of ice (and you'd get even better by coring it cylinders rather than converting the whole volume to chips). Melting a kilogram takes 334 kJ. So unless you need liquid water or managing the waste material is too difficult (chip evacuation is a thing!), it's better to cut it: it sounds like they need a lot of ice (presumably for reaction mass? I don't know enough about orbital mechanics to know if refueling at Europa makes a lick of sense.)
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Jan 5, 2024 09:37
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Sagebrush posted:I feel like rather than digging you should just use a nuclear powered melter machine. Like a TBM but with radiators on the front instead of drills. Suck up the water and pump it through an insulated pipe up to the surface and dispense it as snow. I was curious so I did some math, by the power figures given for LA-class nuke sub it would take about 2 weeks for it to melt it's own displacement worth of -150c ice using the full thermal power of it's reactor. Of course that doesn't count thermal conduction to the ice you're not currently trying to melt, so it would be quite a bit slower still.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:39
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Kafouille posted:I was curious so I did some math, by the power figures given for LA-class nuke sub it would take about 2 weeks for it to melt it's own displacement worth of -150c ice using the full thermal power of it's reactor. Of course that doesn't count thermal conduction to the ice you're not currently trying to melt, so it would be quite a bit slower still. That is a serious loving nuclear reactor, jesus. Looks like an S6G weighs about 150 tons for the entire package, for 156 MW thermal. That's a thousand times more thermal output than any reactor put into space. I guess if you were going to put that into space you'd just position it far away from everyone and drop a lot of the shielding? And really, really hope you don't crash.
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Jan 5, 2024 09:52
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holy gently caress https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwhnArkZTu8
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Jan 5, 2024 09:55
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https://twitter.com/Thinkwert/status/1743011990568567157?t=NfF83XDq06Sk7kbHP9E-4Q&s=19
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Jan 5, 2024 10:04
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Fumble posted:holy gently caress https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwhnArkZTu8 You mean your car doesnt have a jump button?
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Jan 5, 2024 10:10
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Karia posted:That is a serious loving nuclear reactor, jesus. Looks like an S6G weighs about 150 tons for the entire package, for 156 MW thermal. That's a thousand times more thermal output than any reactor put into space. I guess if you were going to put that into space you'd just position it far away from everyone and drop a lot of the shielding? And really, really hope you don't crash. The sub has the advantage of being surrounded by a free, convenient heatsink after all, shedding the waste heat in space would be quite an endeavor.
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Jan 5, 2024 10:13
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Well obviously you'd chain drill by melting, and cut out ice blocks. I'll leave the details of cutting the bottoms free as an exercise, unless you're going full slot? And then build an igloo over your space squirrel base with them, to keep the Vorlons out. Fastest MRR available, unless someone makes a porta-band with a big enough throat for the planetoid in question? Sorry I'm late here, was busy trying to place an order and wait 7-14 days for some 4" wide 3/16" steel strips to arrive! Now to get the forklift and move the 3 skids of 4'x8' sheets of 3/16" steel stacked 2' tall out of the way... I'm sure I got a better deal per-pound here from the OEM and fedex, instead of the steel house that just dropped these off
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Jan 5, 2024 10:16
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Platystemon posted:Build on Rhea, because it’s one of the more stable ice moons. And you would become known as the "goon o' Rhea".
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Jan 5, 2024 10:30
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Fumble posted:holy gently caress https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwhnArkZTu8 Lmao at using a film production clip as news
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Jan 5, 2024 12:01
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"All weather" football pitches.  https://twitter.com/Copa90/status/1743225657851593179
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Jan 5, 2024 13:11
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Jippa posted:"All weather" football pitches. If there's splash on the field, play ball.
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Jan 5, 2024 13:21
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Slats on a plasma table don't need to be replaced on Friday. The extra build up on the slats allows more slag to fill the table. CUT CUT CUT
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Jan 5, 2024 15:36
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Jan 5, 2024 15:58
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Speaking of ablative PPE,
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Jan 5, 2024 17:23
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Jippa posted:"All weather" football pitches. Brings new meaning to "lightly-injured footballer takes a dive"
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Jan 5, 2024 17:28
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Jippa posted:"All weather" football pitches. “There’s a larger pool of footy players this year “
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Jan 5, 2024 17:31
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Jippa posted:"All weather" football pitches. Looks like a pretty standard diving school.
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Jan 5, 2024 18:32
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Jippa posted:"All weather" football pitches. Welp, time to switch to water polo.
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Jan 5, 2024 21:02
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more like assoakiation football
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Jan 5, 2024 21:05
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Underwater polo is a thing now, I guess.
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Jan 5, 2024 22:44
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Karia posted:What I was going for was, why are you asking the question? Are you just curious if it's possible? Is this for a story? Or is this a serious engineering challenge that you actually want to do? To boldly build like no man has built before.
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Jan 5, 2024 23:14
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Latest goon project: colonize an ice moon.
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Jan 6, 2024 04:41
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https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-wants-faa-to-exempt-max-7-from-safety-rules-to-get-it-in-the-air/ Boeing wants to leverage all it's stellar safety history to be allowed to skip the safety checks on the max 7
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Jan 6, 2024 05:16
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Azhais posted:https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-wants-faa-to-exempt-max-7-from-safety-rules-to-get-it-in-the-air/ Remind me whose month‐old plane it was that just violently decompressed on a flight from Portland to Southern California.
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Jan 6, 2024 05:27
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Platystemon posted:Remind me whose month‐old plane it was that just violently decompressed on a flight from Portland to Southern California. Or that just needed to ask all its clients to check on some loose rudder bolts
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Jan 6, 2024 05:29
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wasnt there also some boeing plane that had some warning system that should have been standard as an optional extra?
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Jan 6, 2024 06:26
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Non Compos Mentis posted:wasnt there also some boeing plane that had some warning system that should have been standard as an optional extra? Probably, but nothing is gonna top designing a plane that crashes itself and getting the FAA to approve not training pilots on how to tell the plane to knock it off. Only took 346 lives to figure that one out!
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Jan 6, 2024 06:36
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Azhais posted:https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-wants-faa-to-exempt-max-7-from-safety-rules-to-get-it-in-the-air/ https://x.com/rawsalerts/status/1743476391553683904?s=20
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Jan 6, 2024 06:39
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Non Compos Mentis posted:wasnt there also some boeing plane that had some warning system that should have been standard as an optional extra? it's the same plane. new problem
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Jan 6, 2024 06:43
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