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Xiahou Dun posted:Yeah, I don't know if insulting the judge to his face is a good call when he's the sole person in charge of exactly how hosed you are. I mean it's great foelr everyone not named Trump. Assuming it sticks.
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Jan 11, 2024 20:55
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Xiahou Dun posted:Yeah, I don't know if insulting the judge to his face is a good call when he's the sole person in charge of exactly how hosed you are. Seriously, why the gently caress didn't the judge just cite him for contempt and make him a guest of the state for 48 hours? If I was pulling all these stunts I'd be locked up long before now.
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Jan 11, 2024 21:12
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Cimber posted:Seriously, why the gently caress didn't the judge just cite him for contempt and make him a guest of the state for 48 hours? If I was pulling all these stunts I'd be locked up long before now. It would be cathartic, but he probably doesn't want to get jumped in a dark alley on his way home.
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Jan 11, 2024 21:22
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I mean it's great foelr everyone not named Trump. Assuming it sticks. I try not to assume anyone (even/especially Trump) is a complete moron and actually there's some other strategy, logic, or motive in place (even if it's dumb) but all I can think of is that he knows he's hosed and so he's playing this up to his base. "Oh I'm so persecuted look at me this is unbelievable nobody is treated this unfairly, also give me money" I think Engoron knows this and is trying to thread the needle of giving Trump a LOT of leeway to undercut that narrative while still not letting letting him run completely roughshod. Hence a lot of the permissiveness he's shown.
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Jan 11, 2024 21:25
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KillHour posted:It would be cathartic, but he probably doesn't want to get jumped in a dark alley on his way home. He's already receiving bomb threats, he's probably got a security plan in place DarkHorse posted:I try not to assume anyone (even/especially Trump) is a complete moron and actually there's some other strategy, logic, or motive in place (even if it's dumb) but all I can think of is that he knows he's hosed and so he's playing this up to his base. "Oh I'm so persecuted look at me this is unbelievable nobody is treated this unfairly, also give me money" Pretty much. He's given up on, or never seriously intended to, win a favorable verdict. His strategy is to return to the presidency and make it all disappear
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Jan 11, 2024 21:33
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haveblue posted:
That's a bold strategy Cotton, lets see if it pays off for him.
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Jan 11, 2024 21:36
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Trump's strategy was to get himself in the press as much as possible, to throw enough monkey wrenches into the case so that there's some grounds for appeal (or at least dragging out the appeals process), and to build a media narrative around himself being unjustly persecuted for his fans to gorge on.
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Jan 11, 2024 21:38
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DarkHorse posted:I try not to assume anyone (even/especially Trump) is a complete moron and actually there's some other strategy, logic, or motive in place (even if it's dumb) but all I can think of is that he knows he's hosed and so he's playing this up to his base. "Oh I'm so persecuted look at me this is unbelievable nobody is treated this unfairly, also give me money" He's not a moron but Hanlons razor does not work with Trump because he is clinically insane; specifically, he has one of the most extreme cases of narcissistic personality disorder the world has ever seen. So hes not acting rationally and he isn't evaluating his situation rationally. He can't. He just sees the judge as out to get him personally, because he has a simplistic view of the world that can't grasp anything beyond himself or recognize that other people have motivations any more complex than his own. (If you say Trump doesn't have a disorder because it isn't negatively impacting his life, the legal system is catching up on that front!)
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Jan 11, 2024 21:39
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Cimber posted:Except this is NY state so he can't handwave that away. If he wins the presidency such things as laws and state procedures will cease to exist anyway.
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Jan 11, 2024 22:29
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Comstar posted:If he wins the presidency such things as laws and state procedures will cease to exist anyway. I mean, they've never stopped him before. Literally. Largely because in a surprisingly literal sense he doesn't recognize that they exist. He does stuff because he wants to, and other people just do stuff because they like or don't like him. He doesn't have any other model.
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Jan 11, 2024 22:50
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:He's not a moron but Hanlons razor does not work with Trump because he is clinically insane; specifically, he has one of the most extreme cases of narcissistic personality disorder the world has ever seen. I think insanity is a strong word, but he's definitely cluster B as hell with some Bipolar Disorder thrown in and a smidge of amphetamine abuse for good measure.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:01
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Trial is wrapped. Engoron plans to rule by January 31st.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:34
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Paracaidas posted:Trial is wrapped. Engoron plans to rule by January 31st. i can't imagine he's terribly happy.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:36
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FizFashizzle posted:I think insanity is a strong word, but he's definitely cluster B as hell with some Bipolar Disorder thrown in and a smidge of amphetamine abuse for good measure. Gotta have depression for that bipolar dx. I’m a therapist he’s a pure narcissist and amphetamine abuser.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:45
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Milosh posted:Gotta have depression for that bipolar dx. I’m a therapist he’s a pure narcissist and amphetamine abuser. I'm not a licensed anything in relation to mental health but I am a "survivor", you could say, of a narcissist family member and he is absolutely, one thousand percent, without a doubt a narcissist. I'm not going to be able to write a clinical diagnosis of what he does or why it sets me to red alert status to see his actions or hear his words but it does and I know deeper than my soul he is absolutely a narcissist.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:50
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Cimber posted:i can't imagine he's terribly happy. I imagine Engoron is pretty happy no longer having to hear their arguments.
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Jan 11, 2024 23:54
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bird food bathtub posted:I'm not a licensed anything in relation to mental health but I am a "survivor", you could say, of a narcissist family member and he is absolutely, one thousand percent, without a doubt a narcissist. I'm not going to be able to write a clinical diagnosis of what he does or why it sets me to red alert status to see his actions or hear his words but it does and I know deeper than my soul he is absolutely a narcissist. yep, same. I've never been more sure of anything in my life, you can tell by the way it is
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Jan 12, 2024 00:00
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I read a news article that the reason why Trump was prevented from making a long rambling speech about why he was the most innocent man ever....was because his lawyers didn't file the correct paper work in time. So some of this behaviour is literally because Trump acts like a toddler who wants his play time, and isn't leaving until he gets his play time.
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Jan 12, 2024 00:09
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The Question IRL posted:I read a news article that the reason why Trump was prevented from making a long rambling speech about why he was the most innocent man ever....was because his lawyers didn't file the correct paper work in time. that doesn't capture the whole nuance, Trump's council didn't respond before the judge's deadline, but the response that they didn't give was a promise that Trump wouldn't go on an off-topic rant that the judge stipulated before he would allow Trump to make his own closing
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Jan 12, 2024 00:15
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The Question IRL posted:I read a news article that the reason why Trump was prevented from making a long rambling speech about why he was the most innocent man ever....was because his lawyers didn't file the correct paper work in time. Well this isn't quite right. Trump's lawyers said he was going to, the state said 'uhhh, what? No, that isn't how this works please don't let them do this for all these legal reasons'. The judge said 'this case is weird and trump has reason to want to speak, so I will allow it. But trump has to promise not to be a poo poo heel and only stuck to the facts. Teump' s lawyer responded to that how you can expect. A bunch of back and forth, Trump's mom in law dies, they ask for an extension, judge says no. They don't respond by the second deadline and the judge tells them take it or leave it, they whine about it and then don't reply. So while technically the reason it was denied was that they didn't meet his deadline, the reason they didn't meet the deadline is that trump wouldn't agree to the judge's conditions because those conditions explicitly included 'if he goes off on a tangent I WI have him removed and fined 50,000' and everyone knew he couldn't abide that.
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Jan 12, 2024 02:31
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haveblue posted:He's already receiving bomb threats, he's probably got a security plan in place This is absolutely the strategy and why his lawyers are 100% focused on pleasing the mob boss and not at all concerned with winning the cases. A motion for double jeopardy because you were impeached by congress? Just need to hang on until after the election (going to be very easy to do this with delay tactics, his entire business empire was built on dragging out court cases for decades) when he declares martian law and God president immunity and it all goes away because who's gonna stop him? So far we've had nothing but countless profiles of no courage in Washington that have allowed this fucker to fester for 8 years.
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Jan 12, 2024 02:57
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Asproigerosis posted:when he declares martian law You know, I wouldn’t put it past him tbh.
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Jan 12, 2024 02:58
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Subjunctive posted:You know, I wouldn’t put it past him tbh. True, he already hates doctors and wizards
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Jan 12, 2024 03:30
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haveblue posted:True, he already hates doctors and wizards Wait, so he's a mage slayer barbarian?
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Jan 12, 2024 04:01
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Can Trump shapeshift? Is he especially vulnerable to fire?
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Jan 12, 2024 04:07
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I may be in the minority here but I feel like the judicial system just has to loving break him. Any of the judges involved are well within their rights to legally say he is in contempt and throw him in a cell. Trump is a sociopathic animal that only understands consequences and not consequences. We all know that the judges are terrified of his base and of whatever appeals his legal team is going to file, gently caress it, throw him into a cell. Whatever particular judge makes that decision should just get a ton of private security and bill it out to the taxpayer because who the gently caress cares anymore, throw him into a cell. His base is already doing all the things that everyone is scared of, so stick him in a loving hole and every time he acts out he goes back into the hole for more time. He is a bully and bullies don't understand anything until they get their teeth kicked in. I'm so loving over this.
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Jan 12, 2024 04:51
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cr0y posted:I may be in the minority here but I feel like the judicial system just has to loving break him. It sounds like you forgot how the US legal system works for rich white guys. ESPECIALLY rich white former presidents.
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Jan 12, 2024 06:21
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Charliegrs posted:It sounds like you forgot how the US legal system works for rich white guys. ESPECIALLY rich white former presidents. Normally yes, but it requires that they do some level of playing along and doing their part to keep the gravy train going. Trump is not playing along and the gravy train is looking a bit wobbly
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Jan 12, 2024 06:31
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cr0y posted:I may be in the minority here but I feel like the judicial system just has to loving break him. Laws and their enforcement are about deterrence. There is no deterrence if, especially in cases like Trump, one spends their entire life without feeling consequences severe enough to deter actions. So yeah, it's absurd that we're 3+ years out from this guy committing literal treason and we still have to scream for the legal and political systems to stop keeping their powder dry and hit this guy with something that will mean something, but here we are. Him getting kicked off the ballot in 2 states is the most real impact I've seen, and even that is still up in the air.
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Jan 12, 2024 06:53
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cr0y posted:I may be in the minority here but I feel like the judicial system just has to loving break him. The reason they aren't throwing Trump in jail for contempt isn't because they're scared of his base. It's because he's well within his rights to make unlikely legal arguments and whine about the trial on Twitter. Contempt is very much a last resort, not a first resort. The power to arbitrarily jail someone indefinitely is one that should be exercised very rarely and very carefully, even if you hate the target and feel like they don't deserve due process. If you're this worked up about the trials, then you should honestly stop following them day-to-day. Check back in six months or so. TV/IVing stuff like this is a bad idea if you're heavily emotionally invested in the result, because the legal system is generally not paced for good entertainment. Especially when it comes to the prosecution of organized crime bosses for organized crimes mostly carried out by their lackeys, something which is notoriously difficult to prosecute on.
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Jan 12, 2024 07:49
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FLIPADELPHIA posted:Mike Duncan wrote a book called The Storm Before the Storm about the century leading up to the fall of the Roman Republic and one of the themes he returns to quite often is the steady erosion of mos maiorum, or the uncodified but vital social norms that formed an important supporting structure in roman civic life. These rules were sacrosanct until they weren't any longer (the book is filled with examples of important Roman figures like Marius, Sulla, and others breaking them), and as these unspoken prohibitions crumbled, ambitious individuals were afforded more and more leeway to blatantly ignore the actual laws. We all know what the result was and reading the book, it was difficult not to see the politics of the last 20 years closely resemble this pattern. I've seen articles and editorials since the early 90s that the USA is speed-running the Roman empire. The only change I've ever seen in the discussion is to what will cause it. I dug around but it's difficult to find articles pre-dating the internet.
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Jan 12, 2024 08:02
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Main Paineframe posted:Contempt is very much a last resort, not a first resort. And Trump has done a whole lot of things to either push the judges buttons or outright piss in his face. Anyone else pulling the poo poo he has would've been slapped in jail over a contempt charge and no one would've batted an eye.
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Jan 12, 2024 08:29
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FLIPADELPHIA posted:Hate to be That Guy but the Ghandi Civ thing is an urban legend Never, it's a real as taser balls heart attack. It's real forever now
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Jan 12, 2024 08:40
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I'm just wondering why no one has directly asked Trump, to his face, "You understand that if you have full immunity, including being allowed to kill your political rivals, that Biden does as well?" It always seems to be people asking lawyers or legal experts, but it see,smloke no one has asked Trump himself. I just want to see his reaction when he realizes that he's saying that it's perfectly fine for himself to be assassinated.
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Jan 12, 2024 12:54
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Something something Biden’s not really president, I’m the best president, the only president ever really… I don’t think it’s be satisfying to watch. But I suspect it might lead to some extra paranoia.
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Jan 12, 2024 13:40
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M.c.P posted:Something something Biden’s not really president, I’m the best president, the only president ever really… Cleary Biden is not the president, as Trump was the rightful winner of the hijacked election, ergo...
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Jan 12, 2024 13:43
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Yeah. Anything Biden does is ipso facto illegitimate because he is not the president. Even though, correct me if I am wrong, if Biden were to come out and say 'yes, every single thing Trump has said about the election is true, I cheated and stole the election," and then even detailed how he did it, he'd remain president, no? Once installed as president the only way you leave office before your term is death, resignation, Article 25, or impeachment, no? Like even if the president is conclusively proven, convicted even, of election fraud, he remains in office until if/when Congress impeaches him.
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Jan 12, 2024 13:43
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Randalor posted:I'm just wondering why no one has directly asked Trump, to his face, "You understand that if you have full immunity, including being allowed to kill your political rivals, that Biden does as well?" It always seems to be people asking lawyers or legal experts, but it see,smloke no one has asked Trump himself. He doesn't have a concept of right and wrong in that sense. He just thinks Biden is too "weak" and "afraid" to order that Trump be assassinated; he also thinks Biden has ordered him to be arrested, charged, etc. HIs response would be that he wouldn't need to do that because he'd have Biden charged and "locked up."
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Jan 12, 2024 13:51
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:Yeah. Anything Biden does is ipso facto illegitimate because he is not the president. Probably? Nothing was written with this scenario in mind. What you said makes as much sense as anything, because it's probably what causes the least amount of disorder, but hoping everyone agrees to what causes the least disorder has, over the past few years, increasingly looked less of a sure thing.
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Jan 12, 2024 14:04
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:Yeah. Anything Biden does is ipso facto illegitimate because he is not the president. Even if there were anything in the Constitution about this, Biden has ABSOLUTE PRESIDENTIAL IMMUNITY against the laws of man and God
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Jan 12, 2024 14:15
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