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Uh… so cops you know those rifles you carry around? The one loving time…
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Jan 15, 2024 01:54
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Yeah! Protect that property with his life!
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Jan 15, 2024 02:23
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https://twitter.com/CENTCOM/status/1746705110401695779?s=20 delusional to try and take on a DDG in a task force with a lone anti-ship cruise missile
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Jan 15, 2024 02:35
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I wonder what type of missile.
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Jan 15, 2024 02:37
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Stultus Maximus posted:I wonder what type of missile. I'm always partial to the C-802
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Jan 15, 2024 02:39
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pmchem posted:delusional to try and take on a DDG in a task force with a lone anti-ship cruise missile Delusional is a strong word. Russia’s fancy stuff doesn’t work right now and the Stark attack, while almost 40 years ago and not an AEGIS destroyer, showed that USN ships might not be as good as “advertised”.
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Jan 15, 2024 03:18
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hobbesmaster posted:Delusional is a strong word. Russia’s fancy stuff doesn’t work right now and the Stark attack, while almost 40 years ago and not an AEGIS destroyer, showed that USN ships might not be as good as “advertised”. .....I suspect a Reagan era attack has little bearing on the readiness of modern US destroyers, and the issue was less around the destroyer and more around its current state, it was not expecting nor watch for an attack and most of its any missile systems stayed in standby until second before it hit. Not really relevant.
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Jan 15, 2024 03:45
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CommieGIR posted:.....I suspect a Reagan era attack has little bearing on the readiness of modern US destroyers, and the issue was less around the destroyer and more around its current state, it was not expecting nor watch for an attack and most of its any missile systems stayed in standby until second before it hit. Not really relevant. My point is more that there are so few publicly known real world tests that it isn’t delusional to try. hobbesmaster fucked around with this message at 06:41 on Jan 15, 2024 |
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Jan 15, 2024 04:07
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If they did land one on a US ship they would very much learn the definition of be careful what you ask for. Intervention would be terrible for the US, but it'd be catastrophic for them
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Jan 15, 2024 06:30
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hobbesmaster posted:Delusional is a strong word. Russia’s fancy stuff doesn’t work right now and the Stark attack, while almost 40 years ago and not an AEGIS destroyer, showed that USN ships might not be as good as “advertised”. Literally every shred of evidence since the Gulf War has borne out that most US weapon systems, though insanely expensive boondoggles, generally work extremely well. Our strategy might be terrible, our goals nonsensical, and our conduct questionable, but the weapons themselves are generally both reasonably functional and terrifyingly lethal. AEGIS certainly has a pretty stellar combat record as far as I'm aware, and has shot down every missile and/or airliner pointed at it since the '80s. e: Like, sure, there's always the chance that something goes wrong and the missile gets lucky. But it's certainly not something I would bet on. I certainly wouldn't say the guys who shot the missile are "delusional" — they may very well have expected the missile to get shot down. But I would have to question their intelligence and foresight if they were seriously anticipating any other result. Acebuckeye13 fucked around with this message at 07:07 on Jan 15, 2024 |
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Jan 15, 2024 07:04
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The real delusional part of firing a cruise missile at a US Navy warship to see what would happen is thinking that there's going to be any positive outcome for you and everyone within a hundred miles of you if it *does* hit.
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Jan 15, 2024 07:15
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Kazinsal posted:The real delusional part of firing a cruise missile at a US Navy warship to see what would happen is thinking that there's going to be any positive outcome for you and everyone within a hundred miles of you if it *does* hit. Propping up a pretender government for 20 years just so your kids have to grow up in a cave.
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Jan 15, 2024 08:03
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Kazinsal posted:The real delusional part of firing a cruise missile at a US Navy warship to see what would happen is thinking that there's going to be any positive outcome for you and everyone within a hundred miles of you if it *does* hit. This seems wild to me, insofar as the whole point of destroyers in a modern navy is to act as missile screens…and not just taking them on the chin either. God help us all once the rest of a strike group gets pissy and starts slinging back more than they already have.
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Jan 15, 2024 08:07
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Soul Dentist posted:Yeah! Protect that property with his life! People sit in cars. Heck sometimes they leave pets and children in them when they run inside to get something.
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Jan 15, 2024 08:16
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Literally every shred of evidence since the Gulf War has borne out that most US weapon systems, though insanely expensive boondoggles, generally work extremely well. Our strategy might be terrible, our goals nonsensical, and our conduct questionable, but the weapons themselves are generally both reasonably functional and terrifyingly lethal. AEGIS certainly has a pretty stellar combat record as far as I'm aware, and has shot down every missile and/or airliner pointed at it since the '80s. It's probably just a PR stunt on the part of the Houthis to show they're still in the fight after last week's airstrikes. They haven't launched any further complex attacks since the US and UK strikes, which would indicate that their capabilities have been degraded, but they're doing this for a domestic and regional media audience who don't know or care.
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Jan 15, 2024 09:32
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Crab Dad posted:People sit in cars. Heck sometimes they leave pets and children in them when they run inside to get something. That cop car certainly had a cop in it. A very angry cop by the looks of it, after he got Bobcatted. Either way, everyone seems to be alive, hopefully insurance will take care of the property damage, Bobcat guy got to have some fun, and everything's OK. E: here's an actual article Bobcat Boy injured at least one person in an occupied vehicle he attacked. Elviscat fucked around with this message at 10:30 on Jan 15, 2024 |
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Jan 15, 2024 10:27
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Elviscat posted:hopefully insurance will take care of the property damage Unless everyone pays for comprehensive with no deductible or that guy is rich, I have bad news.
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Jan 15, 2024 10:49
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Crab Dad posted:People sit in cars. Heck sometimes they leave pets and children in them when they run inside to get something. Thankfully, liqour stores never have people in them, only alcoholics.
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Jan 15, 2024 12:21
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Stravag posted:Thankfully, liqour stores never have people in them, only alcoholics. 
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Jan 15, 2024 13:13
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I was being sarcastic and agreeing with crabdad that its really shortsighted to dismiss it as only property being threatened
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Jan 15, 2024 13:58
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Hell yeah let's pop his head like a balloon with a high caliber rifle bullet to teach him a lesson about being mentally ill in the United States. I, and I cannot believe I have to say this, am also being sarcastic because a cop shooting a gun isn't going to help anything
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Jan 15, 2024 14:36
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Yeah we're pretty all agreed on the ACAB part, but going on a rampage with a bobcat - even if it is slow and goofy - is still assault with a deadly weapon. Like were in austin powers level territory of the classic 'stop or i'll shoot'
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Jan 15, 2024 14:47
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At least the people taking cover/taking video had the situational awareness to realize that that cop was about to start blasting...
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Jan 15, 2024 15:39
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Soul Dentist posted:Hell yeah let's pop his head like a balloon with a high caliber rifle bullet to teach him a lesson about being mentally ill in the United States. I, and I cannot believe I have to say this, am also being sarcastic because a cop shooting a gun isn't going to help anything Hell, when the cop dismounts and has gis pistol drawn, the crowd of onlooker rapidly GTFO as they realize they are the fleshy backstop if the cop starts firing at the bobcat. Thankfully didn’t happen, but that was the moment of checking out the bobcat guy vs mortal danger. Beaten
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Jan 15, 2024 15:41
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hobbesmaster posted:Delusional is a strong word. Russia’s fancy stuff doesn’t work right now and the Stark attack, while almost 40 years ago and not an AEGIS destroyer, showed that USN ships might not be as good as “advertised”. dude the Ukrainians have been shooting down russian hypersonics with export versions of the Patriot for months now and you're questioning whether a task force there to stop missile attacks can shoot down a lone subsonic cruise missile headed at a DDG that has been designed and upgraded over the past 30+ years specifically to stop missile attacks on task forces it didn't even make it to the ship-borne defense layer, it got shot down by some fighter pilot just to show off
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Jan 15, 2024 15:50
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M_Gargantua posted:Yeah we're pretty all agreed on the ACAB part, but going on a rampage with a bobcat - even if it is slow and goofy - is still assault with a deadly weapon. Like were in austin powers level territory of the classic 'stop or i'll shoot' But it being slow is an important point here. It's better that this guy is boxed in with half a dozen police SUVs/APCs that he can destroy until the gas runs out than him getting shot for a menty b.
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Jan 15, 2024 16:22
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AreWeDrunkYet posted:But it being slow is an important point here. It's better that this guy is boxed in with half a dozen police SUVs/APCs that he can destroy until the gas runs out than him getting shot for a menty b. this. its not hard to call up roads and grounds have em bring in 5 or 6 dumptrucks. sure ya might have to replace a tire or two and bang out some dents, but nobody dies because one dude had a bad mental health day.
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Jan 15, 2024 16:51
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pmchem posted:dude the Ukrainians have been shooting down russian hypersonics with export versions of the Patriot for months now and you're questioning whether a task force there to stop missile attacks can shoot down a lone subsonic cruise missile headed at a DDG that has been designed and upgraded over the past 30+ years specifically to stop missile attacks on task forces The DDGs out there are much more alert/prepared, but the 2016 engagement of Houthi-fired anti-ship missiles, while successful, wasn't all high fives and cocky assuredness. The US Navy even used the example in its pitch for new "Warrior Toughness" training for sailors. https://www.usna.edu/CoreEthics/syllabus/classes/Vampire,_Vampire.pdf quote:After alerting the crew of the incoming threat, Mason’s on-watch Tactical Action Officer If you want to have some level of assuredness that you will destroy a ship, one missile sure isn't it, but you only have to get lucky once with a system being down, sensors not tuned well, crew behaving improperly. Air defense is one of those jobs where the sensors and people and weapons all hve to be "on" all the time, so you're rarely going to be able to count on something approaching a 100% intercept rate. Plus, if you ant to send a message that one night of airstrikes isn't gong to make the Houthis back down, a missile is a pretty clear way to do it. They're a tenacious and experienced organization.
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Jan 15, 2024 17:13
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AreWeDrunkYet posted:But it being slow is an important point here. It's better that this guy is boxed in with half a dozen police SUVs/APCs that he can destroy until the gas runs out than him getting shot for a menty b.
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Jan 15, 2024 17:16
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Houthis don't have to hit anything. They are putting pressure on vessel traffic through the region and forcing coalition forces to be on and actively patrolling. Most companies have diverted vessel traffic around the Cape at this point. MSP vessels have been delayed for weeks from moving through, along with other commercial traffic. You can check with USN people but all our forces are already spread thin so extended actions/deployments aren't a good thing. The Suez is also a major source of revenue for Egypt so this greatly affects them. Unions are pushing for wartime/hazard pay for sailors in the region and there's a huge shortage of qualified personnel. The USCG recently relaxed requirements for upgrade from ordinary seaman to able seaman because they can't fill slots. This also highlights how weak US logistics chains are. If there were multiple actions across the globe its unlikely the US has the capacity to supply them all, the Navy has already stated that convoys like WWII aren't possible, they don't have the resources to cover them and merchant shipping will be on their own for the most part.
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Jan 15, 2024 17:31
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Aren't our military logistics ships completely outdated and falling apart, too?
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Jan 15, 2024 17:45
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~56 ships in the national defense fleet for MARAD with MSC ships under operational command of the USN. Cape Hs for example are >40 years old and the government wants them to last another 20 years. They still have spring close exhaust valves and belong in a museum. These are supplemented by MSP and TSP vessels which are required to be <20 years old.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:01
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Cugel the Clever posted:I don't understand what you're responding to in that post. They weren't asserting that everyone ending up alive at the end of the day was in any way a bad thing, just that it would be naive to argue that there was no circumstance in which an attack with a Bobcat wouldn't entirely warrant lethal force. There are circumstances where an attack with a stuffed animal warrants lethal force. But it should still be the last option on the list, especially when there’s no imminent need to make an immediate decision.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:08
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It amazes me that we spend $800+ billion a year on 'defense', but our actual equipment is just as ancient, grizzled, and broken-down as our politicians are.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:08
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pseudosavior posted:It amazes me that we spend $800+ billion a year on 'defense', but our actual equipment is just as ancient, grizzled, and broken-down as our politicians are. Because defense spending is a political act not a military act.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:16
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AreWeDrunkYet posted:There are circumstances where an attack with a stuffed animal warrants lethal force. But it should still be the last option on the list, especially when there’s no imminent need to make an immediate decision. Did you check every car in the parking lot for people? No elderly or children? (Why didn’t these people run out of their cars through the icy parking lot in the first place?) Ok have fun organizing 10 cops on your boxing in expedition with no prior training on the exceptionally unlikely scenario of rampaging cutie tractor. Lol they can’t even take a school shooter out of a school without wasting 10 hours. I would literally pay money to see that.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:16
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I don't understand why SUV officer didn't just ram it broadside and flip it. But then again, I value life more than the average cop, it seems.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:31
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bulletsponge13 posted:I don't understand why SUV officer didn't just ram it broadside and flip it. But then again, I value life more than the average cop, it seems. Those things are usually heavier than an SUV and its generally low to the ground to keep it stable on loose soil. They start at 5,000 lbs and only get significantly heavier, up to 12,000 lbs.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:36
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That would be an lol/lmao moment Forklifts are no joke
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Jan 15, 2024 18:37
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not only heavy, but it turns out that even a front end loader needs quite a low center of gravity to function.
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Jan 15, 2024 18:58
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