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Warmachine
Jan 30, 2012



quote:

An explanatory conversation was held with the allies, now they will stop shooting you in the back with burst attacks;

:allears:

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Janissary Hop
Sep 2, 2012

quote:

An explanatory conversation was held with the allies, now they will stop shooting you in the back with burst attacks;

BOOOOOOOOO. Getting annihilated by Jae's team in her recruitment quest is an experience everyone should go through.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012
I'm more curious if this also means enemies won't shoot each other in the back. Early on that was quite helpful in certain fights.

The Lord of Hats
Aug 22, 2010

Hello, yes! Is being very good day for posting, no?

quote:

Flame weapon expert talent was reducing the firing cost of some abilities to zero - fixed;

:negative:

I mean, obviously this wasn't intended behavior, and it's not like it really makes Argenta less cracked than she already is, but dammit I was using that bug. Next you're going to tell me that I'm not going to randomly get even more extra attacks on turns than I was supposed to. Or that that's just me being unable to count, which is also possible, but I'm pretty positive I've had Cassia use the same attack three times in a turn.

Or that you'll fix The shields handed out by the Occluding Sphere on that one Nurgle-infested Inquisition Ship killing the unit they're on once broken, turning them from a buff to a really substantial debuff.

Janissary Hop
Sep 2, 2012

By the way, I don't know if everyone just knew this and it was only me assuming it was impossible because it's so stupid: you can repair your ship during ship combat. Just open up the ship management screen like normal. Impossible to tell if this is intended or not, because lowlcat.

Zodium
Jun 19, 2004

Janissary Hop posted:

By the way, I don't know if everyone just knew this and it was only me assuming it was impossible because it's so stupid: you can repair your ship during ship combat. Just open up the ship management screen like normal. Impossible to tell if this is intended or not, because lowlcat.

lmfao. did not know this.

Preechr
May 19, 2009

Proud member of the Pony-Brony Alliance for Obama as President

Janissary Hop posted:

By the way, I don't know if everyone just knew this and it was only me assuming it was impossible because it's so stupid: you can repair your ship during ship combat. Just open up the ship management screen like normal. Impossible to tell if this is intended or not, because lowlcat.
:lmao: can you change equipment, too?

Quicksilver6
Mar 21, 2008



“Rogue Trader, why not simply tell the crew NOT to let the ship explode?”

“I COULD DO THAT THIS WHOLE TIME?!”

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

If an Officer can simply yell at someone to not die then I don't see why they can't do the same to a ship.

Arglebargle III
Feb 21, 2006

If there's any one thing 40K believes in absolutely it's the power of yelling.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

If Orcs can do it then so can the Rogue Trader.

Soylent Pudding
Jun 22, 2007

We've got people!


The idea of all initiative being ground out of the lower decks crew to the point where they will look at a hole in the hull and refuse to start patching it without direct orders, lest the be executed for acting without authorization feels extremely 40k though.

Warmachine
Jan 30, 2012



Soylent Pudding posted:

The idea of all initiative being ground out of the lower decks crew to the point where they will look at a hole in the hull and refuse to start patching it without direct orders, lest the be executed for acting without authorization feels extremely 40k though.

I mean, I feel it's more of a time problem. Those serfs are loving quick if they can bodge together a 10% hull into a 100% hull in the time it takes me to bring the ship about.

edit: Work like that is worth one extra meal. But not two. Three meals a day is heresy and a clear sign of madness.

Old Doggy Bastard
Dec 18, 2008

Can my secret companion equip items yet? That seems like a big issue and easy fix.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



Warmachine posted:

I mean, I feel it's more of a time problem. Those serfs are loving quick if they can bodge together a 10% hull into a 100% hull in the time it takes me to bring the ship about.

edit: Work like that is worth one extra meal. But not two. Three meals a day is heresy and a clear sign of madness.
I had a dark chortle when that came up on the prison planet

Warmachine
Jan 30, 2012



Nessus posted:

I had a dark chortle when that came up on the prison planet

They understand the rules better than any character in 40k.

FuzzySlippers
Feb 6, 2009

Patch didn't fix my problem. I still get stuck in a conversation in act 4 and can't advance to the meeting.

Szarrukin
Sep 29, 2021

FuzzySlippers posted:

Patch didn't fix my problem. I still get stuck in a conversation in act 4 and can't advance to the meeting.

Ok, so my break from RT still continues.

Ojetor
Aug 4, 2010

Return of the Sensei

Finished the game. Iconoclast ending with Nomos. Slides were overall positive other than loving Pasqal killing Yrliet and not even caring after she tried to parlay with him? What an rear end in a top hat! I assume if you don't have Nomos become the C'tan your breakway little kingdom is just crushed by the Imperium when they invade? That's about what I'd expect.

Really liked it overall but really the game system is just stupid broken. Even playing on daring, the last half of the game (like 50+ hours of playtime) was every single combat encounter ending before enemies were able to act. In the whole of acts 3 to 5, maybe 20 enemy actions happened, total. I might as well have been playing with the Toybox murderhobo toggle. Even the final boss didn't get a turn besides a couple of scripted attacks interrupting my chain turns bullshit.

I don't think it can be reasonably fixed, either. Entire archetypes are explicitly based around ridiculously broken mechanics like granting extra turns, always going first, versatility, lethality, the list goes on. Feels like every other talent and item is yet another absurdly scaling damage modifier to add to your number soup. Even boss tier enemies can rarely survive a single attack from all the wild poo poo the party is putting out. The combat was kinda cool at the start but player power quickly spirals out of control even if you're not trying too hard or don't know the system.

In WotR, for all the faults of Pathfinder 1e, it at least felt like enemies could pull some nasty poo poo on you sometimes. Even if you had broken builds. In this game it's no loving contest, you always go first and do some insane time fuckery of giving various people extra turns and making a dozen attacks in a turn and then everything is dead.

I did enjoy the space combat, reminded me of playing the X-wing minis game a decade ago. Wish that part of the game was a bit more fleshed out, definitely better than loving Crusade mode.

Ojetor fucked around with this message at 09:18 on Jan 19, 2024

evilmiera
Dec 14, 2009

Status: Ravenously Rambunctious

Szarrukin posted:

Ok, so my break from RT still continues.

Legit wait until early summer, it won't be playable until then. Owlcat always has these issues and with how the beta looked it was a given it would take that long to fix it.

12Apr1961
Dec 7, 2013

Ojetor posted:

I don't think it can be reasonably fixed, either. Entire archetypes are explicitly based around ridiculously broken mechanics like granting extra turns, always going first, versatility, lethality, the list goes on. Feels like every other talent and item is yet another absurdly scaling damage modifier to add to your number soup. Even boss tier enemies can rarely survive a single attack from all the wild poo poo the party is putting out. The combat was kinda cool at the start but player power quickly spirals out of control even if you're not trying too hard or don't know the system.

I don’t know, this feels like something that could be done as a balance patch or mod?

Grant extra turns? Sure, except that the target can’t use any 0 AP attacks on it. So, the target gets 2 AP, enough for a single deadeye shot or burst fire, but no Death Whisper for Assassin, no free attacks for Arch-Militant. Still a good ability - one attack from the target, one attack from the officer, but the officer has to spread their abilities between buffing and direct attacks.

Other stackable abilities need limits too. Versatility stacks can be limited by Willpower bonus, for example. Wildfire minimum AP cost could be 1 AP. Cassia’s WP stacking can be limited by her Fellowship bonus. Lethality can be capped at Agility+Perception, or something like that (my main is an Assassin, but I haven't paid too much attention to it - my main job is to go first and kill a mook, so we can start chaining heroic acts).

Momentum gains need to be re-worked too. Maybe no momentum gains for kills made on heroic act turns / actions?

I liked the feeling of X-COM lite in Act 1 and early Act 2, but now that I’ve finished Act 2, later parts of it did feel rather ridiculous, with combat going “the enemy Space Marine takes a single potshot at us, we kill everything on the battlefield”.

FuzzySlippers
Feb 6, 2009

Ojetor posted:

I don't think it can be reasonably fixed, either. Entire archetypes are explicitly based around ridiculously broken mechanics like granting extra turns, always going first, versatility, lethality, the list goes on. Feels like every other talent and item is yet another absurdly scaling damage modifier to add to your number soup. Even boss tier enemies can rarely survive a single attack from all the wild poo poo the party is putting out. The combat was kinda cool at the start but player power quickly spirals out of control even if you're not trying too hard or don't know the system.

In WotR, for all the faults of Pathfinder 1e, it at least felt like enemies could pull some nasty poo poo on you sometimes. Even if you had broken builds. In this game it's no loving contest, you always go first and do some insane time fuckery of giving various people extra turns and making a dozen attacks in a turn and then everything is dead.

I did enjoy the space combat, reminded me of playing the X-wing minis game a decade ago. Wish that part of the game was a bit more fleshed out, definitely better than loving Crusade mode.

Yeah, fixing is going to require such a significant rework that I'm not expecting them to do it especially with how many bugs are left in the game. They certainly didn't do anything like that before though those were adaptations instead of so much of their own systems work. Maybe to coincide with dlc a long time from now, but I'm more hopeful about a reimagined system in a mod if it's possible with the tools available.

Also agree the space combat is awesome and I hope they consider a spinoff or dlc focus. I'd happily play a game with mostly space combat and only a little bit of on foot stuff.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

12Apr1961 posted:

I liked the feeling of X-COM lite in Act 1 and early Act 2, but now that I’ve finished Act 2, later parts of it did feel rather ridiculous, with combat going “the enemy Space Marine takes a single potshot at us, we kill everything on the battlefield”.

Should have used Seize the Initiative and Grand Strategist to kill everything on the battlefield before the enemy space marine gets to take that potshot.

The Lord of Hats
Aug 22, 2010

Hello, yes! Is being very good day for posting, no?
It'd be one thing if the system was breakable if you knew what you were doing and worked towards it, but it's basically inevitable that you're going to end up doing the broken stuff without even particularly aiming for it. I think you'd have to actively try to avoid it, actually. Your archetype options are too limited for that not to be the case--if you're not making Argenta an Arch-Militant, you're putting her in... what, Bounty Hunter (which is a class that as far as I can tell is just finnicky work for no real payoff).

Give me an archetype for heavy weapons! Or something even more melee focused, or make psyker an archetype instead of just "Thing you also do and put all your investment into instead of the archetype you supposedly are".

Bohemian Nights
Jul 14, 2006

When I wake up,
I look into the mirror
I can see a clearer, vision
I should start living today
Clapping Larry
My word, who thought it was a good idea to have this CYOA section in space Menzoberranzan that outright kills you if you fail a skill check. Especially funny when it kills you even when you supposedly have a 100% chance of success

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012

The Lord of Hats posted:

It'd be one thing if the system was breakable if you knew what you were doing and worked towards it, but it's basically inevitable that you're going to end up doing the broken stuff without even particularly aiming for it. I think you'd have to actively try to avoid it, actually. Your archetype options are too limited for that not to be the case--if you're not making Argenta an Arch-Militant, you're putting her in... what, Bounty Hunter (which is a class that as far as I can tell is just finnicky work for no real payoff).

Give me an archetype for heavy weapons! Or something even more melee focused, or make psyker an archetype instead of just "Thing you also do and put all your investment into instead of the archetype you supposedly are".

Yeah but there's a very tiny range of flexibility given how the developed the enemy power curve and a total rework would require not only massive amounts of effort on how the classes work but to then balance the entire game's combat against that hopefully in a less Owlcat way then standard.

Gainsboro
Feb 28, 2023

Twenty Year Lurker

Ojetor posted:

I assume if you don't have Nomos become the C'tan your breakway little kingdom is just crushed by the Imperium when they invade? That's about what I'd expect.
On my heretical run the Nomos quest broke for me and I couldn't complete it, but I was still able to harness the power of the shard and rule the sector with a tzeentchy fist without Nomos.

Ojetor posted:

reminded me of playing the X-wing minis game a decade ago.
I would kill for a vidya with a similar ruleset, even if we'd probably miss out on funny player fumbles like crashing into asteroids.

Arglebargle III
Feb 21, 2006

Bounty Hunter does what it says on the tin, it gives you massive crits on 3 targets per combat. It's just that arch militants and assassins get to do that to everyone for free.

Relevant Tangent
Nov 18, 2016

Tangentially Relevant

12Apr1961 posted:

I don’t know, this feels like something that could be done as a balance patch or mod?

Grant extra turns? Sure, except that the target can’t use any 0 AP attacks on it. So, the target gets 2 AP, enough for a single deadeye shot or burst fire, but no Death Whisper for Assassin, no free attacks for Arch-Militant. Still a good ability - one attack from the target, one attack from the officer, but the officer has to spread their abilities between buffing and direct attacks.

Other stackable abilities need limits too. Versatility stacks can be limited by Willpower bonus, for example. Wildfire minimum AP cost could be 1 AP. Cassia’s WP stacking can be limited by her Fellowship bonus. Lethality can be capped at Agility+Perception, or something like that (my main is an Assassin, but I haven't paid too much attention to it - my main job is to go first and kill a mook, so we can start chaining heroic acts).

Momentum gains need to be re-worked too. Maybe no momentum gains for kills made on heroic act turns / actions?

I liked the feeling of X-COM lite in Act 1 and early Act 2, but now that I’ve finished Act 2, later parts of it did feel rather ridiculous, with combat going “the enemy Space Marine takes a single potshot at us, we kill everything on the battlefield”.

it's a single player game, if you want to make it suck feel free but none of your ideas are things anyone who enjoys the game now wants

Servetus
Apr 1, 2010
I wish Homeworld/Origin had some more reactivity. Playing as Voidborn is wild when your High Factotum reminisces about hunting and killing Voidborn for sport, to your face. And there is no option to space him because the game doesn't have homeworld checks for dialogue.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012

Servetus posted:

I wish Homeworld/Origin had some more reactivity. Playing as Voidborn is wild when your High Factotum reminisces about hunting and killing Voidborn for sport, to your face. And there is no option to space him because the game doesn't have homeworld checks for dialogue.

Yeah but those are the lower class voidborn, not the 'noble' families.

It's wild how little reactive content there is for a sanctioned psyker as well.

Phoix
Jul 20, 2006




Man the start of chapter 3 is a truly souring experience. I'm pretty sure this is numerically impossible for me without using toybox

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

What Class are you?
You shouldn't be getting into any fights until you've had a chance to recover a companion or two.

Phoix
Jul 20, 2006




The Lone Badger posted:

What Class are you?
You shouldn't be getting into any fights until you've had a chance to recover a companion or two.

I'm a psyker but I ended up with too many stacks of perplexed so I'm pretty much just a brief meat shield, and the party members I ended up with aren't really suitable for the fight. I should probably just reload to the beginning of the chapter and not do any skill checks

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

Yeah I guess that could be pretty rough. I was a officer/tactician who picked up Argenta and Abelard before my first fight so everything went pretty smoothly.

Buschmaki
Dec 26, 2012

‿︵‿︵‿︵‿Lean Addict︵‿︵‿︵‿

Relevant Tangent posted:

it's a single player game, if you want to make it suck feel free but none of your ideas are things anyone who enjoys the game now wants

I'd like the game more if the gameplay didnt suck, personally

CmdrSmirnoff
Oct 27, 2005
happy happy happy happy happy happy happy happy happy
This is the only thing I've been playing lately and I just beat it. Random thoughts:

- game good. Compared to BG3 it's hard to tell which is "better", but I left BG3 in the last act to play this all the way through...
- bugs, but it's noticeably better as the patches have rolled in. The camera is still atrocious though.
- too many loving levelups, oh my god. I didn't even bother respeccing anyone the entire game because I dreaded having to go through it again.
- too many cinematics that are just some rear end in a top hat crawling slowly across the map to do a salute animation or some stupid poo poo
- I thought the combat was a blast because the combat is as broken as you want it to be. There's obviously completely OP poo poo out there but you don't have to abuse it. Why bother if it's not fun? Why force yourself to use extra turn + Argenta and then complain? Take the 12 ROF bolter out of her hands and try other stuff, because it's all pretty good. Or just see how bad you can break it and have your power fantasy. There's a ton of options out there.

Solid 8/10, got my money's worth, will come back in a few years to see what's changed.

Pershing
Feb 21, 2010

John "Black Jack" Pershing
Hard Fucking Core

CmdrSmirnoff posted:

- The camera is still atrocious though.

It's some iron law of 40k games that they have to terrible third person perspectives. Mechanicus was a little better but still...

CmdrSmirnoff posted:

- too many loving levelups, oh my god. I didn't even bother respeccing anyone the entire game because I dreaded having to go through it again.

I seriously don't understand why we have to go thru that poo poo...'granular' is an understatement. Is it a reflection of the TTRPG?

CmdrSmirnoff posted:


- I thought the combat was a blast because the combat is as broken as you want it to be.

Ancient Plasma Rifle still hasn't been patched and I'm thrilled. Bounty Hunter Pasqal with this is loving awesome.

Griddle of Love
May 14, 2020


Pershing posted:

I seriously don't understand why we have to go thru that poo poo...'granular' is an understatement. Is it a reflection of the TTRPG?

Yes, but it's so much worse in the CRPG. They really amped it up to eleven.

The TTRPG is so granular you don't even have levels, you just spend xp on individual advancements whenever you have enough for that specific advancement.

Griddle of Love fucked around with this message at 14:41 on Jan 20, 2024

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Eifert Posting
Apr 1, 2007

Most of the time he catches it every time.
Grimey Drawer

Griddle of Love posted:

Yes, but it's so much worse in the CRPG. They really amped it up to eleven.

The TTRPG is so granular you don't even have levels, you just spend xp on individual advancements whenever you have enough for that specific advancement.

The first video playthrough I saw of Rogue Trader had a character the DM had to scold because he would just hold on to his points until he needed to do something and level up a skill when it came up.

By the end of the game the guy had the equivalent of like three or four levels that he just never bothered to cash in.

So many painting hours spent listening in on Grey Hunter and cknoor rogue trader.

A part of me wishes that they had somehow done a perfect translation of the pen and paper acquisition system. Just type an item description into the search bar and hit enter and some dice roll behind the scenes and you either have it or you don't. Then you plug another name into the search engine and the game pauses and yells at you because you're 40 minutes into a 3-hour session and you haven't done poo poo other than look for plasma rifles.

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