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You know, when the Oblivion potato people reacted the same way it wasn't quite as horrifying. Edited for context and snype:
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Jan 21, 2024 18:12
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| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:24 |
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This game has a lot of flaws and things it could/should have done better. That being said, it still grabbed me and I have over 200 hours played. Currently on my 6th NG+ and I'm finding new POIs and ways to roleplay. For instance, on this NG+ I was excited to find the Hunter had already killed everyone in Constellation including myself which was the perfect opportunity to play as a baddie, which I never do in Bethesda games. I did some crimes right off the bat to get arrested and went right into the Crimson Fleet questline. Now I just fly around killing and spacejacking people with no ties to anyone or responsibilities. It's made me understand and sympathize with the Hunter more than I had previously. I'm treating everyone and everything as a cynical means to an end, just like he taught me. And I ran into the Starseed quest and Vulture's Roost which were both new to me after 200+ hours. There's a lot of meat on this bone despite the issues and all the negativity. FistEnergy fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Jan 21, 2024 |
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Jan 21, 2024 19:59
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"lotta meat on this bone" says man cracking through bone with bare teeth.
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Jan 21, 2024 20:32
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"lot of candy left in this piñata", says man as wax lips, circus peanuts, and candy corn bounce off his head
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Jan 21, 2024 20:40
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“Plenty of tread left on these tires” as the man skids down the street on metal rims, showering horrified onlookers with sparks. “Lots of life left in this horse,” as I go to rain another furious blow on the equine skeleton. “Plenty of laughs to be had with this joke format,” as I goonishly run an originally fun premise into the ground.
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Jan 21, 2024 20:45
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that's okay, I'll still keep playing that garbage
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Jan 21, 2024 22:18
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I'm still playing, too. On my NG+ game I have not gone to Constellation at all, I just headed out into the unknown and started base building on the same planet as the Mantis hideout. The other day it started bugging out, when I would open up the scanner it hard locked the game time and time again. So, I flew off into the galaxy and did some random poo poo. I think it was a day or two real time before I thought about going back to drop off resources and while the planet has the indicator on it that there is an outpost there (edit; the little triangle-ish thing on the planet, not the diamond one on the surface)...you can't see it anymore, there isn't a landing spot for it at all. Well, I had landed on the planet a few times before and I knew one of those landing zones was nearby the base I built so I managed to find it and walked over to my base and stupidly opened up the scanner and it locked up again.  I've started a new base, elsewhere in the great beyond. SIGH
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Jan 21, 2024 22:33
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Barometer posted:I'm still playing, too. On my NG+ game I have not gone to Constellation at all, I just headed out into the unknown and started base building on the same planet as the Mantis hideout. The other day it started bugging out, when I would open up the scanner it hard locked the game time and time again. So, I flew off into the galaxy and did some random poo poo. I think it was a day or two real time before I thought about going back to drop off resources and while the planet has the indicator on it that there is an outpost there (edit; the little triangle-ish thing on the planet, not the diamond one on the surface)...you can't see it anymore, there isn't a landing spot for it at all. Wonder if you're having this problem: https://www.pcgamesn.com/starfield/new-game-plus-bug quote:This Starfield bug crashes your game more if you don’t New Game Plus
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Jan 21, 2024 22:38
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Oy Vey. I've done a lot so I wonder if getting the ball rolling by going to Constellation will help, at this point. It hasn't really been crashing on the other planets or anything, but still.
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Jan 21, 2024 23:08
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DancingShade posted:Wonder if you're having this problem: they fixed this in the beta patch iirc.
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Jan 22, 2024 02:19
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FistEnergy posted:This game has a lot of flaws and things it could/should have done better. That being said, it still grabbed me and I have over 200 hours played. Currently on my 6th NG+ and I'm finding new POIs and ways to roleplay. For instance, on this NG+ I was excited to find the Hunter had already killed everyone in Constellation including myself which was the perfect opportunity to play as a baddie, which I never do in Bethesda games. What sort of new POIs did you see? Because I got real tired of the identikit Abandoned Robotics Facilities, all with the same person having been crushed under a catwalk.
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Jan 22, 2024 09:41
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The crushed worker was in the original blueprint, so every time a team goes out to build a new one they draw straws to see who gets to be retired.
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Jan 22, 2024 10:58
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Say what you will about the game's issues, at least it provokes discussion/complaints.
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Jan 22, 2024 11:26
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In conclusion, Starfield is a land of contrast.
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Jan 22, 2024 11:32
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Sandepande posted:Say what you will about the game's issues, at least it provokes discussion/complaints. Thank you BSG!
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Jan 22, 2024 13:17
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It's nice, those who like the game can play it, and those who don't get to tear into it.
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Jan 22, 2024 13:24
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Sandepande posted:Say what you will about the game's issues, at least it provokes discussion/complaints. *entire audience of Bethesda all hands groans*
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Jan 22, 2024 13:25
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Wipfmetz posted:I've said it once, and I'll say it again: I had more fun with this thread than with the game itself. You would enjoy the Star Citizen thread. 
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Jan 22, 2024 13:47
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FishMcCool posted:You would enjoy the Star Citizen thread. Yeah but I was smart enough not to buy that
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Jan 22, 2024 13:55
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FistEnergy posted:Now I just fly around killing and spacejacking people with no ties to anyone or responsibilities. It's made me understand and sympathize with the Hunter more than I had previously. I'm treating everyone and everything as a cynical means to an end, just like he taught me. This is an unintended consequence of the game's problems; he doesn't care about the world or the people in it because he's an immortal divorced from the human race, we don't care because the game's failings leave us unengaged with large sections of the game, coasting along through the inertia of the Bethesda gameplay loop or tinkering with the ship builder.
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Jan 22, 2024 14:03
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Jack B Nimble posted:we don't care because the game's failings leave us unengaged with large sections of the game, coasting along through the inertia of the Bethesda gameplay loop or tinkering with the ship builder. Maybe that was intentional and this is Art.
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Jan 22, 2024 14:08
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Strange hostility to people who have had the nerve to openly enjoy this game. I haven't played it in weeks, but I remember entering a kind of fugue state when I played. One where my intellect understood that the game was bad as I was playing, that all I was doing was running through corridors, opening doors and menus, navigating interstitial loading screens, ignoring bland dialogue and bunny hopping around, but my impulses to check boxes just wouldn't let me stop playing. It's the most boring but also one of the most moreish games I've played recently, I still think to myself about hopping back in.
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Jan 22, 2024 14:29
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I liked enough, but I find the regressions from previous Bethesda RPGs frustrating. At various points they've made more cohesive engaging games but Starfield has so many weird gaps that detract from the experience. But of course, if you're having fun, keep on keepin on.
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Jan 22, 2024 14:46
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I don't think people are hostile to others enjoying Starfield, just frustrated with design choices. Bethesda games can be compelling and enjoyable, this felt like a step backward in most if not all respects. Despite that it's still... ok. Not great, but I wouldn't say it's actively bad either. If you enjoy it as-is, that's great and I hope you continue to have fun with it. I'm doing a second playthrough trying to see stuff I didn't before - I did the starborn thing too early the first time and having everything taken away from you really, really sucked in a game ostensibly centered around collecting/building outposts, ships, and weapons. I'm interested in seeing where the community and further patches/xpacs take it.
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Jan 22, 2024 15:14
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Philippe posted:In conclusion, Starfield is a land of contrast. Not with the default display settings where everything is washed out! 
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Jan 22, 2024 15:33
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Punished Ape posted:I don't think people are hostile to others enjoying Starfield, just frustrated with design choices. Bethesda games can be compelling and enjoyable, this felt like a step backward in most if not all respects. Despite that it's still... ok. Not great, but I wouldn't say it's actively bad either. If you enjoy it as-is, that's great and I hope you continue to have fun with it. All the things they did over the years to "dumb down the RPG" in terms of less annoying levelling systems made their games a lot more fun to play. For all the teeth gnashing about how fallout 4 killed the series by not adding triple digit numbers to the levelling meter, one of the more substantive complaints that got lost was "hey building a network of settlements requires a ton of charisma and locks out playstyles." Then they went ahead and made the entire tree just like that. Research should have been an alternate way to unlock things instead of skill points.
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Jan 22, 2024 16:45
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someone on reddit posted comparison shots of the lighting tweaks from the beta, and they're actually pretty significant. mostly for the better imo https://www.reddit.com/r/Starfield/comments/19cxq2e/lighting_changes_from_the_beta_update_19470/
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Jan 22, 2024 18:05
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Madam Sauvage's place is a definite improvement.
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Jan 22, 2024 18:15
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Yeah it does look a lot better.
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Jan 22, 2024 18:33
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Looks like they also toned down the interior fog machines in the pirate base.
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Jan 22, 2024 19:17
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Agreed that some of those look distinctly better but I'm really amused that "lighting changes" meant actually changing the actual in-world light bulb positions and colors, I was expecting them to be like a reshade or removing the haze filter on everything
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Jan 22, 2024 19:28
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Tankbuster posted:All the things they did over the years to "dumb down the RPG" in terms of less annoying levelling systems made their games a lot more fun to play. For all the teeth gnashing about how fallout 4 killed the series by not adding triple digit numbers to the levelling meter, one of the more substantive complaints that got lost was "hey building a network of settlements requires a ton of charisma and locks out playstyles." I'll always be someone who prefers a traditional stat block, but FO4 and Skyrim worked well. I guess Starfield wanted to do its own thing and what they chose was not great. There are just so many filler skills and QoL skills that make the game systems you struggle against less annoying, rather than skills that do something cool. I'm not sure how to fix it without a total revamp, maybe fold some skills into other ones, automatically give you the first rank of every skill, give two or three skill points on level up, etc.
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Jan 22, 2024 19:55
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There was a dead NPC I found in a dungeon in BG3 that had a note and a teddy bear about how they were bringing that to their buddy who was trapped further in the dungeon. I picked up the note and teddy bear since “take all” is just as easy to hit as “close” and kept my party moving. After a bit more exploring I found his buddy’s dead body, so I looted it. I was walking away, but something struck me. This guy’s friend died trying to help him and bring him a bit of comfort, so I put the teddy bear into the dead guy’s inventory before continuing on. Nothing special happened, no achievement or unique dialogue, but that tiny bit of role playing made my good guy durge run just that little bit deeper. That said, in Skyrim, Oblivion, and the Fallouts I found little things to role play like that all the time. The gossipy bar maid that I decided was my friend in some tiny town that I’d chat with whenever I was sleeping at the inn. My adopted kid getting excited when I gave them a toy sword I found in some bandit camp. You know, little stuff like that that let me use my imagination a bit. This game has almost none of that that I could find.
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Jan 22, 2024 20:06
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Cora likes to ask for new books a lot, but you can’t actually give her any. She also seems to be programmed to run Adorkable Dialogue exclusively during tense ship battles or landing scenes. So thats irritating and distressing. I like that Barrett hands you random home cooked meals with +% experience gains and nice buffs. It would be nice if you could cook for him too. It’s insane that Sarah hands you poo poo like PLANT (FIBER) and you have no idea where she got it or why she’s giving it to you or what to do with it. I get that the idea is “oh we are cool explorers, check out this Space Orchid, it’s so rare” but somehow that got stripped down to “hello boyfriend/girlfriend, I have gifted you the joy of inventory clutter and vendor garbage.”
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Jan 22, 2024 20:11
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Punished Ape posted:I'll always be someone who prefers a traditional stat block, but FO4 and Skyrim worked well. I guess Starfield wanted to do its own thing and what they chose was not great. There are just so many filler skills and QoL skills that make the game systems you struggle against less annoying, rather than skills that do something cool. I'm not sure how to fix it without a total revamp, maybe fold some skills into other ones, automatically give you the first rank of every skill, give two or three skill points on level up, etc. You have to redesign the tree. It's not an insurmountable problem, the issue is just bad design. To start with, there are a bunch of things that just shouldn't be gated behind a skill. The sneaking hud and jump packs are the two I remember, there might be more. Just yank those entirely, convert the base skill into another step of the bonuses that they higher tiers offer. Second, the skills that let you build stuff need to be moved way down-tier. There are some base building and ship building skills which are really up there and end up being hard to access because of how many points you need to sink in to reach them. Third they need to re-think how they handle gating the higher level skills. I get the intent with wanting you to sink points in but eeeeh it doesn't work in its current form. I'd say either halve the number of points required for each tier in the tree, or make the point spending universal, so if you sink a bunch of points into stealth you can still eventually grab that level 3 base building skill you have your eyes on. Fourth they need to re-think and rebalance how they gate the levels. You know the scan 10 rocks before you can invest the next point in rock scanning thing. Again, I get the intent but it's badly implemented. A lot of the stealth skills hinge on combat, for example, and the building ones are just annoying, while there are others that are so trivial that you can close them out in seconds (jump to different systems for example). They just need to go through and top to bottom rework those so that it's something you will do naturally while playing the game. It also needs to be permanently tracked, not just when the skill is unlocked. Not having all the ships you killed before you put that second point into piloting count is just dumb and leads to unpleasant grind bullshit. Or just gently caress off with this particular gating entirely and remove it. That's an option, but I do think it could work if it wasn't so badly built. They also need to fix the skill descriptions to be less vague and tell you what's going on. The good news is that this is all pretty fixable. I mean, there are some skills that just suck and some things that interact with aspects of the game that are mediocre and not worth putting skills into, but the fundamental problems with the tree and level up system in general are things that can be addressed without totally ground-up rebuilding things. Frankly this is something I expect modders to tackle once the creation kit comes out. That said, this isn't the sort of thing modders should have to do.
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Jan 22, 2024 20:13
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It's wild that one of the first cool items you get from the first base is a jetpack that you can't use without putting a point into jetpacks Like, they really should have been a default skill that gets better with points
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Jan 22, 2024 20:23
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I like how you can plow 8 skill points into Gastronomy and Nutrition and they’re incredibly lovely and pointless. I remember seeing that in my first 2 hours of gameplay and finding a 12,000 polygon sandwich and thinking “holy poo poo the food in this game must be a Big Deal.” Nope total wet fart. Also gated behind Research because gently caress you. Also “we will add eating food directly instead of burying it in your inventory later when we get around to it”. Ah cool love to go hang out at the pirate bar and go through seven menus to pretend to drink a beer with my fake friends.
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Jan 22, 2024 20:29
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But like, MOST of the skills are just boring as gently caress. I'm looking at the tree now, and when it isn't gating basic abilities like jetpacks and ship targeting (and the zoom function lmao) or fixing annoyances like extra carrying capacity and O2, it's all "shoot this type of gun 10% harder" or "succeed at persuasion 10% more often". Even the Level 4 capstones are dull-as-gently caress numerical upgrades a lot of the time, there's almost nothing there that you'd actually be eager to unlock. You'd have to basically throw out the entire existing skilltree and design all new skills from the ground up.
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Jan 22, 2024 20:45
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Phenotype posted:But like, MOST of the skills are just boring as gently caress. I'm looking at the tree now, and when it isn't gating basic abilities like jetpacks and ship targeting (and the zoom function lmao) or fixing annoyances like extra carrying capacity and O2, it's all "shoot this type of gun 10% harder" or "succeed at persuasion 10% more often". Even the Level 4 capstones are dull-as-gently caress numerical upgrades a lot of the time, there's almost nothing there that you'd actually be eager to unlock. You'd have to basically throw out the entire existing skilltree and design all new skills from the ground up. 2077 gets a lot of credit for doing exactly this. We'll see if Bethesda is as ballsy (they're probably not).
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Jan 22, 2024 20:50
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| # ? Jun 3, 2024 13:24 |
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Phenotype posted:But like, MOST of the skills are just boring as gently caress. I'm looking at the tree now, and when it isn't gating basic abilities like jetpacks and ship targeting (and the zoom function lmao) or fixing annoyances like extra carrying capacity and O2, it's all "shoot this type of gun 10% harder" or "succeed at persuasion 10% more often". Even the Level 4 capstones are dull-as-gently caress numerical upgrades a lot of the time, there's almost nothing there that you'd actually be eager to unlock. You'd have to basically throw out the entire existing skilltree and design all new skills from the ground up. Oh sure, I'm not going to go to bat for "shoot lasers 40% harder" being ground breaking game design. You're spot on about that. But as it stands the tree is badly built that makes leveling an unintuitive, pain in the rear end of a process. You also have a lot of places where you want to do a thing but need to grind out levels and skills in something unrelated first. Basically, it's possible to do what they're trying to do here much better. This is a first draft of a skill tree, before anyone has play tested it and can give some feedback on how it works in practice. Maybe the contents of the tree are boring, but you can at least fix the straight up broken parts of it without touching that.
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Jan 22, 2024 20:50
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