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FirstnameLastname
Jul 10, 2022

rgats right

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Trabisnikof
Dec 24, 2005

Nothus posted:

I have trouble believing that neoliberal regimes that can barely manufacture munitions will have the wherewithal to pay for general conscription.

yup thankfully, the private prisons all get paid regardless of how many prisoners they house, so prison diversion programs are still a viable option! :v:

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

strike and the universe submits

VoicesCanBe
Jul 1, 2023

"Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

The Oldest Man posted:

they know who must go

If the US withdraws then the Kurds really don't have much choice other than negotiate with Assad. They're not gonna negotiate with Turkey who actively wants to push them out.

Turkey also just approved Sweden's NATO membership days ago. Can't help but wonder if a deal was struck where the US hangs the Kurds out to dry.

busalover
Sep 12, 2020

Skaffen-Amtiskaw posted:

Has anyone got a good book on updated Marxist theory? I was going to read all of Capital as I finished Fisher’s Capitalist Realism and wondered if there was a better core text now.

Also, lol at Biden.

Maybe Mouffe and Laclau?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hegemony_and_Socialist_Strategy?useskin=vector

hamas ftw
Nov 25, 2023

by Fluffdaddy

Honky Mao
Dec 26, 2012


Ok even I wouldn't go this far with a prank

mlmp08
Jul 11, 2004

Prepare for my priapic projectile's exalted penetration
Nap Ghost
I hope that instead of losing WW3 (WW3 seems bad), the US just loses the new cold war.

Ziggy Starfucker
Jun 1, 2011

Pillbug

VoicesCanBe posted:

If the US withdraws then the Kurds really don't have much choice other than negotiate with Assad. They're not gonna negotiate with Turkey who actively wants to push them out.

Turkey also just approved Sweden's NATO membership days ago. Can't help but wonder if a deal was struck where the US hangs the Kurds out to dry.

Again?

Skaffen-Amtiskaw
Jun 24, 2023

Frosted Flake posted:

Or the more, lol probably a bit more honest, version

"We all shall lead more happy lives
By getting rid of brats and wives
That scold and bawl both night and day
Over the hills and far away"

"Courage boys 'tis one to ten
We'll return all gentlemen
All gentlemen as well as they

Over the hills and far away"



Trying to get men to endure conditions like this without paying them more than they'd making staying at home is frankly nonsensical, I am bewildered that our lords and masters think they figured out One Weird Trick every previous state in history, worldwide, never thought of - pay soldiers very little, but also rely on volunteers.

You missed out the tradition electric guitar.

https://youtu.be/8Xi79uEDbag?si=wOCCJhm1fNAdOgy3


Cheers. Will check them out too, though maybe I’ll read the OG like a good scholar first.

hamas ftw
Nov 25, 2023

by Fluffdaddy

mlmp08 posted:

I hope that instead of losing WW3 (WW3 seems bad), the US just loses the new cold war.

it's only a cold war if your nukes still work

hamas ftw
Nov 25, 2023

by Fluffdaddy
don't worry the US nukes are only rotting in their silos to demonstrate that the US could neglect other country's nukes too, if they wished too

its called strategry

zetamind2000
Nov 6, 2007

I'm an alien.

quote:

Jan 24 (Reuters) - The United States has asked China to urge Tehran to rein in the Iranian-aligned Houthi rebels attacking commercial ships in the Red Sea but has seen little sign of help from Beijing, the Financial Times reported on Wednesday, citing U.S. officials.

The U.S. has repeatedly raised the matter with top Chinese officials in the past three months, the report said.

dear president xi, please tell iran to stop

bobtheconqueror
May 10, 2005

zetamind2000 posted:

dear president xi, please tell iran to stop

Didn't we ask Iran to stop Ansar Allah and Iran's response was, "We don't tell them what to do"? Are we like going to Iran's manager right now lmao?

hamas ftw
Nov 25, 2023

by Fluffdaddy

bobtheconqueror posted:

Didn't we ask Iran to stop Ansar Allah and Iran's response was, "We don't tell them what to do"? Are we like going to Iran's manager right now lmao?

listen those mindless drones gotta have a secret central command HQ somewhere. level every hospital until we find it

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

zetamind2000 posted:

dear president xi, please tell iran to stop

if xi doesn't agree we will bomb another eurocuck pipeline

BillsPhoenix
Jun 29, 2023
But what if Russia aren't the bad guys? I'm just asking questions...

dead gay comedy forums posted:

It's not proposed, it's an observed thing but confirmation basically requires some society to commit to ultimate capitalist maximalism -- which is why economic "scientific discourse" leads to economics being called the dismal science

I really appreciate your efforts to understand what is trying to be conveyed. I'm a bit envious of how purposeful your effort posts are. I posted a theory question in the Marxist thread.

I agree with the critique of economics as a science, I call it an art with applied math and stats. It's certainly not a hard science.

TRPF is taught in the US by most decent economic programs. I think it's more commonly attributed to Smith, but also as a critique of Marx. There's a huge host of academic material supporting and critiquing the theory. At a high level you can lol away either side, but once you get into the details there is valid support for either.

Ultimately economics not being a hard science means TRPF is both unprovable and unfalsifiable.

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

by Fluffdaddy

Truga posted:

"nationalism is dumb, ideology is a gently caress, we're global capitalism now, free market owns, market yourself for the better job"
everyone leaves the job where you get abused for months by a dumbass drill sergeant
"huh where did everyone go???"

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

by Fluffdaddy

The empire crumbles a little more.

JAY ZERO SUM GAME
Oct 18, 2005

Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.


the idea that iran controls yemen or ansarallah is just loving lunacy, there's no way the us government actually asked china to talk to iran. wtf

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Truga posted:

"nationalism is dumb, ideology is a gently caress, we're global capitalism now, free market owns, market yourself for the better job"
everyone leaves the job where you get abused for months by a dumbass drill sergeant
"huh where did everyone go???"

Skaffen-Amtiskaw
Jun 24, 2023

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

the idea that iran controls yemen or ansarallah is just loving lunacy, there's no way the us government actually asked china to talk to iran. wtf

The latest Radio War Nerd goes into detail on how dumb this take is. Well worth a listen.

BillsPhoenix posted:

I really appreciate your efforts to understand what is trying to be conveyed. I'm a bit envious of how purposeful your effort posts are. I posted a theory question in the Marxist thread.

I agree with the critique of economics as a science, I call it an art with applied math and stats. It's certainly not a hard science.

TRPF is taught in the US by most decent economic programs. I think it's more commonly attributed to Smith, but also as a critique of Marx. There's a huge host of academic material supporting and critiquing the theory. At a high level you can lol away either side, but once you get into the details there is valid support for either.

Ultimately economics not being a hard science means TRPF is both unprovable and unfalsifiable.

As I understand it, the TRPF is pretty evident in the works published in the last decade or so. It also follows from just a general resource extraction principle, since there is only so much other people's money out there and removing it from the pool at ever higher rates is not dissimilar to sucking oil out the ground using enhanced recovery tech. You get more out until you get nothing.

Skaffen-Amtiskaw has issued a correction as of 22:48 on Jan 24, 2024

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

by Fluffdaddy

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

the idea that iran controls yemen or ansarallah is just loving lunacy, there's no way the us government actually asked china to talk to iran. wtf

US thinking: They're all just muslims right? Complain to the muslim manager about your happy meal.

I know that seems extraordinarily stupid but just stop and reflect on it for a moment. Pretend your understanding of how the world works never got any more complicated than a children's cartoon.

FirstnameLastname
Jul 10, 2022

DancingShade posted:

US thinking: They're all just muslims right? Complain to the muslim manager about your happy meal.

I know that seems extraordinarily stupid but just stop and reflect on it for a moment. Pretend your understanding of how the world works never got any more complicated than a children's cartoon.

they also think that the only reason to oppose America is to be a part of a wicked plot to destroy America because bad guys are bad and do bad things because they are bad, which means America is good

Cindy the SKULL
Nov 27, 2023

by Athanatos

(and can't post for 10 years!)

FirstnameLastname posted:

they also think that the only reason to oppose America is to be a part of a wicked plot to destroy America because bad guys are bad and do bad things because they are bad, which means America is good

death to america tho

The Oldest Man
Jul 28, 2003

bobtheconqueror posted:

Didn't we ask Iran to stop Ansar Allah and Iran's response was, "We don't tell them what to do"? Are we like going to Iran's manager right now lmao?


DancingShade posted:

US thinking: They're all just muslims right? Complain to the muslim manager about your happy meal.

I know that seems extraordinarily stupid but just stop and reflect on it for a moment. Pretend your understanding of how the world works never got any more complicated than a children's cartoon.

To the US state and its various bureaucrats, an "ally" is a subsidiary who ultimately answers to you on foreign policy. The UK, AUS, etc. Maybe they squirm a bit but at the end of the day you'll strong-arm them into at least overtly lining up behind whatever idiot moron thing you want them to do. Even if it's under duress and the "lining up" is sending three guys and a pizza instead of a warship that is at least demonstrating fealty.

The idea that there could be mutually beneficial but non-hegemonic inter-state relationships is as alien a concept as anti-gravity to people inside the US state apparatus. They see China is cooperative with but bigger than Iran, who is cooperative with but bigger than Ansar Allah, and their hegemon brain puts those three in a clearly hegemonic, hierarchical relationship because they can't conceive of anything else.

Therefore, if Ansar Allah is causing you problems, yeah you absolutely call the manager. The idea that it's a distinct and independent organization with some mutual goals with Iran (or Iran with China) but that A is not giving orders to B is like an Escher drawing to that mindset, it can't be made to make sense.

bobtheconqueror
May 10, 2005

The Oldest Man posted:

To the US state and its various bureaucrats, an "ally" is a subsidiary who ultimately answers to you on foreign policy. The UK, AUS, etc. Maybe they squirm a bit but at the end of the day you'll strong-arm them into at least overtly lining up behind whatever idiot moron thing you want them to do. Even if it's under duress and the "lining up" is sending three guys and a pizza instead of a warship that is at least demonstrating fealty.

The idea that there could be mutually beneficial but non-hegemonic inter-state relationships is as alien a concept as anti-gravity to people inside the US state apparatus. They see China is cooperative with but bigger than Iran, who is cooperative with but bigger than Ansar Allah, and their hegemon brain puts those three in a clearly hegemonic, hierarchical relationship because they can't conceive of anything else.

Therefore, if Ansar Allah is causing you problems, yeah you absolutely call the manager. The idea that it's a distinct and independent organization with some mutual goals with Iran (or Iran with China) but that A is not giving orders to B is like an Escher drawing to that mindset, it can't be made to make sense.

Which of course puts our silence on Israel in an even more hilarious light, although I don't think that's revelatory to anyone here.

VoicesCanBe
Jul 1, 2023

"Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

bobtheconqueror posted:

Didn't we ask Iran to stop Ansar Allah and Iran's response was, "We don't tell them what to do"? Are we like going to Iran's manager right now lmao?

They believe their own propaganda and assume all their enemies are "proxies" that ultimately answer to China probably, for some reason.

Tbh it's probably projection since the US only has vassals not allies.

VoicesCanBe has issued a correction as of 23:16 on Jan 24, 2024

yellowcar
Feb 14, 2010

the US actually believes they're Iranian proxies and not like a separate entity with its own goals and agendas

and you can extrapolate that logic and interpret burger brain thinking as "and so Iran is also a puppet of Xi/Putin"

americans are not ready for a multipolar world lol

Cao Ni Ma
May 25, 2010



DancingShade posted:

The empire crumbles a little more.

Telling kurds "drat sucks to be you with our ally Turkey blowing you up, but dont worry things will get better" for years and things only getting worse

Im sure the kurds in iraq have no more love for the US and the Sunni dont either. They are going to get kicked out, I feel it

fizziester
Dec 21, 2023

Source: Financial Times


https://www.ft.com/content/bba68661-6c9b-41b5-ab74-d573b3a27c54

US urges China to help curb Red Sea attacks by Iran-backed Houthis
Demetri Sevastopulo and Felicia Schwartz in Washington and Wenjie Ding in Beijing
Yesterday

The US has asked China to urge Tehran to rein in Iran-backed Houthi rebels attacking commercial ships in the Red Sea, but has seen little sign of help from Beijing, according to American officials.

Officials have repeatedly raised the matter with top Chinese officials in the past three months, asking them to convey a warning to Iran not to inflame tensions in the Middle East after Hamas’s October 7 attack on Israel and the ensuing war.

US national security adviser Jake Sullivan and his deputy, Jon Finer, discussed the issue in meetings this month in Washington with Liu Jianchao, head of the Chinese Communist party’s international department, according to US officials. Secretary of state Antony Blinken also raised it, said a state department official.

But US officials said there was little evidence China had put any pressure on Iran to restrain the Houthis, beyond a mild statement Beijing issued last week calling on “relevant parties” to ensure safe passage for vessels sailing through the Red Sea, a critical shipping route for global trade.

On Wednesday, the Chinese foreign ministry said Beijing was calling for a stop to “disturbance to civilian ships” and had “been in close communication with various parties and worked actively to alleviate the tension in the Red Sea”.

However, in veiled criticism of the US and UK attacks on the Houthis, the ministry urged the “relevant parties to avoid adding fuel to the fire”, adding that the UN Security Council had “never authorised the use of force by any country on Yemen”.

The Red Sea tension was also a “spillover” from the Gaza conflict, which should be ended as soon as possible, the ministry said.

The diplomatic push on Beijing comes as the US and allies continue to bomb Houthi positions in Yemen in response to at least 33 Houthi attacks on commercial vessels transiting the Red Sea since mid-November. The US and UK carried out widespread strikes again on Monday.

The Houthis are backed by Iran, which has enjoyed deeper commercial and diplomatic ties with China in recent years.

One official said the US would continue to raise the issue of Iran and the Houthi attacks with Beijing but was not particularly optimistic that China’s attitude would change.

Another US official said there had been “some signs” of China engaging on the issue, but not in a significant way. “I wouldn’t want to overstate either how much they’ve done or what impact it has had,” the official said.

John Kirby, National Security Council spokesperson, on Tuesday said Washington would “welcome a constructive role by China, using the influence and the access that we know they have to . . . help stem the flow of weapons, ammunitions to the Houthis”.

Liu, who is viewed as a top candidate to become Chinese foreign minister, travelled to Iran in December. His visit came days after US President Joe Biden and his Chinese counterpart, Xi Jinping, held a summit in San Francisco.

US officials had hoped Beijing would take action because it viewed the Houthi attacks as a menace to its own commercial interests, given that the Red Sea was a critical route for Chinese exports to Europe.

Ahead of the San Francisco summit, US officials repeatedly urged China to use whatever leverage it had with Iran — whose proxy groups in Iraq and Syria have also targeted American military bases — amid concerns that the Israel-Hamas war could spiral into a broader conflict in the Middle East.

Dennis Wilder, a former top CIA China expert now at Georgetown University, said Beijing had “worked assiduously” to court Middle Eastern nations, including Iran, for economic and geopolitical gain. But he said it would be “very reluctant to use its limited influence with the Islamic state in a way that it perceives advance US interests without benefit to China”.

US officials have also pressed the effort at the UN Security Council, where China is a permanent member, according to a second state department official.

The US has launched eight rounds of missile strikes on Houthi targets in Yemen over the past two weeks in response to the attacks on shipping, including the joint strike with the UK military on Monday.

Suzanne Maloney, head of foreign policy studies at the Brookings Institution, said she had discussed the issue with Chinese experts and had not detected any serious appetite to help.

“I think what they’ve calculated . . . is that this is a crisis that’s bogging the US and its partners down and it has not had a significant impact on Chinese shipping.”

Ma Xiaolin, a professor at Zhejiang International Studies University, said he believed Liu’s visit to Iran in December was not coincidental and that he would have conveyed Chinese demands regarding the need for security.

Ma, an expert on China’s relations with the Middle East, said: “China wishes for the restoration of peace in the Red Sea region and for international shipping to be secure, which aligns with the interests of all parties because this is an important global trade route.”

The Chinese embassy in the US said it had no details about the exchanges with Liu, but that China was concerned about the “escalating tension” in the Red Sea. The embassy said it served the common interests of the international community and that China urged “relevant parties to play a constructive and responsible role in keeping the Red Sea safe and stable”.

VoicesCanBe
Jul 1, 2023

"Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

The Oldest Man posted:

To the US state and its various bureaucrats, an "ally" is a subsidiary who ultimately answers to you on foreign policy. The UK, AUS, etc. Maybe they squirm a bit but at the end of the day you'll strong-arm them into at least overtly lining up behind whatever idiot moron thing you want them to do. Even if it's under duress and the "lining up" is sending three guys and a pizza instead of a warship that is at least demonstrating fealty.

The idea that there could be mutually beneficial but non-hegemonic inter-state relationships is as alien a concept as anti-gravity to people inside the US state apparatus. They see China is cooperative with but bigger than Iran, who is cooperative with but bigger than Ansar Allah, and their hegemon brain puts those three in a clearly hegemonic, hierarchical relationship because they can't conceive of anything else.

Therefore, if Ansar Allah is causing you problems, yeah you absolutely call the manager. The idea that it's a distinct and independent organization with some mutual goals with Iran (or Iran with China) but that A is not giving orders to B is like an Escher drawing to that mindset, it can't be made to make sense.

Better explanation of what I was getting at

Regarde Aduck
Oct 19, 2012

c l o u d k i t t e n
Grimey Drawer
oh no China fired at the houthis but all their missiles went into the US carrier :(

MadSparkle
Aug 7, 2012

Can Bernie count on you to add to our chest's mad sparkle? Can you spare a little change for an old buccaneer?

VoicesCanBe posted:

If the US withdraws then the Kurds really don't have much choice other than negotiate with Assad. They're not gonna negotiate with Turkey who actively wants to push them out.

Turkey also just approved Sweden's NATO membership days ago. Can't help but wonder if a deal was struck where the US hangs the Kurds out to dry.

Wouldn't be the first time

The Oldest Man
Jul 28, 2003

VoicesCanBe posted:

Better explanation of what I was getting at

VoicesCanBe posted:

Tbh it's probably projection since the US only has vassals not allies.

I actually think this is a better explanation than my :words: one

fizziester
Dec 21, 2023

fizziester posted:

Source: Financial Times


https://www.ft.com/content/bba68661-6c9b-41b5-ab74-d573b3a27c54

US urges China to help curb Red Sea attacks by Iran-backed Houthis
Demetri Sevastopulo and Felicia Schwartz in Washington and Wenjie Ding in Beijing
Yesterday

...

Suzanne Maloney, head of foreign policy studies at the Brookings Institution, said she had discussed the issue with Chinese experts and had not detected any serious appetite to help.

“I think what they’ve calculated . . . is that this is a crisis that’s bogging the US and its partners down and it has not had a significant impact on Chinese shipping.”

...


Ms Suzanne Maloney is deeply mistaken. fizziester has been informed by the mostly highly authoritative sources that Ansarallah are indiscriminately opportunistic terrorist pirates whose statements that "we are only targeting Israel and its allies because of their role in the genocide of Palestinians" can't be trusted or believed.

MadSparkle
Aug 7, 2012

Can Bernie count on you to add to our chest's mad sparkle? Can you spare a little change for an old buccaneer?
US running to China for help after insulting their president LOL

FirstnameLastname
Jul 10, 2022

Cindy the SKULL posted:

death to america tho

added to villain heirarchy

RIP Syndrome
Feb 24, 2016

zetamind2000 posted:

dear president xi, please tell iran to stop

my merchant fleet yearns for freedom of navigation

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Al!
Apr 2, 2010

:coolspot::coolspot::coolspot::coolspot::coolspot:

hamas ftw posted:

don't worry the US nukes are only rotting in their silos to demonstrate that the US could neglect other country's nukes too, if they wished too

its called strategry

youve gotta wonder how many silo doors simply fail to open because squirrels got at the mechanism

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