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Potato Salad posted:you could use proxmox at home but you won't be learning any skills that are useful for your career imo Nah, you can use Terraform with it OOTB and packer. Plenty of stuff to learn.
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Jan 5, 2024 23:08
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well yeah so use a modern hypervisor there's a free gitlabs tier, put up some teraform and go learn proper cdci
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Jan 5, 2024 23:16
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does.... anyone use proxmox in enterprise, at scale? maybe it's me who is out of touch
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Jan 5, 2024 23:17
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Potato Salad posted:does.... anyone use proxmox in enterprise, at scale? maybe it's me who is out of touch Our hpc setup runs a proxmox partition for stuff that wouldn't fit in k8s. I've heard it's not that weird as a setup if you don't need to run windows loads.
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Jan 5, 2024 23:26
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ESXi is clearly hosed under Broadcom, if IBM hadn't simultaneously been wrecking Red Hat I'd actually be betting on Red Hat Virtualization/ oVirt picking up some market share. KVM itself is completely rock solid and has been for ages. There's not going to be any real replacement for how big ESXi was because operating an on-prem virtualization farm will become lostech and everyone will just pay AWS more money. Edit: if anything in the longer term I'd bet that the groups that continue to run on-premises will move to a bare-metal kubernetes solution without any hypervisor. You can run a KVM guest as a kubernetes pod if you need actual VM isolation. Twerk from Home fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Jan 5, 2024 |
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Jan 5, 2024 23:29
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Twerk from Home posted:There's not going to be any real replacement for how big ESXi was because operating an on-prem virtualization farm will become lostech and everyone will just pay AWS more money.
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Jan 5, 2024 23:31
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Potato Salad posted:you could use proxmox at home but you won't be learning any skills that are useful for your career imo I'm really not worried about picking up VMware skills. I've already done things like written a custom VM build system to connect to it using the SOAP and REST APIs and build VM templates and deploy them to VMs, developed an integration for it for our CMDB, etc. Like I said, I'm using the free ESXi license because I already use it at work and I'm familiar with it. Though, these days, I do a lot less with VMware directly, since I've been doing a lot of security policy work. SlowBloke posted:At this point in the post acquisition stage, getting esxi skills today would be like like getting novell groupware knowledge in the early two ks. Broadcom is going to kill esxi no if no buts, it's just a matter of time. Also, this. I don't see VMware doing well under Broadcom with the changes they've announced, between the licensing changes and selling off all the workstation products. Mainly, I'm just wondering whether Proxmox is reliable and maintained well enough to replace ESXi at home at this point. I've never run into it in the wild, so I have zero experience with it, but at least on paper, it sounds like the platform I'd want to move to (free, supports Windows, Linux, and FreeBSD guest VMs, has some sort of web UI for easy admin tasks, has an API, supports ZFS for VM storage, supports device passthrough so I can pass my GPU through to my Plex VM).
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Jan 5, 2024 23:37
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I meant go learn KVM nobody should be learning more VMware rn proxmox in enterprise? ehhhhhhhhhhh sounds like there's one poster who has it for a kinda standalone thing, that's hardly a vote in confidence for any notion that serious businesses use proxmox in robust devops stacks
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Jan 5, 2024 23:42
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I have been skimming the Proxmox support forums, it's a mix of hobbyists that have no idea what they're doing running into predictable problems with their stupid home setups, and pros with what sounds like a reasonable, modern environment experiencing a bunch of problems with HA. Here's an example of the latter: https://forum.proxmox.com/threads/unexpected-fencing.136345/ quote:I have a 28 node PVE cluster running PVE 7.4-16. All nodes are Dell R640/R650 servers with 1.5 or 2TB of RAM and Intel Xeon Gold CPU's. They all have 2 x 1GB NIC's and 4 x 25 GB NIC's. HA sounds completely busted for them. Apparently that's around the effective max size of a proxmox cluster right now before it collapses under its own weight, judging by responses.
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Jan 5, 2024 23:49
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If I had extra metal and azure credits, I would test Azure HCI before investing time in KVM but alas I have neither.
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Jan 6, 2024 00:02
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can you do azurestack HCI homelab for a good price
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Jan 6, 2024 00:08
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Potato Salad posted:I meant go learn KVM Eh, if I were thinking about going with KVM directly, I'd just use bhyve instead. I like FreeBSD more than I do Linux, plus it natively supports ZFS. Twerk from Home posted:I have been skimming the Proxmox support forums, it's a mix of hobbyists that have no idea what they're doing running into predictable problems with their stupid home setups, and pros with what sounds like a reasonable, modern environment experiencing a bunch of problems with HA. Hmmm. Good to know. I'd only have it on a single node, but that's still good info to have. I've mostly found the people with broken setups who don't know what they're doing, so it's good info seeing what actual problems it has. Thanks!
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Jan 6, 2024 00:21
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Kreeblah posted:Also, this. I don't see VMware doing well under Broadcom with the changes they've announced, between the licensing changes and selling off all the workstation products. IMHO, VMware is hosed long-term, but Broadcom is going to squeeze existing customers for a while before they can switch to more cost-effective solutions. Kreeblah posted:Mainly, I'm just wondering whether Proxmox is reliable and maintained well enough to replace ESXi at home at this point. I've never run into it in the wild, so I have zero experience with it, but at least on paper, it sounds like the platform I'd want to move to (free, supports Windows, Linux, and FreeBSD guest VMs, has some sort of web UI for easy admin tasks, has an API, supports ZFS for VM storage, supports device passthrough so I can pass my GPU through to my Plex VM). Proxmox is fine for home use. Don't enable clustering just for shits and giggles, read the docs first. I would consider HA an advanced feature. Potato Salad posted:can you do azurestack HCI homelab for a good price 
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Jan 6, 2024 00:25
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h y p e r - v
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Jan 6, 2024 08:37
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Potato Salad posted:well yeah If I was a new company looking at it, I'd be very careful, since they've not only shown that they can change the license, but will do so, if it benefits them and nobody else. Twerk from Home posted:ESXi is clearly hosed under Broadcom, if IBM hadn't simultaneously been wrecking Red Hat I'd actually be betting on Red Hat Virtualization/ oVirt picking up some market share. Selfishly, I hope bhyve will get the little bit of TLC it needs to get to the point that it can be used in production by everyone. As it is, the main pain-point is being able to transfer guests between hosts - but that's being worked on, and since most of the things, that people want the high-availability for, can be done further up-stack, it's production ready for the vast majority of use-cases.
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Jan 6, 2024 15:20
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I think the best part of proxmox is that they have their own backup service (PBS) so you don't have to deal with all the bullshit like paying extra just so backups are supported and then paying extra for 3rd party software. Backup is fundamental and VMWare treats it like some fringe benefit.
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Jan 8, 2024 18:40
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What would be a recommended hypervisor running on Linux that will support Windows VMs? This is for home usage. KVM or Proxmox seem like the two mentioned most recently on this page but I do not know enough about the benefits/drawbacks of both to make an informed decision. I am looking to switch from Windows to Linux (haven't decided on distro, yet) for my main machine. However, I need to bring over a Windows VM with the move. It is currently running under Hyper-V. I don't plan on spinning up other VMs on a regular basis for this machine. I know as part of the move, I will also need to figure out some way to convert the Hyper-V VM to whatever hypervisor I end up deciding on.
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Jan 9, 2024 00:43
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KVM is the Linux hypervisor and proxmox is a web interface for managing KVM. There are other front ends but they weren't very mature when I tried them like 4 years ago.
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Jan 9, 2024 05:54
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Yeah, as I understand it Proxmox is fundamentally Debian with KVM, LXC, various storage/networking features and a nice web interface for managing them. It can do a lot out of the box but also you can pretty much just install whatever you want with apt if there are any features you need in the base OS instead of in a container/VM. There appear to be a few straightforward methods to migrate a VM guest from Hyper-V: https://pve.proxmox.com/wiki/Migration_of_servers_to_Proxmox_VE#HyperV Installation is very easy and it runs well even on pretty old hardware, so I'd recommend giving it a try if you have a spare machine. However, it doesn't have a desktop environment by default so if you are looking for a desktop Linux distro that can also host VMs then I'd just get Ubuntu/Fedora and run virt-manager to manage KVM. Eletriarnation fucked around with this message at 17:11 on Jan 9, 2024 |
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Jan 9, 2024 06:14
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I've been pretty happy with Proxmox for my home lab. It might not see a ton of use in the corporate space, but it's a pretty high speed low drag way to slot a web managed hypervisor into your home network. And you can just ssh in and give qm commands if you want instead.
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Jan 9, 2024 10:07
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Ahh, that makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the explanations and conversion link! I’ll have to play around a bit on a separate machine to get things writing how I want before making the move.
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Jan 9, 2024 14:07
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I'm sure this is nothing new to you guys, but I found this video on the subject of KVM and figured I would link it here since it is by someone I know has been talked about positively before in these forums: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgZHbCDFODk
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Jan 9, 2024 16:33
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Huh, this is a neat experiment from the Podman crew. Super new, but might be useful for temporary vms for different arches or if you need a special kernel and are famliar with the general syntax of podman/docker. https://github.com/containers/crun-qemu Doesn't seem like the intended use case is long-running vms though.
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Jan 9, 2024 21:44
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First the Broadcom takeover, now HPE snatches up Juniper? It's time for a career change. Every company/product stack that I enjoy is apparently on a conveyor belt within a slaughterhouse.
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Jan 10, 2024 05:59
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Kibner posted:I'm sure this is nothing new to you guys, but I found this video on the subject of KVM and figured I would link it here since it is by someone I know has been talked about positively before in these forums: Thanks for this… I actually had the exact same question you asked earlier, so this helps. Anyone know if there’s a way to have a windows vm with dual monitor support? I figure maybe it’s possible using GPU passthrough but is that the only way? e: should have specified that the host would have two monitors… and I’d like to use the vm using both of them. Sort of a desktop replacement thing for work namlosh fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Jan 10, 2024 |
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Jan 10, 2024 15:15
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namlosh posted:Thanks for this… I actually had the exact same question you asked earlier, so this helps. i was able to do this via pci-e passthrough
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Jan 10, 2024 18:10
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namlosh posted:Anyone know if there’s a way to have a windows vm with dual monitor support? I figure maybe it’s possible using GPU passthrough but is that the only way? I used to do that with VirtualBox running on Linux. It was just two separate windows I could position where I want. Should also be possible with KVM and Virt-manager, but I didn't get it to work last time I tried.
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Jan 10, 2024 21:48
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Watermelon Daiquiri posted:i was able to do this via pci-e passthrough Saukkis posted:I used to do that with VirtualBox running on Linux. It was just two separate windows I could position where I want. Should also be possible with KVM and Virt-manager, but I didn't get it to work last time I tried. Thanks for the replies… while I’ve never tried it, I’ve always heard that pic-e pass through was a pain to set up correctly. If I can’t just get it to work via kvm and virt-manager, any tips on how to go about it successfully are appreciated.
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Jan 10, 2024 23:17
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oh it is a pain. i got it working ish on ubuntu, but i run into an issue where the entire computer freezes after i shut down the vm. It has something to do with what all i'm sending into the kvm but since i need the usb3 and hdmi sound i put up with it. You need to make sure you're enabling all the correct options, blacklisting the correct modules, and passing the right things through. I only got it working because my workstation seems to be in the ideal setup for it with the dedicated gpu taking over the hdmi port and one of the usb3 ports, and it being in it's own IOMMU group outside of the integrated graphics.
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Jan 11, 2024 04:29
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I have no practical knowledge or experience with it but why haven't I seen Nutanix in the VMware replacement conversation very much?
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Jan 28, 2024 14:50
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Kaddish posted:I have no practical knowledge or experience with it but why haven't I seen Nutanix in the VMware replacement conversation very much? I guess probably just general awareness, and then looking at it they have their own hypervisor but 5 minutes of googling doesnt turn up any description of what technology its based on. So thats a “hmmmmmmm….” Then once you put it in front of the technical team they give you a list of reasons why it wont work that all come after unspoken reason 0: its not vmware so i dont want to do it.
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Jan 28, 2024 16:11
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fresh_cheese posted:I guess probably just general awareness, and then looking at it they have their own hypervisor but 5 minutes of googling doesnt turn up any description of what technology its based on. So thats a “hmmmmmmm….” My understanding is that Nutanix is just a much less trusted hypervisor at the core than VMWare, Hyper-V, or KVM/Qemu, which are all rock solid and proven. The various management interfaces for KVM might all suck, but KVM itself will never let you down. Nutanix was designed for doing hyper-converged VDI and just wasn't designed to be an all purpose virtualization solution. VMWare is not the only option, I bet we're going to see plenty of shops move to Hyper-V. Look at the OP of the Homelab thread for a firsthand account into why Nutanix failed to ever get a foothold in the hobbyist market, which matters because people will try things at home before bringing them up at work: H2SO4 posted:In case anybody is starting out on the homelab journey and is thinking about going the Nutanix CE route, let me offer a couple words of widsom.
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Jan 28, 2024 16:39
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Twerk from Home posted:My understanding is that Nutanix is just a much less trusted hypervisor at the core than VMWare, Hyper-V, or KVM/Qemu, which are all rock solid and proven. The various management interfaces for KVM might all suck, but KVM itself will never let you down. Nutanix was designed for doing hyper-converged VDI and just wasn't designed to be an all purpose virtualization solution. VMWare is not the only option, I bet we're going to see plenty of shops move to Hyper-V. According to https://portal.nutanix.com/page/documents/solutions/details?targetId=TN-2038-AHV:nutanix-ahv-components.html , AHV is based on KVM/Qemu. My problem with it as a new hypervisor is that we have a huge investment in non-Nutanix hardware and storage. You start asking them about how to use your existing blade servers and vvol storage with AHV, they look for diplomatic ways to say, "not our circus, not our monkeys." Zorak of Michigan fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Jan 28, 2024 |
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Jan 28, 2024 16:57
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I just don't see a big migration to Hyper-V without a Microsoft vCenter. I absolutely see Microsoft squandering the opportunity to become the virtualization platform of small/medium American businesses by continuing to confound what should be simple interfaces and tools with cloud integrations. Already, 2/3 of what's in Windows Admin Center is functionally nagware to pay for things that SMBs probably aren't ever going to pay for, and it confuses the everliving hell out of the hordes and hordes of general practice IT workers who burn the incense that keeps AA_april2013-gross_FINAL(1)_FINAL DONT REMOVE(1)(1).xls running.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:24
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I'm going to Azurestack HCI but that's because we have the budget for genuine engineers. Half the guys who do IT at my local card shop are just happy to churn through five or six tickets a day and drive to a site to get a laptop deployed without hitting traffic. there's billions upon billions of dollars in the market that serves those dudes, and that's why I continue to insist that, after KVM matured, vmware's core product was actually vCenter.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:29
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OVirt is still there, has it started withering yet since redhat killed RHV?
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Jan 28, 2024 17:31
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Finally, XenServer's time to shine!
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Jan 28, 2024 17:41
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Internet Explorer posted:Finally, XenServer's time to shine!
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Jan 28, 2024 17:46
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Kaddish posted:I have no practical knowledge or experience with it but why haven't I seen Nutanix in the VMware replacement conversation very much? Thanks Ants fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Jan 28, 2024 |
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Jan 28, 2024 17:49
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