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dialhforhero posted:Hi I am just barging in to say that was the worst Royal Rumble I have ever seen and I feel like it was changed drastically before it happened. He's not pissed, he's a man who's out of options and knows they have him on the shortest leash imaginable.
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Jan 28, 2024 16:10
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dialhforhero posted:Hi I am just barging in to say that was the worst Royal Rumble I have ever seen and I feel like it was changed drastically before it happened. I don’t know the context but that sounds like a work. I can’t imagine he could have been 100% happy about Cody shouting out Kenny and the Bucks after eliminating him though which is the only clip I saw
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Jan 28, 2024 16:11
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Chris James 2 posted:Danielson said outright Kane’s the smartest man he’s ever known in wrestling, I am willing to call him dumb or believe him being dumb is possible I give him the caveat of saying “in wrestling”
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Jan 28, 2024 16:11
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Pylons posted:He's not pissed, he's a man who's out of options and knows they have him on the shortest leash imaginable. He sees the blood money covered dick in Saudi Arabia looming on the horizon and knows this is a prison he has made for himself.
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Jan 28, 2024 16:12
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https://twitter.com/AdamOSports/status/1751493459783881075?t=GTUjdffmswYs1ianOKp8Iw&s=19
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Jan 28, 2024 16:13
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100% agree. Anyone involved with hiring, aiding, or otherwise abetting this Scurlish behavior should be punished.
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Jan 28, 2024 16:15
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https://twitter.com/rondarousey/status/1751301113838801383?s=46&t=sf3N3Et41KxvCa4RdixF8A An angle I forgot to consider. They're still going to do whatever vince says because his ventriloquist dummy is still in the room
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Jan 28, 2024 16:17
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Lol reading the outcomes of last night's RR and everything had the most boring outcome possible
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Jan 28, 2024 16:22
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Fucker posted:guys like styles, punk, edge, christian, rhodes, big show, bryan danielson, kevin owens, miz, even guys like adam cole. they at the very least strongly suspected some seriously shady rear end poo poo was going down Edge and Lita did not want to do the live sex celebration but only Lita was threatened with firing if she didn't do it
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Jan 28, 2024 16:25
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dialhforhero posted:Hi I am just barging in to say that was the worst Royal Rumble I have ever seen and I feel like it was changed drastically before it happened. Cm punk should make a statement of anger that his boss was sex trafficking
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Jan 28, 2024 16:49
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RealityWarCriminal posted:Edge and Lita did not want to do the live sex celebration but only Lita was threatened with firing if she didn't do it Just remembering how they had Cryme Tyme humiliate Lita during her first retirement match by having them sell her underwear to the crowd while they chanted "slut".
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Jan 28, 2024 16:50
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cm punk, one of the biggest hypocrites in wrestling history, will not do or say poo poo about anything currently happening because he's in his typical 'happy to be here' honeymoon phase trying once again to show for the fifth or sixth time he won't make waves
Orange Carlisle fucked around with this message at 17:04 on Jan 28, 2024 |
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Jan 28, 2024 16:56
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bartok posted:Just remembering how they had Cryme Tyme humiliate Lita during her first retirement match by having them sell her underwear to the crowd while they chanted "slut".
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Jan 28, 2024 16:58
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keithy george posted:There was all the stuff about sponsors not being happy during the Attitude Era, bother with the PTC, but it seems like things were far worse in the Ruthless Aggression era and yet it never seemed to attract trouble for the company. All the Lita stuff, Katie Vick, HLA, absolutely anything involving Vince who seemed to go feral starting with Trish. Even if we were to expand it, the racism was reaching horrendous levels. I was watching an old Jimmy Wang Yang vignette because I have fond memories of his team with Shannon Moore from when I was first starting watching and the moment he said "now you might think all Asians are good at math and stuff!" I felt like my skin was going to crawl off of my body. The Attitude Era was bad for many reasons but it at least felt like it was trying to attract an audience of horny teenage 90s kids who wanted car crash TV. Ruthless Aggression's lows existed to please one person, and it was Vince himself.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:06
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Sydney Bottocks posted:I think it's hard to have that debate, though, when someone's starting from the basis of "everyone clearly thinks wrestling is 100% squeaky clean EXCEPT for WWE", which is demonstrably not true given that there have been a few discussions about that very subject in the AEW threads (most recently when Flair got hired, and again shortly after when the accusations-that-weren't were made by Hausman towards Jericho). Kind of hard to have a good faith debate when someone's already decided that the other side is a bunch of naive rubes. It does feel like things outside of WWE are starting to trend in the right direction, but we're not even 4 years removed from all of the victims coming out in 2020. There's still a lot of work to do. I'd like to hope that over time, things will continue to improve, and pro wrestling can be a safe space for people, but there's still a long ways to go. It's why we're all so insistent that TKO needs to clean house. You need to show your employees you're serious about inflicting positive change. I'm quite cynical about major corporations so I'll believe they're actually going to do it when I see it.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:09
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JUNGLE BOY posted:no but like actually? what are you trying to accomplish here, in your words? It sure is awesome that random-rear end dudes with literally three posts here before are coming out of the woodwork to stand up for the WWE. It is astonishingly ignorant of how the wrestling business works to try to claim that everyone in the locker room didn't know about this stuff. No, that does not mean that Vince personally showed the photos and texts to everyone (although I'm sure he showed them to a lot of people), but this is the loving wrestling business, where literally any wrestling autobiography has tons of poo poo about everyone in the locker room knowing you shouldn't let women (and sometimes young men) alone with some guys for ~reasons~ and taking people aside to tell them about the lovely guys they need to watch out for. And yes, that includes the guys in power. This poo poo has gone on in the WWE for so loving long that everyone in that loving dressing room knew that Vince abused women. Maybe they didn't use those exact words, and I'm not saying that they knew the specific details of this case (although, again, I'm sure Vince bragged to many people about the details of the poo poo he was doing, because that's the kind of guy he is, and history is full of examples of him doing that literal loving thing), but everyone knew 100% what kind of guy he is. I can understand people not volunteering to speak up because that's just how people are. But also gently caress Cody for his dumbass comments. I still had respect for him as a person until yesterday, but now he can gently caress off into a ditch with the rest of them. Akileese posted:It does feel like things outside of WWE are starting to trend in the right direction, but we're not even 4 years removed from all of the victims coming out in 2020. There's still a lot of work to do. There absolutely is, but we also don't have to give the WWE any kind of pass because "that's just how the wrestling business is" (and I'm not saying you are; but a lot of people seem to be). Aside from the fact that that kind of whataboutism sucks in general and hinders progress because apparently we can't address issues until we address ALL the issues simultaneously, they're a uniquely hosed up institution because they've been under the control of a literal rapist sociopath since the early 80s, and he has surrounded himself with people who agree with him and built the entire company structure around that poo poo. It's pervasive from the top to the bottom and while I'm not saying the whole company needs to be burned down, there does need to be a MASSIVE clearout. Shaman Tank Spec fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Jan 28, 2024 |
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Jan 28, 2024 17:15
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Akileese posted:It does feel like things outside of WWE are starting to trend in the right direction, but we're not even 4 years removed from all of the victims coming out in 2020. There's still a lot of work to do. I'd like to hope that over time, things will continue to improve, and pro wrestling can be a safe space for people, but there's still a long ways to go. Ari emmanuel is literally Vince's personal talent agent, there is a very specific reason wwe sold to endeavor when they did.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:17
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MasterSitsu posted:Was looking for a conversation about the moral dilemma of watching wrestling as a whole when the culture that Vince fostered - which includes not just abuse but apathy and fear of doing anything to stop it, inability to unionize, the whole shebang - is seeded throughout the industry. Anyone who has been through the WWE system has to some degree been tainted or taught to accept that things are the way they are. Start with the bolded part next time. "I want to believe better things are possible!" in the face of what we all just learned is willful ignorance, and quite frankly I question your ability to even process the real world and how you survive in it. It is heinous enough that trying to just post through it makes you look worse. Yeah, it's cool that overall the industry is not as thoroughly insane as it used to be with the drugs and the drunks and the burning a candle at double time. But if UUDD, if Cody, if Roman, if anyone knew even the tiniest fuckin degree of some of the poo poo that was happening in the WWE was going on at any point and they ignored it then they can all gently caress right off. If they're in AEW right now? They can still gently caress off. It ain't tribalism, it's "hey are humans being treated as property by the guy running your company? You should probably do something. Anything." This whole disaster calls into question so many talents' ethical and moral fiber that the idea that you waddle in here and whine and screech about how we're painting with broad brushes it's insulting. Buddy, the HOLLYWOOD HUNK who is jobber level has talked about how he heard some awful things and actually tried to speak to someone about it, only to get in hot water. The responses by various women on social media to the news implies they were certainly aware of this poo poo too. But maybe I guess I'm being naive and ignoring what Nemeth brings to the table in terms of connections and how easily it would be for him to uncover the terrible truth. I mean, he's known for being the brother of another wrestler. That would make finding this all out easy as pie, yeah? I dont give a poo poo about a lol teehee youtube show and the laughs it provides if the host and the team making it have been actively trying to ignore the worst kept secret in the company for decades. Better things are only really possible when you're not being anchored down by a notorious sexual predator, rapist, cult leader, criminal, liar, thief and overall gigantic piece of poo poo. Truth be told this whole thing has destroyed a ton of respect I had for wrestlers who wouldn't be directly involved in this. Bryan is too close, I hesitate to take him at his word. Is it possible Mox never heard of this poo poo? Hell, the audacity to put Bayley front and center to start the press conference, the whole poo poo they did with her and Billie, it all stinks from top to bottom and it's going to be a while before I'm truly comfortable with some of the people I'm seeing on my screen. But hey, thanks for coming in the week all of this drops and yelling about how we're being too harsh in the light of all of this news, news that I think most of us would come out eventually in some way or another but hoped it would never be something as disgusting as this. Get out, stay out, go gently caress yourself. I'll take a 6er.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:19
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https://twitter.com/KXNGAO/status/1751471603760734305?t=R04yG7YTwD39flm3HnnXsg&s=19
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Jan 28, 2024 17:24
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Erin M. Fiasco posted:Even if we were to expand it, the racism was reaching horrendous levels. I was watching an old Jimmy Wang Yang vignette because I have fond memories of his team with Shannon Moore from when I was first starting watching and the moment he said "now you might think all Asians are good at math and stuff!" I felt like my skin was going to crawl off of my body. The Attitude Era was bad for many reasons but it at least felt like it was trying to attract an audience of horny teenage 90s kids who wanted car crash TV. Ruthless Aggression's lows existed to please one person, and it was Vince himself. I mean, there was an entire thread devoted to all the offensive stuff on rewatch. And enough content to keep it alive for long enough people noticed it.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:25
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Okay, deep breaths, everyone. Maybe it's naive of me to want to believe people in this conversation have good intentions, but that's just how I operate. It can't be overstated the overwhelming pressure that exists in the wrestling business and especially in the WWE to fall in line and stay there. When the right people in power are telling different stories, half-truths, and preying on people they're working with, it all becomes so muddled and hard to escape from. It's a snare trap. It is a cult, a culture of manipulation. It is so hard to know exactly how you'll react when you've been browbeaten into thinking some of the really awful poo poo is normalized. Sometimes you have to get out of the environment and confront it to realize how bad it all truly was. There was certainly an element of hoping that it wasn't so ingrained and pervasive as it was. I don't blame people, especially those who may not have been following wrestling for as long as others, for not wanting to believe in the depths of the depravity. The reason this particular lawsuit is such a big deal is not just because it's full of horrific things but because it reframes lots of small stories - from Bill DeMott and the jelly donut hazing to Ryan Nemeth and Luchasaurus's whistleblowing to the many stories of Johnny Ace and the Divas Search all the way to Vince's first departure - into a whole that is impossible to deny. I think there's a disconnect between those of us who are seeing all these little puzzle pieces that we've been slowly collecting through the years click into place and those that aren't quite so ingrained in the goings-on with the company. Try not to jump on each other for that. There have been people who have slid into the threads to try and stir the pot or just say some whack poo poo, but it's important to remember that not everyone is there to do this. Again, deep breaths. In, uh, mildly lighter news, I did look at a few clips from last night out of curiosity and Jesus Christ I can't get over how artificial and dull the product is compared to even a year ago. That Jordynne Grace entrance was beyond sad and Naomi and Andrade got "polite buzzing" and bad commentary. Oof. Dango Bango posted:I mean, there was an entire thread devoted to all the offensive stuff on rewatch. And enough content to keep it alive for long enough people noticed it. Well some of us are blind and didn't realize SA had a wrestling forum until last year, okay 
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Jan 28, 2024 17:32
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keithy george posted:There was all the stuff about sponsors not being happy during the Attitude Era, bother with the PTC, but it seems like things were far worse in the Ruthless Aggression era and yet it never seemed to attract trouble for the company. All the Lita stuff, Katie Vick, HLA, absolutely anything involving Vince who seemed to go feral starting with Trish. Nothing happend because being as offensive as possible was a broader media trend in the 00's, and wrestling had an awful reputation at the time so there wasn't a higher standard that they were failing to meet they did face consequences in a way, advertisers don't want their brands associated with that stuff so even when they were the hottest thing on television, they were getting low rates for promotional stuff. viewership is a lot lower nowadays but they make more money since the product is so sanitized little munchkin fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Jan 28, 2024 |
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Jan 28, 2024 17:34
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the final 2 in last night's Rumble were Cody/Punk, which is a seismic moment given the last few years, and.....they somehow made it boring. I was praying for some Kevin Dunn camera cuts instead of the static-rear end wide shots of Tropicana Field (probably the ugliest stadium in American history) and Michael Cole talking about how many butts were in the seats. Also Punk looks beyond washed
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Jan 28, 2024 17:36
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Erin M. Fiasco posted:Well some of us are blind and didn't realize SA had a wrestling forum until last year, okay drat I didn't realize Erin was the hot new babyface that showed up in the theorist and got the rocket-strap push to the top of the card 
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Jan 28, 2024 17:36
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Dango Bango posted:drat I didn't realize Erin was the hot new babyface that showed up in the theorist and got the rocket-strap push to the top of the card EMF was born when EMF purged the good from their body and created two EMFs from one being, not dissimilar from what kami had to do to become guardian of the earth
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Jan 28, 2024 17:39
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STONE COLD 64 posted:EMF was born when EMF purged the good from their body and created two EMFs from one being, not dissimilar from what kami had to do to become guardian of the earth Picturing EMF seeing their other half "oh you got the neck tattoo?"
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Jan 28, 2024 17:40
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Erin M. Fiasco posted:the many stories of Johnny Ace and the Divas Search That entire program seems like a system designed to find new women to exploit.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:40
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There's only one EMF and they owe us jackets.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:42
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Akileese posted:It does feel like things outside of WWE are starting to trend in the right direction, but we're not even 4 years removed from all of the victims coming out in 2020. There's still a lot of work to do. I'd like to hope that over time, things will continue to improve, and pro wrestling can be a safe space for people, but there's still a long ways to go. They *should* clean house, but they won't. As far as most of the fans and public are concerned, Vince was the only perpetrator and he's gone so now everything is hunky dory. Slim Jim was the only sponsor to pull out, and even that was for less than 24 hours. They're betting (correctly, unfortunately) that those who only know a little about the scandal are placated, and those who know more, like us, either won't leave or will leave briefly and then come back. The public has a short memory. Trump literally bragged on tape about grabbing women's privates and got elected. He got found legally liable of that very thing, and he'll still be the runaway nominee for the Republican party this fall. Most people don't remember or don't care. Or worse, don't believe it and think it's just a plot to take someone down.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:42
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explosivo posted:"The modern WWE crew". Cody, this poo poo happened 3 years ago. Talking about it like this is poo poo that happened forever ago to people they never met so eh it's in the past! This poo poo was happening 2 years ago as he was negotiating directly with Vince for his return.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:44
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You know, Bray depicting Vince with ever-constant devil horns anytime he showed up in a Firefly Funhouse seems a lot more potent after this past week than it did before
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Jan 28, 2024 17:49
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The Cameo posted:You know, Bray depicting Vince with ever-constant devil horns anytime he showed up in a Firefly Funhouse seems a lot more potent after this past week than it did before Well, drat. Yeah, it does hit harder.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:55
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Erin M. Fiasco posted:There have been people who have slid into the threads to try and stir the pot or just say some whack poo poo, but it's important to remember that not everyone is there to do this. People can make long wordy posts that are still just obvious attempts at this. SA has a whole forum dedicated to it. "I just want to start a conversation" is one very small step removed from "I'm just asking questions". The purpose is very clearly to obfuscate by casting blame as wide as possible, but as you can see it's not working very well because the vast majority of people here know that you should never pin your hopes on a wrestler having principles
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Jan 28, 2024 17:55
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A reminder once more that it's often a safe bet to just assume that pretty much everyone in the wrestling biz is a scumbag at the very least, until they prove otherwiseTarnop posted:People can make long wordy posts that are still just obvious attempts at this. SA has a whole forum dedicated to it. "I just want to start a conversation" is one very small step removed from "I'm just asking questions". The purpose is very clearly to obfuscate by casting blame as wide as possible, but as you can see it's not working very well because the vast majority of people here know that you should never pin your hopes on a wrestler having principles This, and also crying about "the wrestling business as a whole" is just some half-assed whataboutism.
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Jan 28, 2024 17:57
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Erin M. Fiasco posted:I think there's a disconnect between those of us who are seeing all these little puzzle pieces that we've been slowly collecting through the years click into place and those that aren't quite so ingrained in the goings-on with the company. Yes, exactly this. I'd guess some of the extra level of anger here is rooted, at least partially, in guilty consciences. Why did it collectively take us until the receipts came out to stop watching? Surely the best time to stop watching/supporting WWE would have been a lot longer ago than the last week or even last 2 years, right? We've given Vince McMahon our money. That doesn't make us complicit, but I don't feel completely clean either.
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Jan 28, 2024 18:00
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delightful posted:Yes, exactly this. I'd guess some of the extra level of anger here is rooted, at least partially, in guilty consciences. Why did it collectively take us until the receipts came out to stop watching? Surely the best time to stop watching/supporting WWE would have been a lot longer ago than the last week or even last 2 years, right? Speak for yourself, please
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Jan 28, 2024 18:01
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In a company that can’t keep anything secret, I find it hard to believe that “everyone knew” Vince was a sex trafficker that was arranging for an employee to be raped. When the hush money payment stuff came out, it seemed more like Vince was cheating on his wife and hiring that person to a role where they did nothing, then gave them money to shut up about it. In hindsight it’s all clear as hell what was happening through. And the vileness of the most recent victim over the past two years just makes it apparent that even more vile poo poo happened associated with all the other hush money payments.
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Jan 28, 2024 18:07
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Astro7x posted:When the hush money payment stuff came out, it seemed more like Vince was cheating on his wife and hiring that person to a role where they did nothing, then gave them money to shut up about it. The initial hush money scandal story talked about the now-named victim being raped and sold to Johnny ace
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Jan 28, 2024 18:09
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Astro7x posted:In a company that can’t keep anything secret, I find it hard to believe that “everyone knew” Vince was a sex trafficker that was arranging for an employee to be raped. When the hush money payment stuff came out, it seemed more like Vince was cheating on his wife and hiring that person to a role where they did nothing, then gave them money to shut up about it. This is not the first major abuse scandal that remained relatively quiet despite everyone knowing. People called one of Mel's victims "Mrs. Mel Phillips" backstage but that remained an open secret. The PC abuse remained an open secret despite everyone knowing down there. Even with this it was well known Vince's marriage has been a business relationship and he's loving around all the time. People keep his secrets. They keep HHH's secrets. They kept secrets 40 years ago. And no, it did not seem that way unless you did not read the WSJ article.
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Jan 28, 2024 18:12
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delightful posted:Why did it collectively take us until the receipts came out to stop watching?' I think you're making a fuckload of assumptions here, buddy. I haven't been watching for a good decade now, and a large reason for it was that I felt scummy about watching the company. There was tons of poo poo about Vince and the WWE/WWF out there years before. 100% honestly Owen's death and the poo poo that came out about it afterwards killed my love for the WWE. I just couldn't get the same entertainment out of the company knowing what I did, and I watched AJPW tapes I got from dodgy Dutch tape traders before drifting away from wrestling in general for a long time. Even though I occasionally remembered to check out the WWE's stuff (them being the only mainstream wrestling option) through the years, it was never the same again, and I probably would never have become an active wrestling fan again if I hadn't heard tons of good stuff about the AEW, and then realizing that thanks to the Internet, it's never been easier to get great wrestling from around the world.
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Jan 28, 2024 18:12
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