Neurolimal posted:

Abu Obeida sighs as he slips the blackberry back into his pocket; Another post misinterpreted, another break from the forums. Nothing else to do but return to the wars at-hand

Weka posted:

If Palestine can get a UN seat it will be game changing. It opens up a bunch of legal avenues. Of course this is why the fascist United States of America will never allow it.

WoodrowSkillson posted:

only issue i have with that is i do not know how a 1 state solution that removes israel's government and allows for Truth and Reconciliation commissions and poo poo can happen any time soon. So in the meantime is a 2 state better than just a ceasefire?

ScootsMcSkirt posted:

crazy things usually happen when ff is on long probes so i say let the mods cook

ScootsMcSkirt posted:

crazy things usually happen when ff is on long probes so i say let the mods cook

Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:

2 state with tanks and S-300s for palestine would be fine.

but every time biden mentions 2 state he mumbles something along the lines of "ya know jack, theres a lot of countries that dont have militaries..." so clearly the 2 state solution means a palestine that explicitly does not have the right or the means to defend itself

lumpentroll posted:

imagine what would happen with 100k

ScootsMcSkirt posted:

didnt kissinger die when FF was on a 30 day probe?

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

Right now FF is cooking up a spirit bomb so powerful they'll have to reboot the boards.

WoodrowSkillson posted:

yeah i know, i just want the death to stop. i know Israel will attack again, same way Palestinians know it. I guess i feel like actual recognition of Palestine as a true state would be a small step forward, if mostly useless since nothing will be solved until its 1 state. Im just a dumb guy though

Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:

2 state with tanks and S-300s for palestine would be fine.

but every time biden mentions 2 state he mumbles something along the lines of "ya know jack, theres a lot of countries that dont have militaries..." so clearly the 2 state solution means a palestine that explicitly does not have the right or the means to defend itself

Al-Saqr posted:

iran has cancelled all entry visa requirements for gulf countries citizens to visit, which is a really strange move because it means that relations between themselves and the gulf has improved massively? wierd that this is happening now.

you would think relations would be getting worse given how firmly the gulfs mouths are wrapped around israels dick

=====

Iran Cancels entry visas for nationals of 28 countries, including Arab countries

NoNotTheMindProbe posted:

The Iranians might be expecting the US to poo poo the bed and are building soft power for when they become the regional hegemon.

docbeard posted:

Iran has shown an incredible amount of restraint in the face of other nations trying to start WW3 for basically as long as I can remember.

quote:

Initially, Hezbollah's fighters targeted a grouping of Israeli occupation soldiers, positioned in al-Tayhat Hill opposite the Lebanese town of Mays al-Jabal in al-Jalil Panhandle. The Resistance confirmed a direct hit to the intended target at 9:35 am...

... the group targeted an Israeli Merkava tank, positioned in the Israeli Bayad Blida military site... Hezbollah said the tank was targeted and directly hit by its fighters who utilized the "appropriate weapons" for the mission, at 1:35 pm.

At 2:45 pm, the Resistance destroyed several pieces of spyware and military-grade hardware at the Israeli "Hanita" military site, in the western district of operations.

Less than half an hour later, Hezbollah fighters targeted a grouping of Israeli soldiers, positioned in the vicinity of the Israeli "Mattat" military site.

At 3:50 pm, Hezbollah launched an attack on a number of Israeli soldiers that had taken positions in a building in the "Metulla" settlement, which is located on the northernmost point of al-Jalil Panhandle, opposite the Lebanese town of Kfar Kila, marking yet another precise hit.

Sancho Banana posted:

FF's post was just awkwardly worded, the 18ner was fine. It's clear what he meant.

Dreylad posted:

It's not dumb. As long as we have a "rules-based international order" or whatever having statehood gains you access to a lot of things, and it makes it far more difficult for other state actors to do things to you like rampage through your cities, imprison your people, cut off access to food, water, and medicine because nominally there are institutions that exist to guarantee these things don't happen without serious international consequences.

Harik posted:

that shoot's as bad as an IDF soldier confronted with a toddler.

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

Incidentally, I get the same kind of "confirming secure connection" message logging onto UNRWA's website that I get browsing to Al Mayadeen and Press TV.

Dreylad posted:

In of itself statehood doesn't matter as long as Israel can do what it likes with impunity, but it's a lot easier to oppose what Israel is doing with statehood.

Weka posted:

Palestine does have statehood, 139 of the 193 U.N. member states recognize it. What it does not have is a UN seat.

Hatebag posted:

slay queen indeed

Al! posted:

only a mother truly knows how to kill a child

quote:

Frosted Flake wrote on Jan 31, 2024 4:20 PM:
I have written an open letter in my defence

I am writing to address the suspension of my posting privileges and to set the record straight regarding the context and content of my recent comments. My intention was to contribute to an informed discussion by drawing on historical and contemporary analyses, not to propagate harmful stereotypes.

My intention now that I stand accused of antisemitism, is to clarify and emphasize that the statements made are grounded in the most recent scholarship and firmly supported by historical context. I am confident in the accuracy of the information I have provided and am ready to defend the position with the strength of the literature.

Historical Accusations Against Jewish Communities:

It is a well-documented historical fact that Jewish communities, along with other minorities, were falsely accused of poisoning wells in medieval and early modern Europe. These baseless claims were part of a broader pattern of persecution and scapegoating. My reference to this history was intended to highlight the tragic irony of such accusations, not to perpetuate them.

The artificial division between Jewish history and the broader narrative of European history has often obscured the true dynamics underpinning the well-poisoning accusations of the late medieval period. A conventional reading might frame these accusations within the continuum of medieval anti-Judaism, drawing parallels with ritual murder or host desecration allegations (Barzilay 2022). However, a materialist historiographical approach reveals that the genesis of well-poisoning charges lies not in anti-Jewish sentiment but in the efforts to justify the persecution of lepers, a fact that significantly shaped the trajectory and nature of these accusations (Barzilay 2022). This insight prompts a reevaluation of the categories traditionally employed in historical analysis, suggesting that in this instance, they may obfuscate more than they elucidate (Barzilay 2022).

Moreover, the historiographical neglect of well-poisoning accusations as a distinct subject of study reflects a broader oversight of the materialist dimensions of historical phenomena (Barzilay 2022). While previous scholarship has often framed such persecutions within the context of religious and cultural antipathies, recent work by Barzilay advocates for a reassessment that foregrounds the material conditions and socio-economic interests shaping these episodes (Barzilay 2022). By weaving together the strands of economic hardship, demographic challenges, and the strategic manipulation of public anxieties, Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422 offers a materialist reinterpretation of well-poisoning accusations, situating them within the larger currents of late medieval European history.

Therefore, I believe that referring to the act of well poisoning as among "the worst stereotypes about Jewish people" and akin to "blood libel" is was correct in the context in which it was used. After reading Barzilay, it seems my mistake was believing such accusations had an enduring legacy. For Barzilay argues, there was a steep decline in well-poisoning accusations as a catalyst for anti-Jewish violence, in part due to the comparative lack of ritualistic and mnemonic resonance (Barzilay 2022). While well-poisoning narratives lingered in the cultural undercurrent, they ceased to function as a significant trigger for organized persecution, overshadowed by accusations that offered a more direct conduit to religious and communal identity formation (Barzilay 2022).

Having read the most recent monograph on well poisoning, I can only conclude that my error was rating well posing among the "worst" of these antisemitic narratives, when in reality it had far less impact than accusations of drinking Christian blood, for example.

Conflation of Israeli and Jewish Identities:

Scholarly research has extensively discussed how the State of Israel and some of its supporters conflate Israeli policies with Jewish identity, as well as anti-Zionism with antisemitism. This conflation can obscure the distinction between legitimate criticism of state policies and prejudiced attacks on a religious or ethnic group.

Michael Lerner's evolving stance on Israel, recorded in Israel and the Diaspora: Jewish Connectivity in a Changing World, reflects broader socio-political dynamics within the Jewish diaspora, particularly in the United States (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). His shifts from a neutral position to a critical post-Zionist perspective were marked at every turn by an association made between the Jewish community worldwide and the state of Israel. Lerner's initial defense of Israel against radical Leftist critique in the United States, grounded in the context of Middle Eastern geopolitics and historical conflicts, underscores the complex interplay between Jewish diasporic identity and the political realities of the State of Israel (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). His critique of the Left's condemnation of Israel reflected diasporic Jewish attitudes toward Israel, weaving together threads of historical memory, contemporary geopolitical analysis, and internal Jewish discourse (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

Lerner initially conflated the two, Israel and the Jewish people writ large, without hesitation, in a way that I believe mirrors the present media narrative, and, forgive me, the moderation decision made in this case: “Equally disturbing was that Jews from all over the country reported to us a disturbing amount of anti-Semitism and Israel bashing in the anti-war movement” (Tikkun, 1991, April: 7)

Lerner's transition to a post-Zionist critique of Israeli policy by the State's fiftieth anniversary signifies a deeper engagement with the moral and ethical implications of the State's actions, reflecting a broader trend within certain segments of the Jewish diaspora toward critical self-reflection (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). This shift can be understood within a materialist framework as a response to the evolving political landscape of Israel and its perceived deviation from the foundational values and aspirations that once galvanized widespread Jewish support for the Zionist project (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). Lerner's use of terms like "false messianism" to describe Israeli state policy points to a disillusionment with the state's trajectory, suggesting a reevaluation of the Zionist narrative in light of contemporary realities (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022):

“The state of Israel that was created to preserve Jews may be at the center of the process that leads Jews away from their Jewishness” (Lerner, 1998: 33).

It is on these grounds that I am prepared to defend that it is widely believed among diaspora Jews that the actions of the state of Israel reflect on them. I did not create this association, and I do not perpetuate it. Like Lerner, I believe the actions of Israel harm the Jewish people, as he says "lead Jews away from their Jewishness” (Lerner, 1998: 33). It is precisely the dire consequences of these actions that I wish to draw attention to, because I believe that the poisoning of wells in 1948, which I will get to shortly, knowingly hurt the Jewish community in light of the association between them and the state of Israel.

Israeli Government's Awareness of this Association:

There is evidence to suggest that the Israeli government is aware of how its actions and policies might be perceived in the context of historical Jewish experiences. This awareness has been used strategically in international forums to counter criticism, sometimes by invoking the specter of historical antisemitism.

Chapo favourite John Podhoretz, Editor-in-Chief of The Forward is the perfect subject to demonstrate this association. The Forward's engagement with Israeli politics, offering advice and urging coalition formations, illustrates the diaspora's active participation in Israeli statecraft, embodying a transnational Jewish political consciousness (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). This dynamic suggests that the Israeli government is aware that its policies and actions reverberate far beyond its territorial confines, impacting the global Jewish community's sentiment and moral standing (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

Moreover, the Israeli government's awareness of its role in representing the Jewish people worldwide is further highlighted by its responsiveness to diaspora perspectives, as evidenced by the diaspora media's influence on Israeli political discourse (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). The Forward's call for the Labor Party to join Sharon's government, aiming to temper aggressive policies, signifies the diaspora's vested interest in Israel's political direction and its implications for global Jewry (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). (Note: "Jewry" was their term in the passage I am paraphrasing) This interaction between the Israeli state and diaspora voices underscores a reciprocal relationship where the diaspora's concerns and aspirations inform the state's policy-making process, reinforcing the notion that Israel's actions are perceived as reflecting the collective will and identity of the Jewish people (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

My statement, "I do wonder if Israel feels a pang of guilt about 'confirming' the worst stereotypes about Jewish people in their actions, while shouting blood libel at every turn," is grounded in the understanding that the Israeli government's actions are undertaken with the knowledge that they could be associated with the Jewish people as a whole. It does not constitute an attack on the Jewish people or rely on prejudiced stereotypes; instead, it highlights the consequences of the Israeli government's actions on the perception of Jews worldwide.

Theoretical Framework for Israeli-Diaspora Relations

The Israeli government's deliberate blending of national (Israeli) and religious/cultural (Jewish) identities is not an incidental byproduct of the state's formation but a calculated effort to harness the global Jewish community's economic, political, and cultural capital (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

By positioning itself as the singular representative and homeland of all Jews, Israel strengthens its geopolitical stance, attracting investment, immigration, and political support that bolster its economy and international standing (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). This conflation is instrumental in the mobilization of diaspora resources, aligning the interests of Jews worldwide with the state's national agenda, thereby transforming global Jewish solidarity into a strategic asset for the Israeli economy and its geopolitical aspirations (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

Moreover, the equation of anti-Zionism with antisemitism is a tactical extension of this identity conflation, serving to deflect criticism and mobilize international support (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). By framing political opposition to Zionism or Israeli state policies as inherently antisemitic, the Israeli government effectively shields itself from legitimate scrutiny and sanctions, casting such critiques as attacks on the Jewish people at large rather than on specific state actions or policies (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). This rhetorical strategy not only stifles debate but also consolidates internal support by invoking a sense of collective threat and solidarity, further intertwining Jewish identity with Israeli statehood (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

I am not guilty of observing that, conflating Israeli state actions with Jewish identity, and anti-Zionism with antisemitism, the Israeli government strategically positioned itself within a historical continuum of Jewish persecution. This conflation served to shield the state from international scrutiny and criticism, framing any accusations against it as a continuation of age-old antisemitic prejudices. It is precisely for these reasons that the actions of the Israeli government in 1948 are so heinous.

The 1948 Well-Poisoning Incident:

The specific incident I mentioned, documented by historians like Benny Morris, involved accusations against Israeli forces for poisoning wells during the 1948 conflict. When these accusations were brought to the UN, the Israeli representative responded by framing them as a continuation of historical antisemitic libels, thus leveraging the painful history of Jewish persecution to deflect the criticism.

In the aftermath of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict, allegations emerged suggesting that the typhoid outbreak in the Arab town of Acre, preceding its capitulation on May 18, was the result of deliberate contamination by Haganah operatives (Morris and Kedar 2023). Concurrently, Egypt reported the apprehension of two individuals purportedly attempting to taint water sources near Gaza (Morris and Kedar 2023). These incidents, documented in various scholarly works, have been scrutinized by researchers such as Sara Leibowitz-Dar, Avner Cohen, and Salman Abu Sitta, relying chiefly on interviews conducted approximately two decades ago (Morris and Kedar 2023). Despite these discussions, access to contemporaneous Israeli records detailing covert biological warfare activities during this period remained restricted, with governmental efforts to obfuscate such information (Morris and Kedar 2023). Notably, edits were made to Ben-Gurion's 1948 diary when published in 1982, eliminating key phrases (Morris and Kedar 2023).



The operation, cryptically titled "Cast Thy Bread", was partially disclosed in a memoir by Arieh Aharoni, a Palmah officer in 1948, who stated its objective was to poison water intended for the Egyptian forces (Morris and Kedar 2023). The operation's full designation came to light in a 2003 article by Abu Sitta, based on information from military historian Uri Milstein (Morris and Kedar 2023). This revelation enabled a thorough examination of numerous documents within the Israel Defense Forces and Defense Ministry Archives, leading to the uncovering of pivotal documents and interviews that elucidated the broader strategy behind the Acre and Gaza incidents, part of a more extensive campaign to disrupt Palestinian Arab militias and the invading Arab armies (Morris and Kedar 2023).



I have attached the entire pdf of Cast thy Bread: Israeli Biological Warfare During the 1948 War. Middle Eastern Studies 59, no. 5 (2023) so that you can see how substantial the evidence is. I believe, without a shadow of a doubt, that the Israeli government poisoned wells. I believe that, in light of the history of well poisoning allegations, and the state of Israel's claims to stewardship of Jewish memory, and representing the Jewish people, they knew their actions "confirmed" the allegations. How could they not? If Israel represents the continuation of the history of the Jewish people (their claim), their actions create a historical continuity with the past (as they have constructed it).

In fact, this is best seen in how Israel faced evidence of these crimes.



The allegations brought forth at the UN Security Council by representatives from Syria and Egypt regarding the poisoning of wells near Gaza by Israeli operatives were met with a calculated response from Israeli representative Abba Eban (Morris and Kedar 2023). Eban's retort dismissed the accusations as reminiscent of "the most depraved tradition of medieval anti-Semitic incitement," thereby invoking the historical persecution of Jews as a rhetorical shield against the charges (Morris and Kedar 2023). This defense not only sought to discredit the specific allegations but also to reinforce the narrative that criticism of Israeli state actions was inherently rooted in antisemitism (Morris and Kedar 2023).

I did not idly say that serious accusations of real crimes were compared to blood label. Israeli officials made those comparisons, entered into the record of the United Nations.

In Summation

- Historical accusations of well poisoning were made against diaspora Jewish and other minority communities in medieval and early modern Europe.

- Israel deliberately conflates Israeli and Jewish identities, as well as anti-Zionism and antisemitism.

- The Israeli government is aware of how its actions can be associated with Jewish people worldwide and strategically encourages this perception.

- There is evidence that the Israeli government carried out well poisoning policies in 1948, and when questioned by the UN, they invoked historical accusations as a defense, knowingly playing on this association.

I have provided the two most important texts supporting this in pdf form here, Cast thy bread’: Israeli biological warfare during the 1948 War accounts for the present history of the Israeli state committing these acts, and Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422 demonstrates a history of the Jewish people being accused of them.

My intention was to illustrate how the actions of the Israeli government in 1948, and the subsequent framing of those actions, echo the very stereotypes that have historically been used against Jewish people (Morris and Kedar 2023). This observation is not an indictment of the Jewish community or an endorsement of antisemitic tropes but a critique of the political use of such historical narratives by the Israeli state (Morris and Kedar 2023). I resent this being treated as a "thought experiment" and not something that can actually be studied, with two excellent, and recent, publications demonstrating that the subject is worthy of inquiry, and that investigation of it is not inherently antisemitic. If the accusation is that I identified the Jewish people with the state of Israel, the fault lies with that state, which is also well documented. I only pointed out the possibility for harm given those associations, when the state of Israel carried out actions in 1948 that closely mirrored medieval accusations.

I believe it is possible to engage in critical discussions about state actions and policies without descending into prejudice. My comments were based on a careful reading of historical and political scholarship, not on unfounded accusations or stereotypes. I hope this clarification demonstrates my commitment to thoughtful and respectful discourse and warrants the reinstatement of my posting privileges.

Yours truly,

(Rank) F. F., RCHA (Retired), (Post-nominals), Late of RCAS

P.S

Bibliography

Barzilay, Tzafrir. "Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422." University of Pennsylvania Press, 2022.

Ben-Rafael, Eliezer, Judit Bokser Liwerant, and Yosef Gorny, eds. "Reconsidering Israel-Diaspora Relations." BRILL, 2014.

Gorny, Yosef. "Ethnicity and State Policy: The State of Israel in the Intellectual and Political Discourse of the US Jewish Press." In "Reconsidering Israel-Diaspora Relations," edited by Eliezer Ben-Rafael, Judit Bokser Liwerant, and Yosef Gorny. BRILL, 2014.

Kenedy, Robert A., Uzi Rebhun, and Carl S. Ehrlich, eds. "Israel and the Diaspora: Jewish Connectivity in a Changing World." Springer, 2022.

Landy, David. "Jewish Identity and Palestinian Rights: Diaspora Jewish Opposition to Israel." Zed Books Ltd, 2011.

Morris, Benny, and Benjamin Z. Kedar. "‘Cast thy bread’: Israeli biological warfare during the 1948 War." Middle Eastern Studies 59, no. 5 (2023): 752-776. DOI: 10.1080/00263206.2022.2122448.

Sicher, Efraim. "Re-envisioning Jewish Identities: Reflections on Contemporary Culture in Israel and the Diaspora." BRILL, 2021.

lumpentroll posted:

quote:

I have written an open letter in my defence

I am writing to address the suspension of my posting privileges and to set the record straight regarding the context and content of my recent comments. My intention was to contribute to an informed discussion by drawing on historical and contemporary analyses, not to propagate harmful stereotypes.

My intention now that I stand accused of antisemitism, is to clarify and emphasize that the statements made are grounded in the most recent scholarship and firmly supported by historical context. I am confident in the accuracy of the information I have provided and am ready to defend the position with the strength of the literature.

Historical Accusations Against Jewish Communities:

It is a well-documented historical fact that Jewish communities, along with other minorities, were falsely accused of poisoning wells in medieval and early modern Europe. These baseless claims were part of a broader pattern of persecution and scapegoating. My reference to this history was intended to highlight the tragic irony of such accusations, not to perpetuate them.

The artificial division between Jewish history and the broader narrative of European history has often obscured the true dynamics underpinning the well-poisoning accusations of the late medieval period. A conventional reading might frame these accusations within the continuum of medieval anti-Judaism, drawing parallels with ritual murder or host desecration allegations (Barzilay 2022). However, a materialist historiographical approach reveals that the genesis of well-poisoning charges lies not in anti-Jewish sentiment but in the efforts to justify the persecution of lepers, a fact that significantly shaped the trajectory and nature of these accusations (Barzilay 2022). This insight prompts a reevaluation of the categories traditionally employed in historical analysis, suggesting that in this instance, they may obfuscate more than they elucidate (Barzilay 2022).

Moreover, the historiographical neglect of well-poisoning accusations as a distinct subject of study reflects a broader oversight of the materialist dimensions of historical phenomena (Barzilay 2022). While previous scholarship has often framed such persecutions within the context of religious and cultural antipathies, recent work by Barzilay advocates for a reassessment that foregrounds the material conditions and socio-economic interests shaping these episodes (Barzilay 2022). By weaving together the strands of economic hardship, demographic challenges, and the strategic manipulation of public anxieties, Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422 offers a materialist reinterpretation of well-poisoning accusations, situating them within the larger currents of late medieval European history.

Therefore, I believe that referring to the act of well poisoning as among "the worst stereotypes about Jewish people" and akin to "blood libel" is was correct in the context in which it was used. After reading Barzilay, it seems my mistake was believing such accusations had an enduring legacy. For Barzilay argues, there was a steep decline in well-poisoning accusations as a catalyst for anti-Jewish violence, in part due to the comparative lack of ritualistic and mnemonic resonance (Barzilay 2022). While well-poisoning narratives lingered in the cultural undercurrent, they ceased to function as a significant trigger for organized persecution, overshadowed by accusations that offered a more direct conduit to religious and communal identity formation (Barzilay 2022).

Having read the most recent monograph on well poisoning, I can only conclude that my error was rating well posing among the "worst" of these antisemitic narratives, when in reality it had far less impact than accusations of drinking Christian blood, for example.

Conflation of Israeli and Jewish Identities:

Scholarly research has extensively discussed how the State of Israel and some of its supporters conflate Israeli policies with Jewish identity, as well as anti-Zionism with antisemitism. This conflation can obscure the distinction between legitimate criticism of state policies and prejudiced attacks on a religious or ethnic group.

Michael Lerner's evolving stance on Israel, recorded in Israel and the Diaspora: Jewish Connectivity in a Changing World, reflects broader socio-political dynamics within the Jewish diaspora, particularly in the United States (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). His shifts from a neutral position to a critical post-Zionist perspective were marked at every turn by an association made between the Jewish community worldwide and the state of Israel. Lerner's initial defense of Israel against radical Leftist critique in the United States, grounded in the context of Middle Eastern geopolitics and historical conflicts, underscores the complex interplay between Jewish diasporic identity and the political realities of the State of Israel (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). His critique of the Left's condemnation of Israel reflected diasporic Jewish attitudes toward Israel, weaving together threads of historical memory, contemporary geopolitical analysis, and internal Jewish discourse (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

Lerner initially conflated the two, Israel and the Jewish people writ large, without hesitation, in a way that I believe mirrors the present media narrative, and, forgive me, the moderation decision made in this case: “Equally disturbing was that Jews from all over the country reported to us a disturbing amount of anti-Semitism and Israel bashing in the anti-war movement” (Tikkun, 1991, April: 7)

Lerner's transition to a post-Zionist critique of Israeli policy by the State's fiftieth anniversary signifies a deeper engagement with the moral and ethical implications of the State's actions, reflecting a broader trend within certain segments of the Jewish diaspora toward critical self-reflection (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). This shift can be understood within a materialist framework as a response to the evolving political landscape of Israel and its perceived deviation from the foundational values and aspirations that once galvanized widespread Jewish support for the Zionist project (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). Lerner's use of terms like "false messianism" to describe Israeli state policy points to a disillusionment with the state's trajectory, suggesting a reevaluation of the Zionist narrative in light of contemporary realities (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022):

“The state of Israel that was created to preserve Jews may be at the center of the process that leads Jews away from their Jewishness” (Lerner, 1998: 33).

It is on these grounds that I am prepared to defend that it is widely believed among diaspora Jews that the actions of the state of Israel reflect on them. I did not create this association, and I do not perpetuate it. Like Lerner, I believe the actions of Israel harm the Jewish people, as he says "lead Jews away from their Jewishness” (Lerner, 1998: 33). It is precisely the dire consequences of these actions that I wish to draw attention to, because I believe that the poisoning of wells in 1948, which I will get to shortly, knowingly hurt the Jewish community in light of the association between them and the state of Israel.

Israeli Government's Awareness of this Association:

There is evidence to suggest that the Israeli government is aware of how its actions and policies might be perceived in the context of historical Jewish experiences. This awareness has been used strategically in international forums to counter criticism, sometimes by invoking the specter of historical antisemitism.

Chapo favourite John Podhoretz, Editor-in-Chief of The Forward is the perfect subject to demonstrate this association. The Forward's engagement with Israeli politics, offering advice and urging coalition formations, illustrates the diaspora's active participation in Israeli statecraft, embodying a transnational Jewish political consciousness (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). This dynamic suggests that the Israeli government is aware that its policies and actions reverberate far beyond its territorial confines, impacting the global Jewish community's sentiment and moral standing (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

Moreover, the Israeli government's awareness of its role in representing the Jewish people worldwide is further highlighted by its responsiveness to diaspora perspectives, as evidenced by the diaspora media's influence on Israeli political discourse (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). The Forward's call for the Labor Party to join Sharon's government, aiming to temper aggressive policies, signifies the diaspora's vested interest in Israel's political direction and its implications for global Jewry (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022). (Note: "Jewry" was their term in the passage I am paraphrasing) This interaction between the Israeli state and diaspora voices underscores a reciprocal relationship where the diaspora's concerns and aspirations inform the state's policy-making process, reinforcing the notion that Israel's actions are perceived as reflecting the collective will and identity of the Jewish people (Kenedy, Rebhun, and Ehrlich 2022).

My statement, "I do wonder if Israel feels a pang of guilt about 'confirming' the worst stereotypes about Jewish people in their actions, while shouting blood libel at every turn," is grounded in the understanding that the Israeli government's actions are undertaken with the knowledge that they could be associated with the Jewish people as a whole. It does not constitute an attack on the Jewish people or rely on prejudiced stereotypes; instead, it highlights the consequences of the Israeli government's actions on the perception of Jews worldwide.

Theoretical Framework for Israeli-Diaspora Relations

The Israeli government's deliberate blending of national (Israeli) and religious/cultural (Jewish) identities is not an incidental byproduct of the state's formation but a calculated effort to harness the global Jewish community's economic, political, and cultural capital (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

By positioning itself as the singular representative and homeland of all Jews, Israel strengthens its geopolitical stance, attracting investment, immigration, and political support that bolster its economy and international standing (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). This conflation is instrumental in the mobilization of diaspora resources, aligning the interests of Jews worldwide with the state's national agenda, thereby transforming global Jewish solidarity into a strategic asset for the Israeli economy and its geopolitical aspirations (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

Moreover, the equation of anti-Zionism with antisemitism is a tactical extension of this identity conflation, serving to deflect criticism and mobilize international support (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). By framing political opposition to Zionism or Israeli state policies as inherently antisemitic, the Israeli government effectively shields itself from legitimate scrutiny and sanctions, casting such critiques as attacks on the Jewish people at large rather than on specific state actions or policies (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014). This rhetorical strategy not only stifles debate but also consolidates internal support by invoking a sense of collective threat and solidarity, further intertwining Jewish identity with Israeli statehood (Ben-Rafael, Liwerant, and Gorny 2014).

I am not guilty of observing that, conflating Israeli state actions with Jewish identity, and anti-Zionism with antisemitism, the Israeli government strategically positioned itself within a historical continuum of Jewish persecution. This conflation served to shield the state from international scrutiny and criticism, framing any accusations against it as a continuation of age-old antisemitic prejudices. It is precisely for these reasons that the actions of the Israeli government in 1948 are so heinous.

The 1948 Well-Poisoning Incident:

The specific incident I mentioned, documented by historians like Benny Morris, involved accusations against Israeli forces for poisoning wells during the 1948 conflict. When these accusations were brought to the UN, the Israeli representative responded by framing them as a continuation of historical antisemitic libels, thus leveraging the painful history of Jewish persecution to deflect the criticism.

In the aftermath of the 1948 Arab-Israeli conflict, allegations emerged suggesting that the typhoid outbreak in the Arab town of Acre, preceding its capitulation on May 18, was the result of deliberate contamination by Haganah operatives (Morris and Kedar 2023). Concurrently, Egypt reported the apprehension of two individuals purportedly attempting to taint water sources near Gaza (Morris and Kedar 2023). These incidents, documented in various scholarly works, have been scrutinized by researchers such as Sara Leibowitz-Dar, Avner Cohen, and Salman Abu Sitta, relying chiefly on interviews conducted approximately two decades ago (Morris and Kedar 2023). Despite these discussions, access to contemporaneous Israeli records detailing covert biological warfare activities during this period remained restricted, with governmental efforts to obfuscate such information (Morris and Kedar 2023). Notably, edits were made to Ben-Gurion's 1948 diary when published in 1982, eliminating key phrases (Morris and Kedar 2023).



The operation, cryptically titled "Cast Thy Bread", was partially disclosed in a memoir by Arieh Aharoni, a Palmah officer in 1948, who stated its objective was to poison water intended for the Egyptian forces (Morris and Kedar 2023). The operation's full designation came to light in a 2003 article by Abu Sitta, based on information from military historian Uri Milstein (Morris and Kedar 2023). This revelation enabled a thorough examination of numerous documents within the Israel Defense Forces and Defense Ministry Archives, leading to the uncovering of pivotal documents and interviews that elucidated the broader strategy behind the Acre and Gaza incidents, part of a more extensive campaign to disrupt Palestinian Arab militias and the invading Arab armies (Morris and Kedar 2023).



I have attached the entire pdf of Cast thy Bread: Israeli Biological Warfare During the 1948 War. Middle Eastern Studies 59, no. 5 (2023) so that you can see how substantial the evidence is. I believe, without a shadow of a doubt, that the Israeli government poisoned wells. I believe that, in light of the history of well poisoning allegations, and the state of Israel's claims to stewardship of Jewish memory, and representing the Jewish people, they knew their actions "confirmed" the allegations. How could they not? If Israel represents the continuation of the history of the Jewish people (their claim), their actions create a historical continuity with the past (as they have constructed it).

In fact, this is best seen in how Israel faced evidence of these crimes.



The allegations brought forth at the UN Security Council by representatives from Syria and Egypt regarding the poisoning of wells near Gaza by Israeli operatives were met with a calculated response from Israeli representative Abba Eban (Morris and Kedar 2023). Eban's retort dismissed the accusations as reminiscent of "the most depraved tradition of medieval anti-Semitic incitement," thereby invoking the historical persecution of Jews as a rhetorical shield against the charges (Morris and Kedar 2023). This defense not only sought to discredit the specific allegations but also to reinforce the narrative that criticism of Israeli state actions was inherently rooted in antisemitism (Morris and Kedar 2023).

I did not idly say that serious accusations of real crimes were compared to blood label. Israeli officials made those comparisons, entered into the record of the United Nations.

In Summation

- Historical accusations of well poisoning were made against diaspora Jewish and other minority communities in medieval and early modern Europe.

- Israel deliberately conflates Israeli and Jewish identities, as well as anti-Zionism and antisemitism.

- The Israeli government is aware of how its actions can be associated with Jewish people worldwide and strategically encourages this perception.

- There is evidence that the Israeli government carried out well poisoning policies in 1948, and when questioned by the UN, they invoked historical accusations as a defense, knowingly playing on this association.

I have provided the two most important texts supporting this in pdf form here, Cast thy bread’: Israeli biological warfare during the 1948 War accounts for the present history of the Israeli state committing these acts, and Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422 demonstrates a history of the Jewish people being accused of them.

My intention was to illustrate how the actions of the Israeli government in 1948, and the subsequent framing of those actions, echo the very stereotypes that have historically been used against Jewish people (Morris and Kedar 2023). This observation is not an indictment of the Jewish community or an endorsement of antisemitic tropes but a critique of the political use of such historical narratives by the Israeli state (Morris and Kedar 2023). I resent this being treated as a "thought experiment" and not something that can actually be studied, with two excellent, and recent, publications demonstrating that the subject is worthy of inquiry, and that investigation of it is not inherently antisemitic. If the accusation is that I identified the Jewish people with the state of Israel, the fault lies with that state, which is also well documented. I only pointed out the possibility for harm given those associations, when the state of Israel carried out actions in 1948 that closely mirrored medieval accusations.

I believe it is possible to engage in critical discussions about state actions and policies without descending into prejudice. My comments were based on a careful reading of historical and political scholarship, not on unfounded accusations or stereotypes. I hope this clarification demonstrates my commitment to thoughtful and respectful discourse and warrants the reinstatement of my posting privileges.

Yours truly,

(Rank) F. F., RCHA (Retired), (Post-nominals), Late of RCAS

P.S

Bibliography

Barzilay, Tzafrir. "Poisoned Wells: Accusations, Persecution, and Minorities in Medieval Europe, 1321-1422." University of Pennsylvania Press, 2022.

Ben-Rafael, Eliezer, Judit Bokser Liwerant, and Yosef Gorny, eds. "Reconsidering Israel-Diaspora Relations." BRILL, 2014.

Gorny, Yosef. "Ethnicity and State Policy: The State of Israel in the Intellectual and Political Discourse of the US Jewish Press." In "Reconsidering Israel-Diaspora Relations," edited by Eliezer Ben-Rafael, Judit Bokser Liwerant, and Yosef Gorny. BRILL, 2014.

Kenedy, Robert A., Uzi Rebhun, and Carl S. Ehrlich, eds. "Israel and the Diaspora: Jewish Connectivity in a Changing World." Springer, 2022.

Landy, David. "Jewish Identity and Palestinian Rights: Diaspora Jewish Opposition to Israel." Zed Books Ltd, 2011.

Morris, Benny, and Benjamin Z. Kedar. "‘Cast thy bread’: Israeli biological warfare during the 1948 War." Middle Eastern Studies 59, no. 5 (2023): 752-776. DOI: 10.1080/00263206.2022.2122448.

Sicher, Efraim. "Re-envisioning Jewish Identities: Reflections on Contemporary Culture in Israel and the Diaspora." BRILL, 2021.

quote:

The naval forces of the Yemeni Armed Forces carried out a specific military operation targeting an American merchant ship "KOI" that was heading to the ports of occupied Palestine with several appropriate naval missiles that directly hit the vessel.

lumpentroll posted: