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Financial planning also encompasses a lot more than investment management. A good CFP will review your insurance policies, estate plan, do tax planning/preparation, and basically be a quarterback for anything in your life with a dollar sign attached to it. Is that worth 1% of your whole entire portfolio annually? Probably not, but if you are in a complicated situation it can make sense. When I was working for a planner, there were a few people who really got value from our services in weird inheritance/trust situations. The others were a wash except that we talked them out of bailing out of the market during the pandemic. And convinced one tech person they really shouldn't put half of their investments in bitcoin right before the btc crash.
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Jan 30, 2024 05:49
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It may also be helpful as a way to switch your brain from “save save save” mode during your working years to “you can spend this money” in retirement.
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Jan 30, 2024 06:11
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1% AUM might be worth it when you only have $100k, but it gets to be a worse and worse deal the more money you have, until you have so much money that you genuinely need complicated poo poo my mother in law has about $600k in her 401k now, which means she's paying $500 a month to the guy at the place. Meanwhile she's afraid to increase her withdrawal rate above minimum required distributions because the money could run out before she's 95 (she's 75 now). That six k a year matters. But she doesn't want to hand over management to her daughter or me, and we don't want to pressure her to. On a call with her advisor last month I asked a lot of pointed questions, and it turns out all her money is in low cost index funds, so he's doing the right things, and he's also managing a weird thing where her old employer has her holding a bunch of shares of the company in an account with it payable to the previous name of her financial advisor's company so the dividend checks aren't cashable so she accumulated uncashable checks for like five years, and now he's getting them to fix it, which is... nice, but still not worth six thousand dollars a year, and if she didn't have a financial advisor the money would have been paid directly to her in the first place. Anyway the shares are finally being transferred and they've lost 50% of their value over the last five years so actually having this complicated arrangement has cost her like ten thousand dollars, on top of the advisor fees. tl;dr fixed fee financial advisor is the best way to go, if you think you need one at all, but unless numbers are very scary to you and you or you can't trust yourself not to empty your accounts and spend it all on NFTs and fancy cookies, spend a few hours learning about the glidepath for a 3-fund portfolio and then spend one hour a year rebalancing and you'll be fine for the next few decades and you can save yourself, in the long run, many tens of thousands of dollars of fees plus earnings on the money you didn't pay as fees so it stayed invested instead.
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Jan 30, 2024 19:09
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Leperflesh posted:1% AUM might be worth it when you only have $100k, but it gets to be a worse and worse deal the more money you have, until you have so much money that you genuinely need complicated poo poo I don't think 1% AUM is ever worth it. Investing a million dollars is no different than investing one thousand dollars. The investments themselves don't get any more complicated as the numbers get larger. Investment advisors are often little more than salespeople and tend to put people in stupidly complicated portfolios of dozens of funds for no other reason than to justify their job. A CFP on the other hand can help you with tax and estate planning. When you have a high net worth its worth paying a flat fee for those services. When you have a very high net worth they can also help you structure your assets to shield them from liability. That way "creative" individuals can't use contrived reasons to sue your money right off you. Antillie fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Jan 30, 2024 |
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Jan 30, 2024 21:07
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Antillie posted:I don't think 1% AUM is ever worth it. Investing a million dollars is no different than investing one thousand dollars. The investments themselves don't get any more complicated as the numbers get larger. Investment advisors are often little more than salespeople and tend to put people in stupidly complicated portfolios of dozens of funds for no other reason than to justify their job. "Very high net worth" is pretty ambiguous. Umbrella policy for anything under like $10M seems more than sufficient.
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Jan 30, 2024 21:28
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Hi thread. My wife and I have always and exclusively contributed to Roth IRAs. This is the first year where we have earned over the limit to claim the Retirement Savers credit. Is there any useful guideline or articles I can read about whether it's worth contributing to a Trad IRA? My understanding is that the answer is generally "no", but figured it was worth asking.
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Jan 31, 2024 04:27
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dpkg chopra posted:Hi thread. If you get deductions and cannot use Roth IRA, using a traditional IRA is definitely worth it. Otherwise, backdoor your Roth IRA If you are in the sweet spot where you earned over the limit of Retirement Savers Credit but can still contribute to a Roth, I think you need to do some math on what is worthwhile
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Jan 31, 2024 05:04
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Antillie posted:I don't think 1% AUM is ever worth it. Investing a million dollars is no different than investing one thousand dollars. The investments themselves don't get any more complicated as the numbers get larger. Investment advisors are often little more than salespeople and tend to put people in stupidly complicated portfolios of dozens of funds for no other reason than to justify their job. The reality is nobody's going to take you as a client if you only have $20k, but if you only have $20k, 1% AUM is $200 and that's a deal for a couple hours of financial advisor time and effort. That's all I meant, that the actual cost per unit of advice and work rises as your portfolio gets bigger, and there's some point, wherever you want to place it, where you're paying someone like a thousand dollars an hour for poo poo anyone who has hung around in this thread for a year could do. That said, investments do get more complicated as you get high wealth individuals who have things like: all their assets are in a trust, they have a self-directed 401k, an RV three jetskis and a boat, own a vacation property that they rent out via AirBnB most of the year, have a couple of trust funds for their kids, etc. etc. I think even in these cases a fee-per-hour advisor is better. And it should be a fiduciary, and people should watch out for sales pitches and insist on mostly cheap index funds for their stock allocation. A "CFP" is not an estate planner. While they may be able to help a little, they don't typically do things like write a will, create a trust, create an advanced directive, or give investment advice. Tax planning, yes. Protecting assets from lawsuit, maybe (put it in a trust is the answer). I expect some estate planners are also CFPs, or have one in their office, but a lot of that work is legal work and a lot of estate planners are lawyers.
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Jan 31, 2024 05:12
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So here's the problem though. Everyone says hire a single flat fee planner or a per hour planner... those basically do not exist. The ones that do exist are either just starting out and looking to get clients any way possible, or are so bad that they need to get clients in any way possible. A good CFP works on AUM or annual retainer because they can. You have to get pretty lucky to get a deal on a good CFP, because, well, if they are any good they are charging way too much for your average poster here to get value out of them. Best case scenario is you hire an annual retainer planner the year before you retire and get all of your Medicare/tax planning/inheritance stuff squared away, and then fire them right after the first year. Which is to say that posting in BFC is the best value financial planning most people can ever dream of finding.
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Jan 31, 2024 05:48
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moana posted:So here's the problem though. Everyone says hire a single flat fee planner or a per hour planner... those basically do not exist. The ones that do exist are either just starting out and looking to get clients any way possible, or are so bad that they need to get clients in any way possible. On a lark I looked at the first financial planner listed near my zip code as a "fee-only" planner. They do not charge an AUM fee... they charge a net worth fee. Cant say I've seen that before. Also, not sure how that works since they would need to value real estate, shares of privately held companies, etc.
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Jan 31, 2024 06:15
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Thanks again for giving me the confidence to tell my financial advisor I didn't want to pursue the asset management fee. Now I have to learn to do Fidelity backdoor roth ira conversions, roll my old 401k plans over, and pick out some things I want to invest in for the downpayment on my house. But I'm so glad I get to keep the money I'd be paying them otherwise. Also lol he seemed a bit annoyed. I told him on the first call I only wanted a review of my situation and didn't want asset management. Then he pushed it. huhu fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Jan 31, 2024 |
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Jan 31, 2024 19:13
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huhu posted:Thanks again for giving me the confidence to tell my financial advisor I didn't want to pursue the asset management fee. Now I have to learn to do Fidelity backdoor roth ira conversions, roll my old 401k plans over, and pick out some things I want to invest in for the downpayment on my house. But I'm so glad I get to keep the money I'd be paying them otherwise. Here's the Fidelity backdoor Roth instruction guide https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/how-to-do-a-backdoor-roth-ira-at-fidelity/
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Jan 31, 2024 20:05
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We had our Simple IRA presentation at work and I found out the financial company running it is charging a 1% management fee. I'm guessing that's on top of whatever the fees on the Schwab funds are. A little annoyed but I just looked around reddit and I think some other people are getting hit with ridiculous fees like 7%+ or even yearly $75 per each fund.
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Feb 1, 2024 04:25
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Mu Zeta posted:We had our Simple IRA presentation at work and I found out the financial company running it is charging a 1% management fee. I'm guessing that's on top of whatever the fees on the Schwab funds are. A little annoyed but I just looked around reddit and I think some other people are getting hit with ridiculous fees like 7%+ or even yearly $75 per each fund. Lame. I have a Simple IRA and its just done through Vanguard with access to all of their mutual funds with no extra fees/expenses. As far as I know, my employer doesnt pay anything either. I really have to wonder if whoever is decision making in your case gets some kinda kickback? Why else would they sign up with some fee charging intermediary? Simple IRA's are supposed to be simple.
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Feb 1, 2024 05:00
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The financial company was also hired this year to be the new accountants so that could part of it. The retirement stuff is just a part of their services. I'll definitely be asking next week. But I don't want to complain right away since it's been a long road in convincing them to start a simple IRA in the first place.
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Feb 1, 2024 05:07
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Mu Zeta posted:The financial company was also hired this year to be the new accountants so that could part of it. The retirement stuff is just a part of their services. I'll definitely be asking next week. But I don't want to complain right away since it's been a long road in convincing them to start a simple IRA in the first place. Its possible the retirement advisory stuff is optional. If Schwab is acting as the account provider, you should ask if its possible to be self directed / DIY.
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Feb 1, 2024 05:21
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Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs.
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Feb 1, 2024 08:17
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. Any HYSA bank is solid. I have had Ally for like, 12 years, and as long as you don’t need to deposit cash they are great (I never do). But most online banks are solid, and local credit unions can be depending on your luck of the draw. Looking at it, my current Savings interest with Ally is 4.35%, so I def would go with anyone who is 4% or higher. An Ally 1 year CD is 4.9%. I would just note that you want some of your emergency savings liquid (because that’s why you have it) so I would keep whatever amount in just the standard savings account (usually 6 months expenses). Supposedly rates may start going down? If they do, I would assume it’ll be a slow change like it was when rates went up, and regardless you want some of your emergency fund liquid no matter what.
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Feb 1, 2024 13:02
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A weird Ally quirk is that they will offer unlisted CDs on unusual durations at slightly higher rates. Like right now they have a 14 month CD at 5% which is higher than their 12 month (4.90%) or 18 month (4.65%). https://www.ally.com/go/bank/14m-select-cd/
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Feb 1, 2024 13:52
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Looking for a bit of guidance:
No tax-advantaged mode of retirement savings available to us, as far as I am aware. However Switzerland has no capital gains tax, although does tax dividends. So how should we go about saving for retirement? I think the least bad option is opening an American brokerage account (Vanguard? Charles Schwab? IB?) and doing a handful of big boring ETFs (possibly Target Date?) and maybe some bonds or treasuries (though the latter might be subject to taxation by both CH and USA). If we were to renounce citizenship, that might force us to liquidate and move to a Swiss brokerage eventually, but would free us from worrying about PFICs. Also considering eventually using retirement capital to buy a primary residence, and liquidating when necessary in retirement. (Downpayment would need to be CHF 280,000 or more, which would be 12+ years from now) webcams for christ fucked around with this message at 14:29 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 14:27
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. If you look in the CC thread there was some very recent discussion on 2% and 5% cash back cards. You can open a Brokerage account at Fidelity and deposit your money there. You can order free checkbooks and debit cards and deposit mobile checks. Uninvested money is automatically converted back and forth into a government money market fund earning 5% at the moment. Fidelity also has an easy 2% CC that would be set to deposit back into the brokerage account. You don’t have to trade any stocks.
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Feb 1, 2024 15:02
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. +1 for Ally. I also have a local credit union account for when I deal with cash (e.g. paying contractors who offer a discount with cash). Another nice thing is you can use the Money Market account like it’s a checking account (debit card, no limit on transactions). So you can just make a big pile of cash on that 4.35% rate. I don’t do it personally because that was a change that came from pandemic era and my usage predates that. Too lazy to change over my DD and auto pay for a bunch of things.
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Feb 1, 2024 17:51
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. Are you doing an IRA? You can open an IRA for you and/or your spouse and that's another $8k/year tax-advantaged savings.
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Feb 1, 2024 18:23
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. Follow the flowchart from the OP.
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Feb 1, 2024 18:31
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Leperflesh posted:Are you doing an IRA? You can open an IRA for you and/or your spouse and that's another $8k/year tax-advantaged savings. An IRA is not necessarily the right choice for "long term savings", since there are restrictions on taking money out before retirement age. But, if OP can contribute to a Roth and isn't, it might make sense to do so since you can at least withdraw the contributions early if needed.
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Feb 1, 2024 18:50
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Yeah OP was vague about what exactly the long term savings are for, but since they only mentioned maxing 401k and not any other tax-advantaged savings, I think it should be at least suggested as a possibility. The correct real answer is CubicalSucrose posted:Follow the flowchart from the OP. Without more details about income, what the savings are for, whether OP is on target for retirement, etc. it's tough to say more than that.
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Feb 1, 2024 18:52
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Discendo Vox posted:Without getting into specifics, my employer's matched policy is insufficient (though I've got it maxed) and I've currently just got checking and debit with BofA (and have generally had poor experiences with them) plus a Capital One credit card flowing from my BofA checking. I'd like to effectively bolster my longer-term savings while taking a minimal involvement, low risk approach (I don't have the time or holdings to make being more active worthwhile). I'm looking into changing up what bank I use and want to consider what my added options are. any recommendations? I was considering moving my checking to Ally and also getting some of their CDs. I've got some long-term "cash" in a couple places, and I'd recommend either or both to you: Vanguard brokerage account -- the "cash" here is automatically held as one of their money market funds, which has a current yield over 5%. Sometimes I buy multi-month treasuries at auction and hold them for their entire period. I was pretty stunned at how easy the Vanguard account was to set up and use...it just worked for me Merrill cash management account -- I believe everything I have in this account is in SGOV? I prefer the Vanguard account, but the thing to keep in mind is how great BofA's CC premium rewards program can be. If you can hold $100k in your accounts across BofA/Merrill, including things like IRAs, then you can get 2.5% back on every purchase (or more if you use the points to buy whatever gift cards are on special). That's as much CC complexity as I want, so that works for me. Even if you're not near $100k (yet!), you might check if the earlier tiers are worth it to you...I think there are some other perks, too, like no ATM fees.
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Feb 1, 2024 19:54
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Planning on earning about 10k from freelancing in 2024. I already have a full time job and am maxing my 401k match (5%), HSA and Roth IRA. I won’t need access to this extra money I’ll earn so I just wanna know what is the best way to save on taxes here? I was looking into opening an individual 401k because it looks like I can contribute either 20% or 25% of my freelance income “from the business” … which reduces my personal income tax liability? And then the rest I can contribute it “personally”? Which means I would receive $0 in income from freelancing which is what I want? Alternatively I was thinking I’d just increase my job’s 401k contribution to contribute whatever freelance profits I make and not bother with it.
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Feb 2, 2024 00:04
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By far the easiest will be to increase your contribution to your work's 401k, but even if you open an individual 401k and get all of your freelance money into it you'll still have to pay payroll tax (employer's portion of social security) plus probably FICA or similar on that money so there's no way for it to become completely tax free. But you're offsetting income tax you pay on that freelance income by reducing the income (and income tax) from your main job, so I'd say max out your employer's 401k first unless that 401k's options are really bad.
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Feb 2, 2024 00:14
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Boris Galerkin posted:Planning on earning about 10k from freelancing in 2024. I already have a full time job and am maxing my 401k match (5%), HSA and Roth IRA. I won’t need access to this extra money I’ll earn so I just wanna know what is the best way to save on taxes here? If you have a CPA, this seems like a great question for them.
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Feb 2, 2024 00:23
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The reason I was looking into an individual 401k first was because if I increase my regular 401k contribution I’ll get a smaller paycheck from my job and then it’ll feel like I got a pay cut for doing the same amount of work at my job. I know it doesn’t make sense because I’ll get the money I “lose” back from freelancing and also I don’t “lose” any money because it’s still mine. But well you know, emotions and all.
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Feb 2, 2024 00:24
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smackfu posted:A weird Ally quirk is that they will offer unlisted CDs on unusual durations at slightly higher rates. Crazy, how do you go about finding these if they’re not listed? Just guess the month number in the URL until you get a hit? Pipistrelle fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Feb 2, 2024 |
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Feb 2, 2024 00:25
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It'll help maybe if you write the numbers down on a sheet where you add your incomes up to a bottom line and show how much you're saving in retirement etc. Another way to look at it is that by putting more into a 401k, you're sheltering more of your money from the tax man. You're literally paying less tax than if you don't. That's more money you keep.
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Feb 2, 2024 00:26
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Pipistrelle posted:Crazy, how do you go about finding these if they’re not listed? Just guess the month number in the URL until you get a hit? They are posted on a number of sites that track these sort of things, like depositaccounts.com. Its also the first result on google if you search "ally cd specials"
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Feb 2, 2024 01:24
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webcams for christ posted:Looking for a bit of guidance: You might find this interview somewhat useful. Though, if I recall, there are really no particularly great options.
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Feb 2, 2024 03:18
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I apologize for being so vague, I have a significant degree of doxxing concern on SA at this point. I am maxing my employer's SIMPLE IRA in a Vanguard target retirement fund. The other aspects of the flowchart involving employer plans are thus not applicable, and I've covered everything up to that point; at this juncture I'm saving a significant percentage of my income (~30%) because I work very hard at spending next to nothing, but it's sitting in a BofA checking account because I have no time to identify somewhere else to put it. I've started having the income to be able to save only very recently, and the flat amount of saving and per-month saved income is still relatively low.
Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Feb 2, 2024 |
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Feb 2, 2024 07:49
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Despite the name, contributions to a SIMPLE IRA have no effect on your ability to contribute to a Roth or Traditional IRA. You can do both: https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plan...%20IRA%20plan). If you intend your additional savings to be retirement savings, I think a traditional or Roth IRA is the next good option for you to save money because it is tax-advantaged and you can choose your own custodian (e.g., Vanguard or Fidelity) which offers excellent low-cost index funds and is very safe and secure. If you intend your savings to be for a medium term thing like a house purchase, future vacations, etc. I agree that using a high yield savings account or similar is best to avoid any exposure to short or medium term market downturns. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 08:03 on Feb 2, 2024 |
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Feb 2, 2024 08:00
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Discendo Vox posted:I apologize for being so vague, I have a significant degree of doxxing concern on SA at this point. I am maxing my employer's SIMPLE IRA in a Vanguard target retirement fund. The other aspects of the flowchart involving employer plans are thus not applicable, and I've covered everything up to that point; at this juncture I'm saving a significant percentage of my income because I work very hard at spending next to nothing, but it's sitting in a BofA checking account because I have no time to identify somewhere else to put it. I've started having the income to be able to save only very recently, and the flat amount of saving and per-month saved income is still relatively low. Follow the flowchart until you get to the end of the flowchart.
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Feb 2, 2024 08:00
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Leperflesh posted:Despite the name, contributions to a SIMPLE IRA have no effect on your ability to contribute to a Roth or Traditional IRA. You can do both: Thanks, this is very helpful- I'd asked this exact exclusivity question last time I was here but didn't get a response. I need to examine the interaction of my SIMPLE and the traditional/Roth to evaluate the tax advantages; this may be complicated by the fact that I am currently making the most I am likely to ever make, and my SIMPLE contributions do affect traditional contribution deductability. Do you have any recommendations regarding placement for HYSA? CubicalSucrose posted:Follow the flowchart until you get to the end of the flowchart. In contrast, this is useless. I already read the flowchart, I said I read the flowchart, the flowchart did not and does not provide enough information or context to identify what I need to do or the potential mistake I was making which Leperflesh identified. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 08:15 on Feb 2, 2024 |
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Feb 2, 2024 08:13
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Discendo Vox posted:Thanks, this is very helpful- I'd asked this exact exclusivity question last time I was here but didn't get a response. I need to examine the interaction of my SIMPLE and the traditional/Roth to evaluate the tax advantages; this may be complicated by the fact that I am currently making the most I am likely to ever make, and my SIMPLE contributions do affect traditional contribution deductability. Do you have any recommendations regarding placement for HYSA? You’re being obtuse. You say you are leaving out details but get upset when you think people don’t understand you. It seems you don’t have enough information to explain your situation yet. If you are within the income limits you should max out both your SIMPLE IRA and a traditional/Roth IRA. “Traditional” and “Roth” just refer to tax treatment. That is different than the “vehicle” which is a legally defined way to contribute money for retirement. There are multiple vehicles. Employer sponsored (401k, 403b, SIMPLE IRA, etc) have their own rules and contribution limits. This is separate from an Individual Retirement Account (IRA), which has their own rules and contribution limits. You can have a Traditional employer plan or a Roth employer plan. You can have a Traditional IRA or a Roth IRA. You can mix them too! For 2024, SIMPLE IRAs have a contribution limit of $16,000. IRAs have a contribution limit of $7,000. You can max out both for a total of $23,000. Now getting back to the flow chart… you said none of the retirement options applied to you, so you were given the response to then move to the next stage of the flow chart, if in fact none of it applied to you. Sounds like you got hung up on that part and didn’t express that you don’t understand and need information to progress. So next steps are to max an IRA (should have been happening before maxing the SIMPLE IRA per the flow chart), and then move on to the next item in the flow chart. If that doesn’t apply to you, go to the next item, and so forth until you get to the end. I haven’t seen you mention a taxable brokerage account so you haven’t hit the end yet. And just to reiterate and try to make clear, a SIMPLE IRA is an employee sponsored retirement account. An IRA, is not the same thing and is an individual retirement account. You can and should contribute to both. You can open an IRA on your own through places like Vanguard and Fidelity. I see in the past you had a lot of trouble getting the SIMPLE IRA set up. I can tell you that setting up an IRA is a million times simpler. Like 5 minutes to create without any other entities involvement. Loan Dusty Road fucked around with this message at 09:05 on Feb 2, 2024 |
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Feb 2, 2024 08:45
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