(Thread IKs:
dead gay comedy forums)
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It's a rehash of what dead gay posted. I tried to allude to this with my "capitalism must end in communism" statement. If capital must be an output of capitalism, not just an incentive, this all tracks. I don't think capital must be an output. This to me is a fundamental difference in how I'm and others here are viewing things, and can't be reconciled. That's OK, it's still been a great discussion imo.
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Feb 15, 2024 04:51
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| # ? May 24, 2024 16:03 |
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BillsPhoenix posted:It's a rehash of what dead gay posted. I tried to allude to this with my "capitalism must end in communism" statement. again what is “capital” ?
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Feb 15, 2024 04:55
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[sliders portal opens up and billphoenix returns to the perfectly frictionless market dimension, armed with new information]
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Feb 15, 2024 04:55
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having observed that hippie girls always get free weed I can only conclude that the source of surplus value is neither selling more dearly than you have purchased nor underpaying workers for the value their labor adds to your product but is, in fact, hippie girls
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Feb 15, 2024 04:57
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Al! posted:the word my buddy uses for this type of mentality is "perfectly spherical" I really like this.
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Feb 15, 2024 04:58
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Flournival Dixon posted:if you take adhd meds you can read 50 pages a day pretty easy, or you can take ephedrine+caffiene if you cant afford to go to the doctor and get a prescription Also a great way to get shredded. ECA stack + Capital + Hobsbawm + Boff and you’re all set.
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Feb 15, 2024 05:04
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Flournival Dixon posted:did you know that you could read 50 pages a day of capital vol 1 and imperialism the highest stage of capitalism and be done in less than a month, and end up with a better understand of the world around you and the workings of capitalism than 99% of english speaking people on the planet Read the Constitution so you can understand what each branch of the government does and can/cannot do. A better thing to do would be to read a basic economics textbook, because that's what most people are actually ignorant about. Any of Greg Mankiw's introductory books are good. Even just learning how and why popular policies like high minimum wages, high corporate taxes, price controls, rent controls, fixed exchange rates, and protectionism are incorrect will make you more informed than the average person.
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Feb 15, 2024 05:08
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Mankiw smashes heaven
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Feb 15, 2024 05:09
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BillsPhoenix posted:The root of our disagreements? BillsPhoenix posted:Also when looking for a super generic "that's why capitalism is efficent" the IMF came up. They claim profit (as an output for capitalists to earn) is a requirement of capitalism so... yeah. nuh-uh, we are doing something different this time BillsPhoenix, you do write structured sentences in proper syntactical formatting, which means you can also read them. Unless you have an extraordinarily rare psycho-linguistic dysfunction that causes you to shuffle ideas at random and thus be incapable of understanding ideas from other people, I am now assuming that you are doing a bit. Nothing wrong with that. The problem is: your bit is not entertaining enough. The whole "hey I am just looking to learn" can provide the setup for useful, engaging and rewarding discussion and/or comedy gold. A reason why I am deciding you are doing a bit is that, see, I volunteer to help people learn about this stuff, while also sitting to study with some extraordinary teachers. Besides that, I also went to the university as a student of economics for five years, sitting through both political economy and mainstream stuff. You see, one of the reasons why the first works incredibly well because it has a rule of no loving around: nobody is getting paid there, it's all sincere effort. In econ courses, there's always a student who thinks they know best, might fancy themselves a brilliant mind by parsing google results for a bit and likes to troll the class coming up with these gotchas and whatnot, but actually is a dumbass. The worst part about this dumbass is that they don't even read the literature of their own perspective, so they think that they are original thinkers in all these apparently great rhetorical points (for them). Besides that, someone who's sincerely trying to engage in order to learn doesn't try to be a smartass that goes for deflection the moment they get explained why they are wrong. You did this a few times already. But now, turns out that I am this thread's idiot king and I am an idiot full of vanity and caprice who's doing this theatre bit through this loving huge-rear end post to entertain myself. So, let's improve the situation and try again: dead gay comedy forums posted:now put that post + what I wrote above and guess what happens? If you post anything that is not a reply to what we presented you there, I am probating you. You can definitely disagree. If that is the case, you have to put out an original, comprehensive argument that goons here can following your reasoning. I sat through three years of loving microeconomic classes and if I read some textbook/GPT bullshit I am going to six your rear end for every post of yours in this thread. If your argument doesn't pass muster by the thread's regulars, it's a sixer for every post of yours here like this one BillsPhoenix posted:I now get why this space and debate are quite literally unable to interact because I don't mind replying to bait, but other posters put effort into engaging with you instead of an uncountable number things more rewarding than dealing with an obnoxious rear end.
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Feb 15, 2024 05:26
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Frosted Flake posted:Also a great way to get shredded. ECA stack + Capital + Hobsbawm + Boff and you’re all set. you can listen to socialist theory at the gym too, most of it works just fine on audiobook except for kapital vol 1 because of all the math equations
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Feb 15, 2024 05:58
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Flournival Dixon posted:you can listen to socialist theory at the gym too, most of it works just fine on audiobook except for kapital vol 1 because of all the math equations I find that anything more intense than a regular walk just gets my body to focus on the exercise itself, so I hear but don't listen and end up just having to rewind often.
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Feb 15, 2024 06:00
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if i was the kind of person whos brain was attached to his body and not floating around between lagrange points 1 and 4 at any given time i wouldnt need ephedrine to pay attention to things in the first place
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Feb 15, 2024 06:16
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BillsPhoenix posted:They continue to exist? They just stop drawing new influxes of capital. There are businesses which are sustainably profitable, but their rate of profit is lower than capitalists desire, so they either dismantle them (strip the copper out of the walls and pawn everything) or start taking huge risks to try to get a higher rate of profit, even if just in the short term, and if the gamble fails whelp just bankrupt the whole thing and move on. MANY such cases. Making profit is absolutely no guarantee that a company will continue to exist. The market demands ever *increasing* profit.
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Feb 15, 2024 11:11
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dead gay comedy forums posted:nuh-uh, we are doing something different this time looks like BillsPhoenix was right: all communists ultimately just want to build
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Feb 15, 2024 13:46
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Orange Devil posted:There are businesses which are sustainably profitable, but their rate of profit is lower than capitalists desire, so they either dismantle them (strip the copper out of the walls and pawn everything) or start taking huge risks to try to get a higher rate of profit, even if just in the short term, and if the gamble fails whelp just bankrupt the whole thing and move on. See: Instant Pot
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Feb 15, 2024 14:19
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Frosted Flake posted:See: Instant Pot Been thinking about this throughout the last few pages. Everyone i complain about it to seem to think they had it coming for making a durable product
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Feb 15, 2024 16:23
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Or the one time I tried pitching a business idea and the investors laughed me out of the room because "at most I'd end up with a stable profit" and "they only invest in things that will make lots and lots of money"
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Feb 15, 2024 16:25
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"at most you'll be successful"
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Feb 15, 2024 19:22
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very normal sentiments from a healthy and self-aware ruling class
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Feb 15, 2024 19:23
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no time for "stable profit" when we may wake up tomorrow with the news that the entire economy collapsed overnight
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Feb 15, 2024 19:25
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Rodney The Yam II posted:Been thinking about this throughout the last few pages. Everyone i complain about it to seem to think they had it coming for making a durable product Maybe they don't know that the Instant Pot creator sold the company to a VC firm (that had also bought up other kitchenware companies like Corel, Pyrex) and then just ran it into the ground by other Instant-brand kitchen appliances. I'm still getting a grasp on the language of Marxism so this is going to be clumsy but it seems a defining feature of neoliberal capitalism especially where the search for profit drives capital through things like private equity to find something that is profitable and extract as much profit as possible before it collapses, in part because of the tendency of the rate of profit to fall. Ultimately it seems like all "sustainably profitable" companies aren't really sustainable, because either economic collapse destroys the fundamental profitability of the company or capitalists eventually seek out and extract as much short-term profit out of any corporation leading to its long-term unprofitability. The current investment impulse in tech to not just invest in something profitable but something that promises constant, endless growth over demonstrating immediate profitability, while company founders hope to be bought out by a bigger company makes it seem like this is an overly complicated shell game. Dreylad has issued a correction as of 19:33 on Feb 15, 2024 |
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Feb 15, 2024 19:30
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mila kunis posted:Mankiw smashes heaven
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Feb 15, 2024 19:42
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I disagree therefore I don't exist. Make it a perma, who carez. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 15, 2024 20:46
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BillsPhoenix posted:I disagree therefore I don't exist. Make it a perma, who carez. You're not as smart as you think, and would benefit from engaging others honestly. But it's your account and your choice!
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Feb 15, 2024 20:51
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Presumably some companies are stable if they have monopoly like positions? Like say Coca-Cola?
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Feb 15, 2024 20:53
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I was engaging, I thought it was good. This thread doesn't have much movement recently outside my posts but... I'm not gonna follow arbitrary mod rules or whatever. Shits terrible on reddit, not gonna do it here either. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 15, 2024 20:56
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Marx was wrong. Capitalism defeated communism. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 15, 2024 20:58
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BillsPhoenix posted:This thread doesn't have much movement recently outside my posts but... "The ten most recent pages are just people pointing out the holes in your logic and asking you simple questions you're dodging" "ah, so you admit they're the ten most recent pages"
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Feb 15, 2024 21:03
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the funny thing is people who support capitalism don't have any understanding of communism, but every communist understands capitalism better than capitalist supporters. in fact, most of the political things that happen are in reaction to communist ideas and marxism. we're trying to patient with you and educate you because it's a liberating ideology, but if you'd rather stay ignorant you're welcome to. just don't treat us as morons when any objective person would see that you're the idiot in this conversation.
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Feb 15, 2024 21:03
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BillsPhoenix posted:Marx was wrong. Capitalism defeated communism. And there we have the apparent core of your thesis
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Feb 15, 2024 21:04
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the most annoying thing* about us losing the cold war is that the stupidest morons can say 'Scoreboard!'. unfortunately we do have to kiss the rings, thats how it works *other than the millions of dead
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Feb 15, 2024 21:07
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BillsPhoenix posted:Marx was wrong. Capitalism defeated communism. alright president xi, do your thing
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Feb 15, 2024 21:07
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BillsPhoenix posted:Marx was wrong. Capitalism defeated communism. Somehow, Communism returned
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Feb 15, 2024 21:14
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capitalism where no one makes a profit but just generates exactly the replacement for their capital investment and no more is like pro starcraft but everyone abides by 15min no rush rules
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Feb 15, 2024 21:14
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dodge rolling into the capitalism room so I can recover all my legitimacy before it defeats me again
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Feb 15, 2024 21:15
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Just read some drat Marx and tell us specifically why it's wrong. Spend 1 hour reading Wage Labour and Capital with a highlighter and come at us swinging, nobody loves a good rhetorical brawl more than Marxists, but part of that is that any vibes-based belief will be tidily wrapped up and thrown in the garbage where it belongs. You're trying to build a castle on quicksand, you believe you are at least left-sympathetic I would guess, but left of what? Can you answer that? If you're victorious already, why aren't you happy about it? Why does your mind not find solace with the argument that truly history has ended and the best possible world is upon us now that the USSR (not communism) is defeated? Are you trying to square a circle or hammer a square block into a circular hole?
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Feb 15, 2024 21:20
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Dreylad posted:Maybe they don't know that the Instant Pot creator sold the company to a VC firm (that had also bought up other kitchenware companies like Corel, Pyrex) and then just ran it into the ground by other Instant-brand kitchen appliances. turns out that when a state can't actually allocate funds strategically and instead just hope for the market to sort things out, the market just continuously generates bubbles. No new foreign markets to exploit, less and less national industries to cannibalize, all that's left is to go all in on whatever new fad appears in the market while hoping you're not left holding the bag.
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Feb 15, 2024 21:26
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In a settler colonial state such as Australia, is the primary contradiction Capitalism or the Colony?
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Feb 15, 2024 21:27
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Halser posted:Somehow, Communism returned
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Feb 15, 2024 21:31
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Bald Stalin posted:In a settler colonial state such as Australia, is the primary contradiction Capitalism or the Colony? if historical example is anything to go by, the colony
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Feb 15, 2024 21:58
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