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(Thread IKs: weg, Toxic Mental)
 
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John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

A real hellraiser


Synesthesian Fetish posted:

If he loses his NJ properties what happens to Ivana's remains? I'm assuming they come with the property.

It'd be funny if registering a property as a cemetery offers it some protections against seizure.

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Zulily Zoetrope
Jun 1, 2011

Muldoon

BrigadierSensible posted:

An actual lol is that Trump is yet to throw his lawyers under the bus yet,

as in "This is all because my lawyers are bad at their jobs and terrible people" kind of poo poo.

Because we know he likes to blame all the bad stuff that happens to him on other people.

And his lawyers are easy targets, and one would think he at least knows one of their names.

The big thing I've come to believe about Trump is that he grew up in a white collar mob boss household, and has no idea what laws and crime actually are. Fred taught him to do as the lawyer says, which mostly means shutting up when told to shut up, and occasionally paying an insultingly small settlement while admitting no guilt if you've done something egregious enough that they can't magic it away entirely.

He does not understand that this isn't actually how the law works, that he inherited an entire infrastructure designed to shield him from the consequences of his own actions, and he thought he had found a big brain genius loophole when he stopped paying the expensive lawyers who told him not to do the things he wanted to do, and replaced them with idiot sycophants.

He still follows the advice of his lawyers, who, as he understands it, are the actual arbiters of law. That's why he keeps making constant affirmations of "presidential records act," "ironclad disclaimer clause," "perfect phone call," et cetera et cetera, because those are things lawyers told him. Anyone who accuses him of wrongdoing must be either unaware or maliciously disregarding the law in service of an ulterior motive.

The thought that his lawyers could be fallible or incompetent would upend his entire worldview. If he ever turns on them, it will be because he thinks they're deliberaly sabotaging him, not because he's burned all his competent mob lawyers and can only afford the clown car selection.

Pookah
Aug 21, 2008

🪶Caw🪶





BrigadierSensible posted:

We all laugh at Tiffany for being the forgotten child of his least favorite wife.

But she managed to keep herself out of all of this. She also avoided the live of a model turned handbag designer turned failed socialite constantly fighting off the advances of her increasingly senile father and evil husband that Ivanka got dealt.

Lol, she married an actual billionaire-in-waiting, she's parachuted herself far far away from all the Trump dirt

Karma Comedian
Feb 2, 2012

PC LOAD LETTER posted:

Just tamping down on expectations on how hosed Trump is here or what this would mean for the RNC.

well stop it

nawilo_420
Nov 24, 2021
Probation
Can't post for 14 days!

dr_rat posted:

Nope, this is all state stuff. Presidents can only pardon Federal crimes.

ok cool :thanks:

Mistle
Oct 11, 2005

Eckot's comic relief cousin from out of town
Grimey Drawer

PC LOAD LETTER posted:

Just tamping down on expectations on how hosed Trump is here or what this would mean for the RNC.

Cheesus
Oct 17, 2002

Let us retract the foreskin of ignorance and apply the wirebrush of enlightenment.
Yam Slacker

dr_rat posted:

Nope, this is all state stuff. Presidents can only pardon Federal crimes.
But I believe he believes that he can kick New York out of the union until they comply.

notwithoutmyanus
Mar 17, 2009
https://www.gofundme.com/f/stand-with-trump-raise-the-settlement comments continue to entertain.


$333 donor posted:

Donald Trump is the only hope for the human race. Say no to the reptilians! Vote human, vote Trump!

and one person used $5 to say gently caress trump, which is entertaining but obviously the wrong place to put money


5$ donor (Ivan Moore) posted:

I paid $5 for the privilege of saying that Donald Trump is a conman, a serial sexual abuser and an insurrectionist scumbag. All of you who seriously contribute money to this man are brainwashed cult members. Trump is a danger to democracy and this country.

which incited (lol)

other 5$ donor posted:

Ivan Moore is the perfect example of how brainwashed people really are in this country. Donald Trump is the greatest President ever, period. His accomplishments while being harassed at every turn speak volumes for his character and commitment to the American people. Thank you. Proud to say I support Donald Trump!

notwithoutmyanus fucked around with this message at 13:24 on Feb 17, 2024

Raged
Jul 21, 2003

A revolution of beats

Fabulousity posted:

If she divorces does she get to keep the Secret Service detail tail?

Also is there a defined increment of time small enough to measure how quickly the MAGAverse will turn on her in whole numbers?

If she divorces him she will move to the UK or EU. I am pretty sure she is sick of this country.

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

Raged posted:

If she divorces him she will move to the UK or EU. I am pretty sure she is sick of this country.

Pretty sure no one will care, other than hoping that if that happens she takes donald for everything he has left before she goes.

digital penitence
Jan 3, 2008

https://www.newsweek.com/jared-kushner-addresses-2-billion-given-saudis-1869757

"Are we really still doing this?" Kushner said during a live interview at the Axios BFD summit in Miami when he was asked if he believed that the Saudi crown prince was responsible for the killing. "I know the person who I dealt with. I think he's a visionary leader. I think what he's done in that region is transformational," he said.


What a piece of human garbage. Imagine responding in exasperation to a request to justify doing business with someone who had a journalist murdered, while in the same breath praising the individual that orchestrated the murder.

withoutclass
Nov 6, 2007

Resist the siren call of rhinocerosness

College Slice
What's half of nothing?

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

withoutclass posted:

What's half of nothing?

He can still be stuck with child support for the rest of his life.

Alan Smithee
Jan 4, 2005


A man becomes preeminent, he's expected to have enthusiasms.

Enthusiasms, enthusiasms...

notwithoutmyanus posted:

https://www.gofundme.com/f/stand-with-trump-raise-the-settlement comments continue to entertain.

and one person used $5 to say gently caress trump, which is entertaining but obviously the wrong place to put money

which incited (lol)

you have to be a special kind of stupid to give money to "elena cardone" because trust her she will give it to trump

but im here for it because they are gonna take the money away from don don

greazeball
Feb 4, 2003



he's on the hook for half a billion dollars and we haven't even really started his four criminal trials yet

Sweaty IT Nerd
Jul 13, 2007

greazeball posted:

he's on the hook for half a billion dollars and we haven't even really started his four criminal trials yet

Do you mean his indictments on 91 charges?

Beefed Owl
Sep 13, 2007

Come at me scrub-lord I'm ripped!

greazeball posted:

he's on the hook for half a billion dollars and we haven't even really started his four criminal trials yet

It really is incredible what we are in for in the LOL department this year

Mr Ice Cream Glove
Apr 22, 2007

JeffLeonard
Apr 18, 2003

TV Violence

Cat Hassler posted:

Pay to the order of…Iron Balls McGinty…one dollar and NINE CENTS!

Thank you for this :lol:

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat
If you don't bankrupt yourself for Trump, Jesus will teabag you in heaven

kw0134
Apr 19, 2003

I buy feet pics🍆

crusty posted:

Useful info from a NY lawyer with expertise in this realm:
https://bsky.app/profile/mitchellepner.bsky.social/post/3kllfqfzloc2x

This is technically correct (the best kind of correct) with SCOTUS but so laughably unlikely that to say it's a Hail Mary vastly overstates it, because Hail Mary passes work often enough to be worth trying. Everything can be phased to give it a federal question gloss, but it's still a state question turd under it all and SCOTUS wouldn't want to touch it.

Sydney Bottocks
Oct 15, 2004

PC LOAD LETTER posted:

He raised more than $700 million in 2020.

You keep saying this, but given how widely the political landscape in the US has changed in the last four years or so, you might as well be saying "He raised more than $700 million in 1920". Four years is several lifetimes ago in politics, and I don't think anyone who's been paying attention would disagree that the US political landscape has had some colossal sea changes during that time. Raising that kind of scratch isn't necessarily a given for him anymore.

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

kw0134 posted:

Everything can be phased to give it a federal question gloss, but it's still a state question turd under it all and SCOTUS wouldn't want to touch it.

This is clearly a Third amendment issue. If trump is forced to sell apartments it possible a solider could end up staying in it, thus being quartered in it without consent of the current owner, Mr Trump. The only way to avoid this possibility is completely nullifying the judgment your honors!!!

crusty
Apr 16, 2015

Crustacean

kw0134 posted:

This is technically correct (the best kind of correct) with SCOTUS but so laughably unlikely that to say it's a Hail Mary vastly overstates it, because Hail Mary passes work often enough to be worth trying.

You're right, but you know he's gonna try it...

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

crusty posted:

You're right, but you know he's gonna try it...

Well he doesn't have much to lose, and I assume the lawyers will be up for trying any long shot as long as they're paid in advance.

Chief McHeath
Apr 23, 2002
Probation
Can't post for 3 days!
Can’t TRUMP just write a check to himself for $450 million dollars? Then the money is in the check and not in the bank anymore, so the court and creditors don’t get it for judgment and he (TRUMP) gets to keep his money?

:chaostrump:

Sombrerotron
Aug 1, 2004

Release my children! My hat is truly great and mighty.

Sydney Bottocks posted:

You keep saying this, but given how widely the political landscape in the US has changed in the last four years or so, you might as well be saying "He raised more than $700 million in 1920". Four years is several lifetimes ago in politics, and I don't think anyone who's been paying attention would disagree that the US political landscape has had some colossal sea changes during that time. Raising that kind of scratch isn't necessarily a given for him anymore.
I would also guess that the bulk of that sum came from really wealthy donors, who at this point may not be too inclined anymore to invest heavily in Trump (especially if it's just to directly pay off his debts, rather than fund his campaign).

EDIT:

Chief McHeath posted:

Can’t TRUMP just write a check to himself for $450 million dollars? Then the money is in the check and not in the bank anymore, so the court and creditors don’t get it for judgment and he (TRUMP) gets to keep his money?

:chaostrump:
I'm not sure if this is an honest question, but 1) I'm pretty sure (not entirely because checks have been obsolete in this part of the world for decades) the check wouldn't really mean anything until it's actually cashed, 2) even if that weren't the case, it would still be money he has himself and he's personally on the hook for those $450 million, and 3) trying to move money away for the express purpose of preventing your creditors from collecting is a very very bad idea.

Sombrerotron fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Feb 17, 2024

Mr Ice Cream Glove
Apr 22, 2007

Huff po released a fantastic article answering the questions most people have about Trump

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-debt-legal-losses_n_65d03728e4b0f7fbe7b2c04e


Some highlights

How much does Trump owe:

quote:

Between Friday’s ruling and the two judgments in Carroll’s case, Trump would be on the hook for about $542 million in legal judgments.
Trump owes another $110,000 for refusing to comply with a subpoena in the civil fraud case and $15,000 for repeatedly disparaging the judge’s law clerk in violation of a gag order. As part of Friday’s ruling, the judge also ordered both of Trump’s sons to pay $4 million apiece.

Trump’s court-ordered debts don’t end there. Last month, he was ordered to pay nearly $400,000 in legal fees to The New York Times after suing the newspaper unsuccessfully. He is currently appealing a judgment of $938,000 against him and his attorney for filing what a judge described as a “frivolous” lawsuit against Hillary Clinton.

How quickly does Trump have to pay?

quote:

Trump has already deposited $5 million owed to Carroll for the first defamation case into a court-controlled account, along with an additional $500,000 in interest required by New York law. Carroll will not have access to the funds until the appeals process plays out.

He may soon be forced to do the same for the $83.3 million judgment in the second Carroll verdict. Alternatively, he could secure a bond and pay only a portion up front — though that option would come with interest and fees and likely require some form of collateral. Trump would have to find a financial institution willing to front him the money.

In the civil fraud case, it will be up to the courts to decide how much Trump must put up as he mounts his appeal. And he may be required to pay the full sum immediately after the appellate court rules, which could come as soon as this summer, according to University of Michigan law professor Will Thomas.

“New York’s judicial system has shown a willingness to move quickly on some of these Trump issues,” Thomas said. “When we hear from the first appellate court, that’s a point where money is almost certainly going to change hands.”

Can he or his businesses declare bankruptcy?

quote:

Under the judge’s ruling Friday, Trump would still be liable to pay even if the Trump Organization declares bankruptcy. If Trump personally declared bankruptcy, the enforcement of the judgment against him would be paused. But political commenters say such a drastic step is unlikely.
Despite the fact that several of his previous companies have gone bankrupt, Trump has repeatedly bragged about the fact that he has never, personally, declared bankruptcy.

What if Trump simply refuses to pay the money?

quote:

Legally, Trump would face the same consequences as any American refusing to pay a legal judgment, including the possibility of having his assets seized and his wages garnished.
“The president is not a king and the president’s assets are not sacrosanct just because he happened to be the president,” Weiner said.

On Friday, the judge overseeing Trump’s civil fraud case appointed an additional monitor to oversee the Trump Organization’s finances, finding they could not be trusted to follow the law. In the event that Trump refused to hand over payments, the courts would have additional discretion to go after Trump and his businesses.

“They have a huge amount of power particularly for someone like Trump who has physical assets inside the state,” Thomas, the law professor, said. “The court might say we’re going to freeze your bank account. Or even worse, they could say, ’We’re seizing Trump Tower and we’re putting it up for sale.’”

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Sombrerotron posted:

I would also guess that the bulk of that sum came from really wealthy donors, who at this point may not be too inclined anymore to invest heavily in Trump (especially if it's just to directly pay off his debts, rather than fund his campaign).

He’s going to be the republican nominee, he’s going to get that money. There isn’t another choice for them to move to

Pot Smoke Phoenix
Aug 15, 2007



Smoke 'em if you gottem!
Dinosaur Gum
I made a handy graphic to help explain what's going on right now

wheatpuppy
Apr 25, 2008

YOU HAVE MY POST!

Wow, an actual "Sir!" - I didn't know those actually existed in the wild.

dr_rat
Jun 4, 2001

Chief McHeath posted:

Can’t TRUMP just write a check to himself for $450 million dollars? Then the money is in the check and not in the bank anymore, so the court and creditors don’t get it for judgment and he (TRUMP) gets to keep his money?
If only trump kept all his money in TrumpCoins none of this would be happening!

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

Derpmph trial star reporter!

has anyone said "lol" yet?

kw0134
Apr 19, 2003

I buy feet pics🍆

crusty posted:

You're right, but you know he's gonna try it...
I mean that assumes he even gets to the first step at the appellate division and likely requires the $355 mill now, no credit cards please. (Engoron can be petitioned to stay the judgment but I don't see that happening.) And I really want to see him try if he does because the petition for cert should be laughably stupid.

digital penitence
Jan 3, 2008

LOL

https://x.com/LauraLoomer/status/1758664719559430333?s=20

Frank Frank
Jun 13, 2001

Mirrored

Three Olives posted:

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1758676216490381375

More solid law stuff and things to come from the esteemed Habba.

Didn’t Trump already call her a loser and tell her law firm they’re done? I could have sworn he already kicked her to the curb

Guy Axlerod
Dec 29, 2008
Trump could make history by having his presidential salary garnished.

Sydney Bottocks
Oct 15, 2004

Also, regarding a Trump personal bankruptcy: I mentioned it before but even if he files, that's not a guarantee that the judgements from either the fraud or defamation cases can be discharged through a personal bankruptcy. Bankruptcy courts generally do not like it when people file with an obvious intent to avoid paying creditors; the idea is that if you file, you do so because you literally have no money to pay them, not because you want to use the bankruptcy court to avoid paying them. Trump would literally set his dumb adult sons on fire before ever admitting that he doesn't have the money to pay those debts, which he would have to do as part of a bankruptcy filing (and which would also be a matter of public record, to boot).

Also, there are exceptions to what debts can be considered eligible for discharge in a personal bankruptcy. This includes things like student loans, money owed to the IRS, and (relevant to Trump's situation here) court-ordered judgements where damages were awarded because either a crime was committed, or there was an obvious and deliberate attempt to cause some form of harm to the other party (whether to their person, or to their reputation and public image). That would pretty much cover both the judgements from the fraud case and the defamation case.

tl;dr: filing for personal bankruptcy isn't necessarily a "Get Out of Jail Free Paying Your Debts" card for TRUMP!

Pot Smoke Phoenix
Aug 15, 2007



Smoke 'em if you gottem!
Dinosaur Gum
GoFundMe has an interesting rule about what you cannot use it for

https://www.gofundme.com/c/terms

9. the legal defense of alleged financial and violent crimes;

This should be fun!

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crusty
Apr 16, 2015

Crustacean

Frank Frank posted:

Didn’t Trump already call her a loser and tell her law firm they’re done? I could have sworn he already kicked her to the curb

I think there was a faked Truth Social post to that effect.

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