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The funniest moment in FFTA for me was when the main girl (I forgot her name) is talking about how she doesn't want to go back to the real because she has white hair. She says this to someone with white hair and they're like ???
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Feb 16, 2024 07:35
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GilliamYaeger posted:Now, this is understandably because none of the protagonists actually know that the summoning of Ivalice resulted in the populace of their town being turned into the NPCs of the world - including the monsters, there's literally a scene at the very start where you see the three bullies from their school being turned into mindless zombie monsters - but good god.   But it is not relevant to the LP, beyond being Ivalice adjacent.
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Feb 16, 2024 07:36
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Hogama posted:I've felt the opposite since Heavensward, that the Shadows of Mhach series feels oddly incongruous with the world despite dealing mostly with existing XIV concepts. quote:It's not helped by the Redbills and Talons feeling like they exist in a completely separate setting Skies of Arcadia, perhaps?
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Feb 16, 2024 08:27
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I find this tangent extremely funny because, as you all know, Tactics Advance is the ONLY FF I've ever owned myself and played to completion, and I love it dearly. There's a very small line in the Fictional Interlude before Rabanastre where Sunako gives Kheris a copy of the Legends of Ivalice concerning King Delita and mentions that the version of the Ivalician Mythos Kheris knows is wrong. That's because I decided that when her dad was telling her stories growing up and got to Ivalice he related a version of FFTA (which he made up out of whole cloth) instead of the traditional FFT-inspired narrative Because Reasons.  I actually have an idea for a future fiction piece that will leverage that, though it'll depend if I find a good moment in the plot to throw it in.
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Feb 16, 2024 08:33
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lmao nice
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Feb 16, 2024 08:47
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That just makes me imagine Kheris' parents having The Marche Discourse.
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Feb 16, 2024 09:14
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Sanguinia posted:I find this tangent extremely funny because, as you all know, Tactics Advance is the ONLY FF I've ever owned myself and played to completion, and I love it dearly. There's a very small line in the Fictional Interlude before Rabanastre where Sunako gives Kheris a copy of the Legends of Ivalice concerning King Delita and mentions that the version of the Ivalician Mythos Kheris knows is wrong. That's because I decided that when her dad was telling her stories growing up and got to Ivalice he related a version of FFTA (which he made up out of whole cloth) instead of the traditional FFT-inspired narrative Because Reasons. It's a great game and does a pretty good job of transposing the console conplexity of FFT gameplay onto handheld (as was the style at the time, Golden Sun) and is really only hobbled by the Judge System which is a massive pain in the arse.
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Feb 16, 2024 10:11
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The best part of the judge system was baiting the AI into violating the rules and watching them get carded.
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Feb 16, 2024 15:29
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I actually prefer the A1 law system to A2’s, because the map designers had this tendency to use the law as the bad kind of added difficulty. Sure, let’s disable all your nu mou for this boss fight where you really benefit from good ranged actions! Sure, let’s forbid being stolen FROM (already ludicrous as a concept) on a map where all your enemies can steal! Not to mention occasionally forbidding things like knockback, which means that critical hits, a thing you have no control over besides not using Attack, break the law. And its start-from-0 MP system that demands either Ethers or Blood Price for mages to get anything really strong off at anything resembling speed. And there was that one pack of characters that get two turns each before you can move… Anyway, the storytelling in this section really does seem haphazard. I can understand rewarding the player for taking time to talk to people, but don’t go putting critical information like that in missable side paths!
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Feb 16, 2024 17:35
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I'm dying at the fact that the most recent update has lead to nearly three full pages of everyone being like "YO THIS QUEST SUCKS!" Has there ever been such unity of opinion in this LP?
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Feb 16, 2024 18:31
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Universal acclaim for Solus from him being in a single cutscene?
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Feb 16, 2024 18:52
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The funniest thing is that the intro to the Orbonne raid is so dense that it took an entire LP post all by itself.
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Feb 16, 2024 19:23
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Thundarr posted:The funniest thing is that the intro to the Orbonne raid is so dense that it took an entire LP post all by itself. It's a great raid, but I have to say, reading the post just made it obvious how incredibly over-convoluted and badly told the story is. Which is unfortunate, because the raid itself is a banger. And like others in this thread, I absolutely ended up skipping my way through it, because holy poo poo that is a lot of  and Sanguinia's done genuine work to make it as readable and coherent as it is presented to us.
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Feb 16, 2024 20:38
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I did these quests a while ago and largely memory-holed them, so until this update, I’d just figured that it was the fandom doing as fandom does and grossly overexaggerating the problem.
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Feb 16, 2024 21:12
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Sang’s post has definitely made me understand the criticisms of this raid storyline more; at the time I just didn’t pay that much attention to the plot one way or another, but when you step back it’s definitely several steps too complicated for its own good.
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Feb 16, 2024 21:15
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Yeah I quite liked this on first pass but I tend to skim read these things. On closer analysis it's crap.
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Feb 16, 2024 21:29
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I am a person that will read the most boring, annoying, piddly, pointless parts of FFXIV's story and generally enjoy myself, and even I was starting to get very, very tired by the end of all of this. I offer my theory on why Matsuno was allowed to just go so hard on all of his special detailed story: Yoshi-P is an enormous fan of his work and was happy to just let this guy that he thought was super cool go absolutely ham on the sheer volume of text here. Anyhow, looking forward to actually DOING Orbonne so I can squee about how much I love Orbonne! It's great! Super great!
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Feb 16, 2024 22:48
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Yoshi-P: And for the end of the expansion we have a raid written the same guy that made the Ivalice stuff fans love so much! Matsuno-san, how's that raid looking? Matsuno: It's called "A Tribute To Various Final Fantasies But Mostly Tactics". It will be a glorious 35 hour finale! Yoshi-P: You get ten quests! Matsuno: [gasps, slams office door shut]
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Feb 16, 2024 23:13
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FeatherFloat posted:I am a person that will read the most boring, annoying, piddly, pointless parts of FFXIV's story and generally enjoy myself, and even I was starting to get very, very tired by the end of all of this. I offer my theory on why Matsuno was allowed to just go so hard on all of his special detailed story: Yoshi-P is an enormous fan of his work and was happy to just let this guy that he thought was super cool go absolutely ham on the sheer volume of text here. Gotta agree with everything here. The team has said multiple times that they really like Matsuno’s work so that’s definitely a big reason he was allowed to go ham.
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Feb 16, 2024 23:33
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Am I right in saying he also wrote the future content which I'm not going to say the name of but for which this raid series is a prerequisite?
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Feb 17, 2024 01:57
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lines posted:Am I right in saying he also wrote the future content which I'm not going to say the name of but for which this raid series is a prerequisite? You are correct indeed.
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Feb 17, 2024 02:20
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While I agree that the Ivalice raid story is terrible, I think I'm in the minority in also hating it mechanically. It's my least favorite raid overall. There is in general way too much time wasting busy work that you can barely speed up with good execution and some mechanics I just personally hate. Mateus has way too many adds, and managing air stacks is pointless busy work that also puts more down time on melee if toads aren't killed close to her. Hashmal is good, imo probably my favorite boss of the entire series, yes it does a lot of damage and you have to dodge and kill things on time, but none of that is actually difficult or annoying to execute, he's very fair. Rofocale spends way too much time untargetable and has that stupid phase where you have to click on stuff while the arena is invisible. Argath Thadalfus has Gnawing Dread, which I absolutely loath as a mechanic, I have never executed it correctly. Famfrit has Tsunami, which is likely to just straight up kill someone if they get hit, very much unlike failing a typical ally raid mechanic which just gives you a vul stack, yes there are mechanics that also just kill people, but Tsunami is extra feelbad because it's technically survivable, just very likely to kill people for an attack that's appears throughout the fight. I don't really get hit by it, but it doesn't noticeably slow down the fight because some people just die like clockwork to it. What I really don't like is Dark Ewer, I guess melee can guarantee uptime if they perfectly shadow the tank and just completely give up on positionals? No way is the tank both going to dodge and bother to keep back/flank open. Belias is mostly inoffensive except it's sort of annoying if someone who doesn't know the mechanics get tethered or multiple people try to increment the clock to swing the aoes outside I guess. I've had horrible luck there with the tanks actually picking up their add during the obligatory "3 adds that tether to each other" phase though, not sure why but maybe all the dashes forcing people to dodge messes up the tanks' perception of where their party's corner is. Construct 7 also has way too much down time where it's outside the arena and dashes around. This is compounded by mechanics where various jobs can't do their proper rotation like Dispose (melees lose positionals, casters lose cast time). Or when math time happens and melees can't do anything at all while casters and ranged can just hit him normally, that's just straight up poor design. Yiazmat also has a very poorly executed 3 adds phase I think because there's a lot of forced movement beforehand so it's hard to keep track of absolute position on a circular arena, especially with Cyclone added in, I don't tank but that is another boss where this part very often has mistakes. Also phase 3 rake is terrible, love for all the melees to chase this rear end in a top hat around while it doesn't stop moving at above sprint speed.
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Feb 17, 2024 02:45
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I mean I do kind of appreciate this raid storyline’s existence for reasons that will come up down the line (including the other storyline Matsuno wrote where I agree it’s also scuffed but I don’t actually think it was his fault that time) so I can’t be a 100% hater but I do find it mystifying that this storyline was allotted so much text space and it’s still cramming way too much stuff in to do any of it justice. Like Sang mentioned I do like many of the individual moving parts in theory but it ends up being a shambling heap of underdeveloped or bafflingly placed concepts stapled onto having to fill people in on the entire plot of a different game.
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Feb 17, 2024 03:16
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Ran Rannerson posted:I mean I do kind of appreciate this raid storyline’s existence for reasons that will come up down the line (including the other storyline Matsuno wrote where I agree it’s also scuffed but I don’t actually think it was his fault that time) so I can’t be a 100% hater but I do find it mystifying that this storyline was allotted so much text space and it’s still cramming way too much stuff in to do any of it justice. Like Sang mentioned I do like many of the individual moving parts in theory but it ends up being a shambling heap of underdeveloped or bafflingly placed concepts stapled onto having to fill people in on the entire plot of a different game. Ironically I think part of the issue is that outside of the raids themselves nothing is voiced so actually implementing all this dialogue took comparatively little effort. Compared with the superstar status Matsuno has I suspect no one ever actually did a proper editing pass on the story.
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Feb 17, 2024 04:52
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I think a good way of putting it is that the story lives to be served by the world of XIV and not the other way around. It insists on the events of FFT and XII having happened in universe to An Extent. That has, by rule, not been the case for the other games in the series which have had Tezuka-like references sprinkled in largely for flavour.
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Feb 17, 2024 07:20
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I don't really think it's a problem that a version of Tactics and XII's story exists in XIV, per se. I'd even expect when they approached Matsuno, they either came to him of a mind of already adapting Tactics/XII (remembering once again that Dalmasca was known to be part of the world even before Doma was, though the English localization chose not to name it explicitly), or it came up in planning the expansion to begin with and was approved long before we actually reached this point of the story. I'm more of a mind that it needed a much greater editing pass - less of the history lessons stuck in the direct path of the plot would help, as would greater distribution of the story beats so the final leg isn't so full to bursting - but this is also likely where constraints of the format hit hardest, since episodic development doesn't leave room to go back and fix things and there's a need to finalize content even before the whole script is complete in the patch series.
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Feb 17, 2024 10:21
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Frankly, I think Ivalice just needed to be an expansion, and I keep expecting that, eventually, it will be. We will eventually go beyond Kugane's gates, we will go to Ivalice properly, I mean Ala Mhigo was a known quantity since 1.0 and we didn't go there till Stormblood.
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Feb 17, 2024 11:18
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I'm not expecting an Ivalice expansion. The playerbase isn't exactly crying out for it and it's got some baggage from this alliance raid.
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Feb 17, 2024 11:33
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I feel like we’d get less of a whole Ivalice Expansion and more that we might actually get to visit more bits of Dalmasca at some point during a larger theoretical Ilsabard expac.
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Feb 17, 2024 11:38
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Yeah. Let's leave the Ivalice Alliance in the past.
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Feb 17, 2024 11:45
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No, no, let them make the Ivalice MSQ. I hear there's really good money in sleep aids. 
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Feb 17, 2024 12:21
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Really? Cause I heard the market shrank and there was L i t t l e M o n e y in that right now.
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Feb 17, 2024 14:23
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ConanThe3rd posted:Really? Cause I heard the market shrank and there was L i t t l e M o n e y in that right now. 
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Feb 17, 2024 19:00
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I think we will not get an Ivalice expansion entirely because this raid exists. Even discounting the reception to this raid, it already used the Tactics story, and they'd have to lean more on XII/Tactics Advance/Tactics A2. I don't think anyone wants the FFXIV team to have to make a version of Luso; the modelling alone would take too much time.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:19
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How would a XIV version of Luso even work? Just some random kid that's like "Well, I guess I'll be a Scion." while trying to figure out how to get back to his own shard?
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Feb 17, 2024 19:36
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Also you know. There's nothing left of Ivalice to even have an expansion about. It's been dead for a long time, Dalmasca was built on its ruins and then THAT was burned to the ground.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:43
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PlasticAutomaton posted:Also you know. There's nothing left of Ivalice to even have an expansion about. It's been dead for a long time, Dalmasca was built on its ruins and then THAT was burned to the ground. I mean, I have no connection to Ivalice from previous titles ( I've played, FF 7, 8 and then 14 ), but I would absolutely be down for an expansion that was about Dalmasca's recovery and rebuilding, including digging up Ivalician stuff and/or ancient artifacts/threats from that civilization at some point. Yes, even with the raid in the game. There's stuff that I'd rather see first, mind ( like Meracydia ), but if they'd announced that Dawntrail was going to be about Dalmasca and Further Adventures in Ilsabard, I wouldn't have been unhappy.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:49
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vagrant story expansion
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Feb 17, 2024 19:51
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Valentin posted:vagrant story expansion Only if the WoL gets an "I am the reinforcements" dialogue option.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:55
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TLM3101 posted:I mean, I have no connection to Ivalice from previous titles ( I've played, FF 7, 8 and then 14 ), but I would absolutely be down for an expansion that was about Dalmasca's recovery and rebuilding, including digging up Ivalician stuff and/or ancient artifacts/threats from that civilization at some point. Yes, even with the raid in the game. There's stuff that I'd rather see first, mind ( like Meracydia ), but if they'd announced that Dawntrail was going to be about Dalmasca and Further Adventures in Ilsabard, I wouldn't have been unhappy. This seems extremely unlikely to happen though given that they canceled Matsuono's third planned venture in FFXIV. Maybe if they do an Auracite expansion or something.
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Feb 17, 2024 19:55
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