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DoesNotCompute posted:Oh 100% I agree with you, it is insane. We briefly looked at a Q7 and to get a spec with a 360 camera it was like $80k for an SUV that will depreciate by 50% in 18 months. The whole market is insane. What car depreciates by 50% in 18 months these days? My Golf R has only depreciated 20% in almost 5 years and that's if you are only looking at trade in value.
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Feb 21, 2024 20:12
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bull3964 posted:What car depreciates by 50% in 18 months these days? I hope all of them go back to depreciating a fuckton. But I think luxury sedans/SUVs (especially electrics) are back to depreciating as they should.
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Feb 21, 2024 20:26
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BuckyDoneGun posted:GOOD NEWS! It's the new Dacia Spring! Hmm as he mentioned the Spring has been available for a while now in other makets but it seems like it got a facelift at least? 16k is way cheaper than the next EV of course, but it's still kind of a lot of money for a very, very basic car with In terms of overall package (well other than safety) it'd be great for someone like my parents on limited income but also with limited travel needs. Buuut if you're on a budget... why not get a used Honda Fit for like $5k? (or my shitbox for $500) I guess it might make sense if you drive a lot within a small radius. e: Thomas has a video too, and he gets to play with the YouClip thing. The base trim also has manual rear windows! Also he barely fits into it lol. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fUCH8tRDvo mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Feb 21, 2024 |
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Feb 21, 2024 20:41
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imo the safety rating basically makes it a non starter. 16 grand buys you a lot of not-deathtrap
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Feb 21, 2024 20:44
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I turned my Expedition lease in at the end of December. It wasn't worth buying out really. I think buyout on it was 38,500. It's on a dealer lot in Oklahoma for 41,9 right now and hasn't sold. Certain segments of the car market may be going back to somewhat normal.
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Feb 21, 2024 20:53
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bull3964 posted:What car depreciates by 50% in 18 months these days? I knew I was being hyperbolic but I went out of curiosity to see a real world example, found a 2022 Q7 Progressiv in Montreal with 42k km for sale at a dealer for $61,990, exact same spec with the same package is $91,250 new. So 32%, not 50%, but that's retail, and certified pre-owned which costs the dealership around $1,800 if I recall correctly from my VW days. Trade value would be frightening. The Golf R is an outlier, they're the Toyota Tacoma of hot hatches (in Canada and the Northeast US anyway). When I was looking at them a year or two ago they were over msrp for 1 or 2 year old examples. Just nuts.
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Feb 21, 2024 20:56
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you gotta look up the 0-60 for the spring. its a thing of its own 19.1s
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Feb 21, 2024 20:56
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That seems undrivable on a highway
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Feb 21, 2024 20:57
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^^^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ExIDot-g_4&t=428s Aix posted:you gotta look up the 0-60 for the spring. its a thing of its own Well only if you cheap out and get the 45hp version! Otherwise it's like 13s which is about the same as my 1.2 Honda Fit, which is perfectly usable mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 21:03 on Feb 21, 2024 |
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Feb 21, 2024 21:00
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euphronius posted:So what are the kias and Mazdas of today ? Still kinda the same for people that have to have a new car with a warranty: Kia Rio/Hyundai Accent, Nissan Versa. All $17,000ish.
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Feb 21, 2024 22:39
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:imo the safety rating basically makes it a non starter. 16 grand buys you a lot of not-deathtrap If you scrap an euro 4 car or older, along with a family income under 30k€ in italy makes a spring a 3000€ car. It makes it more cheap than an Ami or whatever new motorbike you can buy. SlowBloke fucked around with this message at 07:05 on Feb 22, 2024 |
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Feb 21, 2024 22:47
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Hey, the Mitsubishi Mirage is out there for $16,695!
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Feb 21, 2024 22:54
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Thats going away after this model year though right?
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Feb 21, 2024 23:00
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bull3964 posted:Hey, the Mitsubishi Mirage is out there for $16,695! before delivery, destination, and dealer fees. It's $18,110 plus probably $600 dealer fees. Their website has even gone full scumbag dealer. You cannot deselect the $155 cargo cover and $165 "welcome package" which is floor mats and a paint pen. The Canadian site doesn't force you to pay $165 for floor mats but it does include a $599 "Dealer Admin Fee" bringing the pre-tax price to $19,475 CAD Even then it's the cheapest vehicle in Canada. 5 years ago you could get a Spark or Mirage for $10k + fees. The second cheapest vehicle in Canada is the Hyundai Venue at $23,574. The cost of driving a new car here you could reasonably say doubled in 5 years between the cost of the car + insurance, while wages were stagnant to declining.
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Feb 21, 2024 23:05
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Cadillac is going to have a new 3-row EV SUV? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Odb-Abp9qmQ SlowBloke posted:If you scrap an euro 4 car or older, along with a family income under 30k€ in italy makes a spring a 3000€ car in Italy. It makes it more cheap than an Ami or whatever new motorbike you can buy. 
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Feb 21, 2024 23:11
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Powershift posted:before delivery, destination, and dealer fees. It's $18,110 plus probably $600 dealer fees. They force maintenance "packages" worth thousands and simply won't sell you a car if you refuse to buy it. gently caress you with a dildo made out of a splintered piece of wood wrapped in barbed wire. That poo poo needs to be illegal.
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Feb 22, 2024 01:20
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Powershift posted:before delivery, destination, and dealer fees. It's $18,110 plus probably $600 dealer fees. The Big 3 just completely abandoning the entry level segment is still incredible to me. Sure, there's probably some forsaken "new" 2022 Escape/Equinox/Renegade on a lot that can be had cheaper but nothing with an MSRP under 30K* *The Ford Maverick doesn't exist at MSRP.
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Feb 22, 2024 01:25
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https://www.toyota.com/landcruiser/ Land Cruiser configurator is here!
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Feb 22, 2024 01:26
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My next car (once the rates die down a little) is gonna be a 75% depreciated luxury sedan from four to six years ago. The good news about everyone being stupid about their CUVs is that sedans depreciate even harder cause nobody wants em. I’ll probably never buy a new car in my life, unfortunately.
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Feb 22, 2024 01:31
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Dr. Lunchables posted:My next car (once the rates die down a little) is gonna be a 75% depreciated luxury sedan from four to six years ago. The good news about everyone being stupid about their CUVs is that sedans depreciate even harder cause nobody wants em. 2018 Audi A7 with the 3.0T from the S4 is my choice.
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Feb 22, 2024 01:40
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DoesNotCompute posted:The Golf R is an outlier, they're the Toyota Tacoma of hot hatches (in Canada and the Northeast US anyway). When I was looking at them a year or two ago they were over msrp for 1 or 2 year old examples. Just nuts. Ok but a year or two ago this was true of half the cars on sale.
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Feb 22, 2024 01:54
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Residency Evil posted:Automotive depression is a good way to put it. We currently have 3 cars: 2 daily drivers and an old fun car for me. I've thought about reshuffling things as our Macan is at 145k miles and likely due for replacement soon, but I'm not in a huge rush. I want something that's somewhat fun to drive, has 4 doors, decent build quality, no longer than 190 inches, and will make it to the mountains for skiing and back. I think the answer is to just buy another Macan but Sounds like some one needs an Alfa Romeo Stelvio!
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Feb 22, 2024 02:05
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DoesNotCompute posted:2018 Audi A7 with the 3.0T from the S4 is my choice. I don’t like the second gen A7 as much as the first, but yes yes yes
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Feb 22, 2024 02:13
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Failson posted:The Big 3 just completely abandoning the entry level segment is still incredible to me. Sure, there's probably some forsaken "new" 2022 Escape/Equinox/Renegade on a lot that can be had cheaper but nothing with an MSRP under 30K* The new Chevy Trax maxes out at $25K and doesn't seem entirely hateful, which is more than I can say about most subcompact CUVs
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Feb 22, 2024 02:20
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davecrazy posted:Sounds like some one needs an Alfa Romeo Stelvio! I wouldnt wish one of those on my worst enemy
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Feb 22, 2024 02:34
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davecrazy posted:Sounds like some one needs an Alfa Romeo Stelvio! Lmfao, i originally wrote "fun to drive, has 4 doors, no longer than 190 inches, and will make it to the mountains for skiing and back." I then thought "some rear end in a top hat is going to mention the Stelvio" so i added the build quality blurb.
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Feb 22, 2024 02:39
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Who needs build quality when you have soul Your kids will appreciate the character building experience of waiting for a flat bed on the side of the road
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Feb 22, 2024 02:50
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:imo the safety rating basically makes it a non starter. 16 grand buys you a lot of not-deathtrap Didn't they completely gently caress up the ANCAP safety rating by weighting a whole bunch of 'safety' features like lane guidance, automatic braking, driver attention monitoring etc? I think these days the best a completely mechanically safe car can get is like 3 stars without all of the additional electronic gizmos. I bet a 1 star car today is probably at least a 3 star rating 10 years ago, and I bet there are plenty of 10 year old 3 star cars still rolling around. Fake edit: Yep looked it up, a Kia Stonic gets 3 stars without the 'safety package' gizmos but 5 stars with them despite being mechanically the same car with the same actual crash performance.
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Feb 22, 2024 08:29
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:I wouldnt wish one of those on my worst enemy Why not? I've yet to hear anyone say a bad word about them where I live, not even the ones that have had the multiair unit poo poo itself to the tune of 3k€.
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Feb 22, 2024 10:10
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How about the Tonale instead
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Feb 22, 2024 11:03
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weirdly chilly pussy posted:Why not? It's the worst kind of grip pig. Anyone saying it handles well doesn't know what the gently caress they are talking about (grip != handing) it has utterly no throttle balance and huge terminal understeer. gently caress any "journalist" that insists it's some sort of magic handler because straight out bullshit. Let alone the godawful build quaility and the hugely inept suspension control on a less than perfect road, it's just pure dogshit and I have never hurled the fob back for any car as fast as I did for that one. If oyu want a SUV get anything else. If you want a SUV that may have some actual pretensions to sporty, an earlier Cayenne actually is startlingly good.
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Feb 22, 2024 11:48
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:It's the worst kind of grip pig. Anyone saying it handles well doesn't know what the gently caress they are talking about (grip != handing) it has utterly no throttle balance and huge terminal understeer. gently caress any "journalist" that insists it's some sort of magic handler because straight out bullshit. Let alone the godawful build quaility and the hugely inept suspension control on a less than perfect road, it's just pure dogshit and I have never hurled the fob back for any car as fast as I did for that one. A sportwagon is mainly what I'm after, but the Stelvio has been a candidate because the local Alfa nuts always rave about it and the Giorgio platform. Haven't driven one yet, but it's interesting to have differing opinions to compare to, when I eventually do. I almost never take a daily driver to it's limits, so for me it's more about the car being fun, special and not tiresome to drive rather than all-out performance and handling. (also needs a useful boot for work related stuff)
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Feb 22, 2024 12:05
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:It's the worst kind of grip pig. Anyone saying it handles well doesn't know what the gently caress they are talking about (grip != handing) it has utterly no throttle balance and huge terminal understeer. gently caress any "journalist" that insists it's some sort of magic handler because straight out bullshit. Let alone the godawful build quaility and the hugely inept suspension control on a less than perfect road, it's just pure dogshit and I have never hurled the fob back for any car as fast as I did for that one. Just to make sure I don’t have defend the honor of my people, the Guilia is however a good handling platform yes? And the QV owns bones correct?
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Feb 22, 2024 12:51
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Failson posted:The Big 3 just completely abandoning the entry level segment is still incredible to me. Sure, there's probably some forsaken "new" 2022 Escape/Equinox/Renegade on a lot that can be had cheaper but nothing with an MSRP under 30K* It doesn't exist at MSRP yet but I'd be willing to bet it will be under MSRP by this time next year. Car stocks are building up and prices are dropping. Some manufacturers (most notably Jeep) are lowering the MSRPs as well. I talked to someone who bought two Mavericks, one hybrid and one ecoboost that he ordered and paid MSRP for, he and his family drove them for a year and he sold them for more than he paid for them. He said they are good cars but are absolutely not worth more than MSRP. He also said the ecoboost is the better car and that the hybrid had too many issues altho I can't imagine the ecoboost not having any issues either. I thought I wanted a Maverick as my next car. I drove the hybrid and didn't like the drivetrain but liked the car, still want to drive the ecoboost, however the more problems I see with Ford motors, especially the ecoboost motors the less confidence I have in them. So if I did decide to say gently caress it and roll the dice I sure as hell am not paying over MSRP for one, so it's a waiting game and to see if I just get something else before they get back down to reasonable prices.
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Feb 22, 2024 14:31
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This is a throwaway comment, but there does seem to be a difference in reliability between the larger truck based EcoBoosts (>2.7 L) and the car based motors. I don’t have the numbers in front of me but I’d bet the 2.0 is one of the most produced engines globally by a wide margin; there should be less reliability issues with a global, cross platform engine of that scale.
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Feb 22, 2024 15:28
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The 2.0s actually had a kind of bad design until a few years ago where there were long coolant passage cuts between the cylinders that tended to promote the head gaskets failing. Now the weak spot (at least from what I've seen on the Mavs) seems to be more on the 8-speed trans which can suddenly poo poo itself.
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Feb 22, 2024 15:49
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Isn't the Maverick Hybrid a Prius transmission, which has proven itself to be the single most reliable transmission design in the last 30 years? What goes wrong with the hybrid?
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Feb 22, 2024 15:52
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Hybrid specifically has a few issues, most of them first year production. The big one that gets attention is the 2.5L engine plant was getting sloppy on machining/cleanup which caused an elevated (0.17/1000 units, so still pretty rare) chance of catastrophic lower engine failure. Initial recall was a bit of a bandaid removing some active grille shutters and cutting holes in the underbody shield to try and prevent the oil from throwing a rod catching on fire. They issued a second recall that they're finishing up development on that'll be a PCM watchdog to detect if it thinks the engine is about to grenade beforehand. First year also had some bad solder joins on the 12V battery cable end (there's a free replacement campaign for that). They use a heat exchanger on the exhaust like the newer Priuses that could leak or would have a valve fault and tended to be a lot of downtime since it initially required a catback job until they recently came out with a service kit to replace just the exchanger portion. Some are running into CV axle issues (EcoBoosts sometimes too) but don't know if that's as prevalent as some are trying to make it out to be. The 12V batteries still are generally pretty crap on the hybrid and pretty much need an aftermarket one if you don't want to deal with the crapshoot of if it or the replacement aren't going to dip low enough on voltage constantly that the vehicle goes into battery saver mode (I replaced mine after 18 months, but never had it actually fail to power up). A bunch of '22MY general computer calibration stuff that's been patched over time like the a/f mix on remote start causing overheating catalytic converters, erroneous EGR flow fault, some of the aforementioned heat exchanger faults being erroneous, and tuning some of the ICE/electric handover stuff like getting a transition shudder or the low-speed braking being very touchy or inconsistent.
darnon fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Feb 22, 2024 |
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Feb 22, 2024 16:18
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Blackhawk posted:Didn't they completely gently caress up the ANCAP safety rating by weighting a whole bunch of 'safety' features like lane guidance, automatic braking, driver attention monitoring etc? I think these days the best a completely mechanically safe car can get is like 3 stars without all of the additional electronic gizmos. I bet a 1 star car today is probably at least a 3 star rating 10 years ago, and I bet there are plenty of 10 year old 3 star cars still rolling around. the safety package stuff helps people not get in accidents though. the stonic with the gizmos is a safer car than the one without. i agree that you gotta separate fully passive safety performance but we now live in a world where that's not the only thing on the car keeping people safe so just looking at passive safety performance doesn't make sense when trying to figure out how safe a car is like i know all goons are Super Duper Top Tier Drivers that have their eyes on the road every second and can use the superior handling of their Miata to avoid an accident but the safety gizmos help most drivers not do stupid poo poo that causes accidents
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Feb 22, 2024 16:21
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darnon posted:The 2.0s actually had a kind of bad design until a few years ago where there were long coolant passage cuts between the cylinders that tended to promote the head gaskets failing. Now the weak spot (at least from what I've seen on the Mavs) seems to be more on the 8-speed trans which can suddenly poo poo itself. Yeah honestly I'd probably be more worried about the 8 speed trans than the motor, which doesn't bode well for me for the Maverick in general. Have just seen way too many people having issues with Ford products that makes me just want to wait for the Toyota stout and buy once, cry once.
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Feb 22, 2024 16:35
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