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Phobeste posted:this is only true if you assume that rockets continue to hold as much as they do today. i think this is unlikely because of the whole space platform thing. Rocket capacity is basically based on weight derived from input ingredients (1 ore = 2kg, 1000kg rocket capacity) plus some hand tweaking. See this image for a full rocket load. https://cdn.factorio.com/assets/blog-sync/fff-382-rocket-silo-gui.png For another example, a rocket can hold a single stack of modules, which is actually one of the denser things it can carry. The only thing you can fit a lot of is science, where one rocket can carry 1,000. Even with rockets costing 10% of what they do in vanilla today, rocket transport is meant to be fairly expensive though not quite prohibitive. K8.0 fucked around with this message at 02:02 on Feb 24, 2024 |
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Feb 24, 2024 01:59
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| # ? May 19, 2024 11:14 |
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The mental image of Factorio guy building multiple processing and orbital junk ejecting facilities for waste products across multiple planets is simply sublime. The "Factorio Guy is the villain" theory turned up to 11 as he exponentionally expands polluting for personal gain operations. Yes, space is impossibly big but I applaud the spirit of it. Just a half dozen steady streams of debris launched into space as mile high stripes in the sky...
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Feb 24, 2024 02:05
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Doomykins posted:The mental image of Factorio guy building multiple processing and orbital junk ejecting facilities for waste products across multiple planets is simply sublime. The "Factorio Guy is the villain" theory turned up to 11 as he exponentionally expands polluting for personal gain operations. Kessler Syndrome isn't a warning. It's a promise.
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Feb 24, 2024 02:19
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K8.0 posted:Rocket capacity is basically based on weight derived from input ingredients (1 ore = 2kg, 1000kg rocket capacity) plus some hand tweaking. See this image for a full rocket load. ah i'd forgotten about that ty
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Feb 24, 2024 02:20
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Doomykins posted:The mental image of Factorio guy building multiple processing and orbital junk ejecting facilities for waste products across multiple planets is simply sublime. The "Factorio Guy is the villain" theory turned up to 11 as he exponentionally expands polluting for personal gain operations. He’s going to be pumping archeological finds into a recycler in the expansion.
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Feb 24, 2024 02:50
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“Ah, but once I really get going, my factories will be so numerous they blot out the sun!” declared The Engineer With a ripple of forelimbs which signifies amusement, the Biter replied “Well, then we shall Bite in the shade!”
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Feb 24, 2024 04:44
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LonsomeSon posted:“Ah, but once I really get going, my factories will be so numerous they blot out the sun!” declared The Engineer (Spoiler for the movie) All the biters died at the end This film is dedicated to the brave mujahideen fighters of Nauvis.
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Feb 24, 2024 05:01
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meowmeowmeowmeow posted:Lightning scrap recycling planet is gonna be dope. Interesting to read how much they want each planet to feel like it's got unique mechanics and isn't going to be copy pasting blueprints and duplicating work. I mean, calling this an expansion is ridiculous. I know it's using the same engine, graphics whatever but this is definitely going to be worth paying the full price of the game again. So, so deeply hyped.
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Feb 25, 2024 01:05
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Yeah, the tier list of factory games based on features is going to look something like : Factorio Factorio 2.0 (just the new stuff) Everything else
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Feb 25, 2024 06:01
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Monday morning side thought : We can now be certain that the three things on the left are the production structures for the three initial planets. We know from the proving to be accurate deblurring that the third planet will be (minor spoiler that will be revealed within a few months on FFF) Bacchus, and thus likely vegetation-focused. Looking at the one remaining machine, I'm curious how people think that will play into that theme. Is it an air purifier? Liquid handler? Greenhouse? Or somehow an underwater structure? Personally, my guess is that it is in some sense an advanced chemical plant, but like the foundry and electromagnetic plant are not direct upgrades from furnaces and assemblers, it will be similarly skewed and only partially upgrade chemical plants while also having unique functionality they don't. Also worth noting that the final planet is going to be Aquilo, and thus a windy and probably icy planet, so that will doubtless have its own final set of mechanics and challenges, presumably incorporating tech from the previous three.
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Feb 26, 2024 16:19
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I'm going to say it's some kind of bioreactor that does chemical plant-type things, yeah.
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Feb 26, 2024 16:24
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I hope we get some IR3-style tree management from that planet, I really enjoyed the unique gameplay layer that added.
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Feb 26, 2024 18:23
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I wonder if its a bio-reactor type of chem plant thats more efficient/faster/whatever but you have to harvest tress or plant matter which need low pollution and time to regrow between harvests. I think that could be a fun spin on the usual 'destroy the world and harvest from fixed ore patches' mechanic the rest of the game has, would add an interesting design layer to factories kind of like what we've seen on the other planets beyond just a lot of trees everywhere.
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Feb 26, 2024 18:37
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I wouldn’t mind seeing something like CoI-style forestry management, where you’re actually planting new trees and harvesting them all as part of an automated process. Mods could expand such a system into actual farming, no more K2-style “20 logs, water, and time gets you 30 logs” processes to represent agriculture
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Feb 26, 2024 18:58
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I was reading abotu the IR 3 mechanic having never played it and it sounds great, you need to put forestry buildings in chunks with trees and they produce wood and maybe help keep trees alive?? And if you kill the trees with pollution they dont produce anymore.
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Feb 26, 2024 19:41
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Oh that rules, I didn’t realize that had changed between 2 and 3
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Feb 26, 2024 20:38
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Yeah, for IR3 forestry you plop a greenhouse down and it'll generate wood, remove pollution, and grow more trees based on how many trees are in its chunk. So put one in a forest and it gets going right away, but for a desert you need to kickstart it with tree planters, which will gradually turn the chunk into a densely forested spot. It's a great take on farming, and much better than a building that's just "insert seed+water, get wood".
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Feb 26, 2024 20:49
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One thing I've been thinking is that they haven't shown any biters or active mobile threats off of Nauvis. They're implied to be present (comment about making craters on Vulcanus into little pillboxes) but we haven't seen anything more threatening than the environments in space and Fulgora. I can easily accept no biters in space (although there's rocks!), and it seems fair not to have any on Fulgora with the history of widespread settlement and ruin, but we're going to face something elsewhere I'm sure.
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Feb 28, 2024 10:23
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My money's on burrowing worms in the oil sands. Like regular worms, but they can move. Rather than get disturbed and attack based on pollution, they'll be attracted to drilling.
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Feb 28, 2024 10:48
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Xerol posted:My money's on burrowing worms in the oil sands. Like regular worms, but they can move. can't wait for mods to add harvesters and carryalls
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Feb 28, 2024 10:55
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I found this funnyquote:
like its always been the obvious subtext that the engineer is a walking environmental disaster but its interesting to see that the devs consider it so baked into the theme of the game that they were hesitant to make a planet that actually got better as a result of his industrialisation.
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Feb 28, 2024 20:09
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Well, we do have this thread title for a reason.
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Feb 28, 2024 20:31
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Uh, iron and copper sitting out in the open will corrode so by mining them and turning them into refined products, I am preventing needless environmental waste. I also always put absolutely huge solar panel arrays up, and try to shove all my furnaces in a green area to feed the plants. Y'all might be environmental hazards but I'm not
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Feb 28, 2024 20:37
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Teledahn posted:One thing I've been thinking is that they haven't shown any biters or active mobile threats off of Nauvis. They're implied to be present (comment about making craters on Vulcanus into little pillboxes) but we haven't seen anything more threatening than the environments in space and Fulgora. Fulgora would be a bitch to deal with biters on. Limited space on the plateaus, plus no good large-scale choke points since the oil sand "sea" can be walked on. You'd have to wall up all of the ramps onto the plateaus, plus have protection anywhere you have buildings close to the edges.
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Feb 28, 2024 20:57
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Teledahn posted:One thing I've been thinking is that they haven't shown any biters or active mobile threats off of Nauvis. They're implied to be present (comment about making craters on Vulcanus into little pillboxes) but we haven't seen anything more threatening than the environments in space and Fulgora. They've said that "most of them have different military targets." There are only four, so that means three of them have new enemies. Fulgora might be the one without. My other theory is that all of them have enemies, but the plant planet is actually the original home of the biters.
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Feb 28, 2024 22:32
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K8.0 posted:They've said that "most of them have different military targets." ... Can you remind me where you heard that? I must have missed it.
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Feb 29, 2024 01:31
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It's in the Space Age announcement FFF. I don't blame you for forgetting, they have released so much information that at this point I am starting to feel unspoiled because I can't possibly remember most of it.
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Feb 29, 2024 01:43
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So I just started playing Factorio now since I got it from a friend, and coming from satisfactory which is my regular addiction, the whole system with determining how much a node or crafter makes per second is kinda throwing me off and I can't quite seem to get a handle on exactly how many machines to set up to keep stuff from either operating at half speed or building up backlog on belts. I saw a mod posted earlier in the thread for actual craft times, but looks like it was last updated years ago now. Is there a go-to option now for a satisfactory-style display of items per minute or whatnot?
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Feb 29, 2024 13:44
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Max Rate Calculator is what I use, it adds a button to the toolbar that lets you drag a selection over a bunch of machines and spits out the input and output rates. There's no inherent way to see it in the vanilla game, although you can make combinator machines to count belt/inserter throughput and things like that.
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Feb 29, 2024 13:55
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ACES CURE PLANES posted:So I just started playing Factorio now since I got it from a friend, and coming from satisfactory which is my regular addiction, the whole system with determining how much a node or crafter makes per second is kinda throwing me off and I can't quite seem to get a handle on exactly how many machines to set up to keep stuff from either operating at half speed or building up backlog on belts. The typical factorio answer to this is "if there's not enough to fill the belt, build more machines; if there's not enough belt to transport results, build more belts". This is flippant but is sort of the core mechanic that people buy into, and because of this there aren't many mods like you're looking for. Instead, mods are sort of split into two categories: bottleneck identification and production planning The bottleneck identification group is trying to answer, "in this multi-stage production chain, which stage should I expand _right now_ to make more product?" These are mods like -https://mods.factorio.com/mod/RateCalculator seems like it'll do this though it's mostly for calculating whether the selected setup is actually at its max possible rate and telling you where the bottlenecks are -https://mods.factorio.com/mod/BottleneckLite puts colored circles on machines that are like satisfactory's pole lights The production planner group is trying to answer, "If I want a certain amount of this product, how much of each thing should I build?" These are mods like - https://mods.factorio.com/mod/helmod gold standard ahead-of-time planner - https://mods.factorio.com/mod/RecipeBook recipe explorer in general, just fyi if you look at a machine it displays its recipe, and its throughput is (items per recipe)/(recipe time)*(machine speed)*(speed module effects), then multiplied by productivity module effects for product output only. RateCalculator will probably display this, but it's about investigating the world as it stands rather than giving you the fundamental recipe math.
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Feb 29, 2024 13:59
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Also if you're early on, you can just ignore the machine speed bit - if you're taking a recipe running in one assembling machine, and then you feed the outputs into another assembling machine with the exact same speed, then that cancels out and you can just do the math without it to figure out if you've got the right ratio.
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Feb 29, 2024 14:08
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Xerol posted:Max Rate Calculator is what I use, it adds a button to the toolbar that lets you drag a selection over a bunch of machines and spits out the input and output rates. There's no inherent way to see it in the vanilla game, although you can make combinator machines to count belt/inserter throughput and things like that. Does this take into account the whole thing with like the bonus miner output from research too? If so, seems right up my alley, I was worried it might be a bit out of date since it was last updated a while ago, but I guess if it works it works, thanks.
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Feb 29, 2024 14:21
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Don't calculate poo poo. Just look with your eyes. A machine idle with not enough inputs? Put more machines before it to provide more of whatever is supposed to be on that belt. Do you have too many machines consuming from a belt, such that a fully saturated belt is getting completely depleted and no materials are getting to the last few machines? Then disassemble those machines. Don't plan ahead. gently caress around and find out; it's no big deal, you can always rebuild bigger, better, later. Make assemblers that make assemblers/belts/inserters so that you have plenty of material to expand with. The factory must grow. When you're deep into the game and hella hardcore about it you'll wanna calculate stuff, so that's why all these hardcore factorio nerds are telling you about ways to calculate, but don't listen to them. You're not at the point where that's remotely necessary yet. If Factorio gets its hooks in you, you'll eventually get there. But for now, you can just chill.
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Feb 29, 2024 14:25
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Calculators also can only assume so much about the world, and if any of these things aren't true then you won't get an accurate number anyway: -There is enough power -The input belts are providing enough material -The output belts are able to accept enough material -Inserters are able to move items quickly enough -There are no circuit conditions interrupting anything -If applicable, there are enough fluids coming in and/or room for fluids to go out Also forgot to mention this web calculator which I use for most base planning. If you really want to approach things mathematically (which I do not recommend doing until you've beat the game by feel once or twice) you could do spreadsheets and stuff but really all the work's already been done there so I just use the tools that exist instead.
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Feb 29, 2024 14:25
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Yes, but use Rate Calculator instead. Max Rate Calc hasnt been updated in years
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Feb 29, 2024 14:34
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Factorio also just has kind of a different feel than Satisfactory. In Satisfactory, if you perfectly balance all the machines, everything kind of flows like water. It encourages messing around with machine speed so everything is perfectly spaced on the belt and nothing ever stops. Factorio is more like "build more until the input belts are empty or the output belts are full. Then repeat somewhere else." Factorio looks more chaotic. It will never flow like water. Instead, it will be a beautiful Rube Goldberg machine that you'll never fully understand, even though you built it.
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Feb 29, 2024 15:11
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The top down view is also less grand but much quicker for getting a wholistic view. Building in Factorio is much quicker and just even faster once you have construction robots.
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Feb 29, 2024 15:16
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There is like 30 seconds where you build subunits that flow like water after being tapped off a bus or train station but then you research enough bot speed or else give up on going any more mega.
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Feb 29, 2024 15:44
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DontMockMySmock posted:Don't calculate poo poo. Just look with your eyes. A machine idle with not enough inputs? Put more machines before it to provide more of whatever is supposed to be on that belt. Do you have too many machines consuming from a belt, such that a fully saturated belt is getting completely depleted and no materials are getting to the last few machines? Then disassemble those machines. Don't plan ahead. gently caress around and find out; it's no big deal, you can always rebuild bigger, better, later. Make assemblers that make assemblers/belts/inserters so that you have plenty of material to expand with. The factory must grow. I just started my 3rd(?) game after being away for years and have embraced this mind set. I just got to blue science and spent a bit of time optimizing some of it, before that I was winging everything. It's going well. Weird not having a main bus.
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Feb 29, 2024 15:54
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| # ? May 19, 2024 11:14 |
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You never absolutely need to calculate in vanilla. Assemblers are ultra cheap, production chains are fairly simple, and you've got infinite space to build in, so it doesn't really affect anything if you end up having a couple more or less assemblers than you need for a particular step. There's no real downside to overproduction. Mods tend to have more demanding production chains, though, so it's often worth planning things a bit more thoroughly if you're playing a mod. Calculating ratios for everything is a fool's errand. However, for individual production chains it's often easy and worthwhile to calculate, especially in cases where one machine is feeding directly into another machine. For example, the power production ratio (1 boiler produces steam for 2 steam engines) is well-known and quite simple, so there's no reason not to follow it. On the other hand, I don't bother calculating the amount of coal going to those boilers. I just bring in enough coal to saturate the belt and let it run. If I start getting brownouts, I know that means it's time to either supply more coal, upgrade the belt, or both.
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Feb 29, 2024 16:13
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