euphronius posted:

Instead of ceasefire talks, Putin may reunite the Palestinians (politically) which would be (I think ) a major blow to American/Israeli policy ?

StashAugustine posted:

I think it's also really important to situate this conflict as being basically like every other colonial conflict. Israel is Rhodesia is South Vietnam is Algeria is Northern Ireland is El Salvador (and hell, it's basically the same as the American genocide of the natives). Israel is not a unique country in any way except that its marginally more palatable to liberals (and, in theory, for understandable reasons, even if they all turn out to be bullshit in practice)

my dad posted:

That behavior is just settlers 101, tbh. Fascists mostly just copied it.

my dad posted:

That behavior is just settlers 101, tbh. Fascists mostly just copied it.

my dad posted:

That behavior is just settlers 101, tbh. Fascists mostly just copied it.

mdemone posted:

this does not even make sense Euphornymous

BearsBearsBears posted:

It really is. In fact a better example might be America, the US had tons of protests against the government for not letting them kill Indians and settle on their lands. The UK not letting Americans do so was a large part of what caused the American Revolution.

BearsBearsBears posted:

The first example that comes to find for me is the Freikorps of Wiemar Germany. Violent paramilitary groups that thought the government wasn't cracking down on communists (and associated groups) hard enough. Don't know much about rallies performed by them or in support of them.

DJJIB-DJDCT posted:

The Israeli response to Jewish extremism and violence

"Ami Pedahzur looks at the theoretical issue of how a democracy can defend itself from those wishing to subvert or destroy it without being required to take measures that would impinge upon the basic principles of the democratic idea, with a case study of the Israeli response to Jewish extremism."

e: Naomi Klein identified the dynamic here, but the Israeli state relies on "out of control" settlers/extremists to present fait accompli of things they want to do but can't be seen doing. They do the state's dirty work, the state acts like it's helpless and throws up its hands, but then they protect those settlers and extremists.

Unlike other Apartheid states, Israel needs to launder its image for international audiences, hasbara, and so having this degree of plausible deniability allows Israel's image to remain intact. So they always have a degree of plausible deniability, are one step removed from the worst of the actions, can act shocked and horrified when someone shoots up the Cave of the Patriarchs massacre, while still later pointing Ben Gavir to cabinet.

Vox Nihili posted:

I think this is a really important thread in terms of getting out the news of what is happening in Gaza, covering Israel's ongoing crimes, promoting activism, etc., particularly when the media in many countries is, to put it politely, not doing a great job of covering these events. So posts like these, above, can be really damaging and give exactly the wrong sort of people an argument to shut down discussion here. Please be thoughtful when you decide which sources you decide to share here. If the person tweeting is a Nazi please, please find a different loving source. Thank you.

quote:

Oxfam says US policies contributing to risk of famine in Gaza

Oxfam has said that the group is opposed to potential US plans to airdrop packages of food into Gaza, saying that such efforts cannot cancel out US policies that have contributed to extreme hunger throughout Gaza.

“Oxfam does not support US airdrops to Gaza, which would mostly serve to relieve the guilty consciences of senior US officials whose policies are contributing to the ongoing atrocities and risk of famine in Gaza,” Scott Paul, who conducts humanitarian policy at Oxfam America, said in a statement.

“While Palestinians in Gaza have been pushed to the absolute brink, dropping a paltry, symbolic amount of aid into Gaza with no plan for its safe distribution would not help and be deeply degrading to Palestinians. Instead of indiscriminate airdrops in Gaza, the US should cut the flow of weapons to Israel that are used in indiscriminate attacks.”

BearsBearsBears posted:

It really is. In fact a better example might be America, the US had tons of protests against the government for not letting them kill Indians and settle on their lands. The UK not letting Americans do so was a large part of what caused the American Revolution.

TeenageArchipelago posted:

https://aje.io/gs2k6y?update=2741119

Plans to airdrop aid are an open acknowledgement that not enough aid is getting in, but rather than do anything to force the issue the Biden administration is just planning on airdropping a bit of aid and calling it a day

The Easy Rider posted:

I guess the thing that I'm having so much trouble with is the sheer depravity that this requires. It's asking a society to thoroughly drat itself for the sake of fairly marginal political expediency. The degree to which this is a controlled, or even heavily influenced, process is actually I guess just inconceivable to me in its monstrousness.

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

https://twitter.com/ireallyhateyou/status/1763221846387032280?s=20

from the chotiner-kirby interview posted:

How would you describe what the Administration’s policy is with Gaza and Israel at this point?

Right now, the focus is very much on getting a pause in place, an extended pause for six weeks or so, so that we can get all the remaining hostages back with their families, so that we can get a significant reduction in the violence and, therefore, the concomitant reduction in civilian casualties. And to allow us breathing space to increase the flow of humanitarian assistance into Gaza. Our focus is very much on trying to get this new pause in place for all those three purposes, and that’s what everybody’s working very hard on.

Now, from a strategic perspective, we want to see that Israel is able to defend itself and that Hamas is no longer in charge of Gaza. We want to see a post-conflict Gaza that the Palestinian people have a vote and a voice in. We believe the best way to do that is through a revitalized Palestinian Authority, and we’ve already talked to President Abbas about that. We don’t want to see Gaza occupied, we don’t want to see any of Gaza’s territory reduced, and we don’t want to see any forced displacement of the Palestinian people.

The President made clear on Monday that he’s hoping to get a ceasefire in place. You were at the podium last month, and you said, “We don’t believe a ceasefire is going to be the benefit of anybody but Hamas.” What’s changed?

Nothing’s changed. We still don’t support a general ceasefire that would leave Hamas in charge. What we do support is a temporary ceasefire, to get these hostages out and get the aid in.

Hasn’t the White House said that they want to extend the temporary ceasefire?

It is possible, and we’re hopeful that if this temporary ceasefire is abided to by both sides, that we might be able to extend it and see if it can’t lead to a general cessation of hostilities, but our focus is on this temporary ceasefire right now.

I guess my confusion is: if the hope is to extend a temporary cessation of hostilities into more of a longer-range ceasefire, but a ceasefire only benefits Hamas, I’m a little unclear on what the policy is.

If a temporary ceasefire can hold for six weeks or so, we think it’s possible that it might be extended, with a view toward seeing if there’s a way to end this conflict. That’s not the same as saying we’ve changed our mind on a general ceasefire. We want to see the conflict end. We think that a temporary ceasefire can be useful for all the three purposes I gave you, and maybe, potentially, extended even further so that we can get to an end of the conflict.

I understand that. That’s why I’ve been slightly unclear on the idea that a ceasefire just benefits Hamas, because it seems like you’re hoping that the ceasefire could lead to the end of the conflict.

What we’ve said, Isaac, is calling for a general ceasefire right now, with no preconditions, benefits Hamas and leaves them in charge, and they don’t have to pay any price for what they did on October 7th. They wouldn’t have to release any hostages. They wouldn’t have to let any aid in. They’d still be left in charge of Gaza. That’s what we’re saying we don’t support.

PawParole posted:

https://twitter.com/ShaykhSulaiman/status/1762975717459980490

DJJIB-DJDCT posted:

Yeah but then like a loving moron he went on Jordan Jensen's pod and made fun of people for caring about Palestine, went full Cool Adam.

mcmagic posted:

"Jewish Comedian" and "Adam Friedland" are pretty superfluous.

Sherbert Hoover posted:

hold up, he's a comedian?

Seyser Koze posted:

Maybe the wrong thread, but can anybody recommend a book on how apartheid came and went in South Africa or Rhodesia? tia

crepeface posted:

listened to the entirety of the 3.5 hr podcast that talks about the similarities with palestine and the history of south african apartheid and the combo of resistance techniques that managed to overturn it (including their own version of BDS!) and how reparations and justice got co-opted at the end

quote:

In this Rev Left Family Annual Collab (Rev Left+Red Menace+Guerrilla History), Alyson, Henry, Adnan, and Breht sit down for a deep dive on South African Apartheid. Together they discuss its euro-colonialist origins, explain the significance of the Boer Wars, define and explicate the origins of apartheid, explore the political economy of apartheid and how brutal racism shaped it, examine the multi-faceted indigenous resistance to apartheid, analyze the end of formal apartheid as well as its ongoing legacy in post-apartheid South Africa, and try to extract important lessons from this history to apply to the ongoing struggle in Palestine.

https://twitter.com/guerrilla_pod/status/1735734604177260824?s=20
one of the hosts co-translated losurdo's stalin book.

quote:

AUDIENCE MEMBER: Genocide Joe, how many kids have you killed in Gaza?

AUDIENCE: Four more years! Four more years! Four more years!

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (Inaudible.)

AUDIENCE: Four more years! Four more years! Four more years!

THE PRESIDENT: Thank you. Thank you. (Applause.)

Aeolius posted:

just noticed that the phrase "Genocide Joe" appears in two places on whitehouse.gov, via transcripts

kudos to that protester

Bro Dad posted:

lol. lmao.

Diet Crack posted:

Uh, tell that to the Uyghurs. China is not the bastion of roundabout diplomacy you're claiming it to be.

Inb4 "but the US said it wasn't!" Please follow your own post.

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lumpentroll posted:

this allusion meant posted:

the genocide joe administration justifies their maximalist negotiating position of demanding hamas offer a delayed surrender ("temporary ceasefire" where you give up all your leverage and then we threaten to restart the genocide if you don't leave the strip and let our guys take over unbothered) by saying that any scenario where hamas remains in the strip means "they don't have to pay any price" for oct 7. i want someone with access to the press pool to ask whether this means we are fully prepared to tell the rest of the world we think israel shouldn't have to pay any price for any of the things they've done since then (or before) that the rest of the world finds objectionable

e:

don't know if chotiner is play dumb not drawing out this inference that we are saying the famine-massacre continues until they offer delayed surrender

Al! posted:

welp. there will be no excuses for the terror i guess

hailthefish posted:

this thing where they just keep assuming that their enemies will voluntarily destroy themselves will never stop being funny. the mythmaking about the cold war and the end of history has really cooked a lot of brains I guess.

quote:

Israeli body count claims means Palestinian fighters likely remain in sizeable numbers

Israeli military claims that it has killed more than 13,000 Palestinian fighters in Gaza since the start of its ground invasion likely still leaves Palestinian armed groups with a sizeable force as Hamas alone had 40,000 fighters before the latest war began in October, war monitors said.

US-based think thanks Institute for the Study of War (ISW) and the Critical Threats Project (CTP) also said the battle for the Zeitoun area of Gaza City continues, and video footage released by Palestinian Islamic Jihad on Thursday showed its fighters “detonating a house-borne improvised explosive device” (HBIED).

Hamas fighters also reported that they had detonated an HBIED and “two explosive-rigged tunnels targeting Israeli forces”, the ISW and CTP said in their latest battlefield report.

The Popular Resistance Committees, one of the more than five armed groups fighting Israeli forces in Gaza, said it fired rockets on Thursday towards southern Israel, according to the ISW/CTP report.