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so with these ultraorthodox/haredi protests i guess i have a few questions first is of course are ultraorthodox and haredi synonyms? im haredi/haredim is preferred but are there any groups that are ultraorthodox but not haredi? second is what is their relation to zionism? i now htere are some anti-zionist haredim like the satmar in new york and the neturei karta, and i know there is a haredi political party... but my understanding is that most are non-zionist, meaning they live in israel but don't really care about expanding settlements or anything like that. mostly they just want to study the torah all day, have a billion kids, and keep getting welfare checks. my understanding of the settler movement is that it's mostly conservative and orthodox (but not ultra) jews who do believe in the religious mission of zionism, and also secular zionists, and then last also israelis who are getting hosed by the housing crisis and just want a house somewhere.
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Mar 4, 2024 05:37
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Horseshoe theory posted:Ben Gvir purged them, OP. He doesn't have the power to do that, nor does he have the personal restraint to stop himself from screaming about it if he did.
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Mar 4, 2024 05:46
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lobster shirt posted:so with these ultraorthodox/haredi protests i guess i have a few questions First, Ultra Orthodox and Haredi are effectively synonymous in their usage. Second, you can broadly divide them into these three categories wrt zionism: 1. Zionists 2. Anti zionists 3. Non zionists, which is effectively as you described - the guys who aren't actively opposed to Israel's existence but also don't really care about it, they don't see it as the true "Jewish state" and don't have any attachment to the zionist cause. They just live on the land as far as they're concerned. Third, beyond being non zionists, the people protesting the possible draft right now are also doing it on more personal religious grounds - they don't like the culture of the military (and secular Israeli institutions in general, really) and don't want their kids integrate into it.
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Mar 4, 2024 05:55
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"Helping the starving American-style" Soviet propaganda poster from the 1970s
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Mar 4, 2024 05:57
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The Haredim are epic because every now and again, some rabbi pisses people off by saying "IDF soldiers are worthless dogs, our true protectors are Torah students"
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Mar 4, 2024 06:00
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Sancho Banana posted:The Haredim are epic because every now and again, some rabbi pisses people off by saying "IDF soldiers are worthless dogs, our true protectors are Torah students" Only one group in israel is prepared to vie with hamas in tunnelmaking expertise
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Mar 4, 2024 06:15
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Electronic Intifada had a recent video showing the IOF using M113s. That seems very bad for Israel. So that's good for me.
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Mar 4, 2024 06:20
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lol im willing to bet daniel thought he was going to be on the winning side when this all started. Now he's staring at a noose meant for him.
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Mar 4, 2024 06:41
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Al-Saqr posted:lol im willing to bet daniel thought he was going to be on the winning side when this all started. Now he's staring at a noose meant for him. like others have said before I don't think it's because these people suddenly grew a conscience
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Mar 4, 2024 06:43
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Keeper Garrett posted:Electronic Intifada had a recent video showing the IOF using M113s.  paul soccer would approve
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Mar 4, 2024 06:43
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Al-Saqr posted:by the way whats with all these resignations of IDF officers is something happening? do they sense that the war is ending and they are 100% hosed? https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/mass-resignations-among-senior-iof-spox-unit-officials--isra quote:Earlier, Israeli media revealed that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's orders to prepare for a ground invasion in the Gazan city of Rafah had caused significant disagreements between him and Israeli military officials. according to Hezbollah media the officer corps is at their limit with Netanyahu and you can see why. evacuating Rafah just makes sense operationally for the IDF because it’s better to try and fight Hamas in an empty city than a lived in one, but Netanyahu wants results now. I wouldn’t be surprised if this also has something to do with the military faction that wants an invasion of Lebanon asap. nobody can agree on what course of action to take but they know for sure that Netanyahu is getting in the way of anything actionable. if it’s true that the resignations are coming from Hasbara guys like Hagari then maybe the problem is that there’s no consistent messaging or guidelines. Israel actively undermines its own case, as can be seen with their response to the aid trucks massacre.
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Mar 4, 2024 06:43
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It's certainly not for what anyone in this thread would consider moral reasons.
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Mar 4, 2024 06:47
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:The two women became friends years ago as medical clowns. poetry lmao
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Mar 4, 2024 06:52
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Are the Ultra Orthadox guys a large contingent of the online Hasbara trolls too? Or is that the retired/unemployed? or just a mix of anyone bored online?
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Mar 4, 2024 07:13
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this guy looks like the dude from men in black who gets his head shot off and it's halfway through growing back
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Mar 4, 2024 07:16
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they’d need a shabbos goy to troll on shabbat
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Mar 4, 2024 07:17
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BearsBearsBears posted:"Helping the starving American-style" Soviet propaganda poster from the 1970s 
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Mar 4, 2024 07:19
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Malloc Voidstar posted:https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/soccer-fan-arrested-for-waving-palestinian-flag-at-game-ben-gvir-zero-tolerance/ I suspect Ben Gvir doesn't actually intend to punish himself for inciting violence and terrorism, which is definitely something he does
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Mar 4, 2024 07:31
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lmao. "and it just so happens my brother in law is a plastic surgeon. I'd be happy to make a referral."
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Mar 4, 2024 07:33
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mcmagic posted:My "For You" tab on twitter keeps showing this loving disgusting doxxing account that is doing the Libsoftiktok model I guess and it's breaking my brain whenever I see it. I'm really getting tired of these attempts to conflate Joodaism with Xionism
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Mar 4, 2024 07:52
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We shall fight them on the beaches https://twitter.com/krus_vs_insta/status/1624817867664379904 Free paul_soccer
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Mar 4, 2024 08:14
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average millwall fan on holiday
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Mar 4, 2024 08:21
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smug jeebus posted:We shall fight them on the beaches Was reading in If We Burn how football ultras who were part of street fighting helped determine which side held the streets depending on their political allegiance, and it confirmed for me why soccer isn't popular in the USA. Dunno why this video made me think of that.
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Mar 4, 2024 08:24
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Delta-Wye posted:
Oh dang you can blow up an armoured vehicle with an rpg? It's a perfectly serviceable armoured box on tracks that will mostly protect you from small arms fire and shrapnel. It's an upgrade from a truck not a breakthrough assault weapon.
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Mar 4, 2024 08:28
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E2M2 posted:Are the Ultra Orthadox guys a large contingent of the online Hasbara trolls too? Or is that the retired/unemployed? or just a mix of anyone bored online? quote:Around the same time, Israel’s Ministry of Strategic Affairs budgeted another $570,000 to create a computer and smartphone application that would turn thousands of Americans into a robotic army of Israeli trolls. Assigned “missions” from troll headquarters near Tel Aviv, they would hide their links to Israel and launch online attacks against their US targets, including critics of Israel, boycott supporters, and human rights activists. I'm sure there's more in Israel though
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Mar 4, 2024 08:35
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yeah technically speaking you're not supposed to expect APCs to withstand any kind of fire because they're there to transport infantry to the vicinity of a battle, or out of a battle that's already been won. they're a replacement for trucks, which obviously can be shot up, so any protection better than a canvas curtain is gravy
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Mar 4, 2024 08:36
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PhilippAchtel posted:Was reading in If We Burn how football ultras who were part of street fighting helped determine which side held the streets depending on their political allegiance, and it confirmed for me why soccer isn't popular in the USA. azov started as footy hooligans iirc
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Mar 4, 2024 08:40
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Weka posted:Oh dang you can blow up an armoured vehicle with an rpg? It's a perfectly serviceable armoured box on tracks that will mostly protect you from small arms fire and shrapnel. It's an upgrade from a truck not a breakthrough assault weapon. Not figuratively a replacement for trucks either. In the Canadian Army, and I imagine the others as well, they 1:1 replaced the trucks and halftracks that had been used in WW2 without changing the organization or tactics of the units that were equipped with them.  The Motor Battalion was a rare beast in the Commonwealth Armies in NW Europe. It was an organic armoured infantry battalion integral to Armoured Brigades, both those in Armoured Divisions (4th Canadian Armoured Division) and in Type A Independent Armoured Brigades (2nd Canadian Armoured Brigade). It was fully mechanized in tracked lightly-armoured vehicles - either M3 halftracks or Kangaroos - so that it could keep up with the tanks. It had considerable integral support capability, but it was short on infantry. In 4 Armoured Division only 1 of its 4 infantry battalions was a Motor Battalion, the other 3 were standard Infantry Battalions with trucks for long distance movement. In 2nd Canadian Armoured Brigade, the Elgin Regiment had Kangaroos. One last thing, keep in mind, every infantry battalion had Bren Gun carriers, even in the infantry divisions. The M113 was light enough, and cheap enough, that it could entirely replace the trucks and half tracks, army-wide. It also took over from the Bren Gun carrier as a weapons carrier,  But just because it was protected and had weapons didn't mean you were supposed to use it like a weaker tank. It was just a better protected, cross country, amphibious, truck. 
DJJIB-DJDCT has issued a correction as of 09:01 on Mar 4, 2024 |
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Mar 4, 2024 08:49
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tbh I wouldn't be suprised if they've been rolling in M-113s since the start, their replacement with Namers has been a gradual process (despite how controversial the usage of the old model has become) and reports were coming out of Mk 3 Merkavas being used in addition to the Mk 4s as early as October - the question is how many of them are in Gaza right now, and how that reflects on the state of their armored battalions.gradenko_2000 posted:yeah technically speaking you're not supposed to expect APCs to withstand any kind of fire because they're there to transport infantry to the vicinity of a battle, or out of a battle that's already been won. they're a replacement for trucks, which obviously can be shot up, so any protection better than a canvas curtain is gravy Maybe, but we're talking about the guys who put a lovely expensive missle interception systems on their newest, fanciest APCs.
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Mar 4, 2024 08:55
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:https://twitter.com/Aldanmarki/status/1764397394358161518?s=20 BATTLE OF THE PROMISED CONQUEST AND SACRED STRUGGLE!
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Mar 4, 2024 09:02
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Horseshoe theory posted:Ben Gvir purged them, OP. the military is not in Gvir's portfolio avtually
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Mar 4, 2024 09:06
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Gvirn to Tradition
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Mar 4, 2024 09:11
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/mass-resignations-among-senior-iof-spox-unit-officials--isra netanyahu happily getting his soldiers killed to manage his news cycle and the military getting progressively more and more pissed off about it. sounds familiar somehow
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Mar 4, 2024 09:14
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Sancho Banana posted:Maybe, but we're talking about the guys who put a lovely expensive missle interception systems on their newest, fanciest APCs. I think the Namer is the best protected armoured vehicle (including main battle tanks) in existence just in terms of armour too. Despite this they get blown up by RPGs with warheads made in a concentration camp basement.
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Mar 4, 2024 09:32
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Sleekly posted:azov started as footy hooligans iirc Them and some ultranationalists got together
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Mar 4, 2024 09:33
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Fuligin posted:Only one group in israel is prepared to vie with hamas in tunnelmaking expertise lmao
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Mar 4, 2024 09:43
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E2M2 posted:Are the Ultra Orthadox guys a large contingent of the online Hasbara trolls too? Or is that the retired/unemployed? or just a mix of anyone bored online? The Haredim are not "supposed" to be online because the internet is a sinful place (accurate). there are markets for "kosher" phones that limit and filter internet access. of course that doesn't mean they all adhere to it, but I don't think a significant number partakes in hasbara. the israeli hasbara trolls are mostly volunteers from secular/religieus nationalists parts of israeli society and professional propagandists.
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Mar 4, 2024 09:50
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Weka posted:I think the Namer is the best protected armoured vehicle (including main battle tanks) in existence just in terms of armour too. Despite this they get blown up by RPGs with warheads made in a concentration camp basement. The Namer has more armor on it than the Merkava, and that was the whole point of the concept. You can take the turret off a Merkava and replace the loss in tonnage with more armor plating. It's not something the M113 can manage in any condition, and once the aluminum armor on the M113s melt they won't be able to be reserviced like other armored vehicles can be. IIRC the M113s were being introduced months ago to make up for other losses, but they managed to keep them away from the front of fighting.
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Mar 4, 2024 09:51
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BearsBearsBears posted:"Helping the starving American-style" Soviet propaganda poster from the 1970s the soviet union had so much god tier agitprop. these posters for some weird reason bring to my mind the incredible work that came out of Soyuzdetmultfilm in the '60s-80s, especially Tarasov's "Shooting Range", imo one of the more scathing indictments of American society ever to be animated https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AfrSzzvEsk
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Mar 4, 2024 11:24
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https://twitter.com/M_N_Albukhaiti/status/1764593581044441553
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