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Fallout 4's treatment of Kellogg would work better if you did the memory den segment before you killed him. As it is, you get this whole (probably expensively made) backstory and bespoke mechanic to learn about a guy who will never matter to the story again. Since Starfield is about multiverse shenanigans, it's hard to say who the antagonist really is.
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Mar 9, 2024 10:05
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I still think Mankar Cameron (sp?) was a cool antagonist, almost up there with Dagoth. And there were years of debate on these very forums regarding Ulfric and the Civil War from Skyrim.
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Mar 9, 2024 12:33
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webmeister posted:To be honest I reckon they should ditch the packrat aspect of their games. In Oblivion/Skyrim if you needed to murder someone you could sneak into their house at night, steal all their food, and pickpocket a poisoned apple into their inventory. Then when they wake up and try to eat breakfast it kills them. You could sneak into places during gaps in the guard schedule at a given time of day, or hang out at the bar in the evening to hear gossip. You could track someone walking out to their secret stash and trigger dialogue if you’d emptied it. Starfield almost certainly still supports all that, but doesn’t use it. I’d much rather have more quests leveraging the unique aspects of the engine than have them cut for a minor performance gain.
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Mar 9, 2024 14:43
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At it's best Bethesda makes Immersive Sim adjacent open world action RPGs. Multiple solutions to problems, unexpected interconnection between systems. I don't want to see them abandon their detailed prop items, I'd just like to see them used better.
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Mar 9, 2024 14:49
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DancingShade posted:Starfield: maybe some new mini games would fix it. As someone who is currently playing (just got to the third open world zone) Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth: No. I am good for mini games for a while.
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Mar 9, 2024 17:04
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I fondly remember following people through their lives and breaking into their homes. Starfield had... basically none of that, right?
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Mar 9, 2024 19:41
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chaosapiant posted:I still think Mankar Cameron (sp?) was a cool antagonist, almost up there with Dagoth. And there were years of debate on these very forums regarding Ulfric and the Civil War from Skyrim. I guess I was referring to the main story. All of their games have some good side quests. You can go through the entirety of Skyrim's story ignoring the civil war
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Mar 9, 2024 20:01
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Azhais posted:I guess I was referring to the main story. All of their games have some good side quests. You can go through the entirety of Skyrim's story ignoring the civil war None of what I wrote referred to side quests. And no, to my knowledge you can’t avoid the civil war. You at least need to broker a temporary truce in the main quest and Ulfric is a part of that. And Mankar is the antagonist (one of two technically) of the Oblivion main quest.
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Mar 9, 2024 20:19
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Old Doggy Bastard posted:I fondly remember following people through their lives and breaking into their homes. Starfield had... basically none of that, right? Yeah people don't have schedules in Starfield.
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Mar 10, 2024 00:05
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Azhais posted:When's the last time Bethesda actually had a decent story with a vaguely interesting antagonist? Morrowind? The Terminator: Future Shock https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBNSThWSZu4
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Mar 10, 2024 01:07
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Flowing Thot posted:Yeah people don't have schedules in Starfield. Apart from the 3 office workers on Mars who go to happy hour at the bar then immediately back to the office, proving that the game can still do it and Beth chose not to.
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Mar 10, 2024 01:57
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Flowing Thot posted:Yeah people don't have schedules in Starfield. I think some of the shop merchants do, it's just that their schedule is "stand here", "sit in this chair", "sweep over there", etc. No running into them in the bar after hours because there is no after hours.
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Mar 10, 2024 04:59
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Old Doggy Bastard posted:I fondly remember following people through their lives and breaking into their homes. Starfield had... basically none of that, right? isndl posted:I think some of the shop merchants do, it's just that their schedule is "stand here", "sit in this chair", "sweep over there", etc. No running into them in the bar after hours because there is no after hours. Nope. Shopkeeps stand motionless in a lot of places. You don't even need to use the bucket trick. I just looted the backroom of the gun store in the basement of the Alpha Centauri city because the shoppie just didn't follow me and doesn't even move occasionally. I used stealth to get everything behind his back and also stuff in front of him if I had a counter or something to be behind. That used to be their main gimmick... Morrowind worked kinda like this but even then they'd follow you into backrooms and stuff.
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Mar 10, 2024 06:27
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skooma512 posted:Nope. Shopkeeps stand motionless in a lot of places. You don't even need to use the bucket trick. I just looted the backroom of the gun store in the basement of the Alpha Centauri city because the shoppie just didn't follow me and doesn't even move occasionally. I used stealth to get everything behind his back and also stuff in front of him if I had a counter or something to be behind. I said some, not all. The mercantile lady next to the spaceport moves around a tiny bit, and the gun store guy sometimes sits in his chair and sometimes doesn't. Madame Sauvage has a trigger to watch you in the Stryker hideout which is baffling. The Stroud-Eklund shipyard guy moves around and sometimes gets stuck in a corner behind a potted plant.
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Mar 10, 2024 06:49
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I would bet a not insignificant amount of money on the idea that they set up the Universal/local time stuff for "space realism" and realized later that having schedules based on local time would mean people potentially have incredibly short or excessively long 24 "hour" cycles, or would have cycles based on universal time that'd be completely out of sync with the local day/night cycle, and said "gently caress it, nobody sleeps" I know there's some "exploit" you can do with making crops grow/resources gather at hyperspeeds by waiting but I don't remember the details since I never bothered with it-- it's either they're tied to universal so planets that take weeks per rotation you can wait for "an hour" on, or they're tied to local and you can wait an hour in space while the planet spins 20 times, and I cba to boot the game up to check, but either way seems like it'd be prime potential fuckery for NPC scheduling and routing
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Mar 10, 2024 10:45
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Yeah, resource production is tied to universal time and waiting is based on local time, so making an outpost on a planet with a high time ratio lets you grind resources really fast. Bessel-3b became famous as an experience farming spot for that reason.
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Mar 10, 2024 10:57
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Yep, I ground out thousands of xp on that planet, you set up resource extractors and sleep for literally one hour and they fill up entirely. The only NPCs I really noticed moving significantly were the ones that teleported miles outside New Atlantis, way beyond the invisible boundary. This happened with: - the kid from the Tree Falls in New Atlantis quest - the shopkeeper in that luxury store - the spaceport technician - the journalist guy from the end of the Ryujin quest And at least one other I’ve forgotten. It was pretty great!
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Mar 10, 2024 11:37
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Talkie Toaster posted:proving that the game can still do it and Beth chose not to. Like the Razorleaf showing that they can have faction armor type stuff but not being added to put it in past that one implementation. Which really ends up standing out on the Key, when pirates will say they want to kill the mantis, as you walk by dressed as the mantis while going to the only recognizable ship of the game.
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Mar 11, 2024 01:50
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I figured NPC schedules are something they save for the end of production once maps are stable so they just cut it
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Mar 11, 2024 15:35
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OddObserver posted:My theory on Towers of Hanoi is that's what happens when the designer team delegates putting in a puzzle to the programmers (since it's a common recursion exercise, and is much better at that than being a puzzle). If I ever make a game I'm going to put one hanoi puzzle in just because it's funny.
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Mar 11, 2024 18:37
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I will simply be mildly hanoi'd
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Mar 11, 2024 18:41
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Ugly In The Morning posted:Which really ends up standing out on the Key, when pirates will say they want to kill the mantis, as you walk by dressed as the mantis while going to the only recognizable ship of the game. I did kinda respect the log entry bit about how even if you spaceship of theseus her into something else entirely, she's still the mantis' ship
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Mar 11, 2024 19:03
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So I stumbled across this possible weird, repeatable bug/exploit. If you get the random encounter where a Spacer jumps in and hails you demanding money or they'll attack and Spacer ships jump shortly after to help them, target lock the first ship and do not Accept or Ignore the hail. Just kill them as fast as possible and the other Spacer ships won't flip hostile on you. You'll have 3-4 ships just sitting there. If you attack one only it turns hostile, the other ones just sit there idle. Potentially useful if you want to steal a particular ship, I guess.
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Mar 12, 2024 08:37
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isndl posted:I said some, not all. The mercantile lady next to the spaceport moves around a tiny bit, and the gun store guy sometimes sits in his chair and sometimes doesn't. Madame Sauvage has a trigger to watch you in the Stryker hideout which is baffling. The Stroud-Eklund shipyard guy moves around and sometimes gets stuck in a corner behind a potted plant. There's some stuff on the way to the hideout at Madame Sauvage's place that's stealable. She triggers Neon Security if she catches you stealing which seems kind of weird. A better game would have her trigger the gang to clean up for her. On Mars, the staff of the administrative office that's on the top level will go to the bar "after" their work day ends and then return later. It allows you to go in and snoop around for a quest. Other than that, I can't think of anyone who moves around in their outpost/city all that much. A few characters (like the Hunter) will jump between bars and named recruitable characters who you meet on missions but don't immediately recruit will setup shop in bars on different settled worlds.
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Mar 12, 2024 15:24
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Q_res posted:So I stumbled across this possible weird, repeatable bug/exploit. I got jumped, but simply ignored the call to fly behind them, locked, and then engaged them all at similarly low risk. Not the zero risk you had, though.
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Mar 12, 2024 18:05
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Mamma mia, a pretty massive list of bug fixes. https://bethesda.net/en/game/starfield/article/FkSH4RJ9HwfNU1M72Tl23/starfield-update-1-10-30-march-6-2024-beta
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Mar 20, 2024 13:34
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quote:Fixed the gap that allows players to access Spacesuits without picking locks of one of the Spacesuit display cases. 
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Mar 20, 2024 14:22
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quote:Fixed a rare issue where New Atlantis would appear to follow the player ship. hah
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Mar 20, 2024 14:25
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I rushed master lock picking and got that suits tens of hours before the game was over and ended up disappointed I basically never replaced it, it ended up being a major element of the loot treadmill I wasn't engaging in. Maybe my fault since I consciously rushed master lock picking to make sure I didn't miss out on something interesting in a dungeon or quest. Looks like lots of level geometry fixes.
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Mar 20, 2024 14:33
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Jack B Nimble posted:I rushed master lock picking and got that suits tens of hours before the game was over and ended up disappointed I basically never replaced it, it ended up being a major element of the loot treadmill I wasn't engaging in. Ehh... the armor loot treadmill isn't very compelling. The resistances are immaterial and I doubt many people have multiple suits for different situations, so it's mainly just looking for higher tier versions of whatever one you think looks the best.
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Mar 20, 2024 14:48
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I remember getting a suit that made guns weigh half and I never saw one like that again They were really greedy with the good talents
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Mar 20, 2024 14:53
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How was fixing that gap even on the to-do list? Was it really that terrifying that their offline single players could choose to get that suit through a tiny game flaw? Do they imagine that those players would actually have loved the game and left glowing reviews had they not been able to access early loot they were not supposed to?
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Mar 20, 2024 15:16
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FishMcCool posted:How was fixing that gap even on the to-do list? Was it really that terrifying that their offline single players could choose to get that suit through a tiny game flaw? Do they imagine that those players would actually have loved the game and left glowing reviews had they not been able to access early loot they were not supposed to? Have they managed to fix putting a bucket over the shopkeep's head? edit: and yeah, they seriously consider stealing from the shops to be an exploit they have to fix. THey also fixed the shopkeeper inventory chests that you could glitch to through the ground.
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Mar 20, 2024 15:21
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Oh I actually saw that one! Cool that they fixed it. It was very spooky to jump to somewhere and see the entire city floating out in space
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Mar 20, 2024 16:35
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Wonder if there a mod yet that makes it so I never need a spacesuit. Really would prefer to not ever wear one.
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Mar 20, 2024 16:56
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FishMcCool posted:How was fixing that gap even on the to-do list? Was it really that terrifying that their offline single players could choose to get that suit through a tiny game flaw? Do they imagine that those players would actually have loved the game and left glowing reviews had they not been able to access early loot they were not supposed to? They flat out don't think the major issues like the boring plot, bad AI, repetitive POIs that people have with the game are problems at all.
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Mar 20, 2024 16:58
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Octopus Magic posted:They flat out don't think the major issues like the boring plot, bad AI, repetitive POIs that people have with the game are problems at all. Just finished Cyberpunk Phantom Liberty they added a lot more Keanu dialog and it was great. I can't see Starfield bringing back voice actors to improve major story arcs. It's just another of those things that make this game unfixable. There was a part in Phantom Liberty in a 50 year old bunker and all the computers and their interfaces were unique from the rest of the game. All I could think about was the Colony Ship being decorated with the exact same Eggmund type stuff. Starfield is intruding into my other games!
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Mar 20, 2024 17:13
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https://www.pcgamer.com/games/rpg/s...ng-final-quest/ They built the final fight last minute, which is why it takes place in a cave and then in leaps through arenas made of notable areas from throughout the game The quest team was also booked solid and over worked. Also says that the dev team was TOO big; no collaboration, not sure how to combine things, etc.
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Mar 20, 2024 17:21
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Octopus Magic posted:They flat out don't think the major issues like the boring plot, bad AI, repetitive POIs that people have with the game are problems at all. I wouldn't go that far, I'm sure there's plenty of people involved with this game that are fully aware of the issues with it, the problem is "how exactly do you fix that"-- fixing some cabinet geometry is an easy task you can check off a list and say "I fixed a bug" to your manager and your managers manager to prove you're not just faffing around, fundamentally overhauling the game into something good is something they didn't manage after 10 years of development or however long it's been
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Mar 20, 2024 17:34
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Ursine Catastrophe posted:I wouldn't go that far, I'm sure there's plenty of people involved with this game that are fully aware of the issues with it, the problem is "how exactly do you fix that"-- fixing some cabinet geometry is an easy task you can check off a list and say "I fixed a bug" to your manager and your managers manager to prove you're not just faffing around, fundamentally overhauling the game into something good is something they didn't manage after 10 years of development or however long it's been The big issue is that - despite all the horrific problems it had at launch - at the core of Cyberpunk there is a good game with good characters who are part of an interesting story that takes place in a fully realized and fleshed out world that is itself interesting. Need to completely gut the wanted system and rebuilt it? Need to overhaul the shooting? Decide you want to put player-flyable helicopters in for whatever reason? Whatever, if it's within the technical limitations of the engine go nuts, because the core of the game is still solid. gently caress, you could totally re-build the game in a different engine (think a remaster 20 years from now) and it would still be fundamentally the same game because the location and story are interesting. With Starfield the core of the game is bland, uninteresting, and just bad. No amount of overhauling the mechanics or or fixing the dead eyed "bethesda stare" during conversations or rebuilding space travel is going to fix the fundamental problem that Constellation is boring, the world is comprised of ill-fitted parts that clash with each other, and the writing ranges from mediocre to offensively bad. You could magic the whole game into some theoretical perfect engine with no bugs and infinite capabilities and it would still suck because the core of the game is vapid and hollow. There's just no fixing that. The way to fix it would be to somehow go back in time and develop a totally different game with better writing, a more interesting story, and more coherent world building.
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Mar 20, 2024 17:41
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