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Nessus posted:at the risk of tripleposting, I just got through the big parade scene in Malleus, and I am curious, when did Abnett write this? It has a very 9/11 sort of air. Google does not seem to have anything to offer on the subject, unfortunately.
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Mar 8, 2024 20:12
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MMAgCh posted:Malleus came out in December 2001. I have no idea what BL's printing/publishing process was like at the time, but it is not entirely inconceivable that Abnett could have been in a position to take the events of September 2001 into account (or at least rewrite an extant part of the text to give it a more 9/11-y flavour).
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Mar 8, 2024 20:33
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Broke: Tom Clancy foreshadowed 9/11 Woke: Dan Abnett foreshadowed 9/11
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Mar 8, 2024 20:43
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Kylaer posted:Broke: Tom Clancy foreshadowed 9/11 Bespoke: Deus Ex foreshadowed 9/11
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Mar 8, 2024 20:55
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The real Dan Abnett 9/11 homage is in Know No Fear though.
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Mar 8, 2024 21:10
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dan abnett did 9/11
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Mar 8, 2024 22:49
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it was guerilla marketing for his book. and do you know what? It worked.
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Mar 8, 2024 22:49
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PROMETHIUM CAN'T MELT PLASTEEL BEAMS! THE HIGH LORDS KNEW!
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Mar 8, 2024 22:58
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I brought the wrong audible and got warboss instead of da big dakka Still rulez
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Mar 8, 2024 23:58
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Reading Warboss before Big Dakka is actually a really good idea, you'll see what I mean at the end
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Mar 9, 2024 00:12
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On the ork train with Brutal Kunnin, was this really the first novel that was from an ork perspective? It seems like such a long time to wait for that.
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Mar 9, 2024 01:17
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I think there were a handful that had some pork POV chapters maybe but yes it was the first ork focused novel. Honestly orks make great villains but as main/POV characters you really need just the right author because they are not easy to write in a way that isn't dumb AF. I'm not even sure it's a pure skill thing either like I'm not confident Abnett or ADB could write a good ork POV novel it takes a specific type of person or personality to make it good. Mike Brooks is perfect for it.
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Mar 9, 2024 03:23
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D-Pad posted:Mike Brooks is perfect for it. I've seen an interview with him, he was born to write these books. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVuM8SBsIpk
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Mar 9, 2024 04:46
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Sharkopath posted:On the ork train with Brutal Kunnin, was this really the first novel that was from an ork perspective? It seems like such a long time to wait for that. Yeah, we've had very little from the Ork side as long as I can remember. Deff Skwadron was the first thing I can remember and that was a comic that came out decades ago but very little in between.
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Mar 9, 2024 05:09
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:it was guerilla marketing for his book. and do you know what? It worked.
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Mar 9, 2024 08:28
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D-Pad posted:I think there were a handful that had some pork POV chapters maybe but yes it was the first ork focused novel. Honestly orks make great villains but as main/POV characters you really need just the right author because they are not easy to write in a way that isn't dumb AF. I'm not even sure it's a pure skill thing either like I'm not confident Abnett or ADB could write a good ork POV novel it takes a specific type of person or personality to make it good. Mike Brooks is perfect for it. Mixing the goofy ork comedy with the serious grimdarkness of the setting can be very tricky to do well. What's really great about Da Big Dakk is we get shown how ridiculous the ork mindset and other shenanigans are, and then we seem them through Drukhari's eyes and realize how terrifying they are for other species. The contrast is great.
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Mar 9, 2024 13:46
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Xenos play a large part in the Vaults of Terra series and it was really interesting POV
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Mar 9, 2024 15:31
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Reading Da Big Dakka and Brooks done good. The Ork stuff is excellent, but I'm enjoying his examination of Drukhari culture. Being incapable of sorting possible treachery from possible romantic interest seems very on brand.
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Mar 9, 2024 18:36
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habeasdorkus posted:Reading Da Big Dakka and Brooks done good. The Ork stuff is excellent, but I'm enjoying his examination of Drukhari culture. Being incapable of sorting possible treachery from possible romantic interest seems very on brand. The old Fear The Alien anthology had an excellent short called Mistress Baeda's Gift about a deldar archon falling in love. I think the author may have been from the black library open submission thingy for that year. quote:As he passed an ornate mirror, Malwrack paused briefly to assess himself. His haemonculus surgeons had really outdone themselves, he thought. You could see the staples in the back of his skull that pulled his flaccid face tight. A half a dozen of his warriors had been scalped, and now his limp, greasy hair was replaced by a magnificent raven mane. A mixture of drugs and concoctions ran through his injection harness, toning his muscles and giving his eyes a healthy green glow. He curled his lips back, admiring his new stainless-steel teeth. He had dressed in his finest suit of combat armour, replete with a golden tabard, flowing purple cape and the largest shoulder pads that money could buy. This poor woman, he thought to himself, doesn’t stand a chance.
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Mar 9, 2024 19:17
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Improbable Lobster posted:The old Fear The Alien anthology had an excellent short called Mistress Baeda's Gift about a deldar archon falling in love. I think the author may have been from the black library open submission thingy for that year. That's a really great story. No ebook option unfortunately.
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Mar 9, 2024 22:32
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Hey thanks to everybody who recommended Luthor, especially Angry Lobster, because I loved it. It's written cinematically, filled in some gaps from the Siege, and is prominently Luthor's short-story anecdotes from Caliban (between beatings.) Definitely more accessable and entertaining than the the DA Heresy books.
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Mar 9, 2024 22:40
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The surprising thing for me was that the Son of the Forest came out... then nothing. No other Dark Angel forcused books other than the source book appears until Cypher, and a year after the return of the Lion, we still haven't seen the meeting between Robute and Lion.
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Mar 9, 2024 22:55
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Calax posted:The surprising thing for me was that the Son of the Forest came out... then nothing. No other Dark Angel forcused books other than the source book appears until Cypher, and a year after the return of the Lion, we still haven't seen the meeting between Robute and Lion. The Lazarus DA book just released yesterday. I am however a couple of chapters in and it doesnt seem that they are aware of the lions return in it at least so far which probably means it takes place prior.
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Mar 9, 2024 23:09
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Read in a goonhammer interview that Nate Crowley is a huge ork fan and was not much of a necron fan before writing Twice Dead. Gonna check out prophet of the waagh after Brutal Kunnin then. Kunnin is cool. I'm surprised how invested in both sides I am, I thought the mechanicus would detract from the ork perspective but it's almost like a tragedy where I'm rooting for both sides even if the conclusion seems foregone.
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Mar 10, 2024 00:59
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Calax posted:The surprising thing for me was that the Son of the Forest came out... then nothing. No other Dark Angel forcused books other than the source book appears until Cypher, and a year after the return of the Lion, we still haven't seen the meeting between Robute and Lion. I bet that's a bit of a ways off in a future Dawn of Fire book. DoF is so far behind the story of the codexes and such, it's kinda hilarious.
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Mar 10, 2024 03:32
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Sharkopath posted:Read in a goonhammer interview that Nate Crowley is a huge ork fan and was not much of a necron fan before writing Twice Dead. Gonna check out prophet of the waagh after Brutal Kunnin then. I’ve always thought the best genre fiction comes from authors that don’t particularly like a topic because they don’t hold certain things sacrosanct. IMO it’s how Obsidian made KOTOR 2 out of a rubbish IP.
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Mar 10, 2024 08:11
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moths posted:Hey thanks to everybody who recommended Luthor, especially Angry Lobster, because I loved it. Glad you liked it. Also agreed about the last point, this one is way better than all the DA Heresy books (shame on you, Thorpe) D-Pad posted:The Lazarus DA book just released yesterday. I am however a couple of chapters in and it doesnt seem that they are aware of the lions return in it at least so far which probably means it takes place prior. I think there's some plot advancement in the new DA codex. I think (hope?) we'll see some new novels soon to fill the gaps soon.
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Mar 10, 2024 12:13
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Spoilers for the end of the Lazarus/new DA book w/r/t The Lion but not the actual book plot - Lazarus gets an astropathic message summoning all DAs back to The Rock, saying their father is waiting for them
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Mar 10, 2024 15:50
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Can't wait for a sequel to show up when 40k 12th edition is out and the plot has crawled its way past that. 
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Mar 10, 2024 20:33
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Sharkopath posted:Read in a goonhammer interview that Nate Crowley is a huge ork fan and was not much of a necron fan before writing Twice Dead. Gonna check out prophet of the waagh after Brutal Kunnin then. Prophet is a more serious and IMO generally better book than the Brooks stories. Brooks' Ork books are a ton of fun, and they have some great moments like the conversation with the Archon, but they're extremely one-sided stomps where the protagonists (except for grots) are never seriously challenged because their enemies keep shooting themselves in the foot, and every single fight ends with the orks winning or mildly inconvenienced at worst. I think they may become the next Cain series, in that they're a great palate cleanser between classically grimdark books but you wouldn't want to read them all at once By contrast, Prophet is a more complete story where the hero actually has to face challenges and grow, in an orkish way.
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Mar 10, 2024 23:41
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Calax posted:The surprising thing for me was that the Son of the Forest came out... then nothing. No other Dark Angel forcused books other than the source book appears until Cypher, and a year after the return of the Lion, we still haven't seen the meeting between Robute and Lion. I'm glad that Dark angles fans are eating, i gurss, but that book was such a stretch of nothing for me. And following it would either be just more of the same "Yeah, push back chaos!" that Guilliman is already doing, or a big culture/history clash with the new Imperium, plus returning to Caliban and getting further into the Unforgiven deal (erasing one of the main themes of the faction and possibly kicking the status quo apart), which I feel no one wants to do right now. So yeah, I'm not surprised it was not followed up on. That said, the Huron book was even -more- of a pile of nothing. Woo, steal Roboute's flagship, take it for a spin, don't do anything really and lose it, Huron tricks an upstart, thank you come again.
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Mar 10, 2024 23:53
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NihilCredo posted:Prophet is a more serious and IMO generally better book than the Brooks stories. I enjoyed brutal Kunnin all the way through, very fun book, some great scenes that had me on the edge of my seat, and I really liked the hero and his mechanicus counterpart. Classic black library ending without a lengthy resolution, if I had to pick a criticism. Just the opening chapter of Prophet blew it out of the water for me. Makaris first (translated) words hit me with the weight of a train and I'm hooked now.
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Mar 11, 2024 00:02
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Sephyr posted:I'm glad that Dark angles fans are eating, i gurss, but that book was such a stretch of nothing for me. And following it would either be just more of the same "Yeah, push back chaos!" that Guilliman is already doing, or a big culture/history clash with the new Imperium, plus returning to Caliban and getting further into the Unforgiven deal (erasing one of the main themes of the faction and possibly kicking the status quo apart), which I feel no one wants to do right now. It was good for being a self contained story. The next logical step for a book about him, is to lead him up to the Arks of Omen fights (including a the fight with Angron). The problem in general with using the big lore characters (in 40k) is you can't really have them mature or have an arc, because they have to be the same person for the game books when they come up with another edition etc. It's why the most interesting parts of the Plague War books was A) The primaris marine dealing with trying to integrate into a new Chapter as well as the fact that he lost 8000 years because of a science experiment and B) the Hints about the Emperor's consciousness awakening to deal with his sons.
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Mar 11, 2024 03:29
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NihilCredo posted:Prophet is a more serious and IMO generally better book than the Brooks stories. its weird to say this but I think a lot of that has to do with Ghaz just being a more serious character than Ufthak, Ufthak is fun but as a character is very much in the "goofy" side of the Ork personality while Ghaz can be portrayed as a legitimately frightening character
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Mar 11, 2024 05:15
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AnEdgelord posted:its weird to say this but I think a lot of that has to do with Ghaz just being a more serious character than Ufthak, Ufthak is fun but as a character is very much in the "goofy" side of the Ork personality while Ghaz can be portrayed as a legitimately frightening character Crowley also I think does a very good job of elevating the material. You can definitely tell in Prophet that he's spent a lot of time thinking about the smaller details of how ork culture is built and organized, so instead of a good book describing a fun proper scrap, Prophet is a retelling of messianic myth with a reverential tone throughout. It still has jokes, just subtler ones, but everything feels super weighty and important. Its real cool, still in part 2 but the experience it reminds me most of was the first time reading infinite and Divine. This and that are probably the two books I'd most recommend to somebody who wanted to start 40k but didn't know nothing.
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Mar 11, 2024 11:35
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AnEdgelord posted:its weird to say this but I think a lot of that has to do with Ghaz just being a more serious character than Ufthak, Ufthak is fun but as a character is very much in the "goofy" side of the Ork personality while Ghaz can be portrayed as a legitimately frightening character Ufthak has the potential to be scary, he just never needs to. Not much of a spoiler but: The high point of the book is Ufthak being captured by dark eldar. The archon he speaks to figures out that you can torture orks by locking them in a cell and denying them a fight - you'd think this would be common knowledge after 10k years, but whatever. This prospect actually makes Ufthak truly angry, he threatens to make the archon suffer for it in a very un-Orkish tone, and when the archon leaves he makes an overture to the nearest prisoner. I figured this was going to be where all of Ufthak's newly-found brainpower paid off and he'd have to prepare and act a longer-term plan, instead nope! The other prisoner is a throwaway joke, another dark eldar overrides the archon and puts Ufthak into a fight in the arena, which suits him just fine. Then he proceeds to beat all the named dark eldar characters fighting him at the same time. Very much a missed opportunity, IMO.
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Mar 11, 2024 12:21
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Finished Prophet, real real real real good. I will instant buy whatever Crowley puts out next.
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Mar 11, 2024 12:52
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NihilCredo posted:Ufthak has the potential to be scary, he just never needs to. Not much of a spoiler but: Yes this was a big wasted opportunity. It was also a nice callback to the book Xenology where an Ork gets locked up in a research lab for a long time and turns into a flabby potbellied loser, wait a second, is my monitor on?
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Mar 11, 2024 13:07
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Sephyr posted:That said, the Huron book was even -more- of a pile of nothing. Woo, steal Roboute's flagship, take it for a spin, don't do anything really and lose it, Huron tricks an upstart, thank you come again. Weirdly, although Brooks is great when writing Alpha Legion (I’ve not read his Ork books as Ork-centric stuff isn’t my vibe), he’s not great when writing Huron. All his Huron short stories/novellas/novels have been super weak and, if I didn’t know he wrote them, would have assumed they were products of the Kyme/Thorpe-tier of BL writers. I think it’s mostly that his vision/version of Huron comes across as quite damp/passive vs the image of him in the lore as a charismatic force of nature, kept alive by sheer will and hate. Tangentially, it makes me wonder if BL know how some of their writers - Nick Kyme and Gav Thorpe in particular for me- are seen by readers and how there seems to be fairly universal groans online when they’re announced as writing a book people would otherwise look forward to. There’s a bit in one of ADB’s afterwords where he talks about Abnett advising him to stay away entirely from online discussion of BL books and I wonder if that’s a view taken more widely across BL authors/editors, leaving them judging authorial quality by sales and other metrics (draft turnaround times, deadline reliability, amount of editing needed etc) rather than critical reception. Those kind of metrics definitely seem to play a big part in author selection at BL - Guy Haley gets lots of books because he’s able to turn around drafts quickly and has a good reputation for hitting deadlines, even if that means his writing quality is very variable. It’s a captive market that’ll buy any slop BL churn out, quality be damned, after all. Kyme is meant to be an amazing editor (cf multiple afterwards across ADB/Abnett/Wraight books) so makes sense they’d let him write some books but what the hell does Gav Thorpe have that makes BL let him churn out crap constantly?!
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Mar 11, 2024 15:52
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kim jong-illin posted:what the hell does Gav Thorpe have that makes BL let him churn out crap constantly?! A cricket bat  And really I think the answer is tenure, he's been writing for them since the 90s IIRC.
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Mar 11, 2024 16:01
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