|
Nobunaga’s time was right before the taiko we see in the beginning of this series
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 01:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 20, 2024 07:50 |
|
|
Peanut Butler posted:so the Taiko- is that supposed to be Nobunaga? Toyotomi Hideyoshi, who was Nobunaga's successor
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 01:46
|
|
|
Nobunaga has been dead for close to 20 years when the series starts, as mentioned already, the Taiko was Hideyoshi and the little kid they're all serving as the regent for is Hideyoshi's son.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 01:52
|
|
|
ah, got it, thanks!
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 02:30
|
|
|
I don't know if his name will come up in the show much but "Goroda" is how they refer to Nobunaga in the book. Because it's Oda with a few extra letters I guess.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 02:33
|
|
|
ohhhh ok I thought the taiko was Goroda, and that those scenes of his death were about 20 years prior to 1600, for some reason the changed names thing is, a choice
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 03:14
|
|
|
Yeah, that deathbed flashback scene was only a year before the events happening in the show.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 06:56
|
|
|
been said a lot, but fuji immediately sticking the gun in the samurai's face while pulling up her sleeve presumably for etiquette reasons ruled loving hard also blackthorne apparently stopped off at world war one before he got to japan, where'd he get those mega cannons? 
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 09:51
|
|
|
Dante posted:Is there a digital edition/kindle edition of this book where parts haven't been cut out for some weird reason by the publisher? For what it's worth, I just went through the Kindle "Read sample" section, which covers the prologue and Chapter 1, which is where the bathing scene is that has the village ladies commenting on how endowed Blackthorne is, and I can't see any changes compared with the copy I bought years ago. So maybe that 1-star review was just wrong.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 10:03
|
|
|
Eau de MacGowan posted:also blackthorne apparently stopped off at world war one before he got to japan, where'd he get those mega cannons? What's mega about them? They aren't doing anything more than what a cannon of that period could do.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 10:22
|
|
|
Eau de MacGowan posted:also blackthorne apparently stopped off at world war one before he got to japan, where'd he get those mega cannons? Great War artillery makes these cannons look like pop guns.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 11:10
|
|
|
Nice Tuckpointing! posted:For what it's worth, I just went through the Kindle "Read sample" section, which covers the prologue and Chapter 1, which is where the bathing scene is that has the village ladies commenting on how endowed Blackthorne is, and I can't see any changes compared with the copy I bought years ago. So maybe that 1-star review was just wrong. Great! Thanks, I'll give that version a try then.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 12:02
|
|
|
For all the Game of Thrones comparisons, Shogun is really much closer to The Wire - it's got the constant narcing from all sides, scheming scoundrels who just aren't quite smart enough to come out on top, the intricate social expectations and suffocating codes of conduct within a system that will ultimately devour us all, the focus on translation and communication, the short and dispassionate bursts of violence, the wealthy criminal shipping syndicate led by devious foreigners, and the lead is a drunk-sounding Englishman who thinks the rules shouldn't apply to him and keeps pissing everyone off. It rocks.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 13:34
|
|
|
grobbo posted:For all the Game of Thrones comparisons, Shogun is really much closer to The Wire Fuji: Where's the baby, Tadayoshi? WHERE THE gently caress IS THE BABY? TADAYOSHI!?! TADAYOSHI! LOOK AT ME! LOOK AT ME! WHERE THE gently caress IS THE BABY, HUH!?! I don't want this kosode wearing motherfucker representing me, so just get the gently caress back down to Osaka!
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 14:08
|
|
|
Peanut Butler posted:the changed names thing is, a choice Well the show/book, while broadly accurate to history, is mostly made up stuff obviously. IIRC Clavell changed the names so he could have them do whatever he wanted them to do for the novel and not be accused of being a historical revisionist or whatever. There's more leeway to say "and then he was over here doing this" because theres no actual historical record that definitively proves that the real person wasn't.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 14:46
|
|
|
grobbo posted:For all the Game of Thrones comparisons, Shogun is really much closer to The Wire - it's got the constant narcing from all sides, scheming scoundrels who just aren't quite smart enough to come out on top, the intricate social expectations and suffocating codes of conduct within a system that will ultimately devour us all, the focus on translation and communication, the short and dispassionate bursts of violence, the wealthy criminal shipping syndicate led by devious foreigners, and the lead is a drunk-sounding Englishman who thinks the rules shouldn't apply to him and keeps pissing everyone off. It rocks. Not having seen The Wire, I've basically been comparing everything against Rome. Sounds like the Wire is the next show I'm binging.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 15:34
|
|
|
The perfect comparison in Chernobyl was already made, no need to keep exploring comps
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 15:44
|
|
|
Jamwad Hilder posted:Well the show/book, while broadly accurate to history, is mostly made up stuff obviously. IIRC Clavell changed the names so he could have them do whatever he wanted them to do for the novel and not be accused of being a historical revisionist or whatever. There's more leeway to say "and then he was over here doing this" because theres no actual historical record that definitively proves that the real person wasn't. The weird thing is, many of the changes in the show are done to make it more historically accurate. Like, Blackthorne bringing the cannons actually does have a historical basis Ieyasu Tokugawa did indeed have the european cannons brought out during the battle of Sekigahara. Panzeh fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Mar 16, 2024 |
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 15:48
|
|
|
kiimo posted:The perfect comparison in Chernobyl was already made, no need to keep exploring comps Watching the Wire if you’ve never seen it is not a bad idea either way, especially if you’re waiting for more Shogun.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 15:54
|
|
|
Jamwad Hilder posted:Well the show/book, while broadly accurate to history, is mostly made up stuff obviously. IIRC Clavell changed the names so he could have them do whatever he wanted them to do for the novel and not be accused of being a historical revisionist or whatever. There's more leeway to say "and then he was over here doing this" because theres no actual historical record that definitively proves that the real person wasn't. The Japanese trailer just straight-up says: Toranaga, inspired by Tokugawa Ieyasu; Mariko, inspired by Hosokawa Gracia; etc, etc. It's a nice touch because I guess it's like a Japanese-US production about the American Revolution based off a Japanese manga with the main character named Grant Waterson, inspired by George Washington. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dr1vH-7robk (warning, there are shots in there from beyond episode 4) On a different note about the names, in one of the promotional interviews, Hiroyuki Sanada mentions that in translation, Toranaga is 虎長, "tiger" and "long", but they changed it to 虎永, "Tiger forever". The official podcast mentions that they changed other names, because Clavell didn't run this poo poo by a feudal Japan expert (they were more polite in how they said that). So Fujiko became Fuji, Kasigi Yabu became Kashigi Yabushige, and the village name was changed from Anjiro to Ajiro. Nice Tuckpointing! fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Mar 16, 2024 |
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:00
|
|
|
skooma512 posted:Watching the Wire if you’ve never seen it is not a bad idea either way, especially if you’re waiting for more Shogun. Yeah seriously You could do a lot worse than the greatest tv show of all time! OP's comparison is pretty apposite, I think
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:04
|
|
|
LMFAO at posting in a prestige TV thread but somehow not having watched The Wire.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:08
|
|
|
withak posted:LMFAO at posting in a prestige TV thread but somehow not having watched The Wire. C'mon bud no need to be exclusionary about it Everyone's got a Something Canonical they've not got round to yet
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:24
|
|
|
withak posted:LMFAO at posting in a prestige TV thread but somehow not having watched The Wire. Strong Dwight Schrute energy
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:37
|
|
|
LMFAO if you haven't read the original Wire books.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:41
|
|
|
Paracausal posted:Great War artillery makes these cannons look like pop guns. They're not even that impressive compared to what was contemporary canons. The Dardanelles Gun for example weighed 16 tonnes and was capable of bringing down the walls of Constantinople.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 16:48
|
|
|
The fun thing is, if they wanted to do a sequel, the actual story of William Adams is pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 20:34
|
|
|
Nice Tuckpointing! posted:The official podcast mentions that they changed other names, because Clavell didn't run this poo poo by a feudal Japan expert (they were more polite in how they said that). So Fujiko became Fuji, Kasigi Yabu became Kashigi Yabushige, and the village name was changed from Anjiro to Ajiro. I'd been wondering about those name changes... thought I was losing my mind at first, then thought, 'oh they're changing her name to Fuji to be like the mountain or some bullshit'. That's amazing that they're actually, I dunno, fixing things.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2024 21:33
|
|
|
A Sneaker Broker posted:Does Shogun take place before or after the Mongolian invasions? Mongol invasions: midgame crusader kings Shogun: midgame Europa universalis *taps head*
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2024 02:56
|
|
|
https://collider.com/shogun-hiroyuki-sanada/ Hiroyuki Sanada does all his own stunts and fighting.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2024 04:13
|
|
|
binged this over the weekend and it's maybe the best show i've seen in the past year. really makes me want a similar treatment for the boshin war.
|
|
#
?
Mar 18, 2024 00:41
|
|
|
Yeah this show is so amazingly good. I can't find a single fault in it other than I have to stare at the screen to read all the subtitles.
|
|
#
?
Mar 18, 2024 01:22
|
|
|
Peanut Butler posted:so the Taiko- is that supposed to be Nobunaga? toyotomi hideyoshi. You may remember him from such episodes as "I will conquer all of asia."
|
|
#
?
Mar 18, 2024 04:01
|
|
|
That scene in ep. 2 in which Ishido banters with Yabu about pulling him out of a pile of bodies is a reference to the time the Taiko tried to conquer Korea. All the daimyos were there genociding their way across the peninsula, except for Toranaga.
|
|
#
?
Mar 18, 2024 04:35
|
|
|
Doltos posted:Yeah this show is so amazingly good. I can't find a single fault in it other than I have to stare at the screen to read all the subtitles. In our giant meeting at Universal today everyone was raving about this show and also mentioning that you can't look at your phone while watching it so there's a level of paying attention that enhances it. I can't remember the last show I WATCHED watched.
|
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 00:58
|
|
|
Great, studio heads are going to take the wrong lesson again and put subtitles in everything.
|
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 03:29
|
|
|
Mariko: You appear to be in good spirits today. Blackthorne: I got my poo poo sucked crazy style!!!
|
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 04:03
|
|
|
kiimo posted:In our giant meeting at Universal today everyone was raving about this show and also mentioning that you can't look at your phone while watching it so there's a level of paying attention that enhances it. Macdeo Lurjtux posted:Great, studio heads are going to take the wrong lesson again and put subtitles in everything. Off-the-cuff thought: I think some of the secret sauce to Shogun is that the book, which the show is doing a good job adhering to, was written before Save The Cat-style rules to audience engagement became the be-all, end-all way of crafting a plot. Audiences have had about two decades of being able to see where a show is going, which is either wasted-potential mystery box poo poo, or super-predictable hero's journey stuff. That and the world-building is really, really good. Edit; made my words match my thoughts better. Nice Tuckpointing! fucked around with this message at 04:57 on Mar 19, 2024 |
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 04:34
|
|
|
New episode owns so far. Goddamn I love this series. The dinner scene is great
|
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 05:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 20, 2024 07:50 |
|
|
Jozen at the end of ep4: 
|
|
#
?
Mar 19, 2024 06:00
|
|
