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Show is good, and The Wire is too
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Mar 19, 2024 06:06
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The story ripple effects of the dead pheasant was nuts.
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Mar 19, 2024 06:11
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I found myself asking if that was supposed to be a tsunami, as though I haven’t watched hundreds of hours of the 2011 Sendai tsunami that looked shot for shot practically identical. It’s kind of amazing to be five episodes in and not one of them has faltered in any meaningful or disappointingly way. I continue to be impressed.
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Mar 19, 2024 06:52
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BrotherJayne posted:Show is good, and The Wire is too Why you guys playing Go with a Shogi board
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Mar 19, 2024 07:21
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I really hope that this show isn't dumb enough to have the anjin's consort and the translator's husband bang, because it hinted at the possibility of that in a way that these forced dramas tend to like to do. It's a shame that Anna Sawai had this sort of role almost immediately after Monarch: Legacy of Monsters. It's almost like trying to take David Schwimmer seriously as a captain of easy company, or having Rowan Atkinson star in a mid-century french detective drama.
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Mar 19, 2024 07:26
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Jehde posted:I really hope that this show isn't dumb enough to have the anjin's consort and the translator's husband bang, because it hinted at the possibility of that in a way that these forced dramas tend to like to do. Meanwhile for people who didn't watch Monarch, she's loving killing it and probably has a great career ahead of her thanks to this show.
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Mar 19, 2024 07:28
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Every time they cut to Ishido, for a split second I think it’s Ken Watanabe
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Mar 19, 2024 07:36
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Jehde posted:I really hope that this show isn't dumb enough to have the anjin's consort and the translator's husband bang, because it hinted at the possibility of that in a way that these forced dramas tend to like to do. Isn't he her uncle?
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Mar 19, 2024 07:38
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Dikkfor posted:Isn't he her uncle? I think you're right, I forgot about that part. Or maybe it doesn't matter?  And yes Anna Sawai is doing great, I just can't help but see her as that super american role she played in Monarch, and she is playing a role that is very much not that here. Jehde fucked around with this message at 07:51 on Mar 19, 2024 |
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Mar 19, 2024 07:44
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Jehde posted:I really hope that this show isn't dumb enough to have the anjin's consort and the translator's husband bang, because it hinted at the possibility of that in a way that these forced dramas tend to like to do. two weird paragraphs
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Mar 19, 2024 08:18
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I love the way they bookend these episodes. Ishido: gently caress, who am I going to replace Toranaga with? Ochiba: Hi, it's me, I'm the captain now, bitch.
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Mar 19, 2024 08:57
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Jehde posted:I think you're right, I forgot about that part. Or maybe it doesn't matter? Stop it
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Mar 19, 2024 09:32
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I do love scenes of people being tired of Anjin's nonsense.
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Mar 19, 2024 10:42
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XYZAB posted:I found myself asking if that was supposed to be a tsunami, as though I haven’t watched hundreds of hours of the 2011 Sendai tsunami that looked shot for shot practically identical. Landslides put the awe in awesome.
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Mar 19, 2024 11:05
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It's been over a decade since I read the book, but I am still a filthy book-read snob and holy poo poo they nailed it. I can't imagine a better portrayal of the pheasant, the earthquake, and most of all the drinking scene . If anything, they improved upon already stellar scenes.
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Mar 19, 2024 12:29
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Yawn, another week, another fantastic episode, the showrunners refuse to change it up! loving amazing all the way through, and I loved the way they made minor alterations to the gardener/pheasant story to tie things in a bit more with the wider story beyond just another "Blackthorne doesn't understand what he's doing" story. It's hard to separate out any one particular moment since everything was so good, but I loved the sequence of Toranaga dressing down his dipshit son and pointing out Omi had played him, then praising Omi to Yabu to put the cat among the pigeons there and occupy the two of them with trying to play each other (Omi's smarter, Yabu has the power advantage) while also probably making Omi feel valued by Toranaga. Meanwhile, Toranaga's son is both furious at his dad but also himself, is probably now paranoid about Omi (and Yabu, but he probably already was) and even more driven to try and prove himself. The whole bit with Toranaga explaining that any man can be broken, you just have to figure out the right way to do it, in action. 
Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 12:51 on Mar 19, 2024 |
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Mar 19, 2024 12:47
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Subtitle talk. Twice, people talk of Blackthorne bringing "tatarigami" into the house, which loosely translates to cursed demons or evil spirits; bad juju. (And a quick google search after I wrote that tells me some anime talks about tatarigami, so maybe some people know the word. Whatevs)
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Mar 19, 2024 13:12
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Panzeh posted:I do love scenes of people being tired of Anjin's nonsense. In particular, I loved the scene where Toranaga is listening to Anjin and Mariko ineptly hide their lover's quarrel and he stands up and says "I cannot spend any more time on this nonsense" What an amazing character moment. He's annoyed and resigned, but not angry. He knows he doesn't have the time or energy to teach Anjin how to be Japanese, and that their cultures are too different to make conversation on the topic constructive. He's got his entire life and legacy to deal with, he can't be bothered to make this rube understand that a gardener's death is nothing to him- he [Toranaga] is juggling the fates of his life, his, clan and his entire society. He has zero capacity to take on more. Stellar acting by everyone involved. I don't know who the gently caress Cosmo Jarvis is (lol fuckin Star Wars rear end name) but he's owning this role.
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Mar 19, 2024 15:46
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The only thing that’s making me scratch my head is wondering if the gardener killing himself over a pheasant is historically consistent with how willing Japanese peasants were to kill themselves over something or if it’s orientalist exotic bs Like, a samurai killing himself after insulting a noble at court I can buy, but a gardener killing himself for disobeying orders over a dead bird? But who knows, I’m not an expert on 17th century Japanese culture. Am I off base here?
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Mar 19, 2024 16:07
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I got the impression (could be wrong) that there was just enough elements of truth in the story that they could use the peasant as cover. The Gardener appeared to be on friendly terms with the samurai working undercover for Toranaga, there was a remark that the gardener had been sick and that this was in some way a way for him to die achieving something greater (protecting his friend as well as indirectly serving Toranaga) while using the useful pretext of the pheasant corpse as a cover. I think (maybe just want to believe) that the gardener wasn't coaxed or manipulated like Omi did to Nagakado, but was asked to do it and agreed. Importantly we don't get to see anything, we just learn about the death after the fact, so there's a lot of space for interpretation.
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Mar 19, 2024 16:15
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I feel like any society where everyone kills themselves over slight things like that would have population stability issues. Reminds me of Game of Thrones where they mention every Dothraki wedding has like 8 murders, at that rate your civilization would disappear after a generation or two.
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Mar 19, 2024 16:16
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Yeah, kinda also like how gladiators being killed every match would be very wasteful. If I'm remembering from the book the gardener volunteered to be the one to take down the rotting pheasant because he was old and sick and figured he would be dead soon anyway. But there is a tad more Orientialist bent to it. The whole miscommunication is linked to how it would be agreat dishonor to even bring up to Hatamoto Blackthorne that the pheasant was bothering the staff and the show smooths this by linking the incident to the bigger story and actually attempting to get Blackthorne's attention.
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Mar 19, 2024 16:38
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that drinking scene makes all the crap I watch waiting for good TV to re-appear worth it
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Mar 19, 2024 16:39
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socialsecurity posted:I feel like any society where everyone kills themselves over slight things like that would have population stability issues. Reminds me of Game of Thrones where they mention every Dothraki wedding has like 8 murders, at that rate your civilization would disappear after a generation or two. It's because it is silly. Did people kill themselves? Sure. Did people get killed for trivial reasons? Yeah, sometimes. They for sure had different ideas than contemporary westerners about honor/death and all that, but the book/show really play up the stereotype that samurai Japan was a bunch of goth kids obsessed with death. It's one of the few things that makes me roll my eyes a little about the show, but it's what's come to be expected about drama/period pieces for this era so we're stuck with it.
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Mar 19, 2024 17:04
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Out of any material in the book that isn't sex weirdo stuff, this is probably what I wish they would have taken the hatchet to the most. They made a few smart snips but it's not the full success I've been conditioned to expect
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Mar 19, 2024 17:11
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Peanut Butler posted:ohhhh ok I thought the taiko was Goroda, and that those scenes of his death were about 20 years prior to 1600, for some reason A lot of the reasons were already mentioned but another is that the show is about the nobility in an island nation during one of the most pivotal periods. Even the characters with 2- 3 lines have a decent notoriety. Mariko's son has a decent sized wikipedia entry, mainly on the back of his patronage of Miyamoto Musashi. Japan has also kept a very good lineage history. Direct descendants of these characters are still prominent in Japanese politics. The Tokugawa family is one of the richest in the country and protectors of one of the three sacred relics. The Emperor's line is the longest unbroken royalty in the world, dating back to the 4th century. You have to change a little bit otherwise you risk defamation claims.
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Mar 19, 2024 17:13
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No Mods No Masters posted:Out of any material in the book that isn't sex weirdo stuff, this is probably what I wish they would have taken the hatchet to the most. They made a few smart snips but it's not the full success I've been conditioned to expect The problem is (spoilers on future events from the book) I think it's needed to set up the attempted seppuku scene by blackthorn and I think it's a bit too good a moment to axe entirely.
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Mar 19, 2024 17:27
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Panzeh posted:The problem is (spoilers on future events from the book) I read that part yesterday and it happens a lot earlier in the book, before the training. Maybe they will add it later though.
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Mar 19, 2024 17:52
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Steve Yun posted:Every time they cut to Ishido, for a split second I think it’s Ken Watanabe I was like that for the first couple of episodes too. Like "holy poo poo, did they get Ken Watanbe for this too and just not tell anyone?" Now that the show's been on for about a month and he appears more regularly, I don't see it any more.
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Mar 19, 2024 18:16
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im not gonna act like I know the guys name but its clearly the male lead from giri / haji which is one of the few good shows on netflix
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Mar 19, 2024 18:25
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What the heck was Blackthorne doing with the pheasant? Hang it up til it rots... and then what, eat it?
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Mar 19, 2024 19:07
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I don't really want to reread the cringiest part of the book for the exact details, but IIRC there he wanted to make some ye olde dish that required the meat to age then forgot about it and the servants were too afraid to tell him. It's a contrived sequence on several levels
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Mar 19, 2024 19:13
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Phenotype posted:What the heck was Blackthorne doing with the pheasant? Hang it up til it rots... and then what, eat it? Yes. https://honest-food.net/on-hanging-pheasants-2/
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Mar 19, 2024 19:16
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Phenotype posted:What the heck was Blackthorne doing with the pheasant? Hang it up til it rots... and then what, eat it? It’s a normal way to prepare pheasant. Kinda gross though.
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Mar 19, 2024 19:16
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Hanging is a Northern European and New England thing because you’d do it when the weather was cold, so it wouldn’t rot. Moisture would evaporate away and concentrate the flavors and give the enzymes in the body time to break down the muscle a little bit. I haven’t read the book so I have no idea if Clavell knew, but Blackthorne might’ve been saved some embarrassment and food poisoning because Japan is way humid and who knows what time of the year it was and whether it was cool enough to do safely. The swarming flies seem to suggest otherwise
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Mar 19, 2024 19:37
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I love how this show takes characters that anywhere else would be just generic one-note side parts and gives them a surprising depth. Buntaro could have just been played as another cruel brute shithead. And he still kinda is that, but he's also more than that. Him backing down from Blackthorne displays a certain degree of principle and self-control (or arguably just plain cunning) that throws an intriguing wrench into things. There's a reason why he's well-regarded by his peers beyond just being good at bows. Also Fuji continues to be great. A great little thing was the way she readied her own weapon when Blackthorne charged into the Toda quarters. She might not like it, but she was still absolutely ready to throw down 
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Mar 19, 2024 19:40
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Toranaga's outfit was spotless after he was pulled up from the landslide 0/10 show sucks. Kidding obviously but it says a lot about the show's quality when little things like that catch my eye and register as noteworthy. Speaking of which, they've really toned down Jarvis' distracting contact lenses in the past two episodes, especially this one. I approve.
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Mar 19, 2024 19:42
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Steve Yun posted:Hanging is a Northern European and New England thing because you’d do it when the weather was cold, so it wouldn’t rot. Moisture would evaporate away and concentrate the flavors and give the enzymes in the body time to break down the muscle a little bit. In the book it's more explicit that he was busy and completely forgot it was there and was left hanging way longer than he intended.
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Mar 19, 2024 19:45
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Also in the book everyone ahistorically acts like it's wildly weird to eat birds in japan, so the servants are kinda just like "maybe he is a goblin who likes eating rotten things IDK"
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Mar 19, 2024 19:49
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Perestroika posted:Also Fuji continues to be great. A great little thing was the way she readied her own weapon when Blackthorne charged into the Toda quarters. She might not like it, but she was still absolutely ready to throw down She really just exudes this air of "Can I just go ONE day with out maybe having to kill someone because of this idiot white man?"
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Mar 19, 2024 19:51
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