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It won't be long before western militaries are a small officer core for decisions, mercenaries for flashy work, and vast penal legions for everything else
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Mar 21, 2024 00:42
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The Oldest Man posted:Solution: you get drafted into flipping burgers for small business owners any time you're not getting sent to die in Yemen I could swear I saw an article tiptoeing around this during the height of the pandemic "labor shortage" from one of the usual ghoulish opinion mills.
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Mar 21, 2024 00:43
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cock hero flux posted:the country started coming apart at the seams the last time they had a draft and odds are it would be even worse if they tried it now That was their hope, if you read the policy books. The problem is, every agrees, mercenaries will only fight in low intensity conflicts. Money is no good to you if you're dead. Well, technology was supposed to make up for this, making even conventional, possibly high intensity, conflicts low risk, so they could go ahead and privatize. Only, Ukraine has undermined that premise, so they're back in the same trap they're always in: their ideology runs counter to the source of the power they want to use to uphold it. Meaning, they want to use the military to enforce an ideology that weakens every aspect of the military, men and materiel. Soapy_Bumslap posted:It won't be long before western militaries are a small officer core for decisions, mercenaries for flashy work, and vast penal legions for everything else This was their hope, correct. Read Armed Drones and the Ethics of War: Military virtue in a post-heroic age and Heroism and the Changing Character of War. The problem is that bugmen aren't actually smarter than all of human history, despite their belief that they are, so there's no One Weird Trick to get around what five thousand years of institutions recognized. Literally since Ur, when organized men first took to the field, the military has been a social organization, it does not function on a market basis. DJJIB-DJDCT has issued a correction as of 00:51 on Mar 21, 2024 |
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Mar 21, 2024 00:49
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"A man does not have himself killed for a half-pence a day or for a petty distinction. You must speak to the soul in order to electrify him." -Leonard Nimoy, Nationalism Tech Quote, Civilization 3
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Mar 21, 2024 00:54
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Owlbear Camus posted:"A man does not have himself killed for a half-pence a day or for a petty distinction. You must speak to the soul in order to electrify him." lol
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Mar 21, 2024 00:55
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heard it with perfect clarity in my head
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Mar 21, 2024 00:55
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youre thinking civ 4 though
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Mar 21, 2024 00:56
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:I don't want to engage with the facility of "neofeudalism" but no, they cannot. The movie Elysium was surprisingly (with the exception of the immediate happy ending) imo realistic look at what would probably happen if the ultra rich retreat to their bunkers/space colony. They just get taken over by the mercenary operator freaks they pay to do all the dirty work that maintaining the divide requires and/or the oppressed finally get lucky because large groups of desperate people with nothing are always going to find some weakness in the defenses. Probably because the movie was a really on the nose allegory for things like private gated communities and borders between the rich and poor countries.
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Mar 21, 2024 00:56
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:
In the Jeff Bezos version of Elysium, all the poor people get exiled to garbage space colonies to toil in the dark forever while the Earth is turned into a nature preserve for rich people to go yachting on
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Mar 21, 2024 01:14
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In the Elon Musk version, everybody on Earth just dies I guess and the whole Elysium/Earth dichotomy is replicated in miniature on a mars base with like 100 people on it where 95 of them live in horrid warrens while Musk and a couple of his slam pieces live in the Paradise Dome
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Mar 21, 2024 01:15
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The Oldest Man posted:Solution: you get drafted into flipping burgers for small business owners any time you're not getting sent to die in Yemen doing my reservist weekend at Goodburger
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Mar 21, 2024 01:34
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Have you considered the IDF model? It's working pretty well.
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Mar 21, 2024 01:41
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Owlbear Camus posted:"A man does not have himself killed for a half-pence a day or for a petty distinction. You must speak to the soul in order to electrify him." I see you and raise you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGCaACqy1Ro
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Mar 21, 2024 01:45
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the algorithm managed to get me to click through to one of the OSINT-adjacent accounts, but it's interesting https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QX68_FZl8UE Ukraine has been using basically drone speedboats to great effect over the past, what, year? This is something that is probably well known in the ukraine thread that I don't really read, but in the context of modern sea warfare it's interesting. The video talks about how a combination of "it being night time" and waves helping to hide the speedboats from radar help the drones get up to Russian ships relatively reliably, which seems like its something that is going to cause a big doctrinal shift over the coming decade or two if countermeasures aren't developed. I can guarantee that if China/Russia/Iran don't have equivalent systems already they're seeing how effective they are, along with drones in general I assume that the US has these drones, that's gotta be where Ukraine is getting them from, but do they have defenses against them? Does anyone have defenses against them? They're oddly reminiscent of the Millenium Challenge where the general used suicide speedboats to great effect. now I just have to clear this guy's video from my history so I don't get anything more from him
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Mar 21, 2024 01:49
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TeenageArchipelago posted:the algorithm managed to get me to click through to one of the OSINT-adjacent accounts, but it's interesting time to bring back a huge line of manned AA guns along the lengths of ships
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Mar 21, 2024 01:53
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Regarde Aduck posted:time to bring back a huge line of manned AA guns along the lengths of ships there is footage of several russians shooting at one with PKMs from the railing of a ship it did not seem very effective
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Mar 21, 2024 02:00
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China built about 100 of these type 022 missile boats in the 00s when they needed something in a hurry in a potential cross-strait conflict. It can go up to 36 knots, I think its a good size to turn into a suicide remote control boat.
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Mar 21, 2024 02:03
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TeenageArchipelago posted:the algorithm managed to get me to click through to one of the OSINT-adjacent accounts, but it's interesting The US and rest of NATO can also fly over the warships with their reconnaissance drones and planes and beam over intelligence in real time well within air defense range too. The Ukrainian drone speedboat strategy is harder to emulate because of some peculiar circumstances that every NATO person is conspicuously ignoring and definitely thinking they can just lazily fly into air defense range and get away with it. Ansarallah is the better model because they have none of the privileges that Ukraine has, and they rely a lot of flying lawnmowers and missiles in comparison.
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Mar 21, 2024 02:38
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i remembered a british test of a nuclear warhead rocket recently that failed and it made me wonder, does the us test its icbms anymore? it'd be very funny if we tried to nuke somebody someday and the rockets just don't work cause stock buy backs are more profitable than making rocket parts
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Mar 21, 2024 04:30
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TeenageArchipelago posted:the algorithm managed to get me to click through to one of the OSINT-adjacent accounts, but it's interesting Didn’t the Houthis do this to Saudi operated US made destroyers to pretty good effect as well?
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Mar 21, 2024 04:38
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Maed posted:i remembered a british test of a nuclear warhead rocket recently that failed and it made me wonder, does the us test its icbms anymore? it'd be very funny if we tried to nuke somebody someday and the rockets just don't work cause stock buy backs are more profitable than making rocket parts you won't be laughing when the minuteman goes up, comes straight back down, blows up, and dominoes all its nearby silo neighbors thus ending all life on earth
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Mar 21, 2024 04:41
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https://news.usni.org/2017/02/20/navy-saudi-frigate-attacked-unmanned-bomb-boat-likely-iranian Ah here we go
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Mar 21, 2024 04:42
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:https://news.usni.org/2017/02/20/navy-saudi-frigate-attacked-unmanned-bomb-boat-likely-iranian Don't need to sink them. Just put a hole in it to render mission ineffective and send back to the drydock for 12 months. Now at a low low low bargain price.
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Mar 21, 2024 04:46
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500excf type r posted:Why is R centerline to centerline when it should just be the wall thickness, which appears to be constant anyways well they're estimating the pressure effect on someone on the opposite side of a wall from an explosion in a room where explosives are stored. so R is the distance between the guy and the explosion and R' is the length of the pathway of the pressure wave. the paper was only about 1-ft thick walls because that was the standard thickness for walls of rooms with explosives at the time.
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Mar 21, 2024 04:47
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The Voice of Labor posted:you won't be laughing when the minuteman goes up, comes straight back down, blows up, and dominoes all its nearby silo neighbors thus ending all life on earth nah that'd be pretty drat funny tbh
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Mar 21, 2024 04:47
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Modern ships needs to start resembling cruisers from the 19th century, covered in lots of assorted guns to deal with combat at any range, from any angle, whether one ship or a swarm. Emphasis on guns because a hundred naval strike missiles is far too expensive to burn casually.
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Mar 21, 2024 04:49
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Maed posted:i remembered a british test of a nuclear warhead rocket recently that failed and it made me wonder, does the us test its icbms anymore? it'd be very funny if we tried to nuke somebody someday and the rockets just don't work cause stock buy backs are more profitable than making rocket parts vandenberg shoots off minutemen from time to time at the pacific target range
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Mar 21, 2024 04:55
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Raskolnikov38 posted:vandenberg shoots off minutemen from time to time at the pacific target range hmm let me read about these on wikipedia... no no oh god no Manufacturer: Boeing nooooooooooooooooooo
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Mar 21, 2024 05:25
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Houthi Cruise Missile Hits Israel in Ominous First https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/houthi-cruise-missile-hits-israel-in-ominous-first/ar-BB1kd38B
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Mar 21, 2024 05:33
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TeenageArchipelago posted:They're oddly reminiscent of the Millenium Challenge where the general used suicide speedboats to great effect. wonder where they got the inspiration... 
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Mar 21, 2024 05:38
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You really have to take into account what perspective plays in European history. For example the Europeans were absolutely terrified of the Ottomans who they considered the worlds supreme military or the best they had par excellence They attack Constantinople https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Constantinople_(1394%E2%80%931402) Crushing the Crusaders who form for the defense https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Nicopolis The city is relieved when Timur threatens Bayezid, defeats his entire military, captures the Ottoman capital, and captures the Sultan alive for the mere act of gaining his attention. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Ankara This initiates the Ottoman interregnum. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Interregnum Ottomans then re gather and instead of doing anything eastward, march immediately on Constantinople. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fall_of_Constantinople HouseofSuren has issued a correction as of 05:45 on Mar 21, 2024 |
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Mar 21, 2024 05:42
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DancingShade posted:Modern ships needs to start resembling cruisers from the 19th century, covered in lots of assorted guns to deal with combat at any range, from any angle, whether one ship or a swarm. Pre-Dreadnkought Battleships with a dozen different caliber weapons ftw
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Mar 21, 2024 06:01
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SMEGMA_MAIL posted:https://news.usni.org/2017/02/20/navy-saudi-frigate-attacked-unmanned-bomb-boat-likely-iranian Yarr.
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Mar 21, 2024 06:10
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Maed posted:i remembered a british test of a nuclear warhead rocket recently that failed and it made me wonder, does the us test its icbms anymore? it'd be very funny if we tried to nuke somebody someday and the rockets just don't work cause stock buy backs are more profitable than making rocket parts Yes, they do test them
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Mar 21, 2024 06:21
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gradenko_2000 posted:Pre-Dreadnkought Battleships with a dozen different caliber weapons ftw Exactly. It'll improve morale too. Nobody wants to boast they're a sailor aboard the frigate SS Pissboat but the fat wide cruiser SS Girthy Stallion? Of course they do. It'll work way better on their caps during shore leave in the bars.
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Mar 21, 2024 07:31
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Maed posted:i remembered a british test of a nuclear warhead rocket recently that failed and it made me wonder, does the us test its icbms anymore? it'd be very funny if we tried to nuke somebody someday and the rockets just don't work cause stock buy backs are more profitable than making rocket parts sure they do https://www.military.com/daily-news/2023/11/02/minuteman-iii-missile-destroyed-after-failed-test-launch-near-california-coast.html quote:The Space Force and Air Force "safely terminated" an unarmed Minuteman III intercontinental ballistic missile over the Pacific Ocean on Wednesday, after a test launch experienced an unknown issue, the military said.
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Mar 21, 2024 08:14
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Owlbear Camus posted:has anyone done any oral histories of the fallout from that? I really kind of doubt it. It was probably the least erotic half hour of my life. What I learned from it is that if you think you are possible about to become explosively owned in a really dumb way that you will probably just be sort of disassociatively melancholic.
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Mar 21, 2024 09:33
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DancingShade posted:Modern ships needs to start resembling cruisers from the 19th century, covered in lots of assorted guns to deal with combat at any range, from any angle, whether one ship or a swarm. Pleeeease can they have a ton of tumblehome too. That was a fantastic look.
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Mar 21, 2024 09:34
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Facehammer posted:Pleeeease can they have a ton of tumblehome too. That was a fantastic look. I don't see why not. They're just floating platforms covered in boom boom. Add on some French hotel uppers as well. Been a while since I was near some fleet planners though. I uh don't think my radical ideas of "don't make them poo poo" fly these days. I mean they could but I don't have convincing voice. DancingShade has issued a correction as of 10:42 on Mar 21, 2024 |
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Mar 21, 2024 10:40
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Facehammer posted:Pleeeease can they have a ton of tumblehome too. That was a fantastic look. the Zumwalt-class destroyers actually are tumblehome designs
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Mar 21, 2024 10:48
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