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Gareth Gobulcoque posted:Marshawn Lloyd is one of the most frustrating prospects I watched this year. 1st round talent who's butter smooth moves are matched only by his butter hands. Makes a lot of bad choices when he thinks his athleticism will let him do things it absolutely won't. Love a 5'8" 220 pounder with a 4.48 40 though. I watched enough Caleb where I'm just gonna blame everything on USCs offensive Line and Lincoln Riley, for why the skill talent underwhelmed.
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Apr 1, 2024 14:18
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Marshawn Lloyd problems are definitely Marshawn Lloyd problems. I don't think he even underwhelmed, he averaged 7.1 yards per carry. While his fumble percentage over his career is very high I think it's mostly mental mistakes rather than any sort of physical security issue. He takes a lot of tackles well behind the line where he could have just stuck his foot in and gone for a short gain instead of taking it outside into the defense for minus 5 yards. But then sometimes he just absolutely takes over drives.
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Apr 1, 2024 14:33
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Doltos posted:Corum sucks and is the kind of back that steals carries from better backs because he's reliable Yeah he is majorly overrated. A backup who can soak up carries when necessary is probably his ceiling as an NFL player. Gareth Gobulcoque posted:Marshawn Lloyd problems are definitely Marshawn Lloyd problems. I don't think he even underwhelmed, he averaged 7.1 yards per carry. While his fumble percentage over his career is very high I think it's mostly mental mistakes rather than any sort of physical security issue. He takes a lot of tackles well behind the line where he could have just stuck his foot in and gone for a short gain instead of taking it outside into the defense for minus 5 yards. But then sometimes he just absolutely takes over drives. One of my problems with frankly a lot of RBs in this draft is how goddamn bounce-happy they are. I realize that this actually works very well in college where edge defense is a bit softer and the running back is one of the best athletes on the field. In the NFL, of course it can work but only when the defense is right for it, like goal line plays where the middle is overloaded. But overall you are much more likely to be caught by an edge defender/linebacker/DB for a TFL in the league. You HAVE to know how to press the middle and follow your blocks, since a short gain of two to four yards versus a loss of a similar amount is such a big deal when it comes to the success of a given drive. Marshawn Lloyd and Bucky Irving are huge offenders in this category. Alright I'll just put up a preliminary list of the guys I like best so far, haven't finished evaluating everyone though. 1) Trey Benson: Really has it all from my perspective. Speed, size, moves, ability to break tackles (he literally set a record for broken tackles per rush attempt in one of his years). Didn't fumble a SINGLE TIME in college. Pretty good vision. May need to adjust is running style in the NFL to something a bit more straight ahead. 2) Jaylen Wright: Doesn't have great moves but in some respects is the total package. Sufficient NFL size, more than sufficient speed, very athletic (his broad and vert were fantastic). He can be a home run hitter in the NFL, but he's not just a specialist like that because he can definitely pound it in the middle and can serve as an every down back. Runs upright and lacks power and contact balance, however. I like this guy a lot more than most. 4) Jonathan Brooks: I don't like him as much as many do. He kind of takes a while to get up to speed, he has long long legs (which also brings up injury concerns and he did just tear his ACL). Stops his feet too much and goes down on first contact often. Just not sure his athleticism and style will translate well in the NFL. On the plus side he does have some pretty nice moves, good vision, good long speed once he's fully up to gear, good at sneaking through defenders through small gaps, good at manipulating defenders on the second level. Excellent production in college. He can bring value but I think he will end up as a much better college player than he will be in the NFL. 3) Marshawn Lloyd: Already kind of covered him but I love his speed and his size/composition. Really really good moves, top flight athleticism with great speed and short area quickness, and big time home run potential. But, he has a very upright running style that severely limits his tackle breaking ability. His vision also needs some work. Bounces way way too much, NFL coaches will have to drill it into him that he needs to take what's there more often. Has a fumbling problem. Probably not an every down back at this point, otherwise I would've put him above Brooks I think. 5) Will Shipley: Now we're kind of into specialist territory. Pure gadget back due to how slight he is. NFL speed. Surprisingly good stiff arm. Excellent at slithering through cracks in the defense and sets up second level defenders well. Really good start/stop and can hurdle defenders. Appears to have pretty good vision. Catches the ball well which will be crucial for his role at the next level. On the negative side, he's very very thin, could never handle a starting back workload. Does not have a lot of production as his college team knew this. Fumbled three times this season and will be even more of a fumble risk at the next level. 6) Braelon Allen: Another specialist, this guy is a big old bruiser, that's for sure, and guys like him have a mixed history in the NFL. But as a short yardage back I think he could bring some value. He's decisive and can take what is blocked up and a bit more. Regularly runs over defenders on the second level. Not very explosive but for what he is, I would not mind having him as a backup RB able to step in and keep the offense moving if the starter is out, as well as get some play on short yardage. Perhaps Blake Corum should be in there, maybe above Allen or Shipley, but he just bores me so much that I refuse to watch a bunch of his tape. Ray Davis I didn't watch much of but I think he has potential, and at the very least could handle a full workload along with Corum. Bucky Irving is going to be a massive bust. Not a fan of Estime or Guerrendo.
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Apr 2, 2024 01:11
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well my top 4 are the same, I have Wright and Brooks flipped. Mainly because I see a bit of the opposite in Wright. I'm not as confident in his ability to run inside in the NFL, where I like Brooks a bit better. Wright's film against better competition is a little worrying, but the Tennessee IOL was absolute dog poo poo. Brooks is a bit one note in his moves, but he plants that leg so violently on the cut that it always works. I think Ray Davis is actually undraftable. I'm meh on Allen. I see Shipley similarly, but am not quite as high on him. There are some guys I really like and the top of that list is Tyrone Tracy Jr. I want to watch a couple more games from Estime and Irving before doing a big post on the mid to late round guys because that's the more fun part of doing this for me. I think there are a few standouts. Hello, Blake Watson.
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Apr 2, 2024 02:18
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Wright is my RB1
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Apr 2, 2024 02:47
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https://x.com/dpbrugler/status/1775168214911144256
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Apr 2, 2024 16:22
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can you guys tell me anything about Kingsley Suamataia, Jordan Morgan and Patrick Paul? I think they are tackles that have at least a chance of still being on the board by the 30th pick, right?
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Apr 2, 2024 16:26
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He had Bryce as QB1 last year Entire expertise invalidated
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Apr 2, 2024 16:35
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Mystic Stylez posted:can you guys tell me anything about Kingsley Suamataia, Jordan Morgan and Patrick Paul? I think they are tackles that have at least a chance of still being on the board by the 30th pick, right? Paul is one of the best pass blocking tackles in the class. He's got long arms. He mirrors well. He anchors well. He's got quick feet for a big man. He's not as much of a technician as Fashanu, and he's not an assertive tackle. He lets guys get into him, which negates a lot of his reach advantage but it's still hard to long arm him. I don't think I ever saw an edge guy successfully run the arc on him and that's where you see the foot speed and wingspan shine the most. Run blocking ranges from ~fine~ to real bad, and you see that lack of assertiveness carry over. You really don't want him pulling or releasing to block in space where his quick feet in pass pro become downright ponderous. About the best you're gonna get in run blocking is him occupying his assignment. Jordan Morgan is a guard in the NFL to me. I need to watch more film on Suamataia, but I was very unimpressed after one game. At the end of the first you might be looking at Graham Barton, who everyone wants to move inside. That's going to be his natural home, but I don't hate him at tackle in the NFL if you really need one. I really want to see Amegadjie's testing
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Apr 2, 2024 18:24
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yay
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Apr 2, 2024 18:26
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Mystic Stylez posted:can you guys tell me anything about Kingsley Suamataia, Jordan Morgan and Patrick Paul? I think they are tackles that have at least a chance of still being on the board by the 30th pick, right? Patrick Paul OT Houston Three year starter at left tackle, spent first two years playing sparingly and lost one to covid. Tall tackle that blocks based on leverage. Great bend despite lanky frame. Has long arms and engages based on the wrap technique. Great first step, fast off the snap and gets into position quick. Good footwork in general, doesn't waste a lot of movement. Prefers to angle out of the play rather than engage vertically. Strong, technique leads to hat on hat blocking that requires brute force to win at times. Decent in the run game, can be aggressive out of stance and do damage with size. Not the fastest but makes up for it with length. Good drive blocker and can move people with powerful lower body. Prefers to block with left leg stuck in the ground which provides good torque but makes him lose to faster rushers taking the corner. Hold machine at times due to hand placement, tries to torque rushers out of the play when losing the engagement, off balance when doing it. Technique allows bull rushers inside his pads. Sloppy run blocking engagement, doesn't square up well in pulls or slip blocks. Pass blocking technique is predictable, repetitive footwork and hand placement tips run plays when coming out of stance. Lacks pure strength at times due to technique, has the size to win but not a good transfer of power from legs into upper body in pass reps. Low sinking first step can give up too much space at times allowing a pocket collapse where the shouldn't be one. Kingsley Suamataia OT BYU Red shirted at Oregon before transferring to BYU starting one year at right tackle then left tackle. Mountainous tackle, tall with long arms and big build. Prefers the one step technique in blocking and looks to set the edge with his frame. Surprisingly athletic for his size, gets out into space fast and can keep up blocking downfield. Hard to get past in stand up blocking situations, anchors well against bull rushes. Good down blocker, uses size well and punishes. Tends to block with one arm on a punch and then engage with the other, kind of a technique for centers. Keeps his head up and looks for work, stays patient and mans his gap well instead of committing to the first block. Good power when lunging in the run game. Terrible hand placement, awful against spin moves, doesn't engage well and has a tendency to place outside the pads losing his length and size advantage. Way too big to block laterally in the initial pocket collapse, shuffles and misses speedier stunts and LB blitzes. Raw, stays patient on blocks but misses ones he should pick up earlier. Choppy footwork before engagement causes loss of power. Jordan Morgan OT Arizona Three year starter all at left tackle, tore his ACL in 2022. Highly mobile and fluid athlete, capable as a man or zone blocker. Gets ahead of blockers in pass reps with quick movement, gets to the second level fast. Prefers to shuffle into his block, staying wide and looking for the envelop. Active hands, probes well and keeps engagements at length. Fluid hips, opens up well to the outside. Has a good redirect when taking the corner and can shuffle rushers out of plays. Blocks and resets well to stay in position. Not overly strong in the run game, just average, doesn't really move anyone. Doesn't find blocks that well, lets rushers blow past his zone. Poor block engagement at the second level. Either misses them or puts himself in a poor position. Has a heavy left foot when planting on the corner and can get caught off balance. Not the greatest hand fighter after the initial engagement, wrap technique leaves him too wide against more violent pass rushers. Moves like a zone blocker but much better at just taking on man assignments in passing reps.
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Apr 2, 2024 18:44
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thanks a lot for the replies guys, these are very informative. appreciate it a ton!
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Apr 2, 2024 19:45
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Which one of you put your name in the draft https://twitter.com/thorku/status/1775037195817992557
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Apr 2, 2024 23:53
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3 reps of 225 at 158 pounds is insane
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Apr 3, 2024 00:06
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kiimo posted:Which one of you put your name in the draft That 40 is to good to be a goon
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Apr 3, 2024 00:24
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Running a sub 5 40 is so hard for average people. The only thing you can really glean out of 40s is how hyper athletic NFL prospects actually are, even if they're an OL hitting mid 5's.
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Apr 3, 2024 00:33
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SKULL.GIF posted:3 reps of 225 at 158 pounds is insane Jesus
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Apr 3, 2024 00:56
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SKULL.GIF posted:3 reps of 225 at 158 pounds is insane Ehhhhhh, not really.
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Apr 3, 2024 01:29
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kiimo posted:Which one of you put your name in the draft lmfao
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Apr 3, 2024 01:34
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YOLOsubmarine posted:Ehhhhhh, not really. Yeah this. I was around 160 when I used to be able to get 3 and 4 sets of 5 reps of 100kg when I was well dedicated in my late 20s. Yes I also injured my shoulder through less than ideal technique and do not do that any longer. Its good for like... the world, but not really elite.
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Apr 3, 2024 04:35
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https://twitter.com/AroundTheNFL/status/1775511844788265063 Good clickbait there with J.J. McCarthy rising one spot, to 20
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Apr 3, 2024 14:52
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The real clickbait juice is La Canfora projecting six QBs in round one, including JJ at 2: 1. Caleb Williams, Chicago 2. JJ McCarthy, Washington 3. Jayden Daniels, Giants 4, Drake Maye, Vikings 13. Michael Penix Jr., Las Vegas 30. Bo Nix, Denver
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Apr 3, 2024 15:35
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xbilkis posted:The real clickbait juice is La Canfora projecting six QBs in round one, including JJ at 2: I don't see the Cardinals moving down to 11 in any world and falling out of the top 3 receivers spots. Maybe they'll move down, but I think they want to stay in the top 10.
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Apr 3, 2024 15:44
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Gully Foyle posted:I don't see the Cardinals moving down to 11 in any world and falling out of the top 3 receivers spots. Maybe they'll move down, but I think they want to stay in the top 10. Maybe they move down for 11 and 23 then use 11 and 35 to move back up? Or they also have the 27th pick so they could use that if need be too. They probably only really need to jump the Bears in that case.
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Apr 3, 2024 15:53
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xbilkis posted:The real clickbait juice is La Canfora projecting six QBs in round one, including JJ at 2: Why would the Patriots trade out of there? Are they getting Daniel Jones?
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Apr 3, 2024 16:18
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Henchman of Santa posted:Why would the Patriots trade out of there? Are they getting Daniel Jones? The belief being the Patriots, front office not wanting to put a rookie QB, especially if they lets say don't have QB3 or QB2 as high on their board. Behind that roster and potentially torch a year of development. Jacoby Brissett can hold down the fort for a year, while they continue to build a decent landing spot. The Patriots Roster is loving diiiiiiiiire in a way that even like the Texans weren't(they had some dudes on the line and Nico Collins). If you believe the QB can be like THE GUY™ then sure draft him and you figure it out, but if you just sorta like them but don't have them that high on your board, trade back get a poo poo ton of players, and figure out QB as you go. It just depends on what the Patriots think about like Drake Maye or Jayden Daniels or JJ McCarthy, who's there and if they are worth taking at 3. Considering the GM, my guess is if Maye is there the Pats are going to take him, as Drake Maye seems extremely like a Wolfe guy. Fix his lazy footwork, to eliminate some of the welp throws and boom.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:27
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xbilkis posted:The real clickbait juice is La Canfora projecting six QBs in round one, including JJ at 2: I can't read the article. What compensation would the Broncos get to drop back? I love the idea and getting Bo Nix at 30 would be dope.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:30
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lmao at Sean Payton ever trading back in the draft.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:30
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3 DONG HORSE posted:I can't read the article. What compensation would the Broncos get to drop back? I love the idea and getting Bo Nix at 30 would be dope. Nothing specific on the trade details, but it's suggesting a trade up into the first rather than a trade back from 12. Also suggests they might consider him at 12 because the Saints might be interested in Nix at 14: quote:I feel more strongly Denver is where Nix ends up than I do about what team the Broncos go through to acquire him. I’m not sure the Broncos will trade down from the No. 12 pick, because there is a chance Sean Payton’s old team — the Saints, who have the 14th pick — would make a play for Nix. Another team also could be involved. But at a certain point, if the Saints pass and Nix is still on the board, this looks like a fit.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:33
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Thank you. Also wtf lol
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Apr 3, 2024 16:36
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Like I don't think a team Sean Payton has some control over has ever traded back in the draft?
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Apr 3, 2024 16:37
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Dexo posted:Like I don't think a team Sean Payton has some control over has ever traded back in the draft? Is trading back and forfeiting picks the same thing?
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Apr 3, 2024 16:38
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Dexo posted:The belief being the Patriots, front office not wanting to put a rookie QB, especially if they lets say don't have QB3 or QB2 as high on their board. Behind that roster and potentially torch a year of development. OK, makes sense I guess. I forgot they even brought Brissett back.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:41
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I can see the logic in the patriots trading down for an absolute pick raft, but none of the new coaching/front office hires/promotions inspire confidence they'll pilot said raft well.
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Apr 3, 2024 16:47
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Theirs gonna be like 5 teams that will try to trade up for AD Mitchell.
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Apr 3, 2024 18:56
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Dexo posted:Like I don't think a team Sean Payton has some control over has ever traded back in the draft? Not once. He's a total wildcard and there's a solid chance they do some insane poo poo to trade up to the top 4 picks
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Apr 3, 2024 19:45
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Been taking a look at Utah edge Jonah Ellis and man, I am impressed. He could be a bit of a diamond in the rough assuming he's there in round 3, maybe even late round 2 if you really like him. An absolute steal if he's around in the fourth round. He doesn't have the full package, but he has some of the best and most violent hands out of any edge rusher in this class, maybe THE best. Not sure of the measurements but he appears to have extremely long arms for his size. Long arms and violent hands play really well in the NFL, you can move blockers around, stymie their punches, collapse the pocket, and set up really good moves. Has a devastatingly effective spin move and some good hook, cross chop and push pull stuff. I really like how he breaks down when approaching the quarterback, chops his feet and stays ready to pounce so he doesn't overrun it and doesn't leave a path to escape. Very good production this season (12 sacks and 16 (!) TFLs) especially considering he missed the last three games of the season. Only 21 years old. On the negative side, not much of a first step and very little bend. Skinny legs compared to his upper body. Won't test due to a shoulder injury that ended his season. Not particularly big and can be overwhelmed in run defense on the edge. Still, to me he absolutely looks like an NFL player. kiimo posted:Which one of you put your name in the draft 4.98 for a wide receiver at 5'7 158 is an absolute travesty. No idea who this is but testing at the combine was a huge mistake. The vert and broad too, my goodness. xbilkis posted:The real clickbait juice is La Canfora projecting six QBs in round one, including JJ at 2: Not even a huge Maye fan (although I admit I'm slowly coming around on him just on pure potential and youth), and I like JJ fine, but taking McCarthy over Maye could end up looking like taking Sam Darnold over Josh Allen, or Mitch Trubisky over Patrick Mahomes. AKA a floor-over-ceiling decision that ruins careers if it doesn't pay off.
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Apr 3, 2024 21:00
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Im coming around very quickly to the Ladd McConkey to carolina train. More I see of him the more I see a mostly slot guy who just produces. Like Cooper or Pacua, I see a lot of negatives in his report about catch radius and speed that just don't exist in testing.
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Apr 3, 2024 22:47
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Stop he has to fall to 32.
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Apr 3, 2024 22:54
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Greedo: Maconkey *gets shot by Han Solo*
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Apr 3, 2024 22:56
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