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Danaru
Jun 5, 2012

何 ??
I use sterile tiles and a sink from Dubs hygiene and my cooks still manage to poison my goons :argh: Food poisoning is pretty much the whole reason I went all in on paste

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George Sex - REAL
Dec 1, 2005

Bisssssssexual
Yeah, nutrient paste rocks. With ideologies there's just no strong incentive to use anything else

Eiba
Jul 26, 2007


jokes posted:

e: Oh it was a siege. Couldn't you just trigger their assault and book it back into your defense/chokepoint?
How does a melee only tribal trigger a siege without massive casualties? Sieges have a 10% chance of assaulting whenever you deal damage, but how do you safely do damage when you have to approach a dozen people with guns out in the open?

Honestly, if you wanted to commit to your caveman Rimworld game you should probably live in a cave. Any challenge should be more or less possible with melee in defensive positions with the exception of sieges which are a pretty solid hard counter to melee only settlements. Just live underground and that's not an issue anymore.

Inexplicable Humblebrag
Sep 20, 2003

devkill a few of the siegers, op

Inzombiac
Mar 19, 2007

PARTY ALL NIGHT

EAT BRAINS ALL DAY


I've put in hundreds of hours and literally never used nutrient paste.
Gonna have to try it.

Dandywalken
Feb 11, 2014

Same tbh!

isndl
May 2, 2012
I WON A CONTEST IN TG AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS CUSTOM TITLE

George Sex - REAL posted:

Yeah, nutrient paste rocks. With ideologies there's just no strong incentive to use anything else

Unfortunately paste doesn't scale well if you have hungry big bois from Big & Small, since they grab one meal from the dispenser when they need six. Also carnivore/herbivore genes are a real bitch to manage, though I think I saw a mod to allow pawns to grab preferred ingredients from a dispenser that I need to check out again.

The infrastructure requirements for Transhumanism also gets pretty taxing when you have twenty pawns demanding biosculpting and neural superchargers. I think Fabricors have zero food poisoning chance by default though.

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.
The food poisoning risk from dirty cooking environments and the risk from low cooking skill are rolled separately and do not interact, so a skilled chef can’t offset a dirty room, but unless the room is tiny, innately dirty work stations like butcher’s tables and stonecutter benches won’t lower the cleanliness enough to risk food poisoning from filth. They will however push it closer to that threshold, so it takes less blood or vomit or whatever to make the room a hazardous cooking zone.

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Eiba posted:

How does a melee only tribal trigger a siege without massive casualties? Sieges have a 10% chance of assaulting whenever you deal damage, but how do you safely do damage when you have to approach a dozen people with guns out in the open?

Honestly, if you wanted to commit to your caveman Rimworld game you should probably live in a cave. Any challenge should be more or less possible with melee in defensive positions with the exception of sieges which are a pretty solid hard counter to melee only settlements. Just live underground and that's not an issue anymore.

The Meat Is Cheap. Maybe send in a few braves, knowing only a couple (or none) will return?

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG

worm girl posted:

I don't understand what you're driving at. If you aren't using high tech gear, you aren't likely to run up against problems with wealth.

this is just not correct at all, producing a lot of food or high quality furniture (even pre-complex furniture) piles up wealth.

also if you arm up with all the piles of gun loot you stop being especially tribal. sure you can set up a bunch of traps and kill the raiders wearing power armor and toting assault rifles and put that stuff on. congratulations you're now spacer tech.

I'm not saying the game is unbeatable, I'm saying the game does not want you to have a low tech slow advancing tribal experience (said this pretty clearly already).

Danaru posted:

I use sterile tiles and a sink from Dubs hygiene and my cooks still manage to poison my goons :argh: Food poisoning is pretty much the whole reason I went all in on paste

skill issue (of the cook)

Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Apr 3, 2024

Telsa Cola
Aug 19, 2011

No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface
I've hit pretty high wealth levels very quickly just by smoothing walls and floors

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010



Gun Saliva
haven't they dialed down the values of smooth floors? For a while smooth floors were a siren call to getting raided.

cause gently caress that crap +1 or +2 i'm going back to covering these rocks with wood or some half rear end carpet if that's what it takes, i don't give a poo poo. Imo it's basically not worth it unless you have like 5 people passionate about construction.

mega dy
Dec 6, 2003

Smoothing takes forever and my guys like, never actually do it. Even if I prioritize construction they will wander around aimlessly before actually smoothing stuff.

Mzbundifund
Nov 5, 2011

I'm afraid so.

SniperWoreConverse posted:

haven't they dialed down the values of smooth floors? For a while smooth floors were a siren call to getting raided.

cause gently caress that crap +1 or +2 i'm going back to covering these rocks with wood or some half rear end carpet if that's what it takes, i don't give a poo poo. Imo it's basically not worth it unless you have like 5 people passionate about construction.

Yeah smooth stone floors have a value of 8, same as stone tile floors. For comparison, carpets have a value of 13, and wood floor has a value of 4.

Danaru
Jun 5, 2012

何 ??
I straight up changed smoothing speed to be ten times faster and it still takes forever for some of.my bigger rooms to get done

Doltos
Dec 28, 2005

🤌🤌🤌
Smoothing has always been a downtime stat raiser for me

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010



Gun Saliva
My guys consider smooth floors to be ULTIMATELY CRITICAL construction jobs and walls to be :shrug:

They think the only thing more important than smooth floors is the sacred temperature regulation implements, better to starve than leave a tile unsmoothened.

I have not adjusted any priority lol

George Sex - REAL
Dec 1, 2005

Bisssssssexual
The solution is 20 constructors.

Jabarto
Apr 7, 2007

I could do with your...assistance.

jokes posted:

Can't you stack a melee defense in your favor by having 3 melee people blocking a 1-tile entrance so that the first guy is always engaged in melee with 3 of your guys? I also don't know how you can be melee only, tribal bows are no joke.

e: Oh it was a siege. Couldn't you just trigger their assault and book it back into your defense/chokepoint?

I tried that but I couldn't peel them away from the encampment. I only had a few good gunmen and they just got injured when they tried.

Also I was playing as neaderthals so melee is kind of my only option. Like I said, though, if I had mortars of my own, or jet packs, or even just some explosives or smoke launchers, things might have gone differently.

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG
psycasts do help a whole lot but the problem is getting through the few years it takes to build up a couple of really good combos like invisibility + berserk pulse or Neuroquake. although again this kind of pushes away from the tribal gimmick and into something else.

Eiba
Jul 26, 2007


Jabarto posted:

I tried that but I couldn't peel them away from the encampment. I only had a few good gunmen and they just got injured when they tried.

Also I was playing as neaderthals so melee is kind of my only option. Like I said, though, if I had mortars of my own, or jet packs, or even just some explosives or smoke launchers, things might have gone differently.
Unless you were doing a themed run with strict rules against ranged weapons, it would still be worthwhile to give some of your neanderthals a sniper rifle or two, or some bolt action rifles with the goal not of doing significant damage, but just annoying the attackers enough from range to come at you. Every hit is a 10% chance to get them to abandon their mortars and assault. It probably would have taken a while, and if the attackers had long range guns of their own it would have been really fiddly to try and stay safe, but that would still be a viable way to force an engagement.

Herstory Begins Now
Aug 5, 2003
SOME REALLY TEDIOUS DUMB SHIT THAT SUCKS ASS TO READ ->>
I'm not surprised that if your tribals manage to get space ikea up and running that they're eventually going to get some pretty big raids

worm girl
Feb 12, 2022

Can you hear it too?
I usually just kept a psychic lance on hand for sieges when I was doing melee. Gauranlen are also surprisingly decent at charging in with the boys.

Herstory Begins Now
Aug 5, 2003
SOME REALLY TEDIOUS DUMB SHIT THAT SUCKS ASS TO READ ->>
i miss when you could just send tame boomalopes into the enemy siege. they're not that effective on their own, but they were effective for burning down the sieges

moot the hopple
Apr 26, 2008

dyslexic Bowie clone
My go-to anti-siege strategy is to fire an incendiary shell onto the enemy's mortar stockpile. I used to try to counter battery their mortars directly with HE shells, but I find that one incendiary shell landing in the general area of the mortar shells is enough to cook them off and cause the enemy to attack directly, as opposed to drop podding in more supplies to rebuild a destroyed mortar. You do lose out on all the siege mats that get burned up but that can be a good thing for wealth management.

I suppose a theoretical strat for early tribals is to keep around some flamebows or use the impid fire ability and try to spread some fire into the siege area and blow up the shells that way. I don't think it'd be very effective though since you'd still need to assault spacers who'll outrange and outgun you from a fortified position.

Telsa Cola
Aug 19, 2011

No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface
Smoothing is a down time all hands activity at lowish priorities for me, and I tend to run mountain bases, so I have a lot of surfaces and corriders to cover, and often at least 3 people who just can do that for hours. It adds up. I think I have archonexus several times within a ingame week/month.

Because skills also influence weath that adds to it too since people skill up a bunch.

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG
yeah the 1st round archonexus value is only 40k, really easy to hit that (mod it to be more like 500k imo)

Danaru
Jun 5, 2012

何 ??
I didn't realize when I did the archonexus quest that you permanently had a bad vibes monolith in the center of your map, that was kinda pants

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled
I mod floor values to virtually nothing, because the beauty bonus that floors provide is completely irrelevant compared to one(1) singular mediocre art piece so the gameplay benefit is minimal and I aesthetically want actual floors instead of lovely dirt and rock everywhere.

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG
Current gimmick: What if Tinkerbell was actually part wasp :hmmyes:



e: I DON'T CARE HOW loving CUTE IT IS AAAAAAAAAAGHGH DON'T SHOW IT TO ME AGAGGHGHGHG OMG IT'S ADORABLE AAAAAAAA :swoon:



She just wants to play :glomp:

Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 07:04 on Apr 4, 2024

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Herstory Begins Now posted:

i miss when you could just send tame boomalopes into the enemy siege. they're not that effective on their own, but they were effective for burning down the sieges

You can still do this if you have a drop pod; enemies won't attack boomalopes but they will attack boomrats. But yeah that's a lot less fun than having a bunch of boomalopes charge into enemies, or you do it with a massive flock of chickens and watch everyone get pecked to death

SugarAddict
Oct 11, 2012
I always considered smoothing walls and floors a way to train construction and a way to get nice walls and floors without having to spend 5000 materials of whatever.

A jargogle
Feb 22, 2011

Danaru posted:

I didn't realize when I did the archonexus quest that you permanently had a bad vibes monolith in the center of your map, that was kinda pants

It did have some unique places in a defense wall/killbox though!

Mindless
Dec 7, 2001

WANTED: INFO on Mindless. Anything! Everything! Send to
Pillbug
I think Flame bows are the middle ground answer for neanderthal v. siege. If you don't care to collect the shells or meals, setting them on fire is the way to go. I use Run and Gun which makes harrying enemy positions a lot easier.

Bread Enthusiast
Oct 26, 2010

The one-week-til-it-comes-out preview is up: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/294100/view/4128184830673758833?l=english

More stuff that I kinda just skimmed over and went ehhh at. But in play I might find it more interesting. Or as enemies.

DoubleNegative
Jan 27, 2010

The most virtuous child in the entire world.
The skip abduction ritual sounds like some nonsense, not gonna lie. Just "oop, one of your colonists is now the victim of our ritual, better come rescue them tee hee."

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

A colonist steps out of his hut, with a newly-aching Bad Back condition. He sighs, wanders over to the pit where we keep raider prisoners, and drinks a few years off a pyromaniac.

Flesh Forge
Jan 31, 2011

LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT MY DOG

DoubleNegative posted:

The skip abduction ritual sounds like some nonsense, not gonna lie. Just "oop, one of your colonists is now the victim of our ritual, better come rescue them tee hee."

it kind of sounds like it's at least on your map like to a siege or cluster, rather than to a different site - that would be pretty hard to tolerate if you have to make a caravan to respond to that.
e: ahahahaha map wide berserk pulse blood rain? okay

jokes posted:

A colonist steps out of his hut, with a newly-aching Bad Back condition. He sighs, wanders over to the pit where we keep raider prisoners, and drinks a few years off a pyromaniac.

yeah I am very on board for this bullshit it sounds hilarious

Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Apr 4, 2024

Eiba
Jul 26, 2007


Danaru posted:

I didn't realize when I did the archonexus quest that you permanently had a bad vibes monolith in the center of your map, that was kinda pants
It's not necessarily the permanent center of you base- you can just leave the map after you study it. Or leave right away and come back with a little research team to study it.

Bread Enthusiast posted:

The one-week-til-it-comes-out preview is up: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/294100/view/4128184830673758833?l=english

More stuff that I kinda just skimmed over and went ehhh at. But in play I might find it more interesting. Or as enemies.
In an effort to be positive, I could consider using the brainwiping ritual on a colony that doesn't exalt individual autonomy. Considering what dumbass destructive things people get up to when they're associated with the wrong faction, brainwiping could be seen as justifiable.

Death refusal could also be a grimly fun one to use in extreme circumstances.

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George Sex - REAL
Dec 1, 2005

Bisssssssexual
Conflicted on what has been teased of this latest expansion.

Ideology changed the way we saw society within the rim. It affected culturally how one group related to another, how the group related to themself. It gave colonies and factions a lot more identity. It was/is very interesting.

Biotech changed the way we thought about pawns and gave us an alternative to traditional pawns in the form of mechs. In a game that is based around the lives of pawns, that is hugely impactful. It was/is very interesting.

Royalty on the other hand fleshes out the background of the world a little bit through the empire. Adds some abilities in the form of psycasts. It also added some variety in the events system. It is/was kind-of interesting.

Anomaly, so far, seems to be a lot more in the vein of royalty over ideology and biotech. Fleshing out events/abilities, rather than reworking a core tenant of the game.

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