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they should make a fallout tactics game but like xcom.
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Apr 13, 2024 17:58
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I would settle for another Xcom
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Apr 13, 2024 17:59
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Tankbuster posted:which is really odd because he runs his place like the ideal small business owner. Doesn't fire people, loses money instead of crunching, takes everyone's input on board. yeah that’s what I mean, the tension is immediately dissipated and goes nowhere. the water chip was completely unnecessary for driving that plot beat. it’s a pure contrivance for fan service that doesn’t make sense. the vault in the first game only received a single water chip as part of its behavioral experiment, but most vaults have backup chips. you even come across boxes of water chips in Vault City during Fallout 2. but vault 31-33 aren’t just a control vault like Vault City, they’re THE managerial vault. they’re the primary purpose of the entire vault project but 33 doesn’t have any backup chips? it’s the dumbest kind of fan service because if you’re a fan then you’re going to recognize all the problems with it immediately. anyway, it’s remarkable how the first and last episodes of the show are the dumbest and worst constructed of all of them and ruins the whole series in the worst way possible. it’s way dumber than the Bethesda games. the funniest thing about it is that everyone trying to claim this is pro-communist or anti-capitalist is getting it completely wrong. it’s anti-professional managerial class, and the world is destroyed for the sake of woke DEI HR Science.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:00
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StashAugustine posted:NPCs showing up at blizzare times is completely accurate. I just had the star cap guy run up to me in the middle of the Goodsprings gunfight the thing being pointed at isn't that the guy shows up in the nick of time, that happens in virtually every story, it's the laughable dialogue. he may as well of said "you're about to experience a character arc that will leave you in a different place than you were at the start of episode one" StashAugustine posted:I think the best way to describe the show is Westworld but aware that it's very stupid it certainly is not aware of that which is part of its charm to me
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Apr 13, 2024 18:02
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Good Soldier Svejk posted:Gotta be a hell of a fun job for the prop department though also for some of the actual gamedevs https://twitter.com/_ArtByAdam_/status/1779101657470517715
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Apr 13, 2024 18:08
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The broken water chip was a joke that highlighted how inept and sheeplike the vault dwellers from 32 and 33 were and how they were unable to handle any kind of a crisis effectively.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:11
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:yeah that’s what I mean, the tension is immediately dissipated and goes nowhere. the water chip was completely unnecessary for driving that plot beat. it’s a pure contrivance for fan service that doesn’t make sense. It makes sense within that context. Lack of a water chip means they have to shuffle populations around to vault 32. The normal Vault 33 character is Chet and he literally looks at the screen and all but says "I am a babby coward whomst lives in a vault and is led by our overseer." Screaming and crying its not logical is like screaming and crying that the legion cannot be a threat because they do crack and try to shoot at professional soldiers with machetes. And yeah anticapitalism in media is just something capitalism sells to people as they get more and more alienated. You aren't becoming a better communist by doing the yes-man/wildcard playthrough of New Vegas either.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:12
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Tankbuster posted:And yeah anticapitalism in media is just something capitalism sells to people as they get more and more alienated. You aren't becoming a better communist by doing the yes-man/wildcard playthrough of New Vegas either. however, this does in fact work in disco elysium
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Apr 13, 2024 18:14
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Disco elysium was also made by people some of which lived in an alternate system to western capitalism. I don't expect obsidian devs to create a game so good it starts the great american prole revolution. Its a great game but if you need a videogame to tell you "drat, capitalism kinda bad" then there's really nothing to say.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:17
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Tankbuster posted:they should make a fallout tactics game but like xcom. xcom the tv series
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Apr 13, 2024 18:19
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Tankbuster posted:they should make a fallout tactics game but like xcom. Honestly kinda interested in the necromunda ripoff minis game they're putting out
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Apr 13, 2024 18:20
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yeah a lot of the good feeling from disco was a piece of media that was like 'wow isn't everything a bit poo poo, something doesn't quite feel right about the state of the world' and the corresponding good feeling because it's nice to not feel like you're the only one that thinks anything is wrong. I've seen the game played by people who weren't particularly political conscious and while they enjoy it they don't really vibe with it to the same extent and they all end up playing a wishy washy character that ends up ignoring the 4 (i think) primary ideologies and they all end up with sorry cops. Disco Elysium hits best when preaching to the choir
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Apr 13, 2024 18:22
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Tankbuster posted:Disco elysium was also made by people some of which lived in an alternate system to western capitalism. I don't expect obsidian devs to create a game so good it starts the great american prole revolution. Its a great game but if you need a videogame to tell you "drat, capitalism kinda bad" then there's really nothing to say. bro just say you like the show and leave it at that. you’re shadowboxing a straw man now. I’m gonna complain about it because I’m a fan and a hater. complaining rules. if you don’t have real hate in your heart you can never know true love.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:22
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Tankbuster posted:It makes sense within that context. Lack of a water chip means they have to shuffle populations around to vault 32. The normal Vault 33 character is Chet and he literally looks at the screen and all but says "I am a babby coward whomst lives in a vault and is led by our overseer." Screaming and crying its not logical is like screaming and crying that the legion cannot be a threat because they do crack and try to shoot at professional soldiers with machetes. Who is to say there aren't plenty of water chips in Vault 31, and they aren't just using the incident to kill the inept members of 32 and 33 so that only the effective ones will live?
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Apr 13, 2024 18:22
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The entire point of the tri-vault system was to cycle populations to keep inbreeding at a minimum and create the ultimate Vault-tec middle manager in the future. Its practically a crusader kings game.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:25
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Regarde Aduck posted:yeah a lot of the good feeling from disco was a piece of media that was like 'wow isn't everything a bit poo poo, something doesn't quite feel right about the state of the world' and the corresponding good feeling because it's nice to not feel like you're the only one that thinks anything is wrong. I've seen the game played by people who weren't particularly political conscious and while they enjoy it they don't really vibe with it to the same extent and they all end up playing a wishy washy character that ends up ignoring the 4 (i think) primary ideologies and they all end up with sorry cops. yeah i tried to get a warrenite friend to play it and he bounced off. it's my game and it was meant for me
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Apr 13, 2024 18:26
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indigi posted:people can like something that is imperfect, and in fact everything everyone likes is imperfect. Mao taught us this.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:35
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Homeless Friend posted:Watching the first ep, the goofy americana is better but its interesting how they tried to emulate the vault exit but you just can't do it with typical camera framing/pacing. It just doesn't work. Really striking thinking back on how for all its faults in having to make fallout jump into 3D, Bethesda completely nailed the fo3 vault exit. Seared into memory. yep
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Apr 13, 2024 18:35
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Tankbuster posted:It makes sense within that context. Lack of a water chip means they have to shuffle populations around to vault 32. The normal Vault 33 character is Chet and he literally looks at the screen and all but says "I am a babby coward whomst lives in a vault and is led by our overseer." Screaming and crying its not logical is like screaming and crying that the legion cannot be a threat because they do crack and try to shoot at professional soldiers with machetes. They don't need the water chip to do that because Vault 32 is already empty. They'd have to resettle it regardless to maintain continuity of the vaults. It's Patty's initiative as overseer and the dwellers would go along with it regardless. The show isn't selling anticapitalism is the point, people interpret "anticapitalism" as anything critical of the United States and markets but it's not anti-capitalist it's literally a reactionary copout that excuses capitalism and American nationalism by pinning the blame for the Great War on a conspiracy of corporate middle managers who want HR departments to be the basis of civilization. If Fallout is anything it's anti-American, or at least it's critical of the exceptionalist tendency in American politics that drives us towards imperialism and conflict. This isn't even critical of THAT, because Howard is the embodiment of true blue American values even to the point of anticommunism. Knowing about the Vault-Tec conspiracy doesn't make him change in any meaningful way. He just leaves his wife and takes his daughter to work birthday parties. The conspiracy isn't an outcome of American social forces or human history, it's the inner circle of the illuminatus conspiring to undermine our precious god-given American liberties with their "reason" and "science." And the conspiracy doesn't even make sense. All of the representatives of the other American conglomerates are only interested in market share and earning potential, why would they give a gently caress about the ideological project represented by the management vaults? It ties in directly to the problem with painting and idyllic picture of pre-War America. If the country was collapsing then it makes sense for them to want to pull the temple down on their heads Sampson-like in the hopes that capitalism can be maintained through the post-apocalypse. But it's not. All they're really doing is wiping out their own capital holdings so they can be put into cryo sleep and never go outside. People complain about the Enclave always coming back but at least the Enclave was the continuity of American govermnent. The United States was literally the bad guys. Now the true badguys all along are the libtards with humanities degrees who want you to eat ze bugs, own nuthink, unt be happy. e: and the last episode just loving sucks! It directly undermines its most impactful emotional moments by layering them over with horrible jokes and dialogue. Bud's brain in a jar is the unfunniest thing in the season and he's doing schtick over its biggest reveal, and Kyle McLachlan gives his big villain speech while the battle between the Brotherhood and NCR remnants is going on. The series is hyper focused on the least interesting parts of the setting and its own narrative while ignoring the most interesting parts. Why did Willzig leave the Enclave? Because of a dog? He's dead already so we'll never know in a way that matters. He's already an afterthought. What was the deal with the NCR remnants and Moldaver? Well they're all dead already, including Moldaver, so that whole plotline has been cut off before it could actually go anywhere. The show sets up stuff just to kill it off and be as uninteresting and stupid as possible. Maybe these will be "resolved" in a second season but it'd have to be purely through flashbacks or some dumbass contrivance because they already wrote themselves into a corner where the only way out is to do something stupid or lame. 
Pener Kropoopkin has issued a correction as of 19:03 on Apr 13, 2024 |
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Apr 13, 2024 18:36
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A Buttery Pastry posted:space aliens, space genders, space sexes, and space religions are why warhammer 40k has the most progressive fascism in fiction. In the Imperium's defense its supposed to be color blind and gender blind Fascism but that rarely translates to the way it's presented in the extremely British media.
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Apr 13, 2024 18:59
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Popy posted:Justified has the most realistic take on law enforcement shootings justified kicks rear end
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Apr 13, 2024 19:00
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Cooper Howard is shown to be overly naive and wrong in the past and overly cynical and wrong in the present. His lack of concrete ideals makes him a mirror that reflects whatever present he's currently in. I don't think you are supposed to ever think he's right. And those aren't corporate middle managers. They are the corporate heads of America's military industrial complex in the fallout universe and in their minds they were creating a scenario where they got to crush all competition forever and end history for good, then get to remake the world however they pleased. There is simply too much "value" and "control" there for them to ignore. Also, you are never going to get someone to explicitly say that communism is good in tv shows and video games. That goes beyond what is allowed in our present culture.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:01
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the fallout show has the junk gun so it's good. simple
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Apr 13, 2024 19:06
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also Walton goggins
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Apr 13, 2024 19:06
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Clip-On Fedora posted:Cooper Howard is shown to be overly naive and wrong in the past and overly cynical and wrong in the present. His lack of concrete ideals makes him a mirror that reflects whatever present he's currently in. I don't think you are supposed to ever think he's right. It doesn't actually matter what Howard believes because all that matters is the conspiracy of the powerful. Having American values or not is completely immaterial. It lets the whole country off the hook. The people seated in the conference room also aren't corporate heads, they're representatives of their respective corporations. Howard's wife even receives orders directly from a shadowy figure implied to either be Vault-Tec's CEO or an even higher authority. I don't expect an American tv show to say that communism is good and capitalism is bad, but I DO expect a Fallout tv show to say that America itself is bad, and not just the "professional managerial class" or the shadowy corporate cabals. It saps itself of all meaningful critique and ultimately says nothing, which is a credit I have to give to the Bethesda games. At least they presented some interesting ideas. This is just exhuming the corpse of Fallout to manipulate it like a marionette and tell an even worse story.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:08
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Clip-On Fedora posted:Cooper Howard is shown to be overly naive and wrong in the past and overly cynical and wrong in the present. His lack of concrete ideals makes him a mirror that reflects whatever present he's currently in. I don't think you are supposed to ever think he's right. you could just watch chinese media lmao.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:11
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:It doesn't actually matter what Howard believes because all that matters is the conspiracy of the powerful. Having American values or not is completely immaterial. It lets the whole country off the hook. The people seated in the conference room also aren't corporate heads, they're representatives of their respective corporations. Howard's wife even receives orders directly from a shadowy figure implied to either be Vault-Tec's CEO or an even higher authority. I don't expect an American tv show to say that communism is good and capitalism is bad, but I DO expect a Fallout tv show to say that America itself is bad, and not just the "professional managerial class" or the shadowy corporate cabals. It saps itself of all meaningful critique and ultimately says nothing, which is a credit I have to give to the Bethesda games. At least they presented some interesting ideas. This is just exhuming the corpse of Fallout to manipulate it like a marionette and tell an even worse story. ah yes, the deep cut of saying america bad. Something that every liberal has been doing since they took a hiking trip to europe and lost 30 pounds.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:12
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Tankbuster posted:ah yes, the deep cut of saying america bad. Something that every liberal has been doing since they took a hiking trip to europe and lost 30 pounds. That is what I want, yes. Even China comes up so little during the tv show I'm not even sure if Howard mentioned who they were fighting in Anchorage. And it'd make sense if they didn't come up, because apparently it's Vault-Tec that's bombing the United States!
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Apr 13, 2024 19:15
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You think they'll make a Skyrim TV show? That would be cool.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:25
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no. The mayo mind cannot understand the 36 lessons of vivec.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:26
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Todd already retconned morrowind by nuking it with a volcano
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Apr 13, 2024 19:30
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Tankbuster posted:also for some of the actual gamedevs Loved seeing how stupid and big (laudatory) the classic 10mm looked
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Apr 13, 2024 19:35
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Massive_Idiot posted:Todd already retconned morrowind by nuking it with a volcano that’s not a retcon that’s just natural history. a retcon is when you change things retroactively, like having Talos make it so Cyrodiil was always fantasy Switzerland instead of jungle Rome with his CHIM powers.
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Apr 13, 2024 19:36
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Regarde Aduck posted:Actual aliens to hate probably would reduce racism a bit shut up ozymandias
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Apr 13, 2024 19:53
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the milk machine posted:justified kicks rear end
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Apr 13, 2024 19:56
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:It doesn't actually matter what Howard believes because all that matters is the conspiracy of the powerful. Having American values or not is completely immaterial. It lets the whole country off the hook. The people seated in the conference room also aren't corporate heads, they're representatives of their respective corporations. Howard's wife even receives orders directly from a shadowy figure implied to either be Vault-Tec's CEO or an even higher authority. I don't expect an American tv show to say that communism is good and capitalism is bad, but I DO expect a Fallout tv show to say that America itself is bad, and not just the "professional managerial class" or the shadowy corporate cabals. It saps itself of all meaningful critique and ultimately says nothing, which is a credit I have to give to the Bethesda games. At least they presented some interesting ideas. This is just exhuming the corpse of Fallout to manipulate it like a marionette and tell an even worse story. America is a conspiracy of the powerful, and even though people on the ground think their values matter, they don’t. I don’t see how reflecting this lets Americans off the hook. Because they all end up paying the price for it. Robert loving House is one of the people at that table, so yes, the people at that table are the corporate heads of the military industrial complex. Also, are we pretending that the United States government isn’t a puppet to corporate interests now? Because I don’t think that’s true.
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Apr 13, 2024 20:05
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so are the fallout games any good or what
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Apr 13, 2024 20:06
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:so are the fallout games any good or what Dunno
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Apr 13, 2024 20:06
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Clip-On Fedora posted:America is a conspiracy of the powerful You sure about that? 
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Apr 13, 2024 20:09
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Tankbuster posted:you could just watch chinese media lmao. When I said culture, I mean American culture. lol sorry about that. But yeah, it’s that or South Korea.
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Apr 13, 2024 20:11
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