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MODS CURE JOKES posted:Maybe...we should take the cop's engagement and professed socialism at face value and not treat him like some otherwordly bad guy from the first Star trek series???? *looks back at entire history of the FBI* i think being cautious is good, actually
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Aug 7, 2017 01:11
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The idea that cops prevent anything is generally a convenient, self-serving lie. They're not that much of a deterrent and it obscures their actual reason to exist.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:11
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Small brain:Relin posted:the best cop probably still has a high school education. an american high school education. they need to be educated in a non patronizing way, not excluded totally out of hand Nitrousoxide posted:My hot take is that people won't stop raping or trying to kill other people just because you collectivize the means of production. BrutalistMcDonalds posted:a cop helped me change my tire on the side of the highway once. TomViolence posted:even the best cop's literal job is protecting capital, if they had a social conscience they wouldn't be doing that job
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Aug 7, 2017 01:12
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*stands up to address the DSA* I.... I... ahh... I am... a gamer.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:12
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MODS CURE JOKES posted:Maybe...we should take the cop's engagement and professed socialism at face value and not treat him like some otherwordly bad guy from the first Star trek series???? no once they put on that hat the cop brain worm gets into them and turns all the hate minority switches in and the class solidarity switches off
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Aug 7, 2017 01:12
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i've heard a lot about these national socialists and if they say they're socialists we should work with them imo
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Aug 7, 2017 01:12
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Rhukatah posted:Small brain: Multi-dimensional brain: Everyone in the DSA becomes a cop and uses entryism to make the police a force for socialism
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Aug 7, 2017 01:13
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the next dsa convention should have gold fringe around the door just to be safeVenom Snake posted:I don't know what you mean by the former. they're veterans and not soldiers. they're not currently employed as armed representatives of the state. i would be careful about putting them in positions of leadership or authority, regardless
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Aug 7, 2017 01:13
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If we are all cops then the FBI can't coopt us checkmate COINHOTEL PROFESSIONALS
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Aug 7, 2017 01:14
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personally context is everything around this and i think we will find out how recent/extensive his activity was. the real thing for me to think about is that dsa got 3 hours out of the adjournment of the 1000 people meeting and the singing of the internationale before the drama bomb set off
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Aug 7, 2017 01:14
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Democratic Socialists of America: We're all cops now
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Aug 7, 2017 01:15
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The central problem that undercuts any nuanced consideration of his career is that he seems to have deliberately downplayed his work with a police union. If he'd been upfront about it, we could have had the same debate before he got on the NPC. Since he did not, we now have a super embarrassing black eye even in the best case scenario.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:15
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Business Gorillas posted:*looks back at entire history of the FBI* I can understand if he was a fed but if he's just like, tangentially related to LE, we should save our energy for retroactively looking for moles instead of casting aspersions on people trying to help us out
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Aug 7, 2017 01:15
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I'm all for increased skepticism of cops based on the long and storied history of law enforcement vis a vis leftism in this country and this guy's evasive language re: his background is enough of a red flag that I'd be in favor of him stepping down. I just don't think former cops and soldiers are ontologically evil or reactionary, even if the majority of the members of both of those organizations are
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Aug 7, 2017 01:16
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According to Our Revolution, Bernie Sanders' semi-autobiographical book about himself and his 2016 campaign for the Democratic nomination, Cops voted for Bernie when he ran for Mayor of Burlington.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:16
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if the election was close the few dozen infiltrators that were definitely there might have helped swing it
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Aug 7, 2017 01:16
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*ripping open envelope* im happy to announce the new head of DSA campus outreach... Terry Norman?!
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Aug 7, 2017 01:18
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Rhukatah posted:According to Our Revolution, Bernie Sanders' semi-autobiographical book about himself and his 2016 campaign for the Democratic nomination, Cops voted for Bernie when he ran for Mayor of Burlington. It should be pretty easy to sell them on socialism if they realize it means that they don't have to bust skulls for profit (ticket revenue) and can actually focus on issues that matter to their community. if you told a cop they could still live comfortably and never have to do something for a lovely reason again they might enjoy being able to sleep at night
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Aug 7, 2017 01:20
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my whiskey and making fun of roberts rules parlimentarians splinter group is still accepting applications (no cops)
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Aug 7, 2017 01:20
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i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org
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Aug 7, 2017 01:20
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R. Guyovich posted:if the election was close the few dozen infiltrators that were definitely there might have helped swing it i really hope danny was acting in good faith. im pissed about the whole situation and if he was in good faith i wish he would have thought about what kind of effect this could have on the org. also the timing of everything is seriously agitation coming from either a subversive within the group or reactionaries from out hoping we cannibalize ourselves
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Aug 7, 2017 01:22
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Also lmao @ the idea of anyone from our braindead political right being savvy enough to pass for a socialist in tyool 2017gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org Yeah dude don't wanna get blackballed from all those sweet employment opportunities Oh wait
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Aug 7, 2017 01:22
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org
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Aug 7, 2017 01:22
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org i agree
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Aug 7, 2017 01:23
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TomViolence posted:whoah whoah whoah no you fuckin don't Why not?
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Aug 7, 2017 01:23
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org i have some bad fuckin news if you don't think the appropriate agencies already have membership rolls
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Aug 7, 2017 01:25
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I nominate the corpse of J Edger Hoover for NPC
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Aug 7, 2017 01:25
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i'm the guy who thinks that the org who's current opsec involves "CCing every delegate to each other instead of BCCing them" keeps the NSA, CIA, and FBI from getting whatever info they want from their servers
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Aug 7, 2017 01:26
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org if they use a computer to store membership lists i've got some bad news....
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Aug 7, 2017 01:26
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org what if the dsa....isn't a radical leftist org *stadium full of people cheers, i have dunked the basketball and won the big game*
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Aug 7, 2017 01:26
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In the future membership rolls will be kept on literal rolls of parchment. Every member must come to the next convention in order to be counted
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Aug 7, 2017 01:27
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Jeb! Repetition posted:Why not? Pretty much because crime under a socialist system that has definitively put capitalism to bed without its supper would be nothing like crime as we know it now. Consequently the approach to managing or combating such crime would require a solution radically different to the forms of police force that have hitherto existed under capitalism. At the very least a drastically less militarised agency whose purview does not include repression of dissenters and minorities, futile drug wars, mass incarceration or frivolously prosecuting property crime.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:27
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also its not like its painfully easy for LE to look up financial transactions and flag all the people giving money to DSA for membership
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Aug 7, 2017 01:27
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R. Guyovich posted:what if the dsa....isn't a radical leftist org Yeah I was gonna say this. The DSA is democratic (says so in the name) and in favor of following the law. Dunno if that counts as radical.
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Aug 7, 2017 01:28
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TomViolence posted:Pretty much because crime under a socialist system that has definitively put capitalism to bed without its supper would be nothing like crime as we know it now. Consequently the approach to managing or combating such crime would require a solution radically different to the forms of police force that have hitherto existed under capitalism. At the very least a drastically less militarised agency whose purview does not include repression of dissenters and minorities, futile drug wars, mass incarceration or frivolously prosecuting property crime. Mm, yeah, but wouldn't people enforcing laws still be police?
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Aug 7, 2017 01:28
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gently caress. marry. t-rex posted:i dont think anyone even tangentially related to law enforcement should have access to the complete membership rolls of a radical leftist org Good thing we're only talking about the DSA then 🇰🇵  🇰🇵Dammit: R. Guyovich posted:what if the dsa....isn't a radical leftist org
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Aug 7, 2017 01:29
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Venom Snake posted:Multi-dimensional brain: Everyone in the DSA becomes a cop and uses entryism to make the police a force for socialism this is unironically what neo nazi/far-right organizations have adopted as a strategy. so, another reason to organize individuals that're cops, veterans, etc. is so that, if there's ever a revolution or widespread political violence, the left won't just be a bunch of dweebs who can't do a violence
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Aug 7, 2017 01:29
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"i don't want the police to have my information!!!" *clicks Accept to the DSA General Meeting facebook event*
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Aug 7, 2017 01:29
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TomViolence posted:Pretty much because crime under a socialist system that has definitively put capitalism to bed without its supper would be nothing like crime as we know it now. Consequently the approach to managing or combating such crime would require a solution radically different to the forms of police force that have hitherto existed under capitalism. At the very least a drastically less militarised agency whose purview does not include repression of dissenters and minorities, futile drug wars, mass incarceration or frivolously prosecuting property crime. the last four things are a given but idk what you're hoping will happen to the inevitable counter-revolution if not, at the very least, politely repressed. if you're talking about after that, then sure. yes. but that's a stage of socialism that has yet to be achieved in reality anywhere
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Aug 7, 2017 01:30
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I regret to inform everyone that the Posadists have been infiltrated by military service dolphins
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Aug 7, 2017 01:30
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