EVE 2021: Much Abloo About Dr. Who

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > The MMO HMO > EVE 2021: Much Abloo About Dr. Who

supersnowman: Oct 3, 2012

I'm not sure which is worse. The posts about how we should switch from jabber to discord or the post about how the fittings should be in a different place than the currently established location.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 15:55

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# ? Jun 12, 2024 10:00

Erulisse: Feb 12, 2019; A bad poster trying to get better.

Smells of piss...pisspee separatist talks!

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:01

Zerg Mans: Oct 19, 2006

Looking at the sov map and its still hilarious how TEST moved to the farthest possible point away from delve

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:15

Foulbrood: May 17, 2004; This is it, Jonesy!

Krogort posted:

What the wiki can do and the fit tool doesn�t is explain what a ship is good for and give a few use case with tips on how to be good with it.

For exemple say that a interceptor can be used as a shuttle provided you put some inertia stab, a shield extender and don�t forget to activate the nullification module at every jump.
Or pointing that the omen Navy can be fitted like your classic Amarr brick but is also a pretty good kiter unlike the aforementioned bricks.

Even the doctrine forum doesn�t give much explanation about why poo poo is done a certain way and not another.

This is basically what I was thinking when bringing up the wiki. The fits and doctrine stuff all makes sense and the new system is a lot better than having to flip between wiki and in game. It's mostly for the general game information - though EVE University Wiki has some of that covered now - when I'm looking for "small/big/solo pvp gud fites" advice or how the interdiction nullifier works. Did see the planned archiving of the current wiki in favor of a more concise, slimmer version, which I think sounds great.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:22

Dalael: Oct 14, 2014; Hello. Yep, I still think Atlantis is Bolivia, yep, I'm still a giant idiot, yep, I'm still a huge racist. Some things never change!

zegermans posted:

Looking at the sov map and its still hilarious how TEST moved to the farthest possible point away from delve

Test woulda moved in Jove space if :ccp:

let them

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:23

CainFortea: Oct 15, 2004

sebmojo posted:

I'm the biggest idiot and they are desperately easy to find

You are not the biggest idiot, as is evidenced by the recent posting. I mean, the loving moron is totally gonna go fix the wiki now, a thing that no one uses for fits because fits are available in every other place in far easier ways.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:24

Erulisse: Feb 12, 2019; A bad poster trying to get better.

This deserves a big red FITS ARE HERE in fleet doctrines subforum :v

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:31

Dalmuti: Apr 8, 2007

fits should be posted on corp mails

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:35

Sickening: Jul 16, 2007; Black summer was the best summer.

Dalmuti posted:

fits should be posted on corp mails

Free the corp mail. Down with the directorate.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:38

CainFortea: Oct 15, 2004

Dalmuti posted:

fits should be posted on corp mails

and make sure everyone does reply all to ask questions like "Will this work with AWU IV?" or "can I use a drake instead?"

# ? Aug 31, 2021 16:51

CopperHound: Feb 14, 2012

CainFortea posted:

"Will this work with AWU IV?"

I just leave one gun offline because I'm afraid to ask questions.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:20

Dalael: Oct 14, 2014; Hello. Yep, I still think Atlantis is Bolivia, yep, I'm still a giant idiot, yep, I'm still a huge racist. Some things never change!

Krogort posted:

What the wiki can do and the fit tool doesn�t is explain what a ship is good for and give a few use case with tips on how to be good with it.

For exemple say that a interceptor can be used as a shuttle provided you put some inertia stab, a shield extender and don�t forget to activate the nullification module at every jump.
Or pointing that the omen Navy can be fitted like your classic Amarr brick but is also a pretty good kiter unlike the aforementioned bricks.

Even the doctrine forum doesn�t give much explanation about why poo poo is done a certain way and not another.

[qu

Andohz posted:

The fitting channels aren't always up to date, which is what this whole discussion is about. As a newbee I used those fits until I realized they weren't the same as in the doctrine threads, luckily before I needed SRP.

The goon fit app is nice but last I checked for ADM fits it didn't have them, meaning I still have to use both.

Saul Kain posted:

Which is why the only updated and current place to always find fits is on the forums in the fittings threads. Go there, get fits. The wiki is out of date and can�t be relied upon. The goonfits channel is helpful but again is not maintained by the fitting team. Arguing about this is pointless unless someone feels inclined to take it upon themselves to fix what they deem to be a shortfall. If you are not willing to fix what you deem to be a shortfall, don�t complain about it. Sickening is the most egregious offender of the �complains about something then becomes conspicuously absent when someone suggests THEY fix what they are complaining about.�

Sickening posted:

You turds are just making poo poo up now lmao.

Saul Kain posted:

So you're volunteering to fix the wiki?

Sickening posted:

Sure, why not. Grant me the wiki roles and I will start the impossible task of posting fits there instead of 5 separated locations.

Saul Kain posted:

https://wiki.goonfleet.com/Goonwiki:Contributing

Goonspeed. I will stop slandering you now.

ote

Dalael posted:

Holy gently caress you guys are such whiny little shits.

If opening the forum, clicking on the big words that say" FLEET DOCTRINES AND REIMBURSEMENT" and then clicking on the post that says "GOONSWARM FEDERATION: UNIFIED STRATEGIC DOCTRINE is too much work for you all, how about you do it once then bookmark the page and put the bookmark in your browser tab for easy access?

https://goonfleet.com/index.php/topic/296794-goonswarm-federation-unified-strategic-doctrine-mk-xi/ <---- Click this link and bookmark it.

It is unreasonable to expect every thing to be done for you all, and handholding you to this level is why people working in the service industry want to kill themselves all the time. I don't remember why, but Arrendis once clearly explained why they chose the forum for fitting doctrines and at the time it made a lot of sense.

There is no reason to make a deal about this. Its about the same number of clicks. The fits are updated and you can easily copy them into EVE.

="Dalmuti"

Saul Kain posted:

Sorry, I wasn't trying to call you out specifically. You post brings up a valid point that there are disparate places where to find fits. Which is why I mentioned where the officially-updated fits reside on goonfleet dot com.

I was also using your post as a springboard to re-interate the old adage "if you're not part of the solution, you are part of the problem."

In my experience Goonfleet has been so successful largely because we've empowered our lowest level to fix problems if they see them. "Wanna FC? no problem here is Skirmish commanders". "Can you code? Sweet see if you can fix this problem." See something, say something AND THEN demand to be part of the solution to something. Leaving out the last part is just complaining for the sake of complaining.

The wiki is a giant herculean task which Sickening has so graciously agreed to take on. I'll be honest, I missed that fireside. If the wiki is getting a clean slate, all the better.

post="

evilweasel posted:

surely a high-paid computer toucher knows the defining feature of a wiki w/r/t the required roles to make edits

Jazzzzz posted:

At one point sometime late last year Atrum had given roles to a few bees to keep the in-game corp fittings sync'd with the forum fittings. I take it those people hosed off/won Eve?

captainclaw posted:

i hope I'm not the only one that can see the irony in a corp made up of people posting on forums, that are complaining that fits are posted on forums

Sickening posted:

Ah yes, the highly paid field of wiki janitoring.

The Protagonist posted:

fits in forums?? shitposts come outta there!!

supersnowman posted:

I'm not sure which is worse. The posts about how we should switch from jabber to discord or the post about how the fittings should be in a different place than the currently established location.

7372220"]
fits should be posted on corp mails
[/quote]

Sickening posted:

Free the corp mail. Down with the directorate.

CainFortea posted:

and make sure everyone does reply all to ask questions like "Will this work with AWU IV?" or "can I use a drake instead?"

AWU V is a must for most things and yes you can now bring your drake

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:24

SHISHKABOB: Nov 30, 2012; Fun Shoe

One thing I'd like to see in the fitting thread is a basic rundown of how the doctrine operates from a regular fleet member's perspective. Maybe even just the default anchor type. I feel like 90% of the time the FC says "anchor up" and I have to ask "what's the anchor". Generally only takes a couple fleets to figure it out and remember for next time, but it would save a bit of grief if I could just see "keep at range 2500m MWD active" when I check the fit for the first time.

I feel like there was a start to making some threads like these but I can't remember where they are or if there was more than just the jackdaw one.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:28

Dik Hz: Feb 22, 2004; Fun with Science

I feel like they should just get rid of fitting skills at this point, for the same reason they did away with learning skills.

I remember when I first started playing many years ago and how much it sucked to train a bunch of skills that were pretty much required but didn't give me any fun new toys to play with.

The optimal way to start a character back then was to create it and then not play it for 3+ months while you trained learning skills and fitting skills. That's especially lovely for your first character, y'know.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:41

Sickening: Jul 16, 2007; Black summer was the best summer.

Dik Hz posted:

I feel like they should just get rid of fitting skills at this point, for the same reason they did away with learning skills.

I remember when I first started playing many years ago and how much it sucked to train a bunch of skills that were pretty much required but didn't give me any fun new toys to play with.

The optimal way to start a character back then was to create it and then not play it for 3+ months while you trained learning skills and fitting skills. That's especially lovely for your first character, y'know.

Can they remove fitting skills without giving the entirety of eve millions of sp in reimbursements? Do they make other skills longer to compensate for time=submoney calculations?

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:46

Kitfox88: Aug 21, 2007; Anybody lose their glasses?

Dik Hz posted:

I feel like they should just get rid of fitting skills at this point, for the same reason they did away with learning skills.

I remember when I first started playing many years ago and how much it sucked to train a bunch of skills that were pretty much required but didn't give me any fun new toys to play with.

The optimal way to start a character back then was to create it and then not play it for 3+ months while you trained learning skills and fitting skills. That's especially lovely for your first character, y'know.

Same, ditch fitting skills and refund that so I can learn things that let me have fun tia

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:48

Gwyneth Palpate: Jun 7, 2010; Do you want your breadcrumbs highlighted?

~SMcD

what they need to do is get rid of attributes, and just give everyone the equivalent of +5s or w/e naturally

# ? Aug 31, 2021 17:59

evilweasel: Aug 24, 2002

Gwyneth Palpate posted:

what they need to do is get rid of attributes, and just give everyone the equivalent of +5s or w/e naturally

that'd collapse mission running

you'd need implants to still exist, they'd just all boost your training speed by some amount with a small set bonus that when you have a full head of them roughly corresponds to the benefit you get from a full head of +1s/+2s/+5s etc

or just force all characters to equal base attributes and have implants be the only thing that distinguishes but that would be dumb

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:01

Micromancer: Apr 17, 2002; He went out to the store
and when he got back
Roll-marks said .22 Short, jack.
If anything I could say that
this gun was rare
Its covered it sweat,
toilet water, and hair

expand the attribute list so each tree has a different major and minor skill that affects it

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:11

Hexel: Nov 18, 2011

evilweasel posted:

that'd collapse mission running

i'm ok with this

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:16

Dalmuti: Apr 8, 2007

Micromancer posted:

expand the attribute list so each tree has a different major and minor skill that affects it

Hop around your capsule to train athletics or just wander around seyda been until you get the scrolls of Icarian flight

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:24

Erulisse: Feb 12, 2019; A bad poster trying to get better.

Dalael posted:

[qu

ote

="Dalmuti"

Yes please, now do this every page and I won't need to login for the corpmail experience!
Also I'm offended no one liked my hard worked paste about goonfleet dot comme posting virgins :<

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:29

Johnny Five-Jaces: Jan 21, 2009

please stop quoting Sickening in this thread

# ? Aug 31, 2021 18:58

lovely tuna snatch: Feb 10, 2010

Dalmuti posted:

fits should be posted on corp mails

Make it alliance mails so everyone could suffer.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:03

CainFortea: Oct 15, 2004

Johnny Five-Jaces posted:

please stop quoting Sickening ~~in this thread~~

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:04

Dalmuti: Apr 8, 2007

Sickening is a lovely boy

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:06

Collateral Damage: Jun 13, 2009

Gwyneth Palpate posted:

what they need to do is get rid of attributes, and just give everyone the equivalent of +5s or w/e naturally

I've been saying this for ages. Attributes are stupid and only in the game because of CCPs earlier WoD aspirations.

Attributes and remaps are nothing but another trap for new players to fall into and get demoralized when they realize they hosed up and now they're stuck with every important skill taking even longer to train.

Remove attributes, normalize training speed for all skills and replace attribute implants with +% training speed implants.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:10

GSV Fuck Your God: Aug 27, 2003; small-l liberalism

As a returning player, I like the goonfits channels and don't see wiki entries as necessary.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:11

CainFortea: Oct 15, 2004

Collateral Damage posted:

I've been saying this for ages. Attributes are stupid and only in the game because of CCPs earlier WoD aspirations.

Attributes far pre-date the whole WoD thing.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:12

Collateral Damage: Jun 13, 2009

CainFortea posted:

Attributes far pre-date the whole WoD thing.

I stand corrected.

Every feature of a game should be viewed through a lens of "Is this an interesting addition to the game, or just a tedium?"

Attributes definitely fall into the latter, just like learning skills did.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:16

The Locator: Sep 12, 2004; Out here, everything hurts.

Oh god.. I had completely forgotten about learning skills.. those sucked.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:29

Warmachine: Jan 30, 2012

Collateral Damage posted:

I stand corrected.

Every feature of a game should be viewed through a lens of "Is this an interesting addition to the game, or just a tedium?"

Attributes definitely fall into the latter, just like learning skills did.

This is correct. At best, they're another thing to juggle and optimize against when building a training queue. At worst, they are a trap for new players to gently caress up, as already stated. Unless you're actively factoring them in using something like Evemon, you probably don't even realize how much time the optimization can save.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 19:44

1001 Arabian dicks: Sep 16, 2013; EVE ONLINE IS MY ENTIRE PERSONALITY BECAUSE IM A FRIENDLESS SEMILITERATE LOSER WHO WILL PEDANTICALLY DEMAND PROOF FOR BASIC THINGS LIKE GRAVITY OR THE EXISTENCE OF SELF. ASK ME ABOUT CHEATING AT TARKOV BECAUSE, WELL, SEE ABOVE

Collateral Damage posted:

with +% training speed implants.

I fixed your system CCP, don't @ me:

All attributes are combined into one attribute called [smartness]. It's base score is 27. Remaps are removed.

Slot 1: Limited [Smartness] Implant : +1 to smartness
Slot 1: Limited [Smartness] Implant - Beta : +2 to smartness
Slot 1: [Smartness] Implant - Basic : +3 to smartness

Slot 6: [Smartness] Implant - Standard : +1 to smartness
Slot 6 : [Smartness] Implant - Improved : +2 to smartness
Slot 6 : [Smartness] Implant - OMEGA : +3 to smartness

Low grades give +1, Mid grades give +2, and High grades give +3 in slots 1 and 6. (but this implant set i like doesn't have high grades/lowgrades waaaaaah- shut the gently caress up, it's called flavor, i love beautiful asymmetry and you should too)

The prices and costs associated with buying implants should go up by double, and the new OMEGA tier learning implant should cost over triple but less than quintuple of the Improved variant in the LP store.

Also CCP tiericide the names into something not stupid while you're at it, and this is a flawless idea that just makes your game better ya fuckin doofs, there is literally no downside it's just pure perfection and amazing.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 20:12

Krogort: Oct 27, 2013

Any implant related to learning should be cheap. People should not have to choose between having fun doing cool stuff and sitting in station learning skills so they can maybe possibly have fun later if they haven�t burnt out of the game by then.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 20:20

1001 Arabian dicks: Sep 16, 2013; EVE ONLINE IS MY ENTIRE PERSONALITY BECAUSE IM A FRIENDLESS SEMILITERATE LOSER WHO WILL PEDANTICALLY DEMAND PROOF FOR BASIC THINGS LIKE GRAVITY OR THE EXISTENCE OF SELF. ASK ME ABOUT CHEATING AT TARKOV BECAUSE, WELL, SEE ABOVE

Krogort posted:

Any implant related to learning should be cheap. People should not have to choose between having fun doing cool stuff and sitting in station learning skills so they can maybe possibly have fun later if they haven�t burnt out of the game by then.

disagree, you aren't not learning skills even when you have no implants, and implants need to have value

# ? Aug 31, 2021 20:39

The Protagonist: Jun 29, 2009; The average is 5.5? I thought it was 4. This is very unsettling.

implants should have a chance to drop from corpses, but you need to scoop the corpse and bring it to a special extraction facility w/ associated skills & quality tiers/chance of extract failure

such dropped implants would be tagged with the name of their original owners, making such things potentially quite collectable!

# ? Aug 31, 2021 21:55

Warmachine: Jan 30, 2012

The Protagonist posted:

implants should have a chance to drop from corpses, but you need to scoop the corpse and bring it to a special extraction facility w/ associated skills & quality tiers/chance of extract failure

such dropped implants would be tagged with the name of their original owners, making such things potentially quite collectable!

This would actually be fun...

# ? Aug 31, 2021 21:58

Rhymenoserous: May 23, 2008

Krogort posted:

Any implant related to learning should be cheap. People should not have to choose between having fun doing cool stuff and sitting in station learning skills so they can maybe possibly have fun later if they haven�t burnt out of the game by then.

Snakes are in fact a form of learning implant. They are also made of goes fast and I�ve lost way too many of them by forgetting I had them plugged in while flying something dumb. Cheap snakes for all if I am elected president.

# ? Aug 31, 2021 21:59

Agrikk: Oct 17, 2003; Take care with that! We have not fully ascertained its function, and the ticking is accelerating.

Dik Hz posted:

The optimal way to start a character back then was to create it and then not play it

ftfy

# ? Aug 31, 2021 22:05

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# ? Jun 12, 2024 10:00

1001 Arabian dicks: Sep 16, 2013; EVE ONLINE IS MY ENTIRE PERSONALITY BECAUSE IM A FRIENDLESS SEMILITERATE LOSER WHO WILL PEDANTICALLY DEMAND PROOF FOR BASIC THINGS LIKE GRAVITY OR THE EXISTENCE OF SELF. ASK ME ABOUT CHEATING AT TARKOV BECAUSE, WELL, SEE ABOVE

The Protagonist posted:

implants should have a chance to drop from corpses, but you need to scoop the corpse and bring it to a special extraction facility w/ associated skills & quality tiers/chance of extract failure

such dropped implants would be tagged with the name of their original owners, making such things potentially quite collectable!

disagree, but you should be able to salvage the corpse to get generic implant salvage that can be processed into lovely temporary skill training speed boosters or something

1001 Arabian dicks fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Aug 31, 2021

# ? Aug 31, 2021 22:09

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