p-lang thread: (now (have you (problems two)))

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > YOSPOS > p-lang thread: (now (have you (problems two)))

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tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

eschaton posted:

no what the hell

that�s as bad as calling dictionaries �hashes,� it winds up implying too much about implementation that people then depend on and can then therefore never change

what are these people smoking

turns out a hashtable into an array of string pointers is cheaper than a hash table to string pointers

# ? Apr 12, 2018 13:31

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 00:38

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

"i wish i could quit you"

code:

Finished building: "../main.c"
 
Building target: "isp_firmware.out"
Invoking: GNU Linker
"C:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/arm-none-eabi-gcc.exe" -O1 -Os -g -gdwarf-3 -gstrict-dwarf -Wall -Wl,-Map,"isp_firmware.map" -o"isp_firmware.out" "./adc.o" "./caldata.o" "./dac.o" "./main.o" "./quarantine.o" "./spi_commo.o"  -Wl,--start-group -lc -Wl,--end-group 
makefile:147: recipe for target 'isp_firmware.out' failed
c:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/../lib/gcc/arm-none-eabi/7.2.1/../../../../arm-none-eabi/lib\libc.a(lib_a-exit.o): In function `exit':
exit.c:(.text.exit+0x2c): undefined reference to `_exit'
collect2.exe: error: ld returned 1 exit status
gmake[1]: *** [isp_firmware.out] Error 1
gmake: *** [all] Error 2
makefile:143: recipe for target 'all' failed

**** Build Finished ****

(the fix was exactly what you think it was, but thanks TI for literally never clicking build on an example project before shipping your IDE)

# ? Apr 12, 2018 14:08

Ralith: Jan 12, 2011; I see a ship in the harbor
I can and shall obey
But if it wasn't for your misfortune
I'd be a heavenly person today

Rust has a distinct random seed for every hash table (when using the default hasher), but it's a security thing to make it more difficult for an attacker that controls keys to synthesize collisions.

# ? Apr 12, 2018 17:32

Sapozhnik: Jan 2, 2005; Nap Ghost

and rust's ordered dictionaries use b-trees instead of red-black trees because b-trees are cache friendlier

rust's stdlib is good

# ? Apr 12, 2018 18:00

Soricidus: Oct 21, 2010; freedom-hating statist shill

yeah having a well defined iteration order is fine. you only run into problems when it�s predictable enough that people rely on it, but not defined so they shouldn�t

the point of randomizing hash seeds to to prevent attacks that force lots of things into the same bucket, not to randomise the iteration order. python just doesn�t use the bucket order for iteration any more.

# ? Apr 12, 2018 18:32

Gazpacho: Jun 18, 2004; by Fluffdaddy; Slippery Tilde

Blotto Skorzany posted:

"i wish i could quit you"

code:

Finished building: "../main.c"
 
Building target: "isp_firmware.out"
Invoking: GNU Linker
"C:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/arm-none-eabi-gcc.exe" -O1 -Os -g -gdwarf-3 -gstrict-dwarf -Wall -Wl,-Map,"isp_firmware.map" -o"isp_firmware.out" "./adc.o" "./caldata.o" "./dac.o" "./main.o" "./quarantine.o" "./spi_commo.o"  -Wl,--start-group -lc -Wl,--end-group 
makefile:147: recipe for target 'isp_firmware.out' failed
c:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/../lib/gcc/arm-none-eabi/7.2.1/../../../../arm-none-eabi/lib\libc.a(lib_a-exit.o): In function `exit':
exit.c:(.text.exit+0x2c): undefined reference to `_exit'
collect2.exe: error: ld returned 1 exit status
gmake[1]: *** [isp_firmware.out] Error 1
gmake: *** [all] Error 2
makefile:143: recipe for target 'all' failed

**** Build Finished ****

(the fix was exactly what you think it was, but thanks TI for literally never clicking build on an example project before shipping your IDE)

It�s your fault for exiting from a microcontroller program, who does that

# ? Apr 12, 2018 19:09

JawnV6: Jul 4, 2004; So hot ...

Blotto Skorzany posted:

thanks TI for literally never clicking build on an example project before shipping your IDE

following standard industry practices

# ? Apr 12, 2018 19:11

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

Gazpacho posted:

It�s your fault for exiting from a microcontroller program, who does that

the callsite is in ti's autogenerated asm startup boilerplate that i stupidly used instead of writing my own

# ? Apr 12, 2018 19:26

carry on then: Jul 10, 2010; by VideoGames
(and can't post for 10 years!)

Blotto Skorzany posted:

"i wish i could quit you"

code:

Finished building: "../main.c"
 
Building target: "isp_firmware.out"
Invoking: GNU Linker
"C:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/arm-none-eabi-gcc.exe" -O1 -Os -g -gdwarf-3 -gstrict-dwarf -Wall -Wl,-Map,"isp_firmware.map" -o"isp_firmware.out" "./adc.o" "./caldata.o" "./dac.o" "./main.o" "./quarantine.o" "./spi_commo.o"  -Wl,--start-group -lc -Wl,--end-group 
makefile:147: recipe for target 'isp_firmware.out' failed
c:/ti/ccsv8/tools/compiler/gcc-arm-none-eabi-7-2017-q4-major-win32/bin/../lib/gcc/arm-none-eabi/7.2.1/../../../../arm-none-eabi/lib\libc.a(lib_a-exit.o): In function `exit':
exit.c:(.text.exit+0x2c): undefined reference to `_exit'
collect2.exe: error: ld returned 1 exit status
gmake[1]: *** [isp_firmware.out] Error 1
gmake: *** [all] Error 2
makefile:143: recipe for target 'all' failed

**** Build Finished ****

(the fix was exactly what you think it was, but thanks TI for literally never clicking build on an example project before shipping your IDE)

sure i'll ask, what's the fix

# ? Apr 12, 2018 20:46

Gazpacho: Jun 18, 2004; by Fluffdaddy; Slippery Tilde

eschaton posted:

no what the hell

that�s as bad as calling dictionaries �hashes,� it winds up implying too much about implementation that people then depend on and can then therefore never change

what are these people smoking

hash

# ? Apr 12, 2018 21:16

Sapozhnik: Jan 2, 2005; Nap Ghost

"map" is a perfectly adequate generic term.
"dictionary" implies ordering imo, by analogy with its printed and bound namesake.
"hash" implies a hash table implementation of some kind and the existence of an associated "hashable" protocol for potential key types.

as with so many other things, java gets this right (interface Map, classes HashMap and TreeMap).

carry on then posted:

sure i'll ask, what's the fix

don't call exit

what does it mean to exit from a bare-metal program

# ? Apr 12, 2018 21:49

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

carry on then posted:

sure i'll ask, what's the fix

either provide a no-op _exit() for the linker to find or dig through the startup boilerplate asm and delete the call to exit() [and then if the startup assembly routines get overwritten from some template when you do a clean-and-build, delete the part of the template that's inserting calls to exit()]

# ? Apr 12, 2018 22:00

Cyberpunkey Monkey: Jun 23, 2003; by Nyc_Tattoo

Blotto Skorzany posted:

(the fix was exactly what you think it was, but thanks TI for literally never clicking build on an example project before shipping your IDE)

Only registered members can see post attachments!

# ? Apr 12, 2018 22:01

Bloody: Mar 3, 2013

Sapozhnik posted:

"map" is a perfectly adequate generic term.
"dictionary" implies ordering imo, by analogy with its printed and bound namesake.
"hash" implies a hash table implementation of some kind and the existence of an associated "hashable" protocol for potential key types.

as with so many other things, java gets this right (interface Map, classes HashMap and TreeMap).

don't call exit

what does it mean to exit from a bare-metal program

disable interrupts and turn off the clock

# ? Apr 13, 2018 00:12

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

Sapozhnik posted:

"map" is a perfectly adequate generic term.
"dictionary" implies ordering imo, by analogy with its printed and bound namesake.
"hash" implies a hash table implementation of some kind and the existence of an associated "hashable" protocol for potential key types.

as with so many other things, java gets this right (interface Map, classes HashMap and TreeMap).

don't call exit

what does it mean to exit from a bare-metal program

The worst offender by far is std::unordered_map which is literally just a hash table.

# ? Apr 13, 2018 07:15

aardvaard: Mar 4, 2013; you belong in the bog of eternal stench

what's wrong with that name

it specifies exactly what it is without including any details about its implementation

# ? Apr 13, 2018 15:55

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

CommunistPancake posted:

what's wrong with that name

it specifies exactly what it is without including any details about its implementation

Except it's specifically defined as a hash table in the standard.

# ? Apr 13, 2018 16:48

rjmccall: Sep 7, 2007; no worries friend; Fun Shoe

basically all maps define their basic implementation in the interface if they allow any sort of (stored) key customization at all

does it require a comparison function? guess what, it�s some sort of search tree

does it require a hash operation? guess what

i mean i guess you could make a map that silently degraded to a linear scan if the key was neither hashable or comparable but that sounds loving terrible

# ? Apr 13, 2018 17:15

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

if your hash functions are bad enough you can do that transparently

# ? Apr 13, 2018 18:59

Wheany: Mar 17, 2006; Spinya^{ha^{ha^haha}ha}ha_{ha_{ha_haha}ha}ha!; Doctor Rope

node related programs fail because of spaces in paths in 2018

https://github.com/zkat/npx/issues/100

# ? Apr 16, 2018 17:02

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

Wheany posted:

node related programs fail because of spaces in paths in 2018

https://github.com/zkat/npx/issues/100

"Windows bug, wontfix"

# ? Apr 16, 2018 17:14

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

https://github.com/nodejs/node-v0.x-archive/issues/6960

Tldr node is completely incompatible with Windows path limits. Node Dev response "node is not broken, not our fault that this most used operating system in the world has used path limits for 40 odd years."

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:13

repiv: Aug 13, 2009

that's from 2014 when they were still on npm v2

npm v3 flattened out the node_modules directory structure and generally works ok on windows now

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:20

Ralith: Jan 12, 2011; I see a ship in the harbor
I can and shall obey
But if it wasn't for your misfortune
I'd be a heavenly person today

aren't there special low-level windows APIs node could be using that aren't subject to those limits anyway

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:21

Malcolm XML: Aug 8, 2009; I always knew it would end like ｔｈｉｓ．

npm is a hilarious cluster gently caress

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:26

Sapozhnik: Jan 2, 2005; Nap Ghost

Ralith posted:

aren't there special low-level windows APIs node could be using that aren't subject to those limits anyway

kinda. Windows has a constant called MAX_PATH whose value is 260, and a lot of programs have stack declarations like "char path[MAX_PATH];" in them. so windows isn't allowed to even read past the 260 character mark for any api that takes a path because idk i guess lots of people did strncpy()s into those stack buffers and potentially failed to NUL-terminate them.

You can, however, indicate that you wish to opt out of this limit by prepending \\?\ to your path, which wasn't a valid path in non-NT windows.

AFAIK the native wide-char win32 apis still have this restriction, since the wide-char api was designed for smooth migration from the 8-bit char api.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:28

The MUMPSorceress: Jan 6, 2012; ^SHTPSTS; Gary’s Answer

It is pretty stupid that windows still has limits on path depth but drat if you don't know how to work around that as a computer programming professional.

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:29

eschaton: Mar 7, 2007; Don't you just hate when you wind up in a store with people who are in a socioeconomic class that is pretty obviously about two levels lower than your own?

POSIX still defines an unfortunate path limit of PATH_MAX that software winds up using, instead of taking advantage of the fact that C strings can be arbitrary length

it�s just often larger than its minimum spec value of 256

# ? Apr 18, 2018 19:40

Janitor Prime: Jan 22, 2004; PC LOAD LETTER

What da fuck does that mean; Fun Shoe

cis autodrag posted:

It is pretty stupid that windows still has limits on path depth but drat if you don't know how to work around that as a computer programming professional.

I don't spend any time writing software for Windows, why should I know how to work around it's 30 year old cruft

# ? Apr 18, 2018 20:15

Thermopyle: Jul 1, 2003; ...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. �Bertrand Russell

it sounds like you do know how to work around that limit

# ? Apr 18, 2018 20:24

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

Thermopyle posted:

it sounds like you do know how to work around that limit

# ? Apr 18, 2018 20:52

HappyHippo: Nov 19, 2003; Do you have an Air Miles Card?

Null terminated strings were a mistake

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:01

Suspicious Dish: Sep 24, 2011; 2020 is the year of linux on the desktop, bro; Fun Shoe

yeah clearly Linux would never have such a boneheaded API

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:01

Thermopyle: Jul 1, 2003; ...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. �Bertrand Russell

all software is boneheaded

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:21

JawnV6: Jul 4, 2004; So hot ...

HappyHippo posted:

Null terminated strings were a mistake

i wonder what horrendous class of bugs we'd see if pascal style '1b of length prepended' strings were the norm

like you get the strn-flavored calls right out the gate

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:28

qntm: Jun 17, 2009

JawnV6 posted:

i wonder what horrendous class of bugs we'd see if pascal style '1b of length prepended' strings were the norm

like you get the strn-flavored calls right out the gate

my idea was to have every string always be length 256 and indexed with a byte

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:53

The_Franz: Aug 8, 2003

Sapozhnik posted:

kinda. Windows has a constant called MAX_PATH whose value is 260, and a lot of programs have stack declarations like "char path[MAX_PATH];" in them. so windows isn't allowed to even read past the 260 character mark for any api that takes a path because idk i guess lots of people did strncpy()s into those stack buffers and potentially failed to NUL-terminate them.

You can, however, indicate that you wish to opt out of this limit by prepending \\?\ to your path, which wasn't a valid path in non-NT windows.

AFAIK the native wide-char win32 apis still have this restriction, since the wide-char api was designed for smooth migration from the 8-bit char api.

even if you do this, the problem is that you are making paths which other programs can't use. maybe it's fixed now, but for a very long time explorer.exe couldn't deal with long paths.

iirc, most filesystems limit each individual portion of a path to either 255 characters or 255 bytes depending upon the implementation, so MAX_PATH is ok for individual parts of the path.

Suspicious Dish posted:

yeah clearly Linux would never have such a boneheaded API

PATH_MAX is dumb, but it's usually something more reasonable like 1024 or 4096 characters. there have also been steps taken such as deprecating hardcoded path-length functions like getwd() and readdir_r() to get people to stop relying on it.

The_Franz fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Apr 19, 2018

# ? Apr 18, 2018 21:54

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

qntm posted:

my idea was to have every string always be length 256 and indexed with a byte

i think this is how Software Tools (the library referenced repeatedly in the famous "Why Pascal Is Not My Favorite Programming Language" paper) worked

# ? Apr 18, 2018 22:09

tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

is this the rocks in a greenhouse thread

# ? Apr 19, 2018 01:35

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 00:38

tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

qntm posted:

my idea was to have every string always be length 256 and indexed with a byte

"\pNice"

# ? Apr 19, 2018 01:37

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > YOSPOS > p-lang thread: (now (have you (problems two)))

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