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SonicRulez
Aug 6, 2013

GOTTA GO FIST
I'm very proud of this picture.



Also I'm very excited for BLU.

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Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist
Defiance will be less damage than going without stance, (Defiance - 1024 + 350 (1374) in 7 gcds, no stance 1300 potency in 6 GCDs). On the 7th GCD no stance will overtake, and be farther ahead in the combo, gaining ground on each combo. Butcher's Block is also stronger than Storm's Path, and you can use that since you're not gaining beast gauge. This is more pronounced if you're spamming overpower.

The difference is minimal, so if you don't need the aggro, healing bonus, or Inner Beast mitigation, you can probably drop Defiance and just combo until infinity. If you're in a trial or raid and not tanking, there's no reason to have Defiance on.

e: doesn't take into account Unchained, obvs.

Orcs and Ostriches fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Jan 15, 2019

FactsAreUseless
Feb 16, 2011

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

Defiance will be less damage than going without stance, (Defiance - 1024 + 350 (1374) in 7 gcds, no stance 1300 potency in 6 GCDs). On the 7th GCD no stance will overtake, and be farther ahead in the combo, gaining ground on each combo. Butcher's Block is also stronger than Storm's Path, and you can use that since you're not gaining beast gauge. This is more pronounced if you're spamming overpower.

The difference is minimal, so if you don't need the aggro, healing bonus, or Inner Beast mitigation, you can probably drop Defiance and just combo until infinity. If you're in a trial or raid and not tanking, there's no reason to have Defiance on.

e: doesn't take into account Unchained, obvs.
So at low levels, Defiance is really only useful against bosses or other single large enemies, since Overpower is your best DPS at 260/gcd as long as there are at least two enemies in the cone.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

FactsAreUseless posted:

I have like six or seven character of various levels, including a second Elezen. I actually like ARR content and I enjoy the low-level areas a lot - especially La Noscea - so I end up making new characters after I have to take long breaks. Only three of them stuck long-term.

Who hurt you like this

FactsAreUseless
Feb 16, 2011

Eopia posted:

Who hurt you like this
Playing through all of Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy on the NES when I was a kid.

Blueberry Pancakes
Aug 18, 2012

Jack in!! MegaMan, Execute!
Is BLU in two hours or eleven? I'm getting conflicting reports!

I just want to experience the terror of having to deal with those horrifying Gigantoads again!

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

Defiance will be less damage than going without stance, (Defiance - 1024 + 350 (1374) in 7 gcds, no stance 1300 potency in 6 GCDs). On the 7th GCD no stance will overtake, and be farther ahead in the combo, gaining ground on each combo. Butcher's Block is also stronger than Storm's Path, and you can use that since you're not gaining beast gauge. This is more pronounced if you're spamming overpower.

The difference is minimal, so if you don't need the aggro, healing bonus, or Inner Beast mitigation, you can probably drop Defiance and just combo until infinity. If you're in a trial or raid and not tanking, there's no reason to have Defiance on.

e: doesn't take into account Unchained, obvs.

Without Defiance on you don't get IB which makes your berserk feel anemic and makes the class boring.

You'll always have unchained with your berserk in raids and trials so the math should be mapped through berserk and the full berserk cooldown.

I'm fairly certain that the math behind berserk with lined up IBs and unchained means you should always use defiance in raids and trials even if you're not tanking. Even if the math doesn't add up, not using defiance seems boring as gently caress anyways.

SwissArmyDruid
Feb 14, 2014

by sebmojo

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

Is BLU in two hours or eleven? I'm getting conflicting reports!

I just want to experience the terror of having to deal with those horrifying Gigantoads again!

Neither, should be three or four.

Gally
May 31, 2001

Come on!
O12S down!




Fantastic fight, I greatly enjoyed both the twins and final omega form. We only made it past Hello World 2 for the first time tonight and got to 2% enrage on that pull, clearing it the next time we managed to make it through HW2 cleanly. I'm pretty jazzed we cleared everything w/out using any guides.

Alphascape is my most liked raid tier of stormblood, I'm really excited for the raids in Shadowbringers. (I think Coil 2 is still my favorite overall tier, having done them all when they were current)

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist

FactsAreUseless posted:

So at low levels, Defiance is really only useful against bosses or other single large enemies, since Overpower is your best DPS at 260/gcd as long as there are at least two enemies in the cone.

I'd argue Defiance is less useful on single a large target, since their damage is generally very predicable. In theory you can cover most of the important hits with your defensive cooldowns and you won't need the extra oomph that Defiance gives you. Warriors are unique in that their stance doesn't prevent damage, so you take damage very predictably.

Paradoxically, large groups of regular mobs however deal a much higher, much less predictable damage output. At the time you'd want to spam overpower for maximum dps, you might actually need the extra healing / steel cyclone or even aggro generation.

That said it's pretty moot sub level 54. You don't have any offensive options, so the default stance is slightly better on paper than the penalty you get from Defiance. When you get Deliverance and Fel Cleave, the stances really start to spread apart.

jokes posted:

Without Defiance on you don't get IB which makes your berserk feel anemic and makes the class boring.

I just threw it into a spreadsheet. For every 90s window, no stance can do 9260. Staying in Defiance, using unchained, berserking with 100 energy and an infuriate to get 3 IBs, Defiance put out 8990. Uses infuriate on cooldown and whatnot. Assuming a Crit/DH does 200% damage, as a few minutes testing in game did.

Minimal difference, and assumes a 0 % crit/dh outside of berserk. Stanceless would also be boring as you say. I'm not saying either way is better / worse, just some numbers.

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Orcs and Ostriches posted:

I just threw it into a spreadsheet. For every 90s window, no stance can do 9260. Staying in Defiance, using unchained, berserking with 100 energy and an infuriate to get 3 IBs, Defiance put out 8990. Uses infuriate on cooldown and whatnot. Assuming a Crit/DH does 200% damage, as a few minutes testing in game did.

Minimal difference, and assumes a 0 % crit/dh outside of berserk. Stanceless would also be boring as you say. I'm not saying either way is better / worse, just some numbers.

Dude you're awesome for handling the due diligence, I had also been curious about the hard numbers honestly.

Did you calculate berserk with 3 IBs and a butchers block?

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010


The Great Twist

jokes posted:

Dude you're awesome for handling the due diligence, I had also been curious about the hard numbers honestly.

Did you calculate berserk with 3 IBs and a butchers block?

Berserk has 3 IBS, Maim, and Storm's Eye. (4.17 attacks in 10 seconds with a 2.4 gcd. It's probably actually too tight to fit that maim, but I wanted to give Defiance the advantage. Unchained also drops before the first IB to maximize its usefulness) I normally go with Eye, Path, Path, Eye combos, for maximum gauge growth and 100% slash uptime.

If we could drop that Storm's Eye out and put in a BB, you could put another 40 potency in towards full Defiance. (20 difference * 2 for direct crit)

It was a quick hack job spreadsheet so I've likely could optimize both sides slightly.

jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

I think you did a good job of showing how slight the advantage is but also pointing out the technical advantage. I personally think in real-world usage, you'll get more mileage out of the defiance burst vs the no-stance game since a lot of bosses have you moving around doing poo poo.

I think I do WAR right but it's hard to say. On a new boss I'll do a maim/storms eye combo, then alternate BB combos and the 30 gauge ability to get gauge up to 100, refreshing maim/storms eye as necessary. Then I pop berserk and friends, hit a BB, and then 3 IBs/fell cleaves.

Whether it's mathematically the best way to do it, it does sate my constant addiction for buzzsaw sound effects that I got the first time I clicked fell cleave.

Die Sexmonster!
Nov 30, 2005
I really like the Orbonne healer armor.



jokes
Dec 20, 2012

Uh... Kupo?

Oracles were such a weird class in FFT it they definitely weren't healers.

Solo Wing Pixy
Aug 5, 2008

It's an amanojaku!
And it hates you so much!

FactsAreUseless posted:

The female Elezen dance looks exactly like what you would get if you just randomly asked someone to dance with no music or prompting.

Elezen are like anti-elves: their emotes usually wind up looking really expressive and kinda dorky instead of being cool and elegant, and I love it. :3:

Also, that’s a lot of alts. Whatever’s fun though! The early game really is kind of charming, and I don’t think people give it enough credit for that.



your characters do kinda look like you split my WoL in two though. :v:

Gally posted:

O12S down!

Fantastic fight, I greatly enjoyed both the twins and final omega form. We only made it past Hello World 2 for the first time tonight and got to 2% enrage on that pull, clearing it the next time we managed to make it through HW2 cleanly. I'm pretty jazzed we cleared everything w/out using any guides.

Alphascape is my most liked raid tier of stormblood, I'm really excited for the raids in Shadowbringers. (I think Coil 2 is still my favorite overall tier, having done them all when they were current)

Congratulations! I’m about past O11S after way too much static drama, and what I’ve seen of O12S, clearing it (or O11S, or even O10S for that matter) is no small feat. Especially without guides. That said, I’d like to say that Alphascape can’t be the best raid tier, because O10S still exists. :shepface:

SwissArmyDruid
Feb 14, 2014

by sebmojo
O10: First mechanic, don't fall asleep to the music. The loving narcolepsy-inducing music.

ParliamentOfDogs
Jan 29, 2009

My genre's thriller... What's yours?

put the bi in bicycle posted:

all racial dances are awkward, as it should be

The highlady dance is pretty much the perfect way to show you aren’t paying attention when being yelled at to stop healer dpsing so much.

Mordiceius
Nov 10, 2007

If you think calling me names is gonna get a rise out me, think again. I like my life as an idiot!
lol. The Blue Mage storyline is basically "Hey! Do you like cultural appropriation?! WE SURE DO!"

Rainuwastaken
Oct 30, 2012

Another blue ribbon for Hecarim.
Tank stance on for trash mobs (your healer gets to dps more and their heart won't explode), tank stance off for bosses. Congrats you now know how to tank every dungeon in the game.

If you have a monster dps that won't use their aggro dump, don't be ashamed to turn tank stance back on for a bit on bosses. It sucks and watching them die is really fun, but in the end it just wastes everyone's time.

King of the Cosmos
Jun 6, 2004

Maybe We'll invent a Cosmic Esperanto.
Looks like Blue Mage just dropped a little while ago. There's only a few hundred people around the starting NPC for the quest.

Cabbit
Jul 19, 2001

Is that everything you have?

Mordiceius posted:

lol. The Blue Mage storyline is basically "Hey! Do you like cultural appropriation?! WE SURE DO!"

On the plus side, we can add beat a giant krakken to death armed only with an ordinary, non-enchanted stick to the WoL's resume.

Kanfy
Jan 9, 2012

Just gotta keep walking down that road.

King of the Cosmos posted:

Looks like Blue Mage just dropped a little while ago. There's only a few hundred people around the starting NPC for the quest.

Also some people already hit level cap which is pretty funny.

Republicans
Oct 14, 2003

- More money for us

- Fuck you


I resubbed and I'm tempted to just start a new character because I have no goddamn idea what to do with this Lv.37 monk I have.

Hommando
Mar 2, 2012

Republicans posted:

I resubbed and I'm tempted to just start a new character because I have no goddamn idea what to do with this Lv.37 monk I have.

Start a new job at level 1.

Karasu Tengu
Feb 16, 2011

Humble Tengu Newspaper Reporter

Republicans posted:

I resubbed and I'm tempted to just start a new character because I have no goddamn idea what to do with this Lv.37 monk I have.

Push a button and then push the next button that unlocks. It's MNK, it's actually quite difficult to play wrong at that level.

unseenlibrarian
Jun 4, 2012

There's only one thing in the mountains that leaves a track like this. The creature of legend that roams the Timberline. My people named him Sasquatch. You call him... Bigfoot.
Unlocked BLU before heading into work this morning. Hopefully by tonight people will have learned that the mobs have to cast the spell before you kill them. Took several tries with people focus firing my bat before I got one that stayed alive long enough to blood drain someone and I learned the spell.

Also the biggest challenge of the questline: so many people around every quest NPC that they keep phasing out of existence.

unseenlibrarian fucked around with this message at 12:28 on Jan 15, 2019

Cabbit
Jul 19, 2001

Is that everything you have?

Kanfy posted:

Also some people already hit level cap which is pretty funny.

The XP bonus for killing poo poo is extremely real, and Water Cannon seems to chunk poo poo five or six levels above me pretty hard.

Stormgale
Feb 27, 2010

Kanfy posted:

Also some people already hit level cap which is pretty funny.

Apparently using N-Than methods

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

Stormgale posted:

Apparently using N-Than methods

N-Than methods?

Ignimbrite
Jan 5, 2010

BALLS BALLS BALLS
Dinosaur Gum

ImpAtom posted:

N-Than methods?

fate trains in north thanalan

god I haven't thought about those for years, thank gently caress


Also if anyone wants a guide to BLU skills, there's one in that link. Spoilers I guess, but it helps with figuring out what the gently caress you need to kill.

Cabbit
Jul 19, 2001

Is that everything you have?

My level 14 BLU can smash level 26 sabotenders by sleeping them with Acorn Bomb, casting Off-Guard, and chain casting 1000 Needles until it actually hits.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

Ignimbrite posted:

fate trains in north thanalan

god I haven't thought about those for years, thank gently caress


Also if anyone wants a guide to BLU skills, there's one in that link. Spoilers I guess, but it helps with figuring out what the gently caress you need to kill.

Wouldn't you get nothing from them since they're level 49 or am I misunderstanding?

Oxygen Deficiency
May 19, 2008



Ignimbrite posted:

fate trains in north thanalan

Ah, memories. :allears:

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
You'd get the actual kill XP but not much of the fate XP until about level 40. But it's actually

have regen healer + shield healer with you but outside party
go north thanlan
let healers regen + shield you
go pull all mobs around you
they will go to regen healer and then they kill em
easy exp and blue mage to 50 in 50 mins


Since that's on :reddit: I'm assuming the efficiency will drop sharply if enough people on a server try that method, though.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Also note that any version of a mob that casts a particular spell seems to count, which is handy for the easier or more common critters that are getting mobbed in certain locations right now.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.
It does seem very strange to me that a class specifically barred from using the random dungeon finder would have so many skills that can only be learned from dungeons and trials. It's such a weird idea for a class in an MMO, and I think blue mage is going to end up like it usually is in FF: either completely useless or blatantly overpowered depending on the individual.

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

I'm not like other posters

Cythereal posted:

It does seem very strange to me that a class specifically barred from using the random dungeon finder would have so many skills that can only be learned from dungeons and trials. It's such a weird idea for a class in an MMO, and I think blue mage is going to end up like it usually is in FF: either completely useless or blatantly overpowered depending on the individual.

Oh it’s already pretty clear that BLU is outrageously overpowered. One shotting mobs ten levels higher than themseves. Given that it’s primarily a solo Job I think that’s kind of the idea.

The dungeon and trial spells are simple: You just bring a premade of Blue Mages who thirst for magic.

Karasu Tengu
Feb 16, 2011

Humble Tengu Newspaper Reporter
BLU is pretty fun and also the /vpose has probably the smuggest expression they've put in the game yet.

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Mango Polo
Aug 4, 2007

Cythereal posted:

It does seem very strange to me that a class specifically barred from using the random dungeon finder would have so many skills that can only be learned from dungeons and trials. It's such a weird idea for a class in an MMO, and I think blue mage is going to end up like it usually is in FF: either completely useless or blatantly overpowered depending on the individual.

Party Finder? I think it's sensible to gate them out considering how they'd clown on the other jobs.

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